Anyone have more details? Sow/cub type thing? You just never know, got to stay vigilant in those parts. I've only been deer hunting once in SE and had to defend myself. Fortunately ended with a dead bear.
Alaska State Troopers were notified of an overdue deer hunter in the Sitka area on Oct. 29. Alaska Wildlife Troopers, USCG, and Sitka SAR, conducted land-based searches on Wednesday, with three search teams combing in the remote wooded area that they reached with the help of a state trooper vessel and Sitka search-and-rescue vessel.
By 11:30 a.m. Wednesday, the remains 50-year-old Tad Fujioka of Sitka were found near a deer carcass. Investigation revealed he was the likely victim of a fatal bear mauling.
Fujioka, who was a salmon troller, was chairman of the Board of Directors of Seafood Producers Cooperative and was active in advocacy for the troll fishery in Southeast Alaska. He was also a parent.
Life Member - NRA & Second Amendment Foundation (SAF) I have Dual Citizenship... Texan by birth, Alaskan by the grace of God! My favorite music color is still "the BLUZ"
I can't figure out why he would 1. cache a deer overnight on baranof and 2. come back for it by himself.
You can't prevent all bear interactions but geez, that's putting yourself in the very highest risk category. SEAK deer hunters are already high enough risk without adding those two variables.
Anyone have more details? Sow/cub type thing? You just never know, got to stay vigilant in those parts. I've only been deer hunting once in SE and had to defend myself. Fortunately ended with a dead bear.
If you don’t mind sharing your bear attack, I would like to hear the story and details of how it happened and what you used to kill the bear.
"When guns are outlawed,only the outlaws will have guns".
Everything that you can imagine as a death you do not want to experience is encompassed in being attacked, and eaten by a bear. I can not imagine a worse way to go.
Everything that you can imagine as a death you do not want to experience is encompassed in being attacked, and eaten by a bear. I can not imagine a worse way to go.
Everything that you can imagine as a death you do not want to experience is encompassed in being attacked, and eaten by a bear. I can not imagine a worse way to go.
Tad sounded like a good Dude, RIP.
A worse way to go would be living a long life and going into an aged-care home, becoming a vegetable and never really having taken any risks and doing the things you would have liked to have done.
Everything that you can imagine as a death you do not want to experience is encompassed in being attacked, and eaten by a bear. I can not imagine a worse way to go.
Tad sounded like a good Dude, RIP.
A worse way to go would be living a long life and going into an aged-care home, becoming a vegetable and never really having taken any risks and doing the things you would have liked to have done.
You mean like Carter?
I have done some research based on Forensic Analysis of humans killed and eaten by bears. In most cases is it a relatively slow death. Guess what actually kills people in most cases when it comes to bears attacks?
I do not like the thought or prospect of being in a vegetative state in a nursing home, luckily for Canadians we can opt for Euthanasia.
Guess what actually kills people in most cases when it comes to bears attacks?
At one time I believe it was sepsis. if you were to look at recent statistics, I suspect that’s no longer the case, and it is probably trauma secondary to the initial attack. But if you have the numbers and verified statistics, please share. Also curious if your numbers are broken down black vs. brown.
From what I have read, based on Forensic Analysis, victims bleed out.
What a Grizz will do once you are incapacitated it will start by eating your arms or legs, while it holds you down by simply putting a paw on your chest as it eats you alive. This accounts for the bleeding out aspect.
Most people think you are dead with a paw slap, that is not what happens. Videos of bears eating prey, display this scenario.
I started reading about and studying bear attacks when I moved out west and started bow hunting in Grizz country. Scared the chit out of me which is why when I bow hunt, I always hold my shotgun in my hands and my bow in on my sling until I need it.
They do not mind the screaming, crying or death moaning as they dine, here is an example with a calf elk.
Don't not watch if you have a weak stomach. Nature is brutal.
From what I have read, based on Forensic Analysis, victims bleed out.
What a Grizz will do once you are incapacitated it will start by eating your arms or legs, while it holds you down by simply putting a paw on your chest as it eats you alive. This accounts for the bleeding out aspect.
In your reading of forensic analysis, what percentage of “grizz” attacks are predatory?
From what I have read, based on Forensic Analysis, victims bleed out.
What a Grizz will do once you are incapacitated it will start by eating your arms or legs, while it holds you down by simply putting a paw on your chest as it eats you alive. This accounts for the bleeding out aspect.
In your reading of forensic analysis, what percentage of “grizz” attacks are predatory?
To be honest, I read it many years ago when I moved out west from Queerbec, there are no Grizz in Queerbec, so I wasn't concerned about it, when I started hunting in the Rockies, I educated myself. If you Google it you may be able to find it.
I have killed many bears, and I have no intention of being eaten alive by a bear. I would not have left a deer carcass over night and gone back to get it like Tad did.
From what I have read, based on Forensic Analysis, victims bleed out.
What a Grizz will do once you are incapacitated it will start by eating your arms or legs, while it holds you down by simply putting a paw on your chest as it eats you alive. This accounts for the bleeding out aspect.
I don’t know about the bears in your study, but this bear was frequently around our cabin on my grandfather’s homestead. This was 1983 and we were there that night.
The man was dragged from his tent, let go and then dragged again by the bear and the bear consumed 75 pounds of the guy. He started in the groin area and ate most of his body cavity, not touching the arms or legs…
Moore said the bear dragged May for several yards while the victim shouted and struggled to free himself. The grizzly turned away momentarily, and May told his friend, 'I'm hurt, bad... but I'm OK now.' The bear then returned and dragged May away, said Moore.
First of all does it make a difference, arms, legs, cock or balls first?
Anyway you slice it, being eaten alive by a bear isn't good. Secondly it was not my study, it was a study I read. I have only repeated what I read from a forensic analysis, which I read years ago to educate myself.
As stated I have killed many bears, and I treat every bear as a potential man eater. One that attacked me, when I was bow hunting them back in the day, didn't realize I had a shotgun as well as my bow with me and for that mistake, I blew his head off with my shotgun at point blank range.
From what I have read, based on Forensic Analysis, victims bleed out.
What a Grizz will do once you are incapacitated it will start by eating your arms or legs, while it holds you down by simply putting a paw on your chest as it eats you alive. This accounts for the bleeding out aspect.
I don’t know about the bears in your study, but this bear was frequently around our cabin on my grandfather’s homestead. This was 1983 and we were there that night.
The man was dragged from his tent, let go and then dragged again by the bear and the bear consumed 75 pounds of the guy. He started in the groin area and ate most of his body cavity, not touching the arms or legs…
Moore said the bear dragged May for several yards while the victim shouted and struggled to free himself. The grizzly turned away momentarily, and May told his friend, 'I'm hurt, bad... but I'm OK now.' The bear then returned and dragged May away, said Moore.
That was the Hebgen lake incident wasn’t it? I remember it well as we were in the park at that time. Can’t believe that’s 40+ years ago.
From what I have read, based on Forensic Analysis, victims bleed out.
What a Grizz will do once you are incapacitated it will start by eating your arms or legs, while it holds you down by simply putting a paw on your chest as it eats you alive. This accounts for the bleeding out aspect.
I don’t know about the bears in your study, but this bear was frequently around our cabin on my grandfather’s homestead. This was 1983 and we were there that night.
The man was dragged from his tent, let go and then dragged again by the bear and the bear consumed 75 pounds of the guy. He started in the groin area and ate most of his body cavity, not touching the arms or legs…
Moore said the bear dragged May for several yards while the victim shouted and struggled to free himself. The grizzly turned away momentarily, and May told his friend, 'I'm hurt, bad... but I'm OK now.' The bear then returned and dragged May away, said Moore.
That was the Hebgen lake incident wasn’t it? I remember it well as we were in the park at that time. Can’t believe that’s 40+ years ago.
