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Hello, I am from the midwest and I have never hunted out west before. I am planning an a DIY backpacking archery hunt right now in the Fossil Ridge Wilderness, specifically the crystal creek drainage, which is in the Gunnison Valley (GMU 55). I am currently doing as much research as I can and reading as many books as I can. I was told that GMU 55 is over-the-counter for archery elk. I tried to find information on Colorado's DOW website, but I can't navigate that site very well and can't seem to find the information I am looking for. I was told to get in contact with the Game and Fisheries Biologist for that area for answers, but I can't find the contact info for who this is. I am a greenhorn when it comes to this so any help is appreciated. I already have topomaps of the area and have an idea of where I want to hunt. I will go ahead and post some questions I have and if someone wants to answer them for me great, or if they have the contact info for someone who can that would be awesome too. Here are some questions I have:
In GMU 55 for OTC archery do have to buy a tag right away when they go on sale (9:00am july 14th, I think) or can I buy one when I get there a day before the season starts Aug 28th?
What is the Bear and Mountail Lion population like in this area, and is something to be concerned about?
Are there some good areas where a person can get away from the majority of hunters? (the spot I'm looking at on maps and Google earth is about 7 miles from the trailhead and at least 2 miles from the nearest trail. will this get me some elbow room?)
The harvest % is around 14% according to DOW. Is there a way to see just archery statistics? Like # of hunters, success %, etc...
What is the Bull to cow ratio? and what % of bulls are "mature" or legal? What is legal in GMU 55? at least 4 pt?
Colorado requires a hunter education card, will my hunter's education card from my state of Illinois work, or do they mean a Colorado hunter education card?
Thats about it for now. Thanks for any help you can give me.
"Thats why they call it hunting"
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Hope this helps some. I've hunted 55 a ton over the years. The Crystal Creek drainage is popular for those that want to get away from the crowds. It's also popular with at least one outfitter in the area. It will be a pretty strenuous hike in as the terrain here is steep and heavily forested. It is worth the effort though. Looks like you are good on the OTC archery tags. http://wildlife.state.co.us/NR/rdonlyres/2BEF643C-C32C-43E9-8017-C84F5C535C1D/0/elk.pdf4 points on a side minimum for archery also. Same page in link. Statistics can be found here for several years. http://wildlife.state.co.us/Hunting/BigGame/Statistics/Your hunter safety card from your home state should suffice. As for the bear/mountain lion issue, it will all depend on who you talk to. My experience has been very few mountain lions but a good number of black bears. Others have cited the ML's as devastating the elk herds and making hunting almost impossible. So, your guess is as good as mine. Bull to cow ratios should be found in the statistics. However, they can be misleading to some extent. Out of the bulls listed, how many are actually legal? And of the legal ones how many are mature? Having hunted this area for a long time my advice is to take the first legal bull you can. There are some big bulls taken here every year, but holding out will probably cost you unless you are extremely educated in the unit and have considerable time. That is of course your choice. It is a beautiful area and I'm sure you will enjoy the hunt. Keep your eye's open as there are a lot of Big Horn in the area and its always fun to see these mighty beasts. The last couple years have been hard in 55. The elk have dwindled in population size and they have also changed their patterns. I'd expect a tough hunt, but a good one. Just my advice and thoughts. If I can help further let me know. Kelly
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Your hunter ed card from ILL will work, I believe you are supposed to carry it on your person while hunting too.
Many good folks here that can help you with the other questions. Good luck on your hunt and keep us posted.
One other bit of advice, be in good physical shape, the elevation will kick your arse.
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DOW contacts: dow If it's OTC, you can buy the tag the day before. If you wait until the season starts, you have buy it at a DOW office. Bears and Mountain Lions: I've never been overly concerned about bears or lions in Colorado. Your state hunter ed card will work. Seven miles is a long way to pack an elk. Might be warm during archery season, too. Are ATVs allowed on the trail? Regardless of the regs, what's the practice re: ATVs in the area? Would suck to walk in 5 miles with ATVs cruising along. But if you have ATVs, a combination ATV/backpack hunt is an appealing idea. What happens if there are no elk in that area? You are a long ways in; how much flexibility to you have to move if the elk just aren't there? Some say it takes five years of hunting an area to really learn it. Definitely run the specific area by the biologist for that area. Also recommend talking to the Forest Service. Sometimes they are tools, but sometimes they are very helpful.
