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OK, mister, that will be enough of THAT talk! We’re talkin’ guns here. Courtesy and acceptance have no place in such matters! 😳

After many hundreds rounds of skeet from low ready with a PG, POW, and English. I ASSURE you I break targets MUCH faster with an English grip.

For the record, I believe you are the one that started spouting facts about PG being faster. Maybe for you they are, but not me everyone and certainly not me and 98% of the grouse hunters I know.

I use them both and for fast a handling upland shotgun it is hard to beat my Bernardelli XXV copy.

My PG Husqvarna hammer guns feel right at home in the duck blind.

I have an English 10ga hammer upland shotgun that is a dandy.

I love my side by side shotguns (and my o/u's, pumps and autos).

Their grips run from straight through PW to full PG and a couple with what I'd call extreme full PG.

I don't see a lot of difference. I doubt that I ever lost or gained a bird because of the grip configuration of the shotgun being used at the time, I'm just not that refined a shooter.

I realize what you have to hold onto is important to some; to me the whole issue is a lot like this business of having a selection of choke tubes in .005" increments. Hell, some of my shotguns don't even have interchangeable choke tube and the ones that do don't often, if ever, get changed.

I've seriously hunted Grouse for 40 some years....and the majority of those I cross paths with are shooting PG...As far as a PG is faster, I don't remember saying that. Perhaps you can point it out? I did say, I thought it was a better choice.

Then again, since you mentioned low gun skeet....What do the low gun International Olympic skeet shooters use. They throw faster targets, and since getting on target quickly is paramount, what do they use...Straight or PG? Inquiring minds and all that....

Perhaps someday I will get around to using a 2 trigger straight SxS and perhaps see the light....

Battue Tell me about those dogs!! Great Pics! Thanks for sharing!

Thanks….
They are both FBEC…field breed English Cockers. A completely different animal than the American Cockers.Essentially a smaller version of a hunting Springer Spaniel.

The white one is pushing 8 and the black 3.

Congrats fine looking hunting buddies!

It looks like they’re sneering at your shotgun. Must be the straight grip. 😳

Always trust the dog.

Na, they are wiser than us…..All they care about is a mouthful of feathers!!!!😁

I had a custom gun made for me and went with double triggers and a straight stock. My stock maker spent a lot of time with me at the patterning board and no detail was overlooked. Aside from the traditional Length of pull and cast measurements, my stocker was especially interested in how thick the grip and its its length to the comb was because of the size of my hands. He said a lot of off the shelf straight stocks don't fit a lot of people really well. I had a CSMC 16 RBL that I sent down the road because of the fat grip area I did not like.

In the end I needed 15 1/8 LOP with a bit of cast on for my left handedness. At 6' 3" with long arms I needed a longer grip area and went with a somewhat diamond shaped grip. The length of the grip was measured for me with the flute of the comb shaped in such a way to catch the base of my palm and ensure a consistent hold with no variation. I shoot this gun lights out and scored my first ever woodcock double with it the first year I used it.

This kind of attention to detail does not come cheap but in the end it was worth it.

Nice… if you don’t mind who was the fitter?

Dan Rossiter before he went to Griffin & Howe.

Thanks!!!!

I like fast, light scatter guns . My upland guns are a Merkel 28G, Franchi 28G , and couple others all straight grip ,light and fast.

Probably a good 90% of the guys I know that use SxS guns have straight grips. But then they have an unhealthy knowledge of the writings of long gone grouse writers bird shooters such as Evans, Woolner, Buckingham, et al as well as later oracles such as McIntosh, Zutz, and the like making their choice based in nostalgia rather than any real science. When the chips are down and the final score is important, virtually all grab something with a pistol grip though it may not be a SxS. These same guys offered me nearly anything to get a copy of my copy of Robert Churchill's treatise on wing shooting. You know, the one where he proclaimed the ideal bird gun had among other features 25" barrels, splinter for ends, straight grip stocks, and the "pull through" method (otherwise known as "butt, belly, beak, bang") as being the final word on wing shooting. The former has pretty much fallen by the wayside though they still look "faster than lightning" while the latter is used far less in all venues than Robert intended. It was probably a good combo for English gentry to learn the basics of driven bird shooting but its application has become more limited.