Yes, it was. The bear ate 75 pounds of the camper, so they trapped him with a culvert trap, euthanized him and did some analysis to determine why he killed and ate the camper. I’m no scientist, but it is clear to me that when a bear eats 75 pounds of meat and guts, he was obviously hungry.
I could have saved them thousands of dollars in analytical forensics…
From what I have read, based on Forensic Analysis, victims bleed out.
What a Grizz will do once you are incapacitated it will start by eating your arms or legs, while it holds you down by simply putting a paw on your chest as it eats you alive. This accounts for the bleeding out aspect.
I don’t know about the bears in your study, but this bear was frequently around our cabin on my grandfather’s homestead. This was 1983 and we were there that night.
The man was dragged from his tent, let go and then dragged again by the bear and the bear consumed 75 pounds of the guy. He started in the groin area and ate most of his body cavity, not touching the arms or legs…
Moore said the bear dragged May for several yards while the victim shouted and struggled to free himself. The grizzly turned away momentarily, and May told his friend, 'I'm hurt, bad... but I'm OK now.' The bear then returned and dragged May away, said Moore.
That was the Hebgen lake incident wasn’t it? I remember it well as we were in the park at that time. Can’t believe that’s 40+ years ago.
Yes, it was. The bear ate 75 pounds of the camper, so they trapped him with a culvert trap, euthanized him and did some analysis to determine why he killed and ate the camper. I’m no scientist, but it is clear to me that when a bear eats 75 pounds of meat and guts, he was obviously hungry.
I could have saved them thousands of dollars in analytical forensics…
Anyone have more details? Sow/cub type thing? You just never know, got to stay vigilant in those parts. I've only been deer hunting once in SE and had to defend myself. Fortunately ended with a dead bear.
If you don’t mind sharing your bear attack, I would like to hear the story and details of how it happened and what you used to kill the bear.
Hunting deer on Kodiak island in 2008. I guess it was a bad berry year and the bears were grouchy. My buddy shot a deer up on the hillside, we dressed it and were packing meat down to the lake. I was in front, he was a few steps behind. I foolishly had my gun on my shoulder, had gotten tired hauling meat and busting through the thick stuff and put the gun on my shoulder instead of in my hands. I had a brief alert with breaking branches and shaking alders and he came busting out of the brush about 17' in front of me coming hard. I instinctively took a step back as I went to get rifle off my shoulder, tripped and went over backwards. My buddy shot him and he turned enough that he didn't run me over. We both unloaded on him until he quit moving. About a 4 yo male. We were both shooting .300 Win Mag.
The craziest thing about this is that just days earlier we had gone to the site where Matt Sutton had been attacked. (His story made it into Outdoor Life, you can look it up. The youtube link below is his story.) We were working for Dean Andrews of Andrews Airways, remodeling some hanger space. Bill Bush was working with us, he is the guy in the story that was with Matt out there in Vikoda Bay. After Matt was attacked he dragged himself down to the water, leaving his pack behind. In his pack was his digital camera, glasses, etc. We decided to go out there and get his stuff for him. Bill wasn't interested in making that trip so he gave us directions as best he could to find the spot. Dean Andrews flew us out there and we trudged around until we found the site. It was pretty surreal. A 10'x10' area torn up, bits of camo hanging in the brush, blood, his pack and walking stick. Just imagining the scene made the hair stand up. I've got the pictures somewhere. He's a tough dude.
Bill was an incredible guy, tough old codger. He kept Matt alive for a few days until they finally made contact for rescue. It was a pretty ugly few days for them, he wasn't going to let Matt die out there. He had Matt's bloody clothes at the jobsite, one of those old school white thermal undershirts that was mostly red.
Anyway, with that scenario pretty fresh in mind, we didn't bother taking names or asking questions, just put that teenage son of a bitch in the dirt when he came calling.
Anyone have more details? Sow/cub type thing? You just never know, got to stay vigilant in those parts. I've only been deer hunting once in SE and had to defend myself. Fortunately ended with a dead bear.
If you don’t mind sharing your bear attack, I would like to hear the story and details of how it happened and what you used to kill the bear.
Hunting deer on Kodiak island in 2008. I guess it was a bad berry year and the bears were grouchy. My buddy shot a deer up on the hillside, we dressed it and were packing meat down to the lake. I was in front, he was a few steps behind. I foolishly had my gun on my shoulder, had gotten tired hauling meat and busting through the thick stuff and put the gun on my shoulder instead of in my hands. I had a brief alert with breaking branches and shaking alders and he came busting out of the brush about 17' in front of me coming hard. I instinctively took a step back as I went to get rifle off my shoulder, tripped and went over backwards. My buddy shot him and he turned enough that he didn't run me over. We both unloaded on him until he quit moving. About a 3 yo male. Luckily it was nice and thick in there, so he likely turned into a few meals for his mates. We were both shooting .300 Win Mag. I think I may have a claw or two somewhere in the pile.
The craziest thing about this is that just days earlier we had gone to the site where Matt Sutton had been attacked. (His story made it into Outdoor Life, you can look it up. The youtube link below is his story.) We were working for Dean Andrews of Andrews Airways, remodeling some hanger space. Bill Bush was working with us, he is the guy in the story that was with Matt out there in Vikoda Bay. After Matt was attacked he dragged himself down to the water, leaving his pack behind. In his pack was his digital camera, glasses, etc. We decided to go out there and get his stuff for him. Bill wasn't interested in making that trip so he gave us directions as best he could to find the spot. Dean Andrews flew us out there and we trudged around until we found the site. It was pretty surreal. A 10'x10' area torn up, bits of camo hanging in the brush, blood, his pack and walking stick. Just imagining the scene made the hair stand up. I've got the pictures somewhere. He's a tough dude.
Bill was an incredible guy, tough old codger. He kept Matt alive for a few days until they finally made contact for rescue. It was a pretty ugly few days for them, he wasn't going to let Matt die out there. He had Matt's bloody clothes at the jobsite, one of those old school white thermal undershirts that was mostly red.
Anyway, with that scenario pretty fresh in mind, we didn't bother taking names or asking questions, just put that teenage son of a bitch in the dirt when he came calling.
Having spent many decades around brown bears, especially on Kodiak and the mainland across...
Ayway, there is way TOO much bullshit added by people with zero bear experience. There is virtually zero reality in the vast majority of the "tale."
Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
I took the measures that the situation called for. Buddy of mine got fined when he turned in a DLP for not leaving the nut sack on the hide. The brown shirt harassed him for not firing a warning shot, even though his 10 year old son was with him, and the bear dropped about rifle length away. Never know what you'll get from those guys.
They do add a bit in that rendition, but pretty much happened as it is told. Matt acknowledged his blunder of trying to run the bears off, probably cost him a few more staples.
Swamp, the unfortunate reality is your racism/anti-semitism casts a pall over what you have to say on any given topic.
Blowing off regs is an insult to honest people who follow them. Those who have nothing to hide don’t hide things.
The fact that you resort to made up nonsense terms created by marxists to shout people down who have a voice, such as "racism & anti-semitism" shows that you are one of the brainwashed morons ...
"The welfare of humanity is always the alibi of tyrants".
There’s no made up nonsense here, and I’m not shouting at anyone. Do you affirm or disavow your previous statements about the Jewish people and the historical reality of the holocaust?
Swamp, the unfortunate reality is your racism/anti-semitism casts a pall over what you have to say on any given topic.
Blowing off regs is an insult to honest people who follow them. Those who have nothing to hide don’t hide things.
Call it whatever you like... AK courts have a long history of hammering people turning themselves in for minor infractions... And going light on those fighting it to the bitter end.
Exactly opposite what they should be doing.
Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
So you never handled your DLP legally because you were scared due to the experience of another person? Just seeking clarification.
You sound nice. The deal with my buddy happened several years after mine, so no I wasn't "scared" because of that experience. Only meant as an example, of far too many, of the hassle of dealing with people. Kinda like now with you. Everyone is an expert on what happened, even tho they weren't there. Better to live and let die. Of course, I may just be making up a story, can't believe everything you read on the internet...
Objectively, I tend to lend credibility to Alaskans who have lived or have hunted in Alaska/Canada MT/WY over other sources on Alaskan bear incidents.
Any that muddy the water with irrelevant statements are dismissed. YOU were not there.
Last summer near Prescott, AZ. a cabin owner was mauled and killed by a black bear. Four years ago a WY guide was killed by a sow grizzly when the guide and hunter returned to the elk bow kill. Grizzly and half-grown cub had taken over the elk kill. Guide left wife and chldren. It happens in the lower-48 also.
When moose or bear/deer/caribou hunting, I carry a Colt New Service with RCMP lanyard along with a 348 or 450 Alaskan Winchester M-71. Bears in poor crop years have no sense of humor and are hungry. With cubs, a grizzly sow in most cases is not a Sierra Club member and wants you gone. It just takes one incident of bad luck, aggressive bear, poor planning or bad judgment to drop you off the food chain.
"The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena-not the critic"-T. Roosevelt There are no atheists in fox holes or in the open doors of a para's aircraft.....
Objectively, I tend to lend credibility to Alaskans who have lived or have hunted in Alaska/Canada MT/WY over other sources on Alaskan bear incidents.
Any that muddy the water with irrelevant statements are dismissed. YOU were not there.
Last summer near Prescott, AZ. a cabin owner was mauled and killed by a black bear. Four years ago a WY guide was killed by a sow grizzly when the guide and hunter returned to the elk bow kill. Grizzly and half-grown cub had taken over the elk kill. Guide left wife and chldren. It happens in the lower-48 also.
When moose or bear/deer/caribou hunting, I carry a Colt New Service with RCMP lanyard along with a 348 or 450 Alaskan Winchester M-71. Bears in poor crop years have no sense of humor and are hungry. With cubs, a grizzly sow in most cases is not a Sierra Club member and wants you gone. It just takes one incident of bad luck, aggressive bear, poor planning or bad judgment to drop you off the food chain.
From what I read, Tad's horrific demise was because of poor planning.
My policy in bear country, get the meat out same day and ASAP, because where I hunt in Alberta Grizz are protected and have no fear of man. They hear a shot, they know there is at least a gut pile with bones to munch on.
I have been told by friends that have hunted Sitka Deer that they are tiny, a few lbs. of meat isn't worth dying for.
Leave the guts and carcass there for the critters to feed on, and DON'T GO BACK.
I was going to stay out of this conversation. However, decided to say something important. I once had a large male Alaska Coastal Brown Bear on top of me (or could be said "over" me) for about 18 to 20 minutes. I remained motionless for the time, taking half breaths. Moving only my eyes. I was not hurt in any way. So, my point is as hard as that was, I knew it was my only hope of not being mauled to death. Remining motionless is hard, very hard, but it can and did work.
ALASKA is a "HARD COUNTRY for OLDMEN". (But if you live it wide'ass open, balls'to the wall, the pedal floored, full throttle, it is a delightful place, to finally just sit-back and savor those memories while sipping Tequila).
First of all does it make a difference, arms, legs, cock or balls first?
Anyway you slice it, being eaten alive by a bear isn't good. Secondly it was not my study, it was a study I read. I have only repeated what I read from a forensic analysis, which I read years ago to educate myself.
As stated I have killed many bears, and I treat every bear as a potential man eater. One that attacked me, when I was bow hunting them back in the day, didn't realize I had a shotgun as well as my bow with me and for that mistake, I blew his head off with my shotgun at point blank range.
Better to be sitting On Them, than In Them!
Any pics of the bear you killed with the shotgun? Just curious and what ammo choice.
I hate that any bear has to be killed in DLP situations but it happens. And its much better than the human dying. I"m around bears a lot during about 6-7 months a year. I"m not at all paranoid of them but I do carry at least a 9mm all the time. At least I really try to have a gun with me constantly regardless just in case. I'm probably 99% good at it. The 9mm did just fine on one black bear destroying our camp. I had another try to rip a tent off me, but I deferred, I try like heck not to shoot a bear when I have clients. Its just a mess of paperwork and a kind of PITA I try to avoid so I crawled out of the now fly less tent with one hole from claws into the tent itself and had quite the discussion with that bear to get it to leave that night. Had it come back that night I probably would have shot it. Thankfully it was 2 nights before it came back and I heard it, and managed to punch it through the tent who knows what it was going to do that night. It never came back after I made contact with it.
Another guide had a similar issue. Once contact was made the bear left the area.
RIP to the hunt and prayers to his family and friends.
We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
I once had (7) "SEVEN" Alaska Coastal Brown Bears in camp all night. I worked constantly to keep pushing them out, to frustrating not going to happen, so I went to bed.
ALASKA is a "HARD COUNTRY for OLDMEN". (But if you live it wide'ass open, balls'to the wall, the pedal floored, full throttle, it is a delightful place, to finally just sit-back and savor those memories while sipping Tequila).
Objectively, I tend to lend credibility to Alaskans who have lived or have hunted in Alaska/Canada MT/WY over other sources on Alaskan bear incidents.
Any that muddy the water with irrelevant statements are dismissed. YOU were not there.
Last summer near Prescott, AZ. a cabin owner was mauled and killed by a black bear. Four years ago a WY guide was killed by a sow grizzly when the guide and hunter returned to the elk bow kill. Grizzly and half-grown cub had taken over the elk kill. Guide left wife and chldren. It happens in the lower-48 also.
When moose or bear/deer/caribou hunting, I carry a Colt New Service with RCMP lanyard along with a 348 or 450 Alaskan Winchester M-71. Bears in poor crop years have no sense of humor and are hungry. With cubs, a grizzly sow in most cases is not a Sierra Club member and wants you gone. It just takes one incident of bad luck, aggressive bear, poor planning or bad judgment to drop you off the food chain.
From what I read, Tad's horrific demise was because of poor planning.
My policy in bear country, get the meat out same day and ASAP, because where I hunt in Alberta Grizz are protected and have no fear of man. They hear a shot, they know there is at least a gut pile with bones to munch on.
I have been told by friends that have hunted Sitka Deer that they are tiny, a few lbs. of meat isn't worth dying for.
Leave the guts and carcass there for the critters to feed on, and DON'T GO BACK.
Just stop. He was known and armchair quarterbacking does no one any good.
Objectively, I tend to lend credibility to Alaskans who have lived or have hunted in Alaska/Canada MT/WY over other sources on Alaskan bear incidents.
Any that muddy the water with irrelevant statements are dismissed. YOU were not there.
Last summer near Prescott, AZ. a cabin owner was mauled and killed by a black bear. Four years ago a WY guide was killed by a sow grizzly when the guide and hunter returned to the elk bow kill. Grizzly and half-grown cub had taken over the elk kill. Guide left wife and chldren. It happens in the lower-48 also.
When moose or bear/deer/caribou hunting, I carry a Colt New Service with RCMP lanyard along with a 348 or 450 Alaskan Winchester M-71. Bears in poor crop years have no sense of humor and are hungry. With cubs, a grizzly sow in most cases is not a Sierra Club member and wants you gone. It just takes one incident of bad luck, aggressive bear, poor planning or bad judgment to drop you off the food chain.
From what I read, Tad's horrific demise was because of poor planning.
My policy in bear country, get the meat out same day and ASAP, because where I hunt in Alberta Grizz are protected and have no fear of man. They hear a shot, they know there is at least a gut pile with bones to munch on.
