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Campfire Ranger
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Have been watching for that. Thank you for the link. Confirms some things I had heard secondhand.
Brutal.
RIP Maynards and peace be with the survivors - this will be with them forever.
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Joined: Mar 2007
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Bad, bad deal, but also bizzare. If it was known that the boat was taking on water, and folks had life vests on, why weren't they outside of the cabin? All of one family survived and got on the dinghy but none of the other? They had to pass coordinates over the radio instead of hitting the EPIRB, or PLB if this was a private, non charter boat? The Coast Guard requires some sort of emergency beacon even on non-commercial maritime vessels, right? The coast guard knows right where it sank, but can't find it? Must have been a severe tidal current.
There's something that just isn't clicking in about this.
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Joined: Sep 2013
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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They had to pass coordinates over the radio instead of hitting the EPIRB, or PLB if this was a private, non charter boat? All the newer marine radios are equipped with an emergency DSC button, which will transmit your position. But it has to be set up. Not sure if they had one or knew how to use it. But it’s never a bad idea to relay coordinates for potential good samaritan vessels - there are usually quite a few in K bay. The Coast Guard requires some sort of emergency beacon even on non-commercial maritime vessels, right? No. The coast guard knows right where it sank, but can't find it? Must have been a severe tidal current. Yes.
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Joined: Oct 2004
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2004
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They had to pass coordinates over the radio instead of hitting the EPIRB, or PLB if this was a private, non charter boat? All the newer marine radios are equipped with an emergency DSC button, which will transmit your position. But it has to be set up. Not sure if they had one or knew how to use it. But it’s never a bad idea to relay coordinates for potential good samaritan vessels - there are usually quite a few in K bay. The Coast Guard requires some sort of emergency beacon even on non-commercial maritime vessels, right? No. The coast guard knows right where it sank, but can't find it? Must have been a severe tidal current. Yes. VHF DSC is great technology. It's often misunderstood and underutilized. Get a distress alert out immediately upon the first hint of apprehension. If it turns out that you resolve the issue, you can always follow up with the Coast Guard. Smaller uninspected passenger vessels aren't required to have an EPIRB. Those 100 tons of greater operating more than 3 miles out are. inspected charter vessels are required. Kinda crazy that the smaller, more vulnerable vessels are exempt.
Last edited by PaulBarnard; 10/13/24.
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 24,411 Likes: 106
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 24,411 Likes: 106 |
Have been watching for that. Thank you for the link. Confirms some things I had heard secondhand.
Brutal.
RIP Maynards and peace be with the survivors - this will be with them forever. Do you know the make/model of the boat? Obviously didn’t have working automatic pumps or a high water alarm. A lot if times that access cover seal on the offshore bracket will go bad and get enough people on the back deck and you can take on water in a hurry.
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Joined: Sep 2003
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Tracker
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Joined: Feb 2004
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Bad, bad deal, but also bizzare. If it was known that the boat was taking on water, and folks had life vests on, why weren't they outside of the cabin? All of one family survived and got on the dinghy but none of the other? They had to pass coordinates over the radio instead of hitting the EPIRB, or PLB if this was a private, non charter boat? The Coast Guard requires some sort of emergency beacon even on non-commercial maritime vessels, right? The coast guard knows right where it sank, but can't find it? Must have been a severe tidal current.
There's something that just isn't clicking in about this. I agree Tinman. Fishy to say the least. Jim
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 20,661 Likes: 105
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 20,661 Likes: 105 |
They had to pass coordinates over the radio instead of hitting the EPIRB, or PLB if this was a private, non charter boat? All the newer marine radios are equipped with an emergency DSC button, which will transmit your position. But it has to be set up. Not sure if they had one or knew how to use it. But it’s never a bad idea to relay coordinates for potential good samaritan vessels - there are usually quite a few in K bay. The Coast Guard requires some sort of emergency beacon even on non-commercial maritime vessels, right? No. The coast guard knows right where it sank, but can't find it? Must have been a severe tidal current. Yes. Thanks for that. I know next to nothing about those regulations. Sounds like a lot of issues were present that culminated into this tragedy. I still think something is off and/or that article was terribly written.
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Joined: Jan 2011
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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Bad deal, plenty of unanswered questions.
Was the boat a rental? Who owned it?
I would assume the batteries went dead when the hull filled with water, no one noticed the electronics not working?