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ATV's use and abuse run rampant in the area. Mainly along the Beaver Creek area which is the boundary for the Wilderness. The DOW and NF service area revamping the travel management plan and have already closed numerous trails in the area for good.
Shut up and hunt!
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Crystal creek drainage is smack in the middle of the fossil ridge wilderness so there should be no ATVs. Thats a big reason I want to hunt a wilderness area.
Thank you guys very much for answering my questions.
As far as getting in great shape, I'm on it and working hard. I consider myself in good shape anyways (I'm 27 and work out regularly),but as a flatlander I know i need to improve my cardio a ton. I've been day hiking in colorado before (vail area) so I know what the low oxygen feels like.
Right now I'm gathering the equipment I need and reading as much as I can. I've read Cameran Hanes book Backcountry Bowhunting, Mike Eastmans Elk Hunting the West, and Elk hunting 101. I have a pre-order in for elknuts playbook which is being published as I type an should be ready by the end of the month. I have watched numerous dvds from eastmans and others.
As far as my expectations go, I am going into this hunt with the goal of it be a learning experience. I am going to work my tail off and hope I can connect on a bull, but if I don't I wont be dissapointed. I am new to this so I know I need to put in my time and truly "earn" a good bull and that may take years. I plan on hunting this area for years to come so the more I can learn with each outing the better.
I am planning a scouting trip out there during the july 4th weekend to try and get a look at the area I have pinpointed and try to find wollows, water holes, sign etc...
As far as bears and cats go. I am from the midwest and have never been around predators bigger than a coyote so I am a little apprehensive about that. Not scared, but I definitely have a profound respect for them. Here is my thought on the bears. I think I will buy some bear spray for defense, but I am also going to carry a handgun with me just for some added security. From what I have read though, it seems bear spray is more effective, and of course I wouldn't want to shoot at one unless absolutely necessary. Most of my concern stems from my wife. She is convinced I am going to get eatin by a bear.
Thanks again for the help.
"Thats why they call it hunting"
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Crystal creek drainage is smack in the middle of the fossil ridge wilderness so there should be no ATVs. Thats a big reason I want to hunt a wilderness area.
Thank you guys very much for answering my questions.
As far as getting in great shape, I'm on it and working hard. I consider myself in good shape anyways (I'm 27 and work out regularly),but as a flatlander I know i need to improve my cardio a ton. I've been day hiking in colorado before (vail area) so I know what the low oxygen feels like.
Right now I'm gathering the equipment I need and reading as much as I can. I've read Cameran Hanes book Backcountry Bowhunting, Mike Eastmans Elk Hunting the West, and Elk hunting 101. I have a pre-order in for elknuts playbook which is being published as I type an should be ready by the end of the month. I have watched numerous dvds from eastmans and others.
As far as my expectations go, I am going into this hunt with the goal of it be a learning experience. I am going to work my tail off and hope I can connect on a bull, but if I don't I wont be dissapointed. I am new to this so I know I need to put in my time and truly "earn" a good bull and that may take years. I plan on hunting this area for years to come so the more I can learn with each outing the better.
I am planning a scouting trip out there during the july 4th weekend to try and get a look at the area I have pinpointed and try to find wollows, water holes, sign etc...
As far as bears and cats go. I am from the midwest and have never been around predators bigger than a coyote so I am a little apprehensive about that. Not scared, but I definitely have a profound respect for them. Here is my thought on the bears. I think I will buy some bear spray for defense, but I am also going to carry a handgun with me just for some added security. From what I have read though, it seems bear spray is more effective, and of course I wouldn't want to shoot at one unless absolutely necessary. Most of my concern stems from my wife. She is convinced I am going to get eatin by a bear.