I have been told by friends that have hunted Sitka Deer that they are tiny, a few lbs. of meat isn't worth dying for.
Leave the guts and carcass there for the critters to feed on, and DON'T GO BACK.
Just stop. He was known and armchair quarterbacking does no one any good.
I've killed 4 DLP bears; 2 with 12 ga slugs. One with a 308, one with a 44 mag. Paperwork done on all 4. A lot of work skinning all those bears that you can't keep.
Didn't mean to hijack this thread.
NRA Benefactor Member
Those who live by the sword get shot by those who don't.
I still need to know what ammo to use to blow a bears head off. Wife did it to a deer once. surprised us. 300 wtby and 168 ballistic tips. I'd never seen that before or since. Fairly sure we have an old 35mm picture of that somewhere.
We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
First of all does it make a difference, arms, legs, cock or balls first?
Anyway you slice it, being eaten alive by a bear isn't good. Secondly it was not my study, it was a study I read. I have only repeated what I read from a forensic analysis, which I read years ago to educate myself.
As stated I have killed many bears, and I treat every bear as a potential man eater. One that attacked me, when I was bow hunting them back in the day, didn't realize I had a shotgun as well as my bow with me and for that mistake, I blew his head off with my shotgun at point blank range.
Better to be sitting On Them, than In Them!
Any pics of the bear you killed with the shotgun? Just curious and what ammo choice.
I hate that any bear has to be killed in DLP situations but it happens. And its much better than the human dying. I"m around bears a lot during about 6-7 months a year. I"m not at all paranoid of them but I do carry at least a 9mm all the time. At least I really try to have a gun with me constantly regardless just in case. I'm probably 99% good at it. The 9mm did just fine on one black bear destroying our camp. I had another try to rip a tent off me, but I deferred, I try like heck not to shoot a bear when I have clients. Its just a mess of paperwork and a kind of PITA I try to avoid so I crawled out of the now fly less tent with one hole from claws into the tent itself and had quite the discussion with that bear to get it to leave that night. Had it come back that night I probably would have shot it. Thankfully it was 2 nights before it came back and I heard it, and managed to punch it through the tent who knows what it was going to do that night. It never came back after I made contact with it.
Another guide had a similar issue. Once contact was made the bear left the area.
RIP to the hunt and prayers to his family and friends.
Hi rost495, I do not have a picture because that bear I killed was dragged away by another bear overnight.
If you like I will tell you the full story, it was my first bear hunt, I didn't know what I was doing and it didn't go as planned.
I shot that bear in the top of the head with a 2 3/4 " Federal Power Shok, inches away from me. Very effective!
Don't cover yourself with Bacon Grease and Sow in Heat Scent when you go bear hunting lol
I was going to stay out of this conversation. However, decided to say something important. I once had a large male Alaska Coastal Brown Bear on top of me (or could be said "over" me) for about 18 to 20 minutes. I remained motionless for the time, taking half breaths. Moving only my eyes. I was not hurt in any way. So, my point is as hard as that was, I knew it was my only hope of not being mauled to death. Remining motionless is hard, very hard, but it can and did work.
One of our guides got knocked down by a teenager after a charge. He fought. And won. Not sure about tactics and thoughts but it worked for him. No bite. Nothing really. Bear didn't know what he had charged after 2 rifle warning shots.
Not sure I could stay still. OTOH if I had no way to win the battle I guess I could be motivated enough to stay still. I know I'd fight to the end on any black bear period.
We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
First of all does it make a difference, arms, legs, cock or balls first?
Anyway you slice it, being eaten alive by a bear isn't good. Secondly it was not my study, it was a study I read. I have only repeated what I read from a forensic analysis, which I read years ago to educate myself.
As stated I have killed many bears, and I treat every bear as a potential man eater. One that attacked me, when I was bow hunting them back in the day, didn't realize I had a shotgun as well as my bow with me and for that mistake, I blew his head off with my shotgun at point blank range.
Better to be sitting On Them, than In Them!
Any pics of the bear you killed with the shotgun? Just curious and what ammo choice.
I hate that any bear has to be killed in DLP situations but it happens. And its much better than the human dying. I"m around bears a lot during about 6-7 months a year. I"m not at all paranoid of them but I do carry at least a 9mm all the time. At least I really try to have a gun with me constantly regardless just in case. I'm probably 99% good at it. The 9mm did just fine on one black bear destroying our camp. I had another try to rip a tent off me, but I deferred, I try like heck not to shoot a bear when I have clients. Its just a mess of paperwork and a kind of PITA I try to avoid so I crawled out of the now fly less tent with one hole from claws into the tent itself and had quite the discussion with that bear to get it to leave that night. Had it come back that night I probably would have shot it. Thankfully it was 2 nights before it came back and I heard it, and managed to punch it through the tent who knows what it was going to do that night. It never came back after I made contact with it.
Another guide had a similar issue. Once contact was made the bear left the area.
RIP to the hunt and prayers to his family and friends.
Hi rost495, I do not have a picture because that bear I killed was dragged away by another bear overnight.
If you like I will tell you the full story, it was my first bear hunt, I didn't know what I was doing and it didn't go as planned.
I shot that bear in the top of the head with a 2 3/4 " Federal Power Shok, inches away from me. Very effective!
Don't cover yourself with Bacon Grease and Sow in Heat Scent when you go bear hunting lol
Power shock buckshot I'm guessing rather than a slug? Interesting choice. I could see that putting a dent in a head for sure. But I can't see it blowing it off. LOL. I'm sure you just over exaggerated that part.
And no, I would have NEVER thought to do sow and bacon grease for a bear hunt. ON my body. Not even sure how that would come to mind actually.
Glad ya survived.
We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
Anyone have more details? Sow/cub type thing? You just never know, got to stay vigilant in those parts. I've only been deer hunting once in SE and had to defend myself. Fortunately ended with a dead bear.
If you don’t mind sharing your bear attack, I would like to hear the story and details of how it happened and what you used to kill the bear.
Hunting deer on Kodiak island in 2008. I guess it was a bad berry year and the bears were grouchy. My buddy shot a deer up on the hillside, we dressed it and were packing meat down to the lake. I was in front, he was a few steps behind. I foolishly had my gun on my shoulder, had gotten tired hauling meat and busting through the thick stuff and put the gun on my shoulder instead of in my hands. I had a brief alert with breaking branches and shaking alders and he came busting out of the brush about 17' in front of me coming hard. I instinctively took a step back as I went to get rifle off my shoulder, tripped and went over backwards. My buddy shot him and he turned enough that he didn't run me over. We both unloaded on him until he quit moving. About a 3 yo male. Luckily it was nice and thick in there, so he likely turned into a few meals for his mates. We were both shooting .300 Win Mag. I think I may have a claw or two somewhere in the pile.
The craziest thing about this is that just days earlier we had gone to the site where Matt Sutton had been attacked. (His story made it into Outdoor Life, you can look it up. The youtube link below is his story.) We were working for Dean Andrews of Andrews Airways, remodeling some hanger space. Bill Bush was working with us, he is the guy in the story that was with Matt out there in Vikoda Bay. After Matt was attacked he dragged himself down to the water, leaving his pack behind. In his pack was his digital camera, glasses, etc. We decided to go out there and get his stuff for him. Bill wasn't interested in making that trip so he gave us directions as best he could to find the spot. Dean Andrews flew us out there and we trudged around until we found the site. It was pretty surreal. A 10'x10' area torn up, bits of camo hanging in the brush, blood, his pack and walking stick. Just imagining the scene made the hair stand up. I've got the pictures somewhere. He's a tough dude.
