Home Forums Lever Action Central Marlin Talk 35 Rem vs 45 70

What are the differences between the two in reguards to recoil, performance on deer game and larger, max distance of the two and any other issues you might want to include. I own an old (made in 1952) marlin 336 rc in 35 rem that could use a new stock and i may drill it/tap it and mount a scope on it-it is a shooter, not a collector-I have a chance at a marlin 1895 in 45 70 NIB for a pretty decent price, but I am not a big fan of taking a whoopin every time I go to the gun range to site in a gun/practice. I don't mind the 35 rem with 150 grn ammo, but the 200 grn ammo is not much fun. I find that finding a good ammo that I can tolerate shooting for a couple of hours at the range lets me get real familiar with the rifle and what it can do so when that one shot in the woods comes, i can do fairly well hitting my target.

Also, how do these two compare to the marlin 1895 in 44 mag--same issues...

thanks

dave

I have never had a 35 Remington but have long been fascinated with the caliber. I did own one of the very first Marlin Guide guns. I sold it in short order as it was nothing short of brutal with premium ammo. I have owned a few 45-70's since but never again a 18" ported barrel. I likethe longer barrels like the Marlin cowboys. I find the recoil more tolerable and the gun better looking. The 44 mag can not really be compared to other in terms of range or power. I have a 1894 Marlin currently that I like very much. I am considering selling it to get a 38-55 cowboy now that Buffalo Bore has premium rounds available for it.

This is comparing apples to oranges for several reasons.
If you hurt with a 200 grainer, then the 45-70 is NOT for you.
I have several Marlins in several calibers. The most punishing ones are the 450Marlin and 45-70 hot loaded ones.
They are virtually identical and unless you are hunting buffalo, you don't really need one for deer.
Unscoped, the bullets will kill out of any of them farther than you can aim. Scoped is a different story.
The 35Rem is a fantastic deer / black bear sized game cartridge out to over 200 yards if handloaded to their potential. I must add that their potential is unbelievable in terms of what the factory puts out. The recoil on hot loads is even harder than factory, and almost rivals the 356 Winchester, which is a mule kicker in and of itself.
The 45 cals are better suited for things that can kill us and would enjoy doing so, like buffalo or brown bear.
The 44Mag, which by the way was only made in the 1894 and 336 configuration is also a fantastic deer / black bear cartridge, but even when hot loaded, is probably good at best to 150 yards. I actually hunt with one of these since 99% of the shots on deer / bear where I hunt are under 50 yards.
Either way, you need to determine what will best suit YOUR needs, then go get it. (Or get both just to be safe)
Ranger

If he thinks 200gr out of a 35Rem hurts then, whatdaya even thinking about a 45-70 or even a 44mag- geez

I have a 336 in 44Mag that I hunt with. They are not available in the 1895, so I will assume you meant the 1894.
The 44Mag is a fantastic deer / black bear cartridge out to 120 and even beyond.
It is what I hunt with, and even hot loaded, the recoil is nothing compared to even the 35 Rem.
This may be the answer.
Ranger

I use a 1894 in 44 mag as well. I shoot the Buffalo Bore loads and even so the recoil is no where near the 35 . The 45-70 can be brutal in some guns.

I have many 45-70's that I like and they can be brutal if you let them be. On deer sized game there really is no need to shoot heavy loads. Your not trying for expansion as the bullet is generally the size of an expanded 30 cal already. Slow moving 300 gr lead flat points will plumb take the legs out from under our mulies around here. If your gonna go out to "plink" with a 45-70 practice with reduced loads anyway. My wife shoots my 300 gr cast loads all day at the long range shoots. Its already been touched on too that the style of rifle makes a huge difference. My 1886 Winchester weighs in at nearly 10 pounds. That soaks up alot of recoil. The guide gun was made to be carried alot and shot a little. The 35 Remington is a great little round and also has good frontal diameter and with modern loads can reach the 150-200 yd mark. A Marlin 336 in that caliber would be comfortable to shoot, if its not, add a recoil pad, shooting vest with pad or something to make it that way. The more you shoot the more tolerance you get too. If you reload look into the many cast bullet designs, the heavy 170's that Lyman makes molds for shoot great in my Remington Model 14 and its a light little rifle. But loaded for fun its a joy. When hunting season comes around I hit the heavier loads, relearn a new trajectory and go hunting with a gun that I am already familiar with. The other thing I do is bring one/two heavy rifles and a few lightwieghts or shorten my range session. Once I shoot a heavy recoiling rifle I settle in with a 32-20 or something to let myself relax. Then trade up and finish off with some more fun things. That way I dont cheat my range day and its still fun. Hope all this rambling helped. Ryan

Let me guess, you live in Cheyenne, Nebraska?

As pointed out by the man from Colorado, it's more than just the cartridge. And we in Wyoming don't need to be rude just because the wind's been getting our knickers in a twist.

