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A DETACHMENT
AK23050316
Location: Hope
Type: Search and Rescue / Death Investigation
Dispatch Text: On May 21, 2023, at 5:52 pm, the Alaska State Troopers were notified that an adult male was stuck in the tidal mud flats near Hope. Troopers and rescue teams from the Hope Sunrise Fire Department and Girdwood Fire Department responded to the scene. Rescue efforts were unsuccessful, and 20-year-old Illinois resident Zachary Porter died at approximately 6:43 pm after being submerged by the incoming tide. Rescue teams recovered Porter’s body at approximately 6:00 am on May 22, 2023. Next of kin has been notified.


ALASKA is a "HARD COUNTRY for OLDMEN". (But if you live it wide'ass open, balls'to the wall, the pedal floored, full throttle, it is a delightful place, to finally just sit-back and savor those memories while sipping Tequila).
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So in 12 HOURS they couldn't get him out of a situation he got himself into? Something we are missing here.

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Originally Posted by mjbgalt
So in 12 HOURS they couldn't get him out of a situation he got himself into? Something we are missing here.
A tide cycle. Big tides. And current. That was a 27’ differential from low when he got stuck to the high shortly after midnight.

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I was just talking about this exact thing with my two children. Now that they’re getting older and going out on their own adventures we review the anticipated problems that might arise and how to respond. They were asking me about quicksand and Cook Inlet tide flats were front and center. I can’t imagine a more terrible way to go.

Prayers for the loved ones left behind.


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Originally Posted by AcesNeights
I was just talking about this exact thing with my two children. Now that they’re getting older and going out on their own adventures we review the anticipated problems that might arise and how to respond. They were asking me about quicksand and Cook Inlet tide flats were front and center. I can’t imagine a more terrible way to go.

Prayers for the loved ones left behind.

If you really want to drive the point home. Tell them there have been people stuck, they tried to hoist them up using a rescue helicopter, and it pulled them in half.


ALASKA is a "HARD COUNTRY for OLDMEN". (But if you live it wide'ass open, balls'to the wall, the pedal floored, full throttle, it is a delightful place, to finally just sit-back and savor those memories while sipping Tequila).
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Originally Posted by AGL4now
Originally Posted by AcesNeights
I was just talking about this exact thing with my two children. Now that they’re getting older and going out on their own adventures we review the anticipated problems that might arise and how to respond. They were asking me about quicksand and Cook Inlet tide flats were front and center. I can’t imagine a more terrible way to go.

Prayers for the loved ones left behind.

If you really want to drive the point home. Tell them there have been people stuck, they tried to hoist them up using a rescue helicopter, and it pulled them in half.

That was the question I was going to ask...why not a helicopter. Yikes.

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“Many have heard the story of the duck hunter who was stuck in the mud on either Knik or Turnagain arm, in the 1960s or 1970s, depending on who tells it, and was pulled in half by a helicopter, leaving the lower half of his body in the mud. Some locals remember the incident vividly. There is no evidence it ever happened, but the story has become an Alaska legend.”

https://akfatal.net/Dickison.htm

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What a horrible way to die. A friend was stationed in AK as a young airman and barely got out in time. Lost his decoys but they weren't worth a life...


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Originally Posted by AcesNeights
I was just talking about this exact thing with my two children. Now that they’re getting older and going out on their own adventures we review the anticipated problems that might arise and how to respond. They were asking me about quicksand and Cook Inlet tide flats were front and center. I can’t imagine a more terrible way to go.

Prayers for the loved ones left behind.

Always a good thing to understand your surroundings and the perils that are ever present hey Aces?

Remember the Tsunami in P h u k e t (a swear word? lol) in 2012 where people were running out into the ocean when the water was sucked out?

Not Smart!

RIP

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A distant buddy came close. A team effort digging up Geoduck which can involve extraction from up to a 3 ft deep hole in wet sand. Given some sinking and continuous cascade of water and sand, he was hip deep with the incoming tide approaching. He was extracted, but said it was an uncomfortable situation.