As for a grip having any affect on the speed of gun mounting, give me a break. There are many other factors that play a far greater role than the grip. Balance and weight distribution are far more important and it is not possible to craft two different guns to have the exact same handling qualities. Besides, just how does one prove one is somehow faster than the other? I highly doubt one has actually timed the mounts and even then personal bias is very likely to rear its ugly head.

Where the two grips diverge is how one moves their gun. The straight grip was designed for a shooting style that emphasizes muzzle movement utilizing the support hand. The pistol grip is meant for muzzle control to be more balanced among the support and gripping hands. So, the former type of shooter sees the pistol grip as an unneeded piece of wood while the second induces some shooter caused error when shooting without that protuberance on the wrist.

I'm of the second type, preferring a pistol grip. I have owned several straight gripped shotguns in the past but all but two have gone down the road. One I keep for sentimental reasons, the other for a specific type of competition. Pistol grips have become ubiquitous in all areas of shotgunning because they have shown an advantage over straight stocks with the most successful shooting styles of this age. One can post good scores without a pistol grip but pistol grips have become dominate for a good reason - they work better. Look at those events that require a fast mount and shot - International/Olympic skeet and trap and box bird shooting and one will have to look long and hard to find something besides a pistol grip.

Those are my thoughts on the grip styles based on my learning and bias'. To be fair I am not a fan of SxS shotguns though I own and use a few. My competitive side forced me to learn to shoot them for various competitions but I rarely grab one for the field. Give me a pistol grip and a semi or full beaver tail forend and I'll be satisfied. A splinter forend and straight grip look classy but they drop my scores even more. That I am not comfortable with.

While I’ve never shot competitively and have never been involved with a fitter or a shooting instructor, I’ve generally found the contour of a PG is much more amenable to the human hand than any SG which demands more inner rotation of the forearm, wrist and hand for control.

Also, it seems, with a SG, more input and control is demanded from the forend hand and even the upper body n controlling the gun during a swing.

That’s all assuming the right thickness of either grip for your hand which is also very important for control. Too thick for your hand is off-putting and results in a loss of control and too wispy isnt good either. The thickness of the grip is the first tactile feature of a gun I notice as I pick it up right along with weight and balance.

A SG is a SG but PG’s vary very much from the relative open, graceful POW style to some very severely closed PG’s. The latter is probably most aesthetically displeasing to me while conversely may give the most control which is the reason they exist. I particularly notice these very closed grips on some of the Browning Citori guns.

There’s a reason tactical arms and long range snipers’ rifles have evolved to having true, extended pistol grips. This is also bleeding into the sporting rifle genre and some of the turkey-specialized shotguns which of course, are aimed also. Again, it’s what works best for the human hand and more control.

Aesthetically, and subjectively of course, I find the classical SG’s on a shotgun still appeal to me a great deal but the POW grip might be my best compromise for both elegance and function.

Just some observation from an old kid toting these fifth appendages around since I was thirteen.

Woodmaster and George are correct….I only disagree on Churchills method of shooting. From what I have read he was more move, mount, shoot…. With complete visual focus on the Bird.

While none iof todays top SC or Fitasc shooters use a SG, many do apply move, mount, shoot to many targets. They use all the methods depending on the target. However move, mount, shoot is used more than a little.

Then again Digweed and Powell will tell you they use swing through almost exclusively.

I have Merkel SXS's is both SG and PG. I like both and can't tell if I'm better with one than the other. Must have double triggers however.

What is the reason for double triggers? The reliability issue is a thing of the past. Some may say choke selection… however point accurately and there is little difference between skeet and Mod. Don’t point well, and chokes again are irrelevant. In addition, failure to fire is again essentially a thing of the past with modern ammo.