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O.K., Jack O'Connors favorite loads for the 270 continued minus the previously mentioned 130 grain bullets;

"100 grain bullet with 52 grains of 4064. Velocity--3,300fps. I've shot dozens of coyotes and hundreds of jackrabbits with this load, but for woodchuck shooting I think the recoil is a bit heavy, and it shoots no flatter than good loads in the 243 and the 6mm Remington. For this light bullet I see no point in using slow-burning powders; all you do is increase the muzzle blast."

"150 grain bullet, controlled expanding type at 2,900-2,950 with 58.5 grains of old H4831, 54 grains of 4350 or 58 grains of 785. At 100 yards this load usually shoots within an inch of the 130 grain loads listed above, slightly lower at 200. Some may not agree with me but I have found it a fine elk load and an excellent one for large African antelope. Bob Lee used the Nosler version on leopard, lion, kudu and gemsbok, as well as on lions."

"160 grain bullet [Nosler, Barnes, Dominion] with 52 grains of 4350 or 54 grains of H4831. The late Hosea Sarber, a legendary Alaskan game warden, shot several big brown bears with the Barnes 160-gr. bullet and 52 grains of 4350. He said it killed as well and gave as deep penetration as the 172-gr. Western Tool and Copper Co. bullet he used in his 30-06."

"170/180-gr. bullets. The Speer 170-gr. round-nose soft point will travel along at 2,652 when pushed by 51 grains of 4350 and at 2,785 with 57 grains of H4831. The 180-gr. Barnes has a velocity of 2,650 with 54 grains of 4831. Barnes makes this bullet as a soft point or a solid. If the elephants are raising hell with your sweetpeas and you own a 270 you might try the 180 gr. solid!"

For those that may not know, the Dominion brand was [is] a Canadian arsenal.

From Layne Simpsons Shooters Handbook; "In it's heyday, the Western Tool and Copper Works had a reputation for making some of the best big game bullets available. Most were of cavity point style and constructed with a soft lead core enclosed by an extremely thick copper jacket. The original Barnes bullets developed by Fred Barnes are similar in constuction. Writers of yesteryear, Jack O'Connor and Elmer Keith in particular, often wrote about using W.T.C.W. bullets on various and sundry game. In fact, Keiths favorite bullets for two of his favorite cartridges, the 35 Whelen and 400 Whelen, were made by that company. I'm not sure when W.T.C.W. stopped producing bullets but it was probably during the late 1940's."

I seem to recall Jack writing he thought that the W.T.C.W. bullets were made by prison labor. Thoughts?


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Originally Posted by 270winchester
O.K. gents, here it is from the horses mouth; Handloaders Digest, New Eighth Edition, Copyright 1978.

Jacks Favored Loads
"130 grain bullet of controlled expanding type with 60-62 grains of old H4831, 61 grains of W-W 785, 60 grains of Norma 205 or 55-56 grains of 4350. Velocity is from 3,050 to 3,150. Exellent bullets I have used are the W-W Power Point, the Remington pointed soft point Core-Lokt and the Nosler. This load can be used on everything from jackrabbits to moose. I have used more Nosler bullets in front of 62 grains of H4831 in W-W cases than anything else."

He includes in the article his favorite loads using 100, 150, and 170/180 grain bullets. If anyone is interested I'll write those up here also.

anyone using 62 grains of H4831 in the 270 Winchester these days?


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FYI: There are also a bunch of J.O'C loads in "The Big Game Rifle" too. They pre-date the loads above so I won't take up space posting them.

FWIW, the RSY classic load is a 140-gr. InterLock atop 58-59 grains of Re-22. wink

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O'Connor pretty much setteled on 62gr of H4831 and 130 Nosler in his favorite M70 Winchesters at the end. He said he had a custom mauser that would give the same velocity at 60 gr of H4831. Very early on he liked the Winchester 130 Pointed Expanding and then for a while the 130 Silvertip. Some others were mixed in, but this is what he mentions most in 130 weight. Hornady is the only place that shows 62 gr of H4831 these days.

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That's probably because Hornady bullets generally have shorter bearing surfaces than other bullets, thus tend to produce less pressure. You can't use the same data for the 130 Partition that you can for the 130 Hornady Spire Point.

It isn't actually necessay to use H4831SC rather than standard H4831 to get 60 grains in the case. O'Connor used 62 grains of the old stuff, which was bulky, and I used it briefly when I started handloading. Just a little of the mil-surp H4831 was still found on shelves then, and I got 62 grains in the case with no real problem. Though the powder filled the cases right up to the case mouth, seating the bullet compressed it a little with no problem.