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Originally Posted by AKwolverine
“Many have heard the story of the duck hunter who was stuck in the mud on either Knik or Turnagain arm, in the 1960s or 1970s, depending on who tells it, and was pulled in half by a helicopter, leaving the lower half of his body in the mud. Some locals remember the incident vividly. There is no evidence it ever happened, but the story has become an Alaska legend.”

https://akfatal.net/Dickison.htm

I'll shed some light on this. In the 70's my partner and myself (Me a very minority share) Started and owned "EAT-ME SUB SHOPS" The manager of the downtown shop was taking a break and visiting us in the shop, it was slow time midafternoon. When in walked her husband, looking sickly. He told us the rescue mission you referred to. He was in the back of the helicopter when they pulled the upper half of him onboard.

Another event. Upper Cook Inlet, Guy was waterfowl hunting with some type of shotgun (He was stuck in the mud) he removed the barrel so as to breathe through it, he died.

There have been many in my 54 years here. Less than two weeks ago the GIRDWOOD Fire & Rescue saved a guy at Twenty Mile Creek.

By the way I live in the Hope/Sunrise community.

Last edited by AGL4now; 05/22/23.

ALASKA is a "HARD COUNTRY for OLDMEN". (But if you live it wide'ass open, balls'to the wall, the pedal floored, full throttle, it is a delightful place, to finally just sit-back and savor those memories while sipping Tequila).
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Another was the young GI driving north with his wife from Ingram Creek on two 3-wheelers. They were gold prospecting. She got her wheeler stuck, got off, and sank in the thixotropic mud. He ran for help and flagged a passing car. He went back to her and attempted to extract her. Girdwood VFD got there but could not get her out. Left her with a hose to breathe through. She died of exposure.


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The microscopic plates lock together very convincingly when the water leaves the mud. Digging a hole nearby only speeds the process. A trash pump pumping water in does far more good than a hole.

It is strange stuff. It feels solid underfoot when walking across. Stop and stomp your feet and rock back and forth a bit and water moves into the agitated mud which softens it. That is when you sink.

Just like ketchup in the bottle which pours freely only after being agitated. (Thixotropism)


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Says authorities were notified at 5:52 pm. He died at 6:43pm. Looks like Rescue team had less than an hour. Retrieved his body at 6:00 am.

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Originally Posted by Sitka deer
The microscopic plates lock together very convincingly when the water leaves the mud. Digging a hole nearby only speeds the process. A trash pump pumping water in does far more good than a hole.

It is strange stuff. It feels solid underfoot when walking across. Stop and stomp your feet and rock back and forth a bit and water moves into the agitated mud which softens it. That is when you sink.

Just like ketchup in the bottle which pours freely only after being agitated. (Thixotropism)

Sitka deer;
Good afternoon to you sir, I trust you and your fine family are well up in your section of Alaska.

Holy smoke that sounds absolutely frightening.

With the understanding that for most of my life I've maintained I'd rather be on a rough horse than a smooth boat, now I have yet another reason to distrust things on or near water.

I do love to fish and find being beside the ocean calming, but it has my respect and then some.

If you or anyone is ever in the area of the Skookumchuck Narrows on the BC coast, it's really something seeing the tide come in and out there. We watched a big twin outboard boat working hard to make progress against it.

Anyways thanks for the science lesson once more, I learned something today - even if it is unsettling.

All the best to you all.

Dwayne


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Originally Posted by scottf270
Says authorities were notified at 5:52 pm. He died at 6:43pm. Looks like Rescue team had less than an hour. Retrieved his body at 6:00 am.
Water temperature in the inlet is in the low 40s right now. Even if you can supply oxygen, it doesn’t take long at that temperature with moving water.

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Turnagain Arm has the second most extreme tidal change, after "The Bay of Fundy". I have seen the "BORE TIDE" (Tidal Change) many hundreds of times, but only "once" was it (10) TEN FEET TALL.

https://www.alaska.org/advice/alaska-bore-tide#What's%20So%20Special%20About%20The%20Turnagain%20Arm%20Bore%20Tide?


ALASKA is a "HARD COUNTRY for OLDMEN". (But if you live it wide'ass open, balls'to the wall, the pedal floored, full throttle, it is a delightful place, to finally just sit-back and savor those memories while sipping Tequila).
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Originally Posted by scottf270
Says authorities were notified at 5:52 pm. He died at 6:43pm. Looks like Rescue team had less than an hour. Retrieved his body at 6:00 am.

From GIRDWOOD Fire Dept. To Hope, Alaska is about 62 or 64 miles AND over Turnagain Pass, With weekend traffic, and four road construction sites.


