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I ought to point out that crack and meth share a very nasty characteristic. One hit is all it takes to addict most people. Heroin a bit longer. I don't see booze being quite so emphatic. Besides, in my previous post, I outlined what those users actually do. Legalizing those drugs would not reduce the need and the necessity of paying for it. End result--burglary,robbery,theft,prostitution. The only other option would be government supplied crack and meth. So what is the answer?? Jail is about as good as we are going to get for the foreseeable future.

Perhaps I'm ignorant on this point, so please inform me of the kind of profit there is to be made selling cigarettes and boos to kids? Sufficient to risk jail time? Remember, your scenario was that it would remain a crime to sell to kids.

I guarantee you that if you slipped some crack in my morning glass of OJ, I would be no more inclined to go out and buy another hit than I am now. More likely less so.

"Things" includes illegal substances such as drugs and alcohol.Never heard of one guy going to jail for selling kids nicotine. The amount of the profit is of no significant import. But, in trying to understand you further, let's say a guy sells a kid a 5th of vodka for 50 bucks. Kid drinks to near unconsciousness then drives and kills an innocent. You feel the seller of the vodka to the kid should be subject to no criminal exposure,right?

There's no such thing as a war on drugs. How many on here have ever seen drugs laying in the street dead or dying? It's a war on people. A war on liberty.

If it continues as it has for another hundred years there will be no more effect than what we've already seen, none. The only difference will be much, MUCH less liberty. The drugs, violent crimes and gang related incidents will continue along smoothly. As will the futiile efforts of black-clad soldiers making war on the citizenry and the Bill of Rights.

How much time would you serve for selling a fifth of vodka to a minor today?

issac, I believe your scenario would be covered by the child endangerment statutes, please correct me if I am wrong Sir.

Hawk, this place is full of adolescent gangs of crack users and dealers....15 year old arrested for murder this week, crack dispute. 14 year old crack ho's. you have to catch them young, because they don't live long.

I'll keep that in mind when I see guys here complaining about how their homes were burglarizes,guns and jewelry stolen,cars broken into and cleaned out. I guess you believe things would be so much better for all of us if we just left those poor little scaliwags to themselves. Of course you will cheerfully pay the much higher insurance premiums and take the first steps towards sharing everything one owns just so these poor druggies can get their candy. If the cops can't fight them we can't either. so where is your liberty then?? At the mercy of drug addicts. And drugs would be legal How did that happen??

"The drugs, violent crimes and gang related incidents will continue along smoothly. As will the futiile efforts of black-clad soldiers making war on the citizenry and the Bill of Rights."

I take that back. In a hundred years theree will be no Bill of Rights. The neoconservatives will have long since done away with that troublesome document...

BWAHAHAHAHAHA! *****evil laugh*****yes, my paranoid friend, the PA stormtroopers are on their way to your house right now.


Before you knock black clad police, you ought to drive the battering ram on a few crack houses in the flooded parts of New Orleans, bro.

And if you think a society can just legalize hard drugs and shrug, take a little historical look at what opium did to the Asian countries where its use was, and is, widespread.

Don't normally answer to questions to a question but from probation to up to 30 days for a first time offense and no aggravating circumstances. Google criminal liability and sentencing of parents who allowed minors to drink in their homes and where aggravating circumstances later resulted. There's a Va couple who got 3 years, I believe, when one of the kids left the party and committed vehicular manslaughter.

Parents lose their children over the contributions to their kid's deliquencies such as permitting them to drink and drug.

You still didn't answer my question but I'll throw in another. Your wonderful child goes to a party where a 21 year old buys her booze and on her way home there is a fatal accident. Your daughter survives, is disfugured and there is a "victimless" dead guy. The 21 year old walks as he only committed a victimless crime that merely involved a financial transaction,right? Now make it pot, coke, meth or whatever your state has deemed a illegal, controlled substance.

Hawk, when you hang your shingle, allow me to give you some free, sound advice. If you get a case such as those described above, don't argue your beliefs to a Florida jury.

True, but that begs the question, doesn't it? Those kids are hooked and causing problems because there are huge profits to be made selling drugs, and that's because they are illegal with stiff penalties attached. These factors raise the price and the profit margins, thus the motivation of the suppliers and pushers, thus the number of kids who are hooked. Take the illegality out of the equation, and you pull the rug out from under the whole industry, and it disappears tomorrow. Of course that would put a whole lot of government employees out of work too, which is a large part of why it doesn't happen.

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No, you're not wrong Terry. Those are part of the criminal stautory scheme. Child endangerment charges are misdemeanor to felony offenses( still criminal statutes) Of course, if aggravating circumstances occur as a consequence of such sale and use, well, you know what lies next!

How many alcoholics and cigarette smokers break into homes to support their habits? Not many, because their habits are relatively cheap to support, as a drug habit would be, if they were legal to possess, sell, purchase. Cheaper, even.

Take the illegality out of it for whom, Hawkeye? Minors?

A lot of Mental Patients,who are largley only a threat to themselves,are taking up space in our cells.These people get no treatment or help.At one time ,they were housed in Mental Institutions.Now with no Meds or help they wind up in jail.I am not talking of murders,rapists or strong arm robbers.I am talking of people who have fallen between the cracks of Society,because of the Demise of Mental health care by our Kinder,compassionate government. I am not a Liberal.No way.Facts are facts.I am all for Swift Justice for Dangerous Criminals(The Gallows)But a lot of people taking up space in prisons do not belong there.

Quit throwing cigarette smoking into the mix. It's silly. As to alcohol, it is probably the most prevalent drug involving all crimes committed while under any influence of intoxicants.

Bullcrap Hawkeye. Most druggies use on the order of $100 a day. Lots use much more. When they use that much more then we get stuck with paying the hospital bills for them and it ain't cheap nor is it pretty. I had to work in the bad areas for 24 years and the toll it takes it stupifying. Cheap?? NOT by any stretch of the imagination. They make the clssic jakie bum look like a clean,model citizen by comparison.

Hawk...Are you trying to dance around a position that it should be legal for minors to purchase alcohol and drugs?