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Joined: Aug 2002
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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Pardon me if the subject has been discussed recently, but my search did not reveal what I was looking for. I have seen several people state that they prefer the short action 84M over the long action 84L in the Montanas. Not sure why that is, my 84L seems fairly light and trim, and reasonably manageable for recoil. Montanas are all about light weight and quick handling. If you're going with a short action cartridge, you might as well get it in a lighter, quicker handling short action rifle. Sure the difference isn't much in absolute terms, but in the world of light rifles a quarter pound is a lot. I have an 84L in 270 Win. that regularly shoots sub-MOA 3-shot groups with the right ammo and when I do my part. I have no plans to change this anytime soon. However, I thought I might like to rebarrel it to a 7mm-08 Rem. if I ever decided to re-barrel it. If I had a Montana in a widely useful cartridge like 270 that shot sub-MOA I wouldn't dream of rebarreling it for any reason. Quit while you're ahead. What are the Pros and Cons of rebarreling an 84L to a short-action cartridge? Are there any benefits to using an 84L for seating higher BC bullets out long? Or would it just be better to use an 84M action if one wants a 7mm-08? Thanks. As explained above, if you want a 7mm-08, get an 84M. As far as putting a short action cartridge in a long action so you can seat the bullets out long, that may let you get the most out of the cartridge, but it doesn't get you the most out of the rifle. If you're going to have a longer heavier rifle, you might as well get the most out of it. This is a drawing of a 358 win cartridge vs a 35 Whelen, but the principle would be the same for a 7mm-08 and a 280: ![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](https://i.imgur.com/g08tS6H.jpg)
Last edited by natman; 01/28/23.
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Joined: Mar 2006
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 21,637 Likes: 54 |
If I had a long action & wanted a 7mm, the 280 Remington would be my huckleberry. Added horsepower & you haven't given up any action space to a lower performing cartridge. I love a 7-08 and have used them. But it is NOT a 280 Remington.
A fool's delight is not in understanding, but only in revealing his own mind. Proverbs 18:2
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jan 2009
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If I had a long action & wanted a 7mm, the 280 Remington would be my huckleberry. Added horsepower & you haven't given up any action space to a lower performing cartridge. I love a 7-08 and have used them. But it is NOT a 280 Remington. In a Kimber long action I sure wouldn't rebarrel to a 280 or 280 AI when looking to use the long bullets, due to limited action length, as well as running into that somewhat nebulous recoil wall in a light rifle. It's not always about shoving the biggest motor into a car.
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Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 63,842 Likes: 477
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 63,842 Likes: 477 |
The sheer and utter CLUELESSNESS of Drooling Dumbfhuqks,NEVER disappoints in it's Magnificent Grandeur. Hint.
The 84L is VERY trite in COAL,for a "long" action. Hint.
For that reason,it's a Goat Fhuqk in 280 or 280AI. Hint.
Because bullets matter wayyyyyyyy more than headstamps,a shorter case with a better bullet,never comes in second place. Read that again. Now one more time. Hint.
A 84L 70Win is a steaming pile of fhuqking schit,that can't begin to keep pace with 264 Kreed Factory Fodder. Hint.
The ONLY things you gals "shoot" are your mouths and fhuqking Imaginations. Hint.
Fhuqking LAUGHING!................
Brad says: "Can't fault Rick for his pity letting you back on the fire... but pity it was and remains. Nothing more, nothing less. A sad little man in a sad little dream."
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2010
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Delkal ‘s first post 9-2024 ;joined in 2004 Hmm
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Joined: Jan 2001
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2001
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Pardon wares that exist,as you Google Gals summons your Imagination and Pretend. Hint. ![[Linked Image from imagizer.imageshack.com]](https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/1600x1200q90/923/YCdybP.jpg) Fhuqking LAUGHING!................
Brad says: "Can't fault Rick for his pity letting you back on the fire... but pity it was and remains. Nothing more, nothing less. A sad little man in a sad little dream."
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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Joined: Jan 2001
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
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You AMAZINGLY Inept clueless Fhuqks,couldn't summons a FIRST Fhuqking Clue,if your "life" depended on it. Fortunately,Imagination and Pretend are free,so even you Brokedicks can "afford" to "contribute". Hint. 1000 words and Google as you MUST,then nod pencil necks in unison,like you "understand". Hint. ![[Linked Image from imagizer.imageshack.com]](https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/1600x1200q90/922/42lC0z.jpg) ![[Linked Image from imagizer.imageshack.com]](https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/1600x1200q90/922/yQKziB.jpg) Fhuqking LAUGHING!..............
Brad says: "Can't fault Rick for his pity letting you back on the fire... but pity it was and remains. Nothing more, nothing less. A sad little man in a sad little dream."
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Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 36,074 Likes: 267
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 36,074 Likes: 267 |
Delkal ‘s first post 9-2024 ;joined in 2004 Hmm
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Joined: Dec 2019
Posts: 411 Likes: 2
Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
Joined: Dec 2019
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OK Stick... I think I did alright for an early Montana that shoots accurately. I have $650 invested in it after I sold the scheit scope that came with it. Not bad in a time when Montanas are fetching a premium right now. As I said...was originally looking for a 7mm-08. Sounds like you prefer the 84M and 8400.
In your opinion, how would you setup an 84L to maximize the potential of that action? Other than to sell the 84L and buy an 84M or 8400. Not trying to be confrontational...I really want to know. I realize that you have setup several Montanas to maximize what you can do with that platform.