ALASKA is a "HARD COUNTRY for OLDMEN". (But if you live it wide'ass open, balls'to the wall, the pedal floored, full throttle, it is a delightful place, to finally just sit-back and savor those memories while sipping Tequila).
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The Turnagain Arm is simply a don’t mess around zone. There are folks that surf the bore tides and kite surf the area and have a few key spots to safely enter and exit, but otherwise a place no one should mess around. 2nd highest tidal exchanges in the world and a total slurry of glacial silt throughout the tidal mud flats. In the almost 20 years I’ve lived here, never once seen a single boat out there, ever.


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On a lighter note, since no one died...

Some years ago there was some big whoop-de-doo in Hope. Music festival or some such. Lots of clueless people poured in. There is a nice green, grassy ocean-side beach next to the mouth of Resurrection Creek. Great tent sites, eh?? It was taken advantage of...

Most of the Hope residents were up on the bluff, watching the show when the Spring Tide rolled in..... smile

As to Will's post, I know of only one. Bill Miller was known to have kayaked from his home in Hope on good, calm high slack tides, over to Bird Point? to be picked up for appointments in Anchorage. A few times, anyway. I think he didn't do it much. He would do his business and catch another tide back when it was right. Or so I was told, but not by Bill.

I believe they also used boats between The two shores during the gold rush years, but I could be wrong about that.

Last edited by las; 05/22/23.

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Originally Posted by las
On a lighter note, since no one died...

Some years ago there was some big whoop-de-doo in Hope. Music festival or some such. Lots of clueless people poured in. There is a nice green, grassy ocean-side beach next to the mouth of Resurrection Creek. Great tent sites, eh?? It was taken advantage of...

Most of the Hope residents were up on the bluff, watching the show when the Spring Tide rolled in..... smile

As to Will's post, I know of only one. Bill Miller was known to have kayaked from his home in Hope on good, calm high slack tides, over to Bird Point? to be picked up for appointments in Anchorage. A few times, anyway. I think he didn't do it much. He would do his business and catch another tide back when it was right. Or so I was told, but not by Bill.

I believe they also used boats between The two shores during the gold rush years, but I could be wrong about that.

20-Mile just happens to be 20 miles from Sunrise?

I have run around the head of TA in boats for years. I have been stuck and have had minor issues a number of times. Just understand the basic physics and do not do stupid things.


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OFF SUBJECT:
A Good Read, Available at most Alaska libraries. Or Amazon.com currently has four copies. I say it is a good and educational read. But I am predacious having lived in Sunrise, Alaska much longer then any location.

SUBJECT:
The Turnagain Arm Gold Rush of 1896, preceded the Klondike, changing the face of Alaska forever. Memories of Old Sunrise chronicles one man's experiences during that pivotal time in Alaska's history. In his own words, A. W. Jack Morgan tells of the triumphs, disappointments, and the adventures of miners who survived backbreaking labor, brutal winters, and mind-numbing isolation in the Last Frontier. With a cast of colorful characters, this autobiography brings back to life the bustling times of a bygone era.

https://www.amazon.com/Memories-Old-Sunrise-Alaskas-Turnagain/dp/146757760X/ref=sr_1_1?crid=2LQ224A2TVTY7&keywords=Memories+of+Old+Sunrise&qid=1684824261&s=books&sprefix=memories+of+old+sunrise%2Cstripbooks%2C1482&sr=1-1


ALASKA is a "HARD COUNTRY for OLDMEN". (But if you live it wide'ass open, balls'to the wall, the pedal floored, full throttle, it is a delightful place, to finally just sit-back and savor those memories while sipping Tequila).
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That is a good book, and there's a picture of my doppelganger in it.

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Originally Posted by cwh2
That is a good book, and there's a picture of my doppelganger in it.
They can fix that surgically, you know...


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Originally Posted by cwh2
That is a good book, and there's a picture of my doppelganger in it.
Can you describe what he looks like?


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Originally Posted by ironbender
Originally Posted by cwh2
That is a good book, and there's a picture of my doppelganger in it.
Can you describe what he looks like?
Just look in your mirror... duh!
wink


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Too bad for the guy in the photo. 😳


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Originally Posted by Sitka deer
Originally Posted by ironbender
Originally Posted by cwh2
That is a good book, and there's a picture of my doppelganger in it.
Can you describe what he looks like?
Just look in your mirror... duh!
wink
I am not nearly as handsome as Chris.


