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What complete 223/556 upper would you guys go with if you had about a 7-800 limit ?

Accuracy would be the main goal so weight isn’t an issue.

I see LaRue has a match grade offering and rock River makes their varmint and predator pursuit upper that I’ve heard good things about. I have a WOA. Any other makes I’m missing?

Cert, the ones you mention are not really "budget" minded. Hopefully this does not get into a pizzing match here. I am reminded by something my buddy, who is an old retired Airborne Ranger, told me a while back. He was talking about barrels and he said most makers barrels these days are actually pretty good. They don't want to have a bad name, or reputation, so they try to put out a good product because they know if they don't, everyone and their brother will hear about it on the internet. My buddy is right for the most part.

What we have seen here recently is some guys mentioning Bear Creek Armory a lot. Some guys are having great luck with them. Even some guys like rost. And rost has shot way more AR's than most of us here. I appreciate reading his experiences here. However, you also see a lot of bad publicity on this brand. So what do we do?

I know I'm the odd man out a lot of times because I have minimal experience with AR's. I only joined this forum because of the black rifle challenge here. I like and appreciate accuracy, even in the AR platform. In my experience, they shoot damn good. I've been extremely lucky I guess?? Since I'm the "odd man out", I'll suggest looking at the Windham Weaponry varmint exterminator upper. It uses a fluted stainless 20" barrel and I have 3 barrels from them that all shoot lights out. 3 for 3 and they are all good. However, the last one is a bit more finicky. I've submitted all of those rifles in the black rifle challenge here and they are sub moa shooters in that event. With that being said, they may also not be "budget" minded at $800.00 for the complete upper (including the BCG with bolt matched to the barrel extension). These have CLE (Compass Lake Engineering) chambers and are generally my go to if I have to shoot one in a competition.


Here's what one of my favorites does on command:



Here is a pic of 2 of the rifles. Basically set up the same way. The rifle on the top is my Noveske iron sight rifle. The 2 below it have VEX barrels:


The other one is a BCM with the Windham Weaponry VEX barrel on it:


The funny thing is I've been playing with the el-cheapo old Bushmaster 1 in 9" twist HBAR rifle the most (where ar's are concerned) over the last 6 months. My Airborne Ranger buddy sold me a complete upper for $250 and I've been pretty dang happy with that one. Cant beat the accuracy you get from some used uppers, if they are quality:




Sometimes you get damn lucky on that kind of stuff. For example: The Noveske shown above was a complete 20" heavy stainless varmint upper that I got for $500.00, used. Maybe sometimes the better option is to buy a good quality used upper, if you are on a budget??? That Noveske is one of my poorer shooting AR's. Only shooting around 1 moa at best, but generally not much worse than that...: Even with the irons, I scored 1.085 MOA in the black rifle challenge here:

Target shot at one of my clubs AR shoots^^^^ With a scope, that is ho hum, but with irons, I can't complain.. That has just been my experience. Not much on multiple brands. I have had one WOA upper and it shot great, but was in a cartridge that is not well supported by WOA. The twist was too slow too, something those sob's should know better. However, if I were to do it all over again, I'd buy a WOA barrel and put it in a good upper receiver and see if it outshot my WW. Chances are good that it would keep up. Maybe???

Even though you already have one, it's hard not to recommend another WOA for a near sure bet, accuracy wise, in the price range.

Not much of a LaRue fan & a lot of variable reports, but their upper / rail attachment system is solid. But I do use their triggers & grips. Some people love 'em.

MM

WOA and Compass Lake are very common names in the AR accuracy competition circles.

Bsa..appreciate your input as always.

I should have maybe omitted “budget” from my title as of course that is a subjective term. I stated the rough budget only to exclude the $3-400 uppers we all know about.

There are no doubt uppers from the likes of PSA that shoot well above their price point. I feel 7-800 is the sweet spot of getting a consistent high quality product but without paying the super big bucks for a Baer or JP…

In that realm you will certainly get great quality but maybe also paying a bit extra for a name…make sense?