Bill was an incredible guy, tough old codger. He kept Matt alive for a few days until they finally made contact for rescue. It was a pretty ugly few days for them, he wasn't going to let Matt die out there. He had Matt's bloody clothes at the jobsite, one of those old school white thermal undershirts that was mostly red.
Anyway, with that scenario pretty fresh in mind, we didn't bother taking names or asking questions, just put that teenage son of a bitch in the dirt when he came calling.
Having spent many decades around brown bears, especially on Kodiak and the mainland across...
Ayway, there is way TOO much bullshit added by people with zero bear experience. There is virtually zero reality in the vast majority of the "tale."
Many. Hmm. Can't find definition, would have guessed normally that would mean something like 10 or more. At least double digits. Decade. 10 years. Man you are looking good for your age. Grins.
We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
First of all does it make a difference, arms, legs, cock or balls first?
Anyway you slice it, being eaten alive by a bear isn't good. Secondly it was not my study, it was a study I read. I have only repeated what I read from a forensic analysis, which I read years ago to educate myself.
As stated I have killed many bears, and I treat every bear as a potential man eater. One that attacked me, when I was bow hunting them back in the day, didn't realize I had a shotgun as well as my bow with me and for that mistake, I blew his head off with my shotgun at point blank range.
Better to be sitting On Them, than In Them!
Any pics of the bear you killed with the shotgun? Just curious and what ammo choice.
I hate that any bear has to be killed in DLP situations but it happens. And its much better than the human dying. I"m around bears a lot during about 6-7 months a year. I"m not at all paranoid of them but I do carry at least a 9mm all the time. At least I really try to have a gun with me constantly regardless just in case. I'm probably 99% good at it. The 9mm did just fine on one black bear destroying our camp. I had another try to rip a tent off me, but I deferred, I try like heck not to shoot a bear when I have clients. Its just a mess of paperwork and a kind of PITA I try to avoid so I crawled out of the now fly less tent with one hole from claws into the tent itself and had quite the discussion with that bear to get it to leave that night. Had it come back that night I probably would have shot it. Thankfully it was 2 nights before it came back and I heard it, and managed to punch it through the tent who knows what it was going to do that night. It never came back after I made contact with it.
Another guide had a similar issue. Once contact was made the bear left the area.
RIP to the hunt and prayers to his family and friends.
Hi rost495, I do not have a picture because that bear I killed was dragged away by another bear overnight.
If you like I will tell you the full story, it was my first bear hunt, I didn't know what I was doing and it didn't go as planned.
I shot that bear in the top of the head with a 2 3/4 " Federal Power Shok, inches away from me. Very effective!
Don't cover yourself with Bacon Grease and Sow in Heat Scent when you go bear hunting lol
Power shock buckshot I'm guessing rather than a slug? Interesting choice. I could see that putting a dent in a head for sure. But I can't see it blowing it off. LOL. I'm sure you just over exaggerated that part.
And no, I would have NEVER thought to do sow and bacon grease for a bear hunt. ON my body. Not even sure how that would come to mind actually.
Glad ya survived.
No it was a Slug! 2 3/4" Federal.
But after learning and I am a Self Taught Big Game Hunter, when I bow hunt in bear county now my Mossy 88 Maverick is loaded with 2 slugs followed by 3 - 3" Magnum 00 Federal Buckshot. 00 Buckshot is absolutely devastating, and if you shoot any bear in the face with 00, it isn't running through it.
I learned that after shooting a rather large bear with 2 - 2 3/4" slugs at 13 yards. That bear ran away and I actually thought I missed, because he ran into the bush right next to my bait barrel, he made it about 40 yards! When I gutted him both his lungs and liver were liquefied, still can believe he made it that far.
Close encounters < 10 yards 00 buckshot is the way to go IMHO.
Yes when I said "Blew his head off" I did not mean that his entire head came off. But basically his head was opened right up with most of his brains blown out, which I consider Blown off.
Dang, playing dead for that long would take nerves of steel.
My favorite bear story is Gene Moe. 69 yo badass that punched a bear in the nose and broke his neck. I think he stuck a knife in his neck a few times and was digging it around, they figure he must have done enough damage that when he punched it the neck broke.
Local pard here has a fun little story about 8? Brownies IIRC around black bear bait site, tree, and helping itself to the tree stand. There was an ursine fatality.
It’s been posted once or twice. Seems like this is a thread for an encore
hint, buddy.
Last edited by ironbender; 11/03/24.
If you take the time it takes, it takes less time. --Pat Parelli
American by birth; Alaskan by choice. --ironbender
Buckshot and or a shotgun would be my personal last choice for defense on bears.
I saw video of a friend last year kill a brown bear with a slug. It ran off a bit. Bears generally run and or move until you hit CNS or they bleed out.
As long as we are all happy with our choices its good enough. And hopefully we never find out. Though I was happy to confirm that 9mm is more than enough in my instance. Which means my 10mm and my 460 Rowland. And my 458 Win mag are all more than enough.
In big bear country I would not be comfortable with anything less than a 375 and prefer 416 up. Especially as a backup gun.
Kind of interesting though that some folks seem like bear magnets. And others go forever without much of an encounter.
I still don't trust black bears though. Just big nosey PITA raccoons basically to me. They keep poking until prodded. Brown and Grizzly seem much more civilized to me.
We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
Kind of interesting though that some folks seem like bear magnets. And others go forever without much of an encounter.
My buddy has been grabbed twice by bears on Baranof. The first time deer hunting in some thick brush and the second time when he was doing a stream survey. He was walking down the stream when he came around a rock outcropping and the bear was right there above him. He struck the bear with the butt plate of his rifle and gouged his hand on the bear's canine when it slipped off the rifle. The bear basically walked over the top of him and left. It's always made me more nervous because I look a lot like him and move a lot like him and it made me wonder if I might have some of his "bear magnetism."
My condolences to the family. Some years ago while fishing in the King Salmon, Alaska area, I briefly encountered a huge bear who seemed to resent my presents on his creek. I felt under-gunned with my 6-weight Sage.
For those that are fans of buckshot, [not me] try some Fiochi nickel plated buckshot and you'll find superior penetration in most cases.
Well said. Anything in shot that needs to be better, hard shot and nickel plated does better than just lead buck. Have used nickel plated a lot on pigs. It works good on them.
A great reminder of things we choose, and could they be better. I"d totally forgotten about nickel plated...
Copper plated in the day was SO much better on turkeys at distance than just lead... Nickel made that even better.
Wonder if there is any even denser stuff that wouldn't shatter on impact. Tungsten and the like.
But I'm with ya. Buckshot and bears just isn't a choice I"m willing to risk.
We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
Dang. I'm gonna update my favorite thing about living in Iowa List.
LOL. Bears are really a non issue. I feel much safer in AK than getting on the road and driving in TX. My odds of a fatal or even non fatal wreck are MUCH higher the months I'm in TX.
We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
Anyone have more details? Sow/cub type thing? You just never know, got to stay vigilant in those parts. I've only been deer hunting once in SE and had to defend myself. Fortunately ended with a dead bear.
If you don’t mind sharing your bear attack, I would like to hear the story and details of how it happened and what you used to kill the bear.
Hunting deer on Kodiak island in 2008. I guess it was a bad berry year and the bears were grouchy. My buddy shot a deer up on the hillside, we dressed it and were packing meat down to the lake. I was in front, he was a few steps behind. I foolishly had my gun on my shoulder, had gotten tired hauling meat and busting through the thick stuff and put the gun on my shoulder instead of in my hands. I had a brief alert with breaking branches and shaking alders and he came busting out of the brush about 17' in front of me coming hard. I instinctively took a step back as I went to get rifle off my shoulder, tripped and went over backwards. My buddy shot him and he turned enough that he didn't run me over. We both unloaded on him until he quit moving. About a 3 yo male. Luckily it was nice and thick in there, so he likely turned into a few meals for his mates. We were both shooting .300 Win Mag. I think I may have a claw or two somewhere in the pile.