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Drowning is a bitch. I drowned as a kid, got revived. Nothing "peaceful" about it. My 1st cousin who was like my brother didn't make it from the drowning. That's why Indian women have so many fkn babies.......ur gonna loose some of them river boys.

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I can only imagine emergency personnel, friends, and family saying goodbye as the tide comes in. You'd have a little bit of time to pray alone, if you could focus.........

Pretty sad stuff......


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Sad, so very sad.

Rest in peace, young man.

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Isn’t there someone list there nearly every year? Or at least quite often?

There are many terrible ways to die in AK as well as many other places. But AK seems to have Murphy’s Law on the top ten read quite often.


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Originally Posted by mainer_in_ak
Drowning is a bitch. I drowned as a kid, got revived. Nothing "peaceful" about it. My 1st cousin who was like my brother didn't make it from the drowning..........

I'm sorry you lost your cousin, and am glad you came back. I almost drowned once. Drove through the ice and rode the truck to the bottom of the lake. Took a while to get out of the cab. It wasn't "peaceful", in fact it was overwhelming panic, but when I accepted the fact that I wasn't going to make it, a calming feeling of wonder and surprise filled me. Immediately afterwards I got the door open and swam up to the hole I'd created in the ice.

Alaskan winter air is the sweetest air on Earth. Delicious. And every breath of it is a gift from God.


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Originally Posted by Akbob5
Isn’t there someone list there nearly every year? Or at least quite often?

There are many terrible ways to die in AK as well as many other places. But AK seems to have Murphy’s Law on the top ten read quite often.

Drownings in general are common but it’s been a long time since the last one like this. Usually several rescues a year from the mud flats - but not fatalities.

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being eaten alive by a grizzly bear like Timothy Treadwell and his girlfriend Amie Huguenard did .


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Originally Posted by AKwolverine
Originally Posted by Akbob5
Isn’t there someone list there nearly every year? Or at least quite often?

There are many terrible ways to die in AK as well as many other places. But AK seems to have Murphy’s Law on the top ten read quite often.

Drownings in general are common but it’s been a long time since the last one like this. Usually several rescues a year from the mud flats - but not fatalities.

I read it's been about 20 years since the last mud flat fatality. Also that the guy pulled in half was at the next low tide body recovery, not at the rescue attempt. Somewhere else is also claiming a pulled-in-half happened in that locale.

Keep in mind it is "journalism". Facts get bent, legends are invented, moved, etc .

Stay off the fuggin mud!

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I heard the story of the rescue attempting to get the guy out of the mud only to pull him in half when I was in-processing at Elmendorf in 2011. I have experienced the mid first hand in Fish Creek while dip netting it a few years back. I only got on foot stuck and was close to the bank that I finally got out, but it was not fun. Drowning from being stuck in the mud flats is not a way I want to go.

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I think everyone has heard the story.

Just like the hundreds of mean problem brown bears that got dropped on on Montague in the 70s and 80s.

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So do you guys have tips on how to avoid such areas?
I saw kids messing around in Coal Bay by Homer and it looked like the mud your talking about.

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Stay the hell off it! Much like avalanche areas.

Darwinism at work, both.

Last edited by las; 05/27/23.

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Originally Posted by las
Stay the hell off it! Much like avalanche areas.

Darwinism at work, both.

Absolutely this!

General advice…
If you had to affect rescue for a stuck HUMAN (not scruffy the 12 year old wonder mutt) spread your weight as wide as possible….like your walking on 10’ soft snowpack, snowshoes, boards, tarps, cardboard, evergreen fronds, ANYTHING that allows you to spread your weight and NOT apply too much weight on a footprint sized spot.

Water-jets are the best way to get unstuck.


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Originally Posted by AcesNeights
Originally Posted by las
Stay the hell off it! Much like avalanche areas.

Darwinism at work, both.

Absolutely this!

General advice…
If you had to affect rescue for a stuck HUMAN (not scruffy the 12 year old wonder mutt) spread your weight as wide as possible….like your walking on 10’ soft snowpack, snowshoes, boards, tarps, cardboard, evergreen fronds, ANYTHING that allows you to spread your weight and NOT apply too much weight on a footprint sized spot.