MM..I have no experience with a LaRue but just happened to see they offer a “march grade” upper in the ballpark price. Would be curious to see if it could hang

Sorry, I didn't see your $7-800.00 price point earlier. That should get you a decent upper. I like MM's suggestion of WOA. Probably less of a gamble that way. However, you also mention Larue. I know you guys have seen the moa all day long challenge over at ar15.com/arfcom. Those Larue's are shooting sob's. But I believe the guy shooting those Larue's is one of the owners?? TWR used to hang out over there, he probably knows more about that. I'd imagine that Larue shooter probably had his pick of uppers to choose from for that shoot too. Maybe an unfair advantage?? What say you?.. In my earlier post, I only showed what has worked for me. Definitely not suggesting them if you are wanting to go full on competition with an AR. I was thinking today that I shoot a lot of paper, some guys don't like my input and others do. All I can do is post honest experience here. Yesterday when you texted me, I was sitting at the bench and had to run down to the target to take a picture of that group at 400 yards. That one almost edged out my best group of .801" fired a couple weeks ago in the creedmoor. I'm often reminded how these dang .22 caliber rifles shoot. An accurate AR15 is a thing of beauty. I hope you find one that shoots lights out!!!

Doesn't really answer the question, but if it was me, I'd just build one. I'd probably try to get Craddock to spin up a Rock Creek 223 Wylde barrel for 400-450 bucks or so, buy an Aero Enhanced upper and handguard for about 300, look around for a deal on a Toolcraft bolt carrier group, and grab whatever gas block and tube caught my eye. A cheap milspec charging handle is like 20 bucks.

Probably would have less than 900 bucks in that setup, even with shipping, and the odds of it shooting good would be high.

I was a LaRue fan but only had one of their barrels. It was their PredatAR pencil barrel. It shot okay but not gonna win matches with a pencil barrel. They were a bit over gassed.

Their Stealth barrels seem to get great accuracy reports but I’ve never shot one.

That said, I’m not a target shooter, I hate heavy barrels. I hate over gassed systems. And I prefer carbines for their utility.

The most accurate barrel I’ve seen was a Krieger from Compass Lake. It was a 17” SPR profile and shot everything I tried. I tried a couple Noveske light weights that were good, I’ve seen a half dozen McGowan’s that shot good too. Pretty much everyone that tries can make a good barrel.

I’m pretty impressed with my Criterion Hybrid barrel. It seems to shoot better every time I take it out and it’s chrome lined. Considering it’s just got a 1-4 on it, it will surprise you.

I like White Oak.
They make your price point, and John's single minded purpose is to build them to win without breaking the bank.
https://www.whiteoakarmament.com/shop/complete-uppers/varmint-uppers.html

Everybody has their favorites. Everyone has heard of brand XYZ that shoots lights out. Every since Rodman Labs put some effort into M16 accuracy and guys like Albert Turner and Bill Wylde cracked the code, it's not hard to make an accurate shooting AR. Brand XYZ might put out uppers that shoot bugholes 75% of the time. I'll go with White Oak at 99% (and if you think you've got a 1% stinker, John will talk you through it and make it right).

Haven't heard the name Albert Turner brought up in quite a while. One of the AR accuracy pioneers for sure. He fitted the MK trigger to my AR here on Phoenix.

Cert, used one of the LaRue uppers for my brother and it’s a great one. Shoots everything real well so far. I am cheap and keep running the PSA’s but I’d opt for a LaRue if I had a little extra and wanted to spend it knowing that it’ll be a shooter.

I'd love to see pics of how your rifles did in the black rifle challenge. Both of you guys have told us you shoot competitively, but I never saw anything submitted. Unless I missed it. Even Rost was kind enough to shoot the irons part of it. And yes, even though I did not submit the "proper" iron sight target, my group size edged out rosts by a few hundredths. I believe he shot something like a 1.3 moa. That is a great challenge here, regardless of some of the bull schidt posted there. You guys should surely best my score. Pics of your rifles and targets would be fantastic!!! That would also be excellent proof that what you say is legit. 2 10 shot groups side by side on the same piece of paper.