I agree completely. My guide gun was brutal with HP loads but the 1886 in a long octagon barrel with lighter loads can be more pleasant. If I was going to buy a new 45-70 it would be a Marlin 1895 Cowboy with the longer barrel.

Have any of you guys used the big loop levers on the 45/70 guide gun? I have two of 'em a stock Marlin in SS and a WWG parkerized, the recoil to the shoulder doesn't bother me as I am pretty used to using a .338. But the recoil of the lever slamming into my middle finger gets to be a distraction and I have been wondering if the big loop levers help in this regard.
Anyone with any experience in this? thanks 1ak

Stetson

I think that you are confused, no hot loaded 35Rem is even going to come close to a .356 or a .358 win and thats a fact. The .358 or .356 will kick out a 250gr bullet at 2,400fps. A hot loaded .35 rem with a 200 grainer is barely going to get 2,100, how does that compare?

The gloved loop lever from DRC availbale through Brownells or DRC is a great looking lever and will alleviate the finger crunch. the other lower cost solution is to have the lever wrapped with leather provided your hands don't need the extra spcae to fit. I have large hands but find the factoryloop fine even with gloves becasue I use my right middle finger as my trigger finger. My index finger was injured when I was 2.5 so it is not usable for shooting. One poster over at marlinowners.com re-did his own levers into large loops and they look great.

Thanks Dave in LB! 1ak

Well it doesn't but then no one was talking about those calibers so you totally lost me on that post <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />
But then the 356 0r 358 wont come close to a 405 so that could go ad nauseum. We were only comparing the calibers mentioned. If not then you are right. I am very confused.

Maybe he wanted his two cents in there but he speaks peso while we were speaking canadian.....Sorry a little bit of early morning smart alec creaping out here. But I was confused by his response too.

Well its easy to misread a post so no biggie but it had me scratching my head all morning wondering where that came from. Perhaps he misread one of the initial posts.

1/ 35 rem. 200 Core locks kill deer dead and big deer too, granted it does not have the initial ME of a 45-70 still ample at ranges near 200 yds.

2/ Forget the 45-70...kick it will, for deer i will take the 35 Rem anyday..its a woods cartridge that feels like a grandfathers coat on a cold day.

3/ 44 mag ..will kill em too but at a reduced range of the 35 rem. recoil is closer to the 35 than the 45-70.

4/ with oput weight of rifle. loadings, type of stock and some other variable these ?'s will be a best a stab in the dark.

264Bore,

You are right, a 35R will never be a 356 or 358 but, Buffalo Bore offers a factory load for the 35R that pushes a 220 gr. bullet to 2200 fps. Have tested them and from an 18.5" barrel they were running 2180 fps.

Also, out of a bolt action 35R, 2400 fps with 200 gr. bulelts, 2200 fps with a 225 and 2100 with a 250 gr. bullets is not hard to get to safely.

The 35R is one of my favorite cartridges and in Marlin lever guns and good bolt actions it can really come alive with handloads. Thats not 2400 with a 250 grainer, heck my 358 will push 200 grain North Forks to 2700 fps and 225s to over 2600 and still be under 58,000 psi (tested).

If you handload for a Marlin or bolt the 35R is allot more than factory ammo would have you believe.

I agree!If you have trouble with the 200gr. .375 bigbore,or the .35 Rem, then stay away from the .45-70. I had two 45-70 Marlins made into guide guns (one of them 15 or 20 years before the Marlin Guide guns were out) and they can KICK! Both of the guns were made the same except for minor differences. First of all,the first one was a blued Marlin micro groove, and the second one was a stainless Marlin with a different rifling. But here is the kicker,Both shot at the same point of impact,both one ragged hole at 25yds and at 50yds they shot about 1to1-1/2 inches. The load was a 405gr. cast bullet made of 1/2 linotype and 1/2 wheel weights, water quenched and gas checked in front of 40gr. of 4198 and a Win. std. primer. WOW! CAN THEY KICK! I Love the kick and love to hear the roar!My shoulder is still purple after a week. Both had the mag tube made one shot longer and the barrel cut to 1/8-1/4 inches longer than the mag. tube,the sight was put back to the original relief, the fore-ends thinned out like a winchester and a recoil pad had to be put on the first. My friends at the gun club laughed when I told them,But when they saw the pair they all were in awe. And if you saw then you'd have to say OOH! BABY! BOY CAN THEY KICK LIKE THUNDER! P.S. the artist was Steven Scott Selby of A-Z Guns Sho LOW Az.

I have an 1895 gs in 45/70. With 300 grain softnose bullets loaded to about 1500fps, I can shoot a box of 20 fairly easy without getting too sore. With 400s loaded to like 1700fps after about 10 I dont want to shoot any more. I am going to load some bear loads with 500's that will surely tear my arm off.

If you can shoot 180s out of a 30-06 youcan shoot the 300 fairly easy. The 06 actually has a sharper kick. The 45-70 has a very hard push.