Water-jets are the best way to get unstuck.
Sorry, but that does not really apply to this mud... move quickly and stay moving. Do NOT step into a low spot! Once a foot is stuck you are in trouble.


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Originally Posted by AcesNeights
I was just talking about this exact thing with my two children. Now that they’re getting older and going out on their own adventures we review the anticipated problems that might arise and how to respond. They were asking me about quicksand and Cook Inlet tide flats were front and center. I can’t imagine a more terrible way to go.

Prayers for the loved ones left behind.

It's been gnawing on me ever since you made this post about your kids to share a story here I was told by a man that rescued himself from being stuck in the mud flats.

He was a beast of a man, over 400 pounds, he'd just moved in with his parents whom were my friends.

He was 42 bed ridden and dieing of advanced complications with diabetes, go figure, he died a few weeks after we had our conversation.

He told me he use to fish, he'd wade out into waste deep water and stay all afternoon. He said it was common that he sunk in the mud a bit but it'd never been a problem until it was.

He'd been in the same spot for a extended time and hadn't realized how deep he'd sunk into the mud until he tried to free himself.

With his every move he sunk deeper, it seemed there wasn't any way he'd be able to free himself and there was a rapidly moving incoming tide. He had some sorta floating tackle box on a tether that was tied to his waist.
He pulled the tackle box in close to him and was able to get both his arms over it and began forcing it under his chest.

It gave him just enough buoyancy that he stopped sinking and was able to start gaining ground with his efforts to free his legs.
He said he was keeping his head tilted back to keep the water out of his mouth and nose before he finally broke free and was able to swim to shore.

He never fished again, it scared him bad.

I never forgot sitting there listening to him tell me his story, it was a horrific near death experience for him.

It makes me think the average guy in a average shape should be able to accomplish the same as this obeist man that was in poor health.

If he just had a buoyant device of some sort that'd support his weight.

I found these 'Restubes' on Amazon, there are a couple different sizes but uninflated either would fit easily in the bottom of a day pack or float bag or whatever you always have along on such adventures. It's the type of thing that could just stay there so you don't have to remember to bring it along.

I know all mud isn't created equal and it might not always work but it'd beat the hell outta having nothing.

With a length of light weight paracord attached it'd make a suitable rescue throw device anyway.

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Originally Posted by JeffA
............ He had some sorta floating tackle box on a tether that was tied to his waist.
He pulled the tackle box in close to him and was able to get both his arms over it and began forcing it under his chest.

It gave him just enough buoyancy that he stopped sinking and was able to start gaining ground with his efforts to free his legs.........

In my near drowning briefly described above, my truck broke through the ice, and I went to the bottom of the lake (45' down) trapped in the cab. There were things in the bed of my truck that floated when the truck sank. One of those items was a 5 gallon half full propane tank that was to fuel my ice fishing tent heater. When I finally escaped the cab of the truck and swam back up to the hole in the ice, I was able to use the floating propane tank as a support in my effort to get out of the water and back on the ice. Took about 10 minutes to work my way out of the water. If I'd had no propane tank, I don't think I would have been able to extricate myself.


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Excellent post JeffA.

“Quicksand”, TA mudflats, etc ALL adhere to the same principle of physics as the others, it is a supersaturated, fine substrate that transforms based upon water content, the forces of physics as it relates to the “vacuum” are no different just because it’s in Alaska. TA is most definitely a dangerous place and it can “grab” you faster but if you understand that hydrodynamics and the physical properties of the buoyancy of the human body apply in the “magical Alaskan mud” as it does everywhere else in the world then use that to your benefit if you get stuck……..STAY OFF THOSE MUDFLATS!

I’ve taken enough classes, received enough certifications and responded to enough accidents to know that there isn’t something special about TA glacial silt……before someone wants to regurgitate some bullshit they think makes it special I’ll trust my certifications, licenses, training (including from Anchorage FD trainers) regarding swift water rescue, SCUBA rescue, Marine Patrol….as well as REAL LIFE experience dealing with stuck individuals in many “rescues”. TA has huge tides and fine mud but that doesn’t negate the scientific forces at play and render it magic mud! That’s as polite as I’ll be when a know-it-all wants to spread bullshit by denying FACTS! Everything in my previous post regarding A STUCK INDIVIDUAL APPLIES if you’re stuck.