The craziest thing about this is that just days earlier we had gone to the site where Matt Sutton had been attacked. (His story made it into Outdoor Life, you can look it up. The youtube link below is his story.) We were working for Dean Andrews of Andrews Airways, remodeling some hanger space. Bill Bush was working with us, he is the guy in the story that was with Matt out there in Vikoda Bay. After Matt was attacked he dragged himself down to the water, leaving his pack behind. In his pack was his digital camera, glasses, etc. We decided to go out there and get his stuff for him. Bill wasn't interested in making that trip so he gave us directions as best he could to find the spot. Dean Andrews flew us out there and we trudged around until we found the site. It was pretty surreal. A 10'x10' area torn up, bits of camo hanging in the brush, blood, his pack and walking stick. Just imagining the scene made the hair stand up. I've got the pictures somewhere. He's a tough dude.
Bill was an incredible guy, tough old codger. He kept Matt alive for a few days until they finally made contact for rescue. It was a pretty ugly few days for them, he wasn't going to let Matt die out there. He had Matt's bloody clothes at the jobsite, one of those old school white thermal undershirts that was mostly red.
Anyway, with that scenario pretty fresh in mind, we didn't bother taking names or asking questions, just put that teenage son of a bitch in the dirt when he came calling.
Having spent many decades around brown bears, especially on Kodiak and the mainland across...
Ayway, there is way TOO much bullshit added by people with zero bear experience. There is virtually zero reality in the vast majority of the "tale."
Many. Hmm. Can't find definition, would have guessed normally that would mean something like 10 or more. At least double digits. Decade. 10 years. Man you are looking good for your age. Grins.
Early '80s to present close enough?
Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
Dang, playing dead for that long would take nerves of steel.
My favorite bear story is Gene Moe. 69 yo badass that punched a bear in the nose and broke his neck. I think he stuck a knife in his neck a few times and was digging it around, they figure he must have done enough damage that when he punched it the neck broke.
OMG!!!!!!!!!!!!! Gene's story is a great one, but none of the elements other than name, age, and badass status exist in your translation!
He did not break the bear's neck, let alone by punching. He did not stab the bear in the neck.
The story has been posted here many times.
Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
Buckshot and or a shotgun would be my personal last choice for defense on bears.
I saw video of a friend last year kill a brown bear with a slug. It ran off a bit. Bears generally run and or move until you hit CNS or they bleed out.
As long as we are all happy with our choices its good enough. And hopefully we never find out. Though I was happy to confirm that 9mm is more than enough in my instance. Which means my 10mm and my 460 Rowland. And my 458 Win mag are all more than enough.
In big bear country I would not be comfortable with anything less than a 375 and prefer 416 up. Especially as a backup gun.
Kind of interesting though that some folks seem like bear magnets. And others go forever without much of an encounter.
I still don't trust black bears though. Just big nosey PITA raccoons basically to me. They keep poking until prodded. Brown and Grizzly seem much more civilized to me.
I completely understand your position and where you are coming from!
In my case where I hunt it isn't legal to carry a hand gun while bow hunting, neither is it legal to carry a rifle, our stupid F'ing Government at work again.
As you know 90+ % of bear attacks are a surprise attack and at very close range, typically in tight bush and you have seconds to react.
For me 00 Buckshot < 15 yards is the best option and will stop anything in North America in its tracks and with 00 you have a wider pattern with 8 to 9 BB'S, which to me is ideal over 1 slug. There isn't a bear in North America that is going to shrug off a face full of 00 at under 15 yards.
I have killed 2 bears with Slugs, one about 12 inches away in the head, not a problem, but as mentioned the other I shot twice @ 13 Yards with slugs and he made it 40 yards from where I shot him, and the damage was enormous with both lungs and his liver Liquefied.
3 shots in quick succession with 00 sends out 27 BB's, the best option IMHO. I am fortunate that I was never attacked by a grizz and had to put that test through the challenge! A black bear attacking me was Intense Enough!
Originally Posted by AGL4now
I was going to stay out of this conversation. However, decided to say something important. I once had a large male Alaska Coastal Brown Bear on top of me (or could be said "over" me) for about 18 to 20 minutes. I remained motionless for the time, taking half breaths. Moving only my eyes. I was not hurt in any way. So, my point is as hard as that was, I knew it was my only hope of not being mauled to death. Remining motionless is hard, very hard, but it can and did work.
OMG, I have never heard anything like that! Would you care to share your story in more detail, would be awesome to hear it?
You must be one VERY INTERESTING CHARACTER, and you definitely have NERVES OF STEEL!
Happy that you got out of that predicament unscathed, so a BIG CONGRATULATIONS to you Sir! 👍👍
OMG, I have never heard anything like that! Would you care to share your story in more detail, would be awesome to hear it?
Not nerves of steel, just the only available option. It is posted elsewhere. I'll try to find it.
ALASKA is a "HARD COUNTRY for OLDMEN". (But if you live it wide'ass open, balls'to the wall, the pedal floored, full throttle, it is a delightful place, to finally just sit-back and savor those memories while sipping Tequila).
Buckshot and or a shotgun would be my personal last choice for defense on bears.
I saw video of a friend last year kill a brown bear with a slug. It ran off a bit. Bears generally run and or move until you hit CNS or they bleed out.
As long as we are all happy with our choices its good enough. And hopefully we never find out. Though I was happy to confirm that 9mm is more than enough in my instance. Which means my 10mm and my 460 Rowland. And my 458 Win mag are all more than enough.
In big bear country I would not be comfortable with anything less than a 375 and prefer 416 up. Especially as a backup gun.
Kind of interesting though that some folks seem like bear magnets. And others go forever without much of an encounter.
I still don't trust black bears though. Just big nosey PITA raccoons basically to me. They keep poking until prodded. Brown and Grizzly seem much more civilized to me.
I completely understand your position and where you are coming from!
In my case where I hunt it isn't legal to carry a hand gun while bow hunting, neither is it legal to carry a rifle, our stupid F'ing Government at work again.
As you know 90+ % of bear attacks are a surprise attack and at very close range, typically in tight bush and you have seconds to react.
For me 00 Buckshot < 15 yards is the best option and will stop anything in North America in its tracks and with 00 you have a wider pattern with 8 to 9 BB'S, which to me is ideal over 1 slug. There isn't a bear in North America that is going to shrug off a face full of 00 at under 15 yards.
I have killed 2 bears with Slugs, one about 12 inches away in the head, not a problem, but as mentioned the other I shot twice @ 13 Yards with slugs and he made it 40 yards from where I shot him, and the damage was enormous with both lungs and his liver Liquefied.
3 shots in quick succession with 00 sends out 27 BB's, the best option IMHO. I am fortunate that I was never attacked by a grizz and had to put that test through the challenge! A black bear attacking me was Intense Enough!
Originally Posted by AGL4now
I was going to stay out of this conversation. However, decided to say something important. I once had a large male Alaska Coastal Brown Bear on top of me (or could be said "over" me) for about 18 to 20 minutes. I remained motionless for the time, taking half breaths. Moving only my eyes. I was not hurt in any way. So, my point is as hard as that was, I knew it was my only hope of not being mauled to death. Remining motionless is hard, very hard, but it can and did work.
OMG, I have never heard anything like that! Would you care to share your story in more detail, would be awesome to hear it?
You must be one VERY INTERESTING CHARACTER, and you definitely have NERVES OF STEEL!
Happy that you got out of that predicament unscathed, so a BIG CONGRATULATIONS to you Sir! 👍👍
Really? 90% fit your fantasy of a bear attack? What a clown!
Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
From what I have read and heard tell, most bear attacks where hunters are involved are in tight bush situations with very little time to react. Opps, maybe it is 82.2%. lol
Really? 90% fit your fantasy of a bear attack? What a clown!
I don't understand or like the "Quote" system on this forum. Easy to get confused as to whom is making reference whom. My question is who are you referring to about 90% fantasy of bear attack.....??? ME or someone else.
ALASKA is a "HARD COUNTRY for OLDMEN". (But if you live it wide'ass open, balls'to the wall, the pedal floored, full throttle, it is a delightful place, to finally just sit-back and savor those memories while sipping Tequila).
Really? 90% fit your fantasy of a bear attack? What a clown!
I don't understand or like the "Quote" system on this forum. My question is who are you referring to about 90% fantasy of bear attack.....??? ME or someone else.
He was commentating on my comment, I said 90%, I was simply using a figure from the stories I have read about and heard.
This gentleman was attacked a couple of years ago where I hunt elk, he had no time to react, this is a picture he took of himself walking out of the bush after he was attacked by a Sow Grizz. He is lucky he made it out alive!
Really? 90% fit your fantasy of a bear attack? What a clown!
I don't understand or like the "Quote" system on this forum. My question is who are you referring to about 90% fantasy of bear attack.....??? ME or someone else.
He was commentating on my comment, I said 90%, I was simply using a figure from the stories I have read about and heard.
This gentleman was attacked a couple of years ago where I hunt elk, he had no time to react, this is a picture he took of himself walking out of the bush after he was attacked by a Sow Grizz. He is lucky he made it out alive!
ALASKA is a "HARD COUNTRY for OLDMEN". (But if you live it wide'ass open, balls'to the wall, the pedal floored, full throttle, it is a delightful place, to finally just sit-back and savor those memories while sipping Tequila).
I found the account of the Brown Bear on top of me and will send it Private Mail.
ALASKA is a "HARD COUNTRY for OLDMEN". (But if you live it wide'ass open, balls'to the wall, the pedal floored, full throttle, it is a delightful place, to finally just sit-back and savor those memories while sipping Tequila).
Dang, playing dead for that long would take nerves of steel.
My favorite bear story is Gene Moe. 69 yo badass that punched a bear in the nose and broke his neck. I think he stuck a knife in his neck a few times and was digging it around, they figure he must have done enough damage that when he punched it the neck broke.
OMG!!!!!!!!!!!!! Gene's story is a great one, but none of the elements other than name, age, and badass status exist in your translation!
He did not break the bear's neck, let alone by punching. He did not stab the bear in the neck.
The story has been posted here many times.
Here's the link to the story, it mentions stabbing the bear in the neck several times, and "lethal punch had finished breaking the vertebrae" , but possible that's not accurate. Maybe you were there?
Most copper plated and nickel plated shot these days is just a wash and adds very little to the hardness of the shot. There used to be exceptions.
The best penetrating buckshot load ever made, IMO, was the Remington Premier Magnum XR nickel plated. Not made anymore, but I've preserved some from when I stocked up in the late 80s. These pellets measure a tad over 00 diameter and appear to have a fairly substantial thickness of nickel plating. Damned shame Remington stopped making them. Broadside, they'll shoot through a deer at reasonable ranges. I have no doubt they would perforate any bear at the same ranges.
Winchester makes the Double X load at 1,450 fps. Recoil is downright painful. But they, likewise, will shoot through a deer at reasonable ranges. The shot is copper plated, but it looks like a thin wash to me. But the stuff hits very hard. If I had to rely on a 00 buckshot load in bear country, and if I was out of my Remingtons, I'd pick the these. The 3" load has 12 pellets and also shoots at 1,450 fps. There's a 2 3/4 load, too. The 3" for me patterns best.
Most copper plated and nickel plated shot these days is just a wash and adds very little to the hardness of the shot. There used to be exceptions.
The best penetrating buckshot load ever made, IMO, was the Remington Premier Magnum XR nickel plated. Not made anymore, but I've preserved some from when I stocked up in the late 80s. These pellets measure a tad over 00 diameter and appear to have a fairly substantial thickness of nickel plating. Damned shame Remington stopped making them. Broadside, they'll shoot through a deer at reasonable ranges. I have no doubt they would perforate any bear at the same ranges.
Winchester makes the Double X load at 1,450 fps. Recoil is downright painful. But they, likewise, will shoot through a deer at reasonable ranges. The shot is copper plated, but it looks like a thin wash to me. But the stuff hits very hard. If I had to rely on a 00 buckshot load in bear country, and if I was out of my Remingtons, I'd pick the these. The 3" load has 12 pellets and also shoots at 1,450 fps. There's a 2 3/4 load, too. The 3" for me patterns best.
For that recoil I will take my 458 every time LOL.
I forgot about the plated vs washed thing...
We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
My experience with two close encounters with grizzlies isn't a large enough sample to consider me an expert on shotgun slugs but a friend had a much larger sample to work with. This friend was the gunner for an ADFG heli bear reduction program. In a week he shot 80+ bears [brown & black] with Brenneke Slugs. The local folks were retrieving many of the dead bears for meat and complained about the excessive meat loss due to the Brenneke Slugs. The next spring he went back and shot 60+ with Foster Slugs. Most of the bears required several Foster Slugs but the local folks could "eat right up to the hole".
I bought some 2-3/4" Brenneke Slugs upon his recommendation and gave a 5 pack to a friend in the bush. Within a month, he had to kill a boar that his little dog had brought back to him, and he was asking me to get him more ammo even though he still had 4 left.
Dang, playing dead for that long would take nerves of steel.
My favorite bear story is Gene Moe. 69 yo badass that punched a bear in the nose and broke his neck. I think he stuck a knife in his neck a few times and was digging it around, they figure he must have done enough damage that when he punched it the neck broke.
OMG!!!!!!!!!!!!! Gene's story is a great one, but none of the elements other than name, age, and badass status exist in your translation!
He did not break the bear's neck, let alone by punching. He did not stab the bear in the neck.
The story has been posted here many times.
Here's the link to the story, it mentions stabbing the bear in the neck several times, and "lethal punch had finished breaking the vertebrae" , but possible that's not accurate. Maybe you were there?
I know Gene and his nephew that was hunting with him. I have seen the major scar. I have heard Gene tell the story a number of times. I saw the bear hide and counted the knife wounds myself.
Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
Dang, playing dead for that long would take nerves of steel.
My favorite bear story is Gene Moe. 69 yo badass that punched a bear in the nose and broke his neck. I think he stuck a knife in his neck a few times and was digging it around, they figure he must have done enough damage that when he punched it the neck broke.
OMG!!!!!!!!!!!!! Gene's story is a great one, but none of the elements other than name, age, and badass status exist in your translation!
He did not break the bear's neck, let alone by punching. He did not stab the bear in the neck.
The story has been posted here many times.
Here's the link to the story, it mentions stabbing the bear in the neck several times, and "lethal punch had finished breaking the vertebrae" , but possible that's not accurate. Maybe you were there?
I know Gene and his nephew that was hunting with him. I have seen the major scar. I have heard Gene tell the story a number of times. I saw the bear hide and counted the knife wounds myself.
Just read the linked story. It bears virtually no resemblance to the story I heard from Gene. Pretty disgusting actually.
Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
Really? 90% fit your fantasy of a bear attack? What a clown!
I don't understand or like the "Quote" system on this forum. Easy to get confused as to whom is making reference whom. My question is who are you referring to about 90% fantasy of bear attack.....??? ME or someone else.
I was not questioning you, but rather the clueless clown.
Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
When Liver Eatin Johnson got attacked by a griz, he took out his bowie, plunged it into the griz, and left it there. The griz was distracted and let him be, Liver Eatin made tracks. True story.