Apparently Weston went back and pulled the dog out of the V berth, assume that would be through a hatch over the V berth. Where were the Maynard's? It was nose up at this time.
Bilge pump wasn't on a auto switch or wasn't working.
If they had just been anchored up, I would think were in less than 200 feet of water.
Plenty of current in CI. Did the boat move that much?
"Nothing has been the same since Skinny hooked up to the grid"
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 20,661 Likes: 105
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 20,661 Likes: 105 |
Bad deal, plenty of unanswered questions.
Was the boat a rental? Who owned it?
I would assume the batteries went dead when the hull filled with water, no one noticed the electronics not working?
Apparently Weston went back and pulled the dog out of the V berth, assume that would be through a hatch over the V berth. Where were the Maynard's? It was nose up at this time.
Bilge pump wasn't on a auto switch or wasn't working.
If they had just been anchored up, I would think were in less than 200 feet of water.
Plenty of current in CI. Did the boat move that much? The article says they pulled anchor-then-tried to start the engines. If there's any shred of truth to that the electronics had to be working but that doesn't mean that the bilge system was. Question for those familiar with such things. Is it normal to use battery power to winch an anchor up, then start engines? A 28 foot vessel had to have quite a heavy anchor that would stress batteries pretty good. I seriously doubt it was hand pulled up. I usually do 2-3 charter trips a year from various ports around Alaska and remember the engines always running when bringing an anchor up. It just seems weird to me to not do so. After rereading the article, I found a few more things that just doesn't make sense and suspect it is just terribly written and/or incorrect.
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Joined: Sep 2013
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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No, personal boat of the Perkovich family.
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Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 2,111 Likes: 29
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Jan 2011
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Bad deal, plenty of unanswered questions.
Was the boat a rental? Who owned it?
I would assume the batteries went dead when the hull filled with water, no one noticed the electronics not working?
Apparently Weston went back and pulled the dog out of the V berth, assume that would be through a hatch over the V berth. Where were the Maynard's? It was nose up at this time.
Bilge pump wasn't on a auto switch or wasn't working.
If they had just been anchored up, I would think were in less than 200 feet of water.
Plenty of current in CI. Did the boat move that much? The article says they pulled anchor-then-tried to start the engines. If there's any shred of truth to that the electronics had to be working but that doesn't mean that the bilge system was. Question for those familiar with such things. Is it normal to use battery power to winch an anchor up, then start engines? A 28 foot vessel had to have quite a heavy anchor that would stress batteries pretty good. I seriously doubt it was hand pulled up. I usually do 2-3 charter trips a year from various ports around Alaska and remember the engines always running when bringing an anchor is winched up. It just seems weird to me to not do so. After rereading the article, I found a few more things that just doesn't make sense and suspect it is just terribly written and/or incorrect. Good catch, normally I will run the engine when pulling the anchor although its not a absolute necessity to do so. The article also said he went to pull the anchor and start the engines, which did not start. Suspect the anchor did not get pulled either. As you said the article leaves a lot to be desired. If they had a electric winch (likely) than batteries would be required, in which case, why didn't the engines start? They could have been pulling the anchor with a buoy, which requires power. Assume batteries were below the deck, thinking older boat as most newer boats have the batteries in a locker at the transom, but not a absolute.
"Nothing has been the same since Skinny hooked up to the grid"
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Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 2,111 Likes: 29
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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Posts: 2,111 Likes: 29 |
No, personal boat of the Perkovich family. Any idea of the make?
"Nothing has been the same since Skinny hooked up to the grid"
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Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 20,919 Likes: 282
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2013
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No, personal boat of the Perkovich family. Any idea of the make? No.
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 24,411 Likes: 106
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2003
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Its always easy to second guess these things but boats sink much faster than people think.
A few things.. It was probably really heavy with 8+ gear. Probably a true 26' boat as 28 is probably loa.
either a hatch or they dunked a bilge or macerator outlet and water came in. There has been some big commercial boats that have sank from dunking the bilge outlet. Once the ball gets rolling on that it's hard to reverse once it gets to a certain point. Could have been toilet plumbing too
-IF you are ever a capt of a boat, put the battery voltage in big lettering on your plotter and watch it like a hawk. Put the low voltage alarm on. That alone would have resulted in much earlier detection and more time to get out a distress call. Voltage is your life and your ticket home. I watch my voltage like a scaredy cat all season long.