Thanks again for the help. You've got a great plan thus far and I hope it works well for you. Your expectations are grounded and I admire that. I hunted this area for 20 years now. It took me nineteen to drop a great bull and 10 to get my first. Hopefully you can make it happen sooner. As for the bears, whatever makes you feel better. I sincerely doubt any problems with the black bears short of them stealing your food if they can find it. As for the ATV's, I can honestly say I've witnessed transgressions into the wilderness there on a yearly basis. You should be alone and not have problems, but don't be surprised if you do. As for the biologists, call the Gunnison office and ask for Brandon Diamond (biologist) and if you can try Chris Parmeter the Warden. With Chris I truly suggest leaving things vague at first and get to know him really well before asking for real detailed stuff. He will help you immensely, but he is bombarded with calls every year for detailed info. Great guy nonetheless. Kelly
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Ditto on shoting the first legal bull,and I think the archery tag is an either sex tag. So if you have not shot an elk yet, a cow is a valid oportunity for any first time elk hunter.
robaly the only bear problem would be them getting after your food. There are quite a few in the area,but I don't considered the dangerous.They can sure make a mess of your camp though, so take appropriate precausions in hanging your food high and no food in your tent. No problem with cats.
Mg biggest offering is make arrangements on how you will get your meat out before you start hunting. If you have never shot an elk before I doubt you realize how much they weigh and I have met several archers who decided they can't make the necceassary trips to pack the meat out and leave some to rot. You have maybe two days to get it to a cooler and then you have to go back in to pack your camp out.
If you are going by yourself, I suggest you invest in one of those SPOT devices and leave the information of what web site someone can go to to track your where abouts
If God wanted you to walk and carry things on your back, He would not have invented stirrups and pack saddles
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Thanks again for the good tips.
As far as the SPOT goes, I am going to rent one from a company that rents them for a weekly fee. I will definitely have a SPOT with me and my GPS, and back-up compass.
As far as hauling the meat out if I connect. Some have told me it can't be done by myself and to have arrangements with a packer. Others have told me it kicks your butt, but it can be done. Right now I am planning on doing it myself just for budget reasons alone. I have not ruled out a packer though yet. It is my understanding that only licensed outfitters can be hired to pack an elk out on wilderness land. Some estimates I got have been around $300 for the service. I am really anal about wasting meat and letting it spoil, out of respect for the animal, so I will work my tail off to get it out.
Kelk, thank you for the contacts in the area. I will try to get a hold of them. I agree with what you said about not calling up and asking a bunch of questions expecting to get some valuable insight. Basically I just want some advice on certain things and if they have some good tips to offer even better.
"Thats why they call it hunting"
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Thanks again for the good tips.
As far as the SPOT goes, I am going to rent one from a company that rents them for a weekly fee. I will definitely have a SPOT with me and my GPS, and back-up compass.
As far as hauling the meat out if I connect. Some have told me it can't be done by myself and to have arrangements with a packer. Others have told me it kicks your butt, but it can be done. Right now I am planning on doing it myself just for budget reasons alone. I have not ruled out a packer though yet. It is my understanding that only licensed outfitters can be hired to pack an elk out on wilderness land. Some estimates I got have been around $300 for the service. I am really anal about wasting meat and letting it spoil, out of respect for the animal, so I will work my tail off to get it out.
Kelk, thank you for the contacts in the area. I will try to get a hold of them. I agree with what you said about not calling up and asking a bunch of questions expecting to get some valuable insight. Basically I just want some advice on certain things and if they have some good tips to offer even better. No problem and glad I could help. My advice about not bugging them in depth was a generic peice of info. Having spoke to them at great length they really do get pounded with folks demanding to know exactly where the elk are at. I can see why they get a little burnt out. lol Enjoy the hunt. Its a magnificent place. The ridge that runs to the left in this picture is on the west side of the Crystal Creek drainage. The bald peaks are what you will be hunting under every day at the head waters of Crystal Creek. This picture was taken in Sept. of 2007. About the 16th I believe. ![[Linked Image]](http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb65/K-elk/gunnison27.jpg)
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That is some awesome scenery. I can't wait! gives me goosebumps. Thanks again for your kindness and the advice.
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groundshrinkage:
Archery tags in unit 55 are over the counter and unlimited. So you can buy one from any sporting goods store any time before the season opens. They are also either sex tags so you can shoot a cow. I know everyone wants a big bull, but since you've indicated the sensible intent to hunt the area over several years, then it's a good idea to kill the first cow that you see. I learned a long time ago that the way to learn to hunt elk is to start with the conviction that taking a cow is OK.
Also, I recommend that you hunt on opening morning of the archery season. Some people say that archery hunting doesn't disturb the elk because archery hunters are so stealthy. But my experience indicates that by Monday after opening morning of archery season, the elk have dissapeared from their summer range and have already become very wary.