Really? 90% fit your fantasy of a bear attack? What a clown!
I don't understand or like the "Quote" system on this forum. Easy to get confused as to whom is making reference whom. My question is who are you referring to about 90% fantasy of bear attack.....??? ME or someone else.
I was not questioning you, but rather the clueless clown.
I’ve seen literally dozens of various sized brown bears killed, have necopsied them, and must say buckshot or foster slugs are among the last things I would trust my life to. A brenneke slug will work, but not impressively so. Brennekes lack sufficient penetration overall and have been found to deflect in ways that a proper rifle does not.
The .375, 9.3, .416, and .458 flavors have impressed me greatly. They bring a combo of power, bullet upset, and straight line penetration that’s an unbeatable problem solver.
Swamp, the unfortunate reality is your racism/anti-semitism casts a pall over what you have to say on any given topic.
Blowing off regs is an insult to honest people who follow them. Those who have nothing to hide don’t hide things.
Call it whatever you like... AK courts have a long history of hammering people turning themselves in for minor infractions... And going light on those fighting it to the bitter end.
Exactly opposite what they should be doing.
You’re not totally wrong there sir. I’ve seen heroin dealers get off easier than a guy killing a sub legal moose. The Alaska judiciary can be pretty goofy.
I’ve seen literally dozens of various sized brown bears killed, have necopsied them, and must say buckshot or foster slugs are among the last things I would trust my life to. A brenneke slug will work, but not impressively so. Brennekes lack sufficient penetration overall and have been found to deflect in ways that a proper rifle does not.
The .375, 9.3, .416, and .458 flavors have impressed me greatly. They bring a combo of power, bullet upset, and straight line penetration that’s an unbeatable problem solver.
Great post Sir!
If you were bow hunting in Grizz country and you were legally not permitted to carry either a Hand Gun or a Rifle and only a Shot Gun which load would you select?
I’ve seen them wounded, not killed by buckshot. Buckshot takes the already limited potential power of the shotgun and divys it up amongst a group of the most ballistically inefficient projectiles in hopes of making something good happen.
Foster slugs are non-penetrating garbage that will barely work on rib only broadside shots, and then not reliably penetrate fully.
20 yards is a helluva long way off for a genuine defensive bear shooting.
I’ve never seen or heard of any professional guide who uses buckshot or foster slugs to back up a client or trail wounded bears. There are very good reasons for that.
24HCF member klikitarik has related his event of shooting a smaller, young brownie with Brennekes and not being successful. Had to get a rifle for success.
If you take the time it takes, it takes less time. --Pat Parelli
American by birth; Alaskan by choice. --ironbender
Barring that, 3” magnum Brennekes and no buckshot. At all.
Yeah, no kidding. Move. But there are some sabot slugs and copper slugs. I'd have to look hard into them. And then compare if 3 inch is actually needed.
No buckshot for me ever. Slugs would have to do some serious reading and confirmation testing for sure.
We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
Just survived a 6 day deer hunting trip on Admiralty Island. Picked up a fall RB-077 tag before we left, just in case these were any "issues". Always take my 35 Whelen over there. Took a kid (28 YO Army Reservist) from Colorado with us to shoot his first deer. Let him shoot my .270 WCF, .30-06 and 300 WSM before the hunt. He insisted on the .270 as that is what he hunts back in CO. Switched the 130 gr load to 150 gr.
Hunting with 3 guys in a single groups kinda sucks, but we made it work. When we got one, 2 guys boned it out and the other guy got to hunt by himself for a little while. Took a few turns with one guy staying at cabin while the other two when out hunting - these were the most productive days.
Hunting was decent - 3 bucks and one doe. Nothing better than a standard forky.
Only saw one buck paired up with a doe. All bucks we got came to the call or rattle.
Have to keep my Resident hunting pard off the trigger as he will shoot anything on 4 legs. We went up to 1,700 ft one day - they seemed to be up high at the snowline. Saw 11 deer that day which was pretty cool. Had a chance at a spike (not what I was looking for) and drilled the tree in front of it. Taught the NR kid from CO how to work the call and he was able to get a couple of does to come in.
Cohos spawning in the stream next to the cabin on Nov. 1 which surprised me Didn't get the election results until the plane picked us up on Nov. 5. Surprised that Trump won by that margin
Didn't look good for the pickup (no planes flew the day before) and the plane shows up 2.5 hrs early. Mad scramble to finish packing, burn trash and clean up cabin. Luckily, no gear was left behind.
Good luck Calvin, there’s some nice bucks in that country. There’s also brown bears, multiple sightings during moose season including one guy who had a big one rushing in on his calling set up.
It is a sad and unfortunate reality that the internet forum platform evolved to its current disrespectful and often savage condition. I sent you a private message. Unfortunate that things can't be posted without the obligatory attacks.
Originally Posted by las
Originally Posted by ironbender
Originally Posted by AGL4now
I found the account of the Brown Bear on top of me and will send it Private Mail.
If you wouldn’t mind, PM to me as well? I’d like to read it.
As would I, please.
ALASKA is a "HARD COUNTRY for OLDMEN". (But if you live it wide'ass open, balls'to the wall, the pedal floored, full throttle, it is a delightful place, to finally just sit-back and savor those memories while sipping Tequila).
It is a sad and unfortunate reality that the internet forum platform evolved to its current disrespectful and often savage condition.
I was wondering why you were being so Secret Squirrel about this, but gotta say it's a smart call.
I am going to explore starting a blog.
ALASKA is a "HARD COUNTRY for OLDMEN". (But if you live it wide'ass open, balls'to the wall, the pedal floored, full throttle, it is a delightful place, to finally just sit-back and savor those memories while sipping Tequila).
Would be interesting if this or some other Hunting focused forums offered blog option.
ALASKA is a "HARD COUNTRY for OLDMEN". (But if you live it wide'ass open, balls'to the wall, the pedal floored, full throttle, it is a delightful place, to finally just sit-back and savor those memories while sipping Tequila).
Good luck Calvin, there’s some nice bucks in that country. There’s also brown bears, multiple sightings during moose season including one guy who had a big one rushing in on his calling set up.
No kidding. We just had to change plans due to unforeseen circumstances. I really wanted to go up there too.
If anyone is interested, Brenneke's Magnum Crush and Black Magics slugs are not hardened. They are massive chunks of pure lead. The Black Magics have been around for years under various names. I've read on some sites that the slug is hardened. It is not.
Brenneke makes several truly hardened slugs. The red Special Forces, the green Green Lightning (which are exactly the same slugs, just one is red and one is green), The Bear Protect (which is the same as the Special Forces and green Lightning), and the new Special Forces Maximum Barrier Penetration Magnum. The last one is presently their hardest, best penetrating slug and is made from high antimony lead.
If anyone is interested, Brenneke's Magnum Crush and Black Magics slugs are not hardened. They are massive chunks of pure lead. The Black Magics have been around for years under various names. I've read on some sites that the slug is hardened. It is not.
Brenneke makes several truly hardened slugs. The red Special Forces, the green Green Lightning (which are exactly the same slugs, just one is red and one is green), The Bear Protect (which is the same as the Special Forces and green Lightning), and the new Special Forces Maximum Barrier Penetration Magnum. The last one is presently their hardest, best penetrating slug and is made from high antimony lead.
The Special Forces Maximum Barrier, if their advertising is correct, seems the current best to me. Too bad Dixie Slugs is no longer around. I bought a few of the Maximum Barrier. Though do not foresee a shotgun replacing my rifles, by first choice. I do want to try these in a shorter barrel Beretta 1301.
I've no clue anyone would want a shotgun unless a rifle was illegal. And at that point I'd still carry a rifle anyway. Maybe put the word shotgun on the side of the stock....
We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
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