Home Forums Hunting & Shooting General Big Game Bullet Failure

I've had pass throughs and slugs that explosively turned into sand never making it to the offside body wall. Never had one fail though. A well placed lugnut at 1200 fps should do the job on all north American game. 1Minute

Jimmy, in my testing of the .257 100g TSX and the 115g TSX, the 100g actually outpenetrated the 115g in the test media that I used(journals, BTT). The 100g bullets were going 3400 fps at muzzle whereas the 115g were "only" going 2950fps at muzzle. Both were shot at 100 yards. The 115g had larger frontal areas which I think decreased the penetration, whereas the 100g bullets lost a petal or two and had a smaller frontal area.

Testing media isnt an animal so take those results however you which.

I dunno. I have seen hogs and deer shot with varmit bullets out of hot .22 caliber rounds and they work pretty good if placed correctly.

Cant you make a hoof soap to go with your deer ribs? Should be about as edible as the ribs..

Having seen what bullets that "explosively turned into sand" can do -- or rather fail to do -- I'll take a well-placed lug nut at 1200fps instead. Every time.

Bullet weight has less to do with it than does bullet construction. A Barnes .224" 45g Solid isn't going to come apart on game at any velocity you can reach with a sporting arm.

My preference is to be able to shoot with confidence from muzzle-contact distances to as far as I am able. Standard cup-and-core bullets are OK at low velocities but I start to get nervous when potential impact (and hence muzzle) velocities get above 2600fps.

(OK, I've never shot anything at muzzle contact distances, but I have passed on a couple shots measuring about five feet and have taken shots at 10.)

I would say, though, that ignorance is a bigger factor in most bullet failures that are the hunting bullets we have available. Well, ignorance and lack of performance on the part of the user. There are rules and some bullet designs really demand attention to them. (Even with Barnes bullets for example, there are people who have used "heavy" 200 grain bullets- and they are heavy in the 30 calibers- who assume that the same bullet weight is also heavy and will perform equally well in the 35 calibers. And with an X design, you may get by with many of the same things, but that 35 will not keep up with the 30 caliber when things get really tough. And if you substitute C&C bullets, then the difference becomes even more obvious, yet there are many people who seem to think that bullet mass alone, whether 200, 300 grains, or whatever, are all about the same. Simple, observable physics rules apply and the responsibility is on the user to know what those rules are and what they mean.

For example, to use that Barnes solid as an example, while most people would acknowledge, or at least assume, that that bullet will not come apart, some may also make the assumption that it will penetrate any and everything and might place one in some ridiculous portion of an animal believing that it will, with certainty, reach a more desireable part of the animal deeper than it has momentum for.

I believe it is incumbent upon the shooter to know, within reason, what a bullet will do at virtually any reasonable distance they might use it. And further, knowing what their chosen bullet will or will not do, it is their responsibility to place that bullet in such a way as to not cause failure.

Some might say that a bullet should be able to "do it all" from any angle on a chosen animal and at any distance or the bullet is a questionable one. That is an ideal, not reality, though there are some bullets which are closer to that ideal than others. When it all boils down though, the final responsibility in most cases still falls on the shoulders of "him who pulls the trigger."

Mr. Klikitarik;
That sir was in my opinion a very fine set of thoughts on the subject.

Well done!

Regards,
Dwayne

Well, actually... I ate water buffalo hoof one time. Emphasis on one. Dim light in a nice restaurant... in Pakistan. It was sort of a high class buffet and I thought those were big chunks of beef in gravy. That was one time my knowledge of critter anatomy let me down. I'd have been better off not to know. They weren't that bad, strings of meat between gristle and jell, hard shells removed of course.

Trouble with us long time posters is repeating tales and I know this is a repeat because I recall Sitka having snide comments on my food proclivities. How do you spell gourmand?

And then there was the 4x4 mule buck going steep up the other wall of a ravine and my partner beside me on the rim who had raised his 30-30 sights as high as they would go for a long shot earlier and not reset them. He aimed at the buck's neck behind the head and hit it's hoof extended out in front as it ran. Fodder for razzing to this day.

More on topic of terminal bullet performance, he was shooting the first plastic tipped bullets I've seen, Sabre tips in Canada years ago. His second shot at that buck slid down the offside withers at a flat angle and took a shovel scoop of hide off the critter and barely cut enough muscle for it to bleed. One hole ten inches across was entry and exit. Must have had violent expansion as it stayed in the flat layer of hide for its full passage through the buck. Huge surface wound with almost no damage to the deer. Bits of plastic bullet tip scattered through the wound. We managed to whittle that buck down and examined the hits.

I remember the hoof story... Did you know Neatsfoot oil is synovial fluid from bovine hooves? True, that is. Suppose the stuff made it slickery going down...

Yikes, not what I'd want either.

VERY well said!

Another stunning contribution..................waste of skin.

"Quick reply often utilized"

I believe that!! Steelhead...you are a loser....plain and simple.....you don't even take the time to read the question before you fire off your half-witted answer.

The only thing worse than NO replies, is a reply from you, because it will make the younger members feel bad for asking, and leave the older members scratching their heads thinking "What the F6CK is wrong with this guy??"

You are an anomaly. For some reason, you see the whole world as an enemy, and as such, stike out at everyone around you. Instead of offering real-life experience....(have any??) you simply pick on the persons' spelling, or make some crass comment. A sad spoecimen indeed.

My father told me everyone has value....you just have to find it.

I've looked and looked in you...........and fear you have proven my father wrong.

Well, you've finally gotten a firm taken on your own situation. Good to see somethings do sink in after all.....

BTW - I'm curious as to what answers you've gotten to the same question posted in the cooking section. Dare I look?

My father told me that everyone had value also, I just forgot how much he said he paid for your .........

Sorry for the late reply, just got back from Vacation. Your mom says hi.

Since when are N/P not suitable for north american game???
Makes me shake my head

I do however enjoy reading these discussions but find it really hard to believe that elk, bear, and moose wear body armour that would stop a N/P from penetrating from 338mag velocities even through bone at common sense ranges.

Put your bullets in the boiler room and start sharpening your knives.

I like the idea of the TSX bullet but shoot Accubonds because they are cheaper and like the partition will kill any north american big game animal reliably and consistently.

That i believe my friends is a proven fact!

I choose the Accubond over the TSX because I think it's a better bullet!

Figured you would like her after she had the sex change, hope you choked.