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Originally Posted by RinB
John,

I have an instance where a 270 would have gotten an antelope that I couldn’t kill with my 280.

I had drawn a permit in an area of Wyoming which was known to have some big antelope bucks. When I packed I forgot my 280 handloads. I drove about 500 miles across southern Idaho and Wyoming stopping in every place that might have a box of ammo. Couldn’t find one box.

I got my best ever antelope using a borrowed rifle. That experience ended my love affair with the 280. Incidentally I have never seen a box of 280 for sale anywhere I have traveled in Namibia, Zimbabwe, RSA, etc.

Rick

Rick,

Yep!

I recently told a similar story about a local friend of mine here. His wife and two teenages daughters also hunted, and to simplify things he got them all .280 Remingtons. They all drew pronghorn tags in eastern Montana, in a pretty remote area about a 5-6 hour drive from here.

After they started hunting they ran out of his handloads pretty quickly, partly due an incident with a pronghorn-shaped and colored rock. They drove to the nearest small town, which took close to an hour, where only the gas station/convenience store sold ammo. It had plenty of the usual suspects--.223, .243, .270, 7mm Remington Magnum, .308, .30-06--but no .280s. Same deal in the next town, and the next....

Once home he sold/traded all the .280s and got everybody .270s.


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If availability of ammo or components is the main issue, everyone should just take their 308.

Which is what just took to Africa. Upon arrival I found that my PH was a 280 Remington fan and had a supply of factory ammo, handloads and a rifle.

So when I go back, the 280 goes too.

The same PH said he and his clients had killed many lions with his 280 using 170-175 grain bullets.

When I asked Phil about bringing a 280 for big bears, he said it was fine with good bullets and good shot placement.

I would rather shoot a 175 grain spitzer partition in a 280 than the 150 or 160 grain 270 equivalents. If you are under gunned, every little bit helps. It can’t hurt that’s for sure.

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Phil also says the .270 is fine with good bullets.

Might also state that the PH I've hunted with most in Africa, who was also the most-experienced for all sorts of reasons, used three rifles for his backup work for many years until he retired a few years ago. They were a 7x57, .375 H&H and .458 Lott, and he used the 7x57 for all his plains-game guiding, including for eland--taking several that his hunters had already wounded with larger cartridges. (He used the .375 for buffalo back-up, and again finished off quite a few that were wounded by clients using larger rounds. He used the .458 Lott only for elephant guiding.)
Also have a local friend who went on a cull maybe a decade ago, and killed around 30 eland with his 7x57, using 154-grain Hornady Interlock Spire Points, everything up through mature bulls.

If you really, truly your .280 will kill stuff a .270 won't, then by all means you should use it.


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The 280 is a sentimental favorite for me,which is as rational as any other argument I have. Hey,you’re the guy who wrote the book on being a rifle loony.

Last edited by ruraldoc; 12/04/23.
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I’ve been a fan of the .280 AI for some time. I had to sell mine a few years back. I used it for everything from around 2004 until I sold it in 2018. It was a very accurate rifle and got good velocity. I enjoyed the lack of trimming necessary and good selection of bullets.

I purchased a donor action in 2019 to build another once financial woes were resolved. I had the brass, bullets, and reamer still, so it was common sense. The donor rifle happened to be a .270 Winchester. I tried to order a barrel but they were back ordered into oblivion. I had reloading equipment and components for .270 from loading for family members’ rifles. I decided to go ahead and whitetail hunt with the .270 barrel. It shot good and worked well. Then 2020 hit and components and parts were impossible to attain. I chose to keep using the .270 since it was there. I practiced quite a bit with the rifle and finally the barrel gave up the ghost verified by borescope. I thought I would go ahead and turn it into a .280 AI but lead times were over a year. There was a .277” barrel in stock and I had a $100 gift card to use. The rest is history. I just bought a second .270 Winchester in planning to build that .280 AI but don’t see a reason at the moment. Between the .270 Win and the 6.5 PRCs I don’t have the itch for anything else.


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Originally Posted by ruraldoc
The 280 is a sentimental favorite for me,which is as rational as any other argument I have. Hey,your the guy who wrote the book on being a rifle loony.

Yep--and the reason I got my first .280 was getting a very good deal on set of .280 loading dies at a local gun show! So of course I had get one--which happened to be the custom Dave Gentry rifle I hunted with for a dozen years....


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Originally Posted by Mule Deer
If you can provide an instance where a .280 or .280 AI dropped some animal where a .270 wouldn't have just as well, please do.

Don't think I implied that. It's ok for me to not like 270's isn't it?


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I have both, can’t tell any difference when I shoot deer and pigs. None of the animals have complained

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Originally Posted by hanco
I have both, can’t tell any difference when I shoot deer and pigs. None of the animals have complained

But were they dead? wink


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John I have a custom .280 AI with nice walnut stock that I built for my youngest son. I wish that I had just built him a
270 Win. Life would now be very simple. The .280AI has too many issues and complicates life. Perhaps a rechamberng job to 7mm Rem. Mag. Will solve issues except for the belt on the case.