-Make sure you have an auto pump in the stern and middle hooked up to a bright light on the dash. That light goes off a few times when it normally doesn't, you better be pulling open a hatch to look. Always run your pump when first getting on step and make note of how long water comes out. Sometimes a hatch and bilge switch will fail and slowly take on water but the operator won't notice until there is a ton of water in the boat. I have seen it happen over the course of a few weeks and the boat feels heavier but the capt gets used to it as it gradual. Manually hit that switch and watch the flow. Most boats will take on water from the top deck, even self bailing.
There are tons of smaller boats out there now compared to yesteryears. Look for more deaths and accidents as a result.
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I run with 2 bilge pumps, one is smallish on a float switch, the other is large with a 1" outlet.
(24 foot boat)
Both can be turned on at the helm, if the float switch turns the smaller one on automatically, the switch at the helm lights up and I can hear it if we are just sitting.
Boat maintenance and particularly electrical is often neglected. Older boats can be horrible as people keep adding on more & more stuff without any idea of what they are doing.
"Nothing has been the same since Skinny hooked up to the grid"
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Joined: Sep 2013
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 20,919 Likes: 282 |
Its always easy to second guess these things but boats sink much faster than people think.
A few things.. It was probably really heavy with 8+ gear. Probably a true 26' boat as 28 is probably loa.
either a hatch or they dunked a bilge or macerator outlet and water came in. There has been some big commercial boats that have sank from dunking the bilge outlet. Once the ball gets rolling on that it's hard to reverse once it gets to a certain point. Could have been toilet plumbing too
-IF you are ever a capt of a boat, put the battery voltage in big lettering on your plotter and watch it like a hawk. Put the low voltage alarm on. That alone would have resulted in much earlier detection and more time to get out a distress call. Voltage is your life and your ticket home. I watch my voltage like a scaredy cat all season long.
-Make sure you have an auto pump in the stern and middle hooked up to a bright light on the dash. That light goes off a few times when it normally doesn't, you better be pulling open a hatch to look. Always run your pump when first getting on step and make note of how long water comes out. Sometimes a hatch and bilge switch will fail and slowly take on water but the operator won't notice until there is a ton of water in the boat. I have seen it happen over the course of a few weeks and the boat feels heavier but the capt gets used to it as it gradual. Manually hit that switch and watch the flow. Most boats will take on water from the top deck, even self bailing.
There are tons of smaller boats out there now compared to yesteryears. Look for more deaths and accidents as a result. All very true; and great advice from someone who does it on a daily basis. Things go south fast, panic ensues, bad [bleep] happens. Super sad deal.
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Joined: Sep 2013
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 20,919 Likes: 282 |
The other thing that is hard to appreciate and conceptualize if you have never experienced it, is just how fast and powerful Cook Inlet currents can be - up to four+ knots. There are times out there it’s a literal river.
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 29,840 Likes: 410
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 29,840 Likes: 410 |
Its always easy to second guess these things but boats sink much faster than people think.
A few things.. It was probably really heavy with 8+ gear. Probably a true 26' boat as 28 is probably loa.
either a hatch or they dunked a bilge or macerator outlet and water came in. There has been some big commercial boats that have sank from dunking the bilge outlet. Once the ball gets rolling on that it's hard to reverse once it gets to a certain point. Could have been toilet plumbing too
-IF you are ever a capt of a boat, put the battery voltage in big lettering on your plotter and watch it like a hawk. Put the low voltage alarm on. That alone would have resulted in much earlier detection and more time to get out a distress call. Voltage is your life and your ticket home. I watch my voltage like a scaredy cat all season long.
-Make sure you have an auto pump in the stern and middle hooked up to a bright light on the dash. That light goes off a few times when it normally doesn't, you better be pulling open a hatch to look. Always run your pump when first getting on step and make note of how long water comes out. Sometimes a hatch and bilge switch will fail and slowly take on water but the operator won't notice until there is a ton of water in the boat. I have seen it happen over the course of a few weeks and the boat feels heavier but the capt gets used to it as it gradual. Manually hit that switch and watch the flow. Most boats will take on water from the top deck, even self bailing.
There are tons of smaller boats out there now compared to yesteryears. Look for more deaths and accidents as a result. Audible bilge alarm, damage control kit with a ditch kit in a float free location. Get the distress alert out the instant you get that oh schidt feeling. Get everyone in PFDs. Nobody in the cabin of a boat. A bilge alarm can give early warning of a problem and buy time to effect emergency repairs.
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