Most .270's do indeed still perk with around 60 grains of H4831 (whether long or short) and a 130. Tweaking the load a little to 59 or 60.5 or whatever probably depends on the bullet used and lot of powder as much as the individual rifle.

I have also found R22 and R19 to work about as well--except they tend to lose a lot of velocity at lower temperatures, and H4831 doesn't.


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I use a fancy drop tube (an old Bic pen body laugh ) between the funnel and case mouth.

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Incidentally, O'Connor himself said that you should drop down a couple of grains with the "new" H4831 and that his 62 gr load was with the mil-surp powder which was apparently a bit slower. I think the only other 60gr+ load with 130s is in the Swift manual.

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For almost ten years a pre64 M70 .270 was my only "big" rifle. For most of those years my only load was much like the rest of you, 60gr. of H4831 and 130gr. bullet, generally a Hornady. Later I came to believe that the 150gr. bullets might be a better all around load. Now, however after doing some expansion/penetration testing in wet newspaper with Nosler Partitions I'm not so sure it matters.

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Thanks to everyone who has posted. On the way to work last night, I found one box of plain Jane Hornady 130 grain Interlocks. I picked them up, along with a pound of H4831. My cases are already prepped, and Maybe I will get a chance to load them tomorrow morning.

Once again, the experience available on this board amazes me.



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Originally Posted by Mule Deer
I have also found R22 and R19 to work about as well--except they tend to lose a lot of velocity at lower temperatures, and H4831 doesn't.


John, I knew this was the case. But, could you quantify "a lot?" And also at what temps. I imagine here in Texas it's a pretty moot point for me, anyway.

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Originally Posted by tominboise
59 grains of H4831 with the 130 Hornady is the classic.


He also used 49.5 gr. of 4064.
Now days thought of as too fast a burn rate for .270's, it continues to do a great job.

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Originally Posted by tominboise
59 grains of H4831 with the 130 Hornady is the classic.


He also used 49.5 gr. of 4064.
Now days thought of as too fast a burn rate for .270's, it continues to do a great job.
Originally Posted by southtexas
If that load doesn't happen to work, 54 or 55gr of IMR4350 is pretty well time proven, also.



I used 54 grains for YEARS with great accuracy in a pre-war M70 .270.

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RSY,

Yeah, in Texas it probably wouldn't matter much. But I have found both powders to lose more than 100 fps from 70 F. to zero, and sometimes 150 fps.


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The Ruraldoc classic is 54 grains of IMR 4350 with a 140 grain hornady BTSP. Used it for twenty years or so now. I have killed dozens of deer and hogs big and little with perfect results.

It has been accurate in a bunch of different rifles and is the quickest killer that I have used in the 270. I usually find the bullet under the offside hide if it doesn't exit. They weigh about half their original weight and expand to close to 2x the original diameter.

Try it if 130s don't group in your 270,or if you want a little bigger bullet to test.


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JB,

Have you tested any of the "newer" RL22?........supposedly not a bad as the "old" stuff.

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Just a thought, don't know if anyone knows. At the time when J'OC was loading 62/H4831 did the 130 Nos. Ptns. have the relief groove in them? Those bullets would probably have decreased the bearing surface and reduced pressure a bit.

I have no idea during what time periods the bullets with the relief grooves were produced. Kind of curious since I happened on some of this style for my .338 WM.

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Jim, the old machined ones with the groove were produced until 1970 or 1971. I used 62 gr of the old H4831 with them a lot.

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Originally Posted by 1OntarioJim


I have no idea during what time periods the bullets with the relief grooves were produced. Kind of curious since I happened on some of this style for my .338 WM.

Jim


I think Nosler changed manufacturing methods around mid-later '70's.

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Originally Posted by MontanaMan
JB,

Have you tested any of the "newer" RL22?........supposedly not a bad as the "old" stuff.

MM


THAT is interesting, newer RL22?

If that is so, I may have to try some; RL22 used to be my mainstay powder in my 270, 270Wby, and 340Wbys-I got fed up with the velocity swings I would see with changing temps.


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Old school loads that were accurate without showing excessive pressure.

60.0 gr. H4831 for 130.

58.0 gr. H4831 for 150

I also had an accurate load for 130 using Win 760 Powder.

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