Most, it not all the bad results I've witnesses was from rifles produced before their bust for illegal workers. Rost's significantly more positive experiences all came later. Brands change. It's entirely possible they've cleaned up their act, are using better supplier, and improved their QC. Look at the progress made my PSA, and how Bushmaster went from a great brand to bottom of the barrel.

I might give them another change, but I'd still swap out the bolt for something known, like a tool craft.

Thanks beretz..that offering from LaRue was in the wheelhouse I was going for.

I could not remember compass lake despite having read about them here before. Definitely would be something to consider tho a few more bucks

I do not have a rock river tho I have witnessed one that shoots very well

They are both high master/one of them is distinguished and have nothing else to prove. Shooting couple 10 shot groups isn’t going to do anything for them. They proven it on the mid range and long range course of fire. They could easily ask you post pictures of a 20 shot group fired at 600yds. Don’t forget they are both sling shooters.

You might want to just take an upper you already have and put a decent barrel on it. That's it. Assuming it wears a float tube, all you have to do is put a good barrel on it.

Otherwise, it's very difficult to build a nice upper with CH & BCG for under ~$700.

Sorry...not interested. When I was a kid, I enjoyed wringing as much accuracy as I could from Dad's rifles (mostly hunters) off the bench. It no longer interests me. You get to a point where it's shooting good off bags, then what? My interests have evolved into areas where my skill and abilities are the bigger part of the equation. An accurate rifle is still important, and part of the equation, but an accurate rifle for me is a given and a starting point. The challenge of pointing the rifle out of position without benefit of a bench or bipod is where it's at for me. I don't enjoy it because I'm good at it or it's easy...it's the opposite; I enjoy it because it's hard and it challenges me. I think I'm more likely to post pics of my fails than my brag groups.

I'll tell you what; I've got a few projects I'm trying to carve out time for. I've got some spare parts I'm thinking about slapping together into a scope upper which means I'll be function and accuracy checking. I'll make you a deal; I'll post groups if you go out and shoot a registered Across the course Highpower Rifle Match and post a link to your results. You might just enjoy it!

Tell me more about this one. I have a vague recollection about you posting. Is my recollection that you got that one used correct? I do know that the WOA was producing these for Highpower and Varminting (with some of the Varmint uppers made in a slow twist). I have a match rifle upper in 6 WOA with some spare parts. What kind of support are you needing?

BSA, I find it odd that my post referencing an old time AR smith triggered such a response. As I have replied to you before, I sold my one and only AR15 some time ago. It was set up for service rifle shooting with iron sights, but with the rule changes became somewhat of a dinosaur. I have posted some write ups regarding recent matches I have attended for those that were interested...

I did for fun, post some 500 yard groups shot with my 12.5 pound iron sighted Palma rifle in the MOA all day long thread, but that drew criticism from you as well. Not sure anyone but you considers an internet posting to be proof of anything, much less a competition. One thing about standardized competition formats, is that with the internet, posted results are not hard to find. That includes both mine, and yours. Good to see that you are branching out from what Rost referred to as the "BSA course of fire" with the LRVS matches. Don't forget to sign up for Saturday's match.

Shoot straight!

This is solid advice.

FWIW if I was going budget I'd buy a 200 buck BCA upper and see if it made me happy. And if not then I"d pursue putting a barrel on it that was better. Actually I'm so sure the BCA would be good enough for a truck gun even if its not MOA or under, that I'd keep that and just then head towards White Oak and tell them what you desire as far as cost and weight etc...
Their Wilson barrels years ago where really decent for lower bucks, as they got the blanks and set up and chambered so a bit more than a Wilson factory tube. But all around better deal in the end.

There are others I"m sure. I simply never found the need to move forward after finding White Oak. That says they kept me happy.