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I’m no writer nor pretend to be but have been around many who have shot both cartridges and have both My father had a couple of 280’s. First was a 700 Mountain Rifle the second a Browning Abolt which I currently have. My uncles ran 270’s. Winchester bolts be it a M70 or the J.C.Highins variant and a couple of 700 BDLs. We all shot deer in mass quantities due to being on a large potato farm in northern Michigan and shot them from zero to kiddy corner of a 40 acre field. I could never really tell the difference in performance on deer after seeing several hundred examples. 130 Speer BTSP for the 270’s and 140”s for the 280s. Now to really stir the pot. Most deer expired within 0=30 yards. Just a good combination of the right bullet and right load. The only time when things went to hell is when my one uncle traded his 270 in for a 7 mm Rem Mag and started using factory loaded Remington 150 grain core lokt loads. Sold that rifle back within two weeks and bought a new Remington 700 BDL 270. When you find the sweet spot don’t screw with it I guess.


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roanmtn,

Just did an article for Sports Afield on the reasons for the commercial success or failure of various smokeless rifle cartridges. One of 'em discussed was the 7mm Remington Magnum, which for some reason is still by far the most popular 7mm magnum on earth--and maybe the most popular 7mm cartridge of all.

This is despite it not having the "design features" considered essential by many cutting-edge shooters today, such as a beltless case, 30-degree shoulder angle, and a longer neck.... wink


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I like 7mm's and have a 7mm08, .280 Rem and 7mm Rem Mag. I bought the .280, a Rem Custom KS Mountain Rifle, used and somewhat by accident, as I was looking for that particular rifle in either .270 or .280. I happened to find a slightly used .280 and it's a shooter. I've used it the most of the three rifles as it's both easy to carry and accurate.

I've never had a .270 as I figured my .280 was functionally the same. Based on my experience, the three 7mm's I have all work well in most hunting situations I encounter. The 7mm RM might be a little more appropriate for larger animals using heavier bullets, but I've seen my wife kill bull elk very effectively with the 7mm08 so any difference is not great.

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Originally Posted by RinB
John,

I have an instance where a 270 would have gotten an antelope that I couldn’t kill with my 280.

I had drawn a permit in an area of Wyoming which was known to have some big antelope bucks. When I packed I forgot my 280 handloads. I drove about 500 miles across southern Idaho and Wyoming stopping in every place that might have a box of ammo. Couldn’t find one box.

I got my best ever antelope using a borrowed rifle. That experience ended my love affair with the 280. Incidentally I have never seen a box of 280 for sale anywhere I have traveled in Namibia, Zimbabwe, RSA, etc.

Rick
Rick told me this story, and I love it! Pragmatically I’d have to buy a 7mag if I thought I needed an advantage over the 270. The problem with all this is that everything is being judged at the end of the rope, the furthest distance. A place that is largely irrelevant and low in probability.
S.

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Thanks Mule Deer. My son is not a man who really loves the outdoors as all of us here on the Campfire. I built the rifle for him when he was fourteen years old and he has never hunted with his rifle. He is now 34 years old. O well! You can't make him love the life all of us cherish. He has complained about no factory ammo available. Well yes! I purchased reloading equipment for him to learn reloading. Maybe lighting will strike if I pray a lot!!!! I have two sons and have never been hunting with either boy. I am jealous when I see other men with their son's going hunting. I was divorced from their mother and not there. I should have just built a 7mm mag and solved the factory ammo problem.


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Originally Posted by roanmtn
Thanks Mule Deer. My son is not a man who really loves the outdoors as all of us here on the Campfire. I built the rifle for him when he was fourteen years old and he has never hunted with his rifle. He is now 34 years old. O well! You can't make him love the life all of us cherish. He has complained about no factory ammo available. Well yes! I purchased reloading equipment for him to learn reloading. Maybe lighting will strike if I pray a lot!!!! I have two sons and have never been hunting with either boy. I am jealous when I see other men with their son's going hunting. I was divorced from their mother and not there. I should have just built a 7mm mag and solved the factory ammo problem.

A bit of a different situation with my son, I have bought him guns both rifles and pistols along with ammo to go with them and he NEVER shoots them !!

On the other hand he loves going hunting with me, loves the outdoors and is way better than me at spotting game he just has zero desire to pull the trigger, so I have given up putting him in for tags and now put in my oldest grandson instead

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I have two little grand daughters who will be able to go fishing with me. I will be too old, if I live, to take them hunting. Their dad is the son who has never hunted with the .280 AI. However, this son loves to fish. Maybe he'll hunt someday. Sooooo.... we'll just go fishing.

Last edited by roanmtn; 12/05/23. Reason: Spelling

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Mule Deer I will be looking for your article if you are able to tell me what issue of Sports Afield I need to buy. This subject very much interests me. I buy this magazine from my local bookstore.


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I've probably taken seven deer with the .270 over the years and one antelope. That's the last time I shot a .270. The antelope was taken in 2009.

I found a pretty good deal on DWM 1909 Argentine Mauser that was barreled to the .280 Rem. It also came with a nice piece if lumber for the stock. My gunsmith had had a heart attack so he farmed my components out to Sterling Davenport and he did a glorious job on that rifle. My rifle may be one of the very last ones he did before retiring. So far, all I've shot with the rifle is paper. A bad accident and other health problems have prevented me from hunting but if I can draw a tag next year I will be out in the field even if I have to use crutches. I would like to try the .280 on elk if I get a tag but I'll settle for deer.
PJ


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Originally Posted by roanmtn
Mule Deer I will be looking for your article if you are able to tell me what issue of Sports Afield I need to buy. This subject very much interests me. I buy this magazine from my local bookstore.

I just sent it in a couple weeks ago, so it will probably appear in the March-April issue.


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