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Joined: Jan 2001
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2001
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The (3) things that matter most,are bullets,bullets and bullets. Hint. The 84M is as maligned as the 84L,in that they are both very trite in COAL "latitude". The 8400 Whizzum's are THE cream of the crop,due COAL latitude,with the 7 Whizzum being The Belle of The Ball. They'll 180 out of the gate. Hint. ![[Linked Image from imagizer.imageshack.com]](https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/1600x1200q90/538/Cf70qI.jpg) NO chambering,can be better than it's bullet. I would MUCH rather gun a 7-08 with .796 BC 180's,than a 280 squirting parachutes. My 280's are typically set up to kiss that 180 at 3.585" COAL. Same goes 7mm RemMags. Why? The cases are of like length and share the same box/follower in a 700 L/A,leaving room to chase lands. Hint. With a 84L Donor on the table,I'd go 8" RPM 7 Mouser and throat 180 Smooches,from it's tiny in comparison box. Hint. In a 84M,I'd go 284 Bleedmire,throated for same. Hint. ![[Linked Image from imagizer.imageshack.com]](https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/1600x1200q90/923/vMhAoJ.jpg) Bullets,bullets and bullets. Hint................
Brad says: "Can't fault Rick for his pity letting you back on the fire... but pity it was and remains. Nothing more, nothing less. A sad little man in a sad little dream."
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 13,616 Likes: 114
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jan 2007
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I've got 2 260's built on long action 700's . for the reason of seating long bullets. in ideal position to lands and still running through the magazine. these 2 I shoot for the high power silhouettes get in the hunter class you have to run the ammo through the magazine... I built these long before the creedmoor was ever thought about...
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Joined: Oct 2000
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 30,687 Likes: 118 |
In your opinion, how would you setup an 84L to maximize the potential of that action? Leave it as it is. For me I've found the enjoyable upper recoil threshold with the 84M and 84L Montana's is the 308 Win in the M and 270 Win in the L. Add bore size and powder and things become too sporty (I've had something like 16+ Montana's). If you don't like the 270, trade it for an 84M Montana.
The 308 Win is like the woman you marry for life - low drama, stable. Maybe not the best at any one thing, but reliable in everything.
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Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 63,842 Likes: 477
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 63,842 Likes: 477 |
I've got 2 260's built on long action 700's . for the reason of seating long bullets. in ideal position to lands and still running through the magazine. these 2 I shoot for the high power silhouettes get in the hunter class you have to run the ammo through the magazine... I built these long before the creedmoor was ever thought about... 700's are easy. Hint. Simply go AICS binderless DBM and you are there. My 8" Hart 260AI loves 147 Smooches,fed from same. Hint. ![[Linked Image from imagizer.imageshack.com]](https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/1600x1200q90/922/0Am1Bu.jpg) ![[Linked Image from imagizer.imageshack.com]](https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/1600x1200q90/923/VylF75.jpg) ![[Linked Image from imagizer.imageshack.com]](https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/1600x1200q90/923/qRhV4o.jpg) Just sayin'. Hint..............
Brad says: "Can't fault Rick for his pity letting you back on the fire... but pity it was and remains. Nothing more, nothing less. A sad little man in a sad little dream."
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Joined: Dec 2019
Posts: 411 Likes: 2
Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
Joined: Dec 2019
Posts: 411 Likes: 2 |
In your opinion, how would you setup an 84L to maximize the potential of that action? Leave it as it is. For me I've found the enjoyable upper recoil threshold with the 84M and 84L Montana's is the 308 Win in the M and 270 Win in the L. Add bore size and powder and things become too sporty (I've had something like 16+ Montana's). If you don't like the 270, trade it for an 84M Montana. Brad...I think I will leave it as is. The juice just doesn't seem to be worth the squeeze, given my barrel is showing accuracy with me behind it. I was curious to see what I could do with a LA Kimber Montana.
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Joined: Dec 2019
Posts: 411 Likes: 2
Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
Joined: Dec 2019
Posts: 411 Likes: 2 |
The (3) things that matter most,are bullets,bullets and bullets. Hint. The 84M is as maligned as the 84L,in that they are both very trite in COAL "latitude". The 8400 Whizzum's are THE cream of the crop,due COAL latitude,with the 7 Whizzum being The Belle of The Ball. They'll 180 out of the gate. Hint. ![[Linked Image from imagizer.imageshack.com]](https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/1600x1200q90/538/Cf70qI.jpg) NO chambering,can be better than it's bullet. I would MUCH rather gun a 7-08 with .796 BC 180's,than a 280 squirting parachutes. My 280's are typically set up to kiss that 180 at 3.585" COAL. Same goes 7mm RemMags. Why? The cases are of like length and share the same box/follower in a 700 L/A,leaving room to chase lands. Hint. With a 84L Donor on the table,I'd go 8" RPM 7 Mouser and throat 180 Smooches,from it's tiny in comparison box. Hint. In a 84M,I'd go 284 Bleedmire,throated for same. Hint. ![[Linked Image from imagizer.imageshack.com]](https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/1600x1200q90/923/vMhAoJ.jpg) Bullets,bullets and bullets. Hint................ Big Stick...thank you for answering my question and providing a "method to the madness" in trying to address optimizing an 84L. I'm picking up what you are putting down regarding choosing a high-BC projectile. I will be watching for an 8400 to turn up at a good price.
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Joined: Dec 2019
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Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
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ALL... I appreciate your input on the subject of rebarreling/chambering an 84L. Thank you for answering my questions. I will refer back to this thread as a template, should I ever get the itch to do something wild with my Kimber.
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