It’s the tide (or exposure) that kills you not the special magical TA mud. 😉


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And yet, it’s different. 😏 😉


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Originally Posted by AcesNeights
I’ve taken enough classes, received enough certifications and responded to enough accidents to know that there isn’t something special about TA glacial silt……

What is it that makes the mudflats of Cook Inlet so unpredictable and so dangerous? Geologist Susan Winkler of the United States Geological Survey said it is the unique character of the grains of silt that are washed down from surrounding glaciers.

Winkler, who recently transferred to the USGS Denver branch, spent several years studying Cook Inlet sediments.

"The grains are highly angular. When they're deposited, they're in contact with each other in a delicate balance," she explained. "When you step on it, you cause it to become more mobile. Then, when it resettles after you've disturbed it, it tends to be more compacted around your foot. The grains are so angular that they're just locked together.

"You have these grains that are just balanced and they have lots of water between the grains. When you disturb it, the grains rearrange themselves and the water flows out and when they rearrange, they're more compact."

https://akfatal.net/Dickison.htm

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Originally Posted by AKwolverine
Originally Posted by AcesNeights
I’ve taken enough classes, received enough certifications and responded to enough accidents to know that there isn’t something special about TA glacial silt……

What is it that makes the mudflats of Cook Inlet so unpredictable and so dangerous? Geologist Susan Winkler of the United States Geological Survey said it is the unique character of the grains of silt that are washed down from surrounding glaciers.

Winkler, who recently transferred to the USGS Denver branch, spent several years studying Cook Inlet sediments.

"The grains are highly angular. When they're deposited, they're in contact with each other in a delicate balance," she explained. "When you step on it, you cause it to become more mobile. Then, when it resettles after you've disturbed it, it tends to be more compacted around your foot. The grains are so angular that they're just locked together.

"You have these grains that are just balanced and they have lots of water between the grains. When you disturb it, the grains rearrange themselves and the water flows out and when they rearrange, they're more compact."

https://akfatal.net/Dickison.htm

Thank you.


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Originally Posted by ironbender
And yet, it’s different. 😏 😉
Yes, it is.


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Originally Posted by AcesNeights
Excellent post JeffA.

“Quicksand”, TA mudflats, etc ALL adhere to the same principle of physics as the others, it is a supersaturated, fine substrate that transforms based upon water content, the forces of physics as it relates to the “vacuum” are no different just because it’s in Alaska. TA is most definitely a dangerous place and it can “grab” you faster but if you understand that hydrodynamics and the physical properties of the buoyancy of the human body apply in the “magical Alaskan mud” as it does everywhere else in the world then use that to your benefit if you get stuck……..STAY OFF THOSE MUDFLATS!

I’ve taken enough classes, received enough certifications and responded to enough accidents to know that there isn’t something special about TA glacial silt……before someone wants to regurgitate some bullshit they think makes it special I’ll trust my certifications, licenses, training (including from Anchorage FD trainers) regarding swift water rescue, SCUBA rescue, Marine Patrol….as well as REAL LIFE experience dealing with stuck individuals in many “rescues”. TA has huge tides and fine mud but that doesn’t negate the scientific forces at play and render it magic mud! That’s as polite as I’ll be when a know-it-all wants to spread bullshit by denying FACTS! Everything in my previous post regarding A STUCK INDIVIDUAL APPLIES if you’re stuck.

It’s the tide (or exposure) that kills you not the special magical TA mud. 😉

Sorry, did not mean to twist your thong.

I am not going to fall back on anything but facts and will simply state TA glacial mud is different in many ways as wolverine's post states. Sticking more appendages in the mud as you sprawl does not work. The increased agitation just sinks you faster.

I have spent significant time out there on the mud flats with individuals engaged in figuring out the science.


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It would appear that holding a hooligan net in waste deep water somehow provides a mystical protective force against the TA mud, completely invisible to those desperately trying not to run over the careless net jousters darting across the Seward Hwy.

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Originally Posted by ArcherBunker
It would appear that holding a hooligan net in waste deep water somehow provides a mystical protective force against the TA mud, completely invisible to those desperately trying not to run over the careless net jousters darting across the Seward Hwy.
Nope, not a bit of mystery. The cuts with significant directed current have the fines washed out leaving a solid bottom of sand to gravel.

There is still mud there, but not in the conditions needed to sink you.


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