There's about a one in a thousand chance that you will see a mountain lion and about a one in a million chance that it will threaten you. There's a 99% chance that you won't see a bear and if you do, it will be running away.
I think you might want to be careful about carrying a firearm (even a psitol) while bow hunting. I'm not sure how the DOW game wardens look upon that. Some might frown on that and give you a hard time over it.
Wind in my hair, Sun on my face, I gazed at the wide open spaces, And I was at home.
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groundshrinkage: It's going to difficult to find an outfitter that will agree to hawl out your meat on horses. The USFS limits the number of clients that an outfitter can have in a given area, so they prefer to provide drop camp services and fully guided hunts because there's more money in that. You might consider buying some Game Saver food grade citric acid spray. I've used it a couple of times in Alaska, when I knew that I had to preserve my meat for several days without refrigeration. It works great. Here's a link for on-line purchases. http://www.indianvalleymeats.com/about.htm You might also want to consider de-boning your meat before you carry it out in a backpack. Colorado requires that you carry out all four quarters, the backstraps and tenderloins, as a minimum. Most ethical hunters carry out a lot more than that. KC
Wind in my hair, Sun on my face, I gazed at the wide open spaces, And I was at home.
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groundshrinkage: It's going to difficult to find an outfitter that will agree to hawl out your meat on horses. The USFS limits the number of clients that an outfitter can have in a given area, so they prefer to provide drop camp services and fully guided hunts because there's more money in that. You might consider buying some Game Saver food grade citric acid spray. I've used it a couple of times in Alaska, when I knew that I had to preserve my meat for several days without refrigeration. It works great. Here's a link for on-line purchases. http://www.indianvalleymeats.com/about.htm You might also want to consider de-boning your meat before you carry it out in a backpack. Colorado requires that you carry out all four quarters, the backstraps and tenderloins, as a minimum. Most ethical hunters carry out a lot more than that. KC Thats awesome! thank you for the link. I will be looking seriously into getting this product. I do plan to bone the meat out first. On a side note, I love this site. Alot of experienced western hunters willing to help a midwest boy out. Thanks again everybody.
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If your going to talk to the DOW ask specifically about the winter kill in that area. The Gunnison area was the hardest hit of all of Colorado.
Ed
A person who asks a question is a fool for 5 minutes the person who never asks is a fool forever.
The worst slaves are those that put the chains on themselves.
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It is permissable now to carry a side arm when hunting archery. If it is concealed, you must have a CCW permit which Colorado recognizes from another state.I think they have abolished the rule of not being able to carry while archery hunting.A call to the area WCO where you plan to hunt or the regional office might be very worth while.
Anyone packs meat or offers any packing service on public land in CO must have an Outfitters license. Not just wilderness areas.
$300 is probably pretty close to the fee to pack meat out. I have heard $175 pre horse, X2 horses .
Lotsa guys pack the meat out on thier back.I don't/can't ,but it does kick your butt
Last edited by saddlesore; 02/15/09.
If God wanted you to walk and carry things on your back, He would not have invented stirrups and pack saddles
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Unit 55 is a well hunted unit in terms of numbers. There are precious few that actually make it to where you are talking about though. You will see a few archery camps out there and may actually run into other archers. So there will be two of you standing there in 10,000 acres of wilderness. It is a very doable trip, success rates vary widely. Weather is a very important variable for your hunt. I personally try to hunt when ever the weather is lousy as I find the bulls active, scent is down and walking is quiet. Last year I hunted the ML week with a friend and it was absolutely beautiful for camping, kinda rough for sneaking up on elk. It was a great time, yet no elk in the freezer. By the way I don't hunt Fossil ridge but north of there. For packing meat out call John Nelson ( http://www.majesticwest.net/ ), who has been outfitting the Fossil Ridge area for years. Bears and Mountain Lions are really low priority worries, ankle fractures, exposure, fatigue are your bigger worries (don't tell your wife that either). Get on the stair master as it is steep. Also you may consider coming a few days early and acclimate before the elevation change. I helped a couple of fellows from the campfire find a hunting spot last year and camp was at 10K and one of them got altitude sickness the first night. If you come out in July I would be happy to help in any way I can, and if I am off would be happy to help you scout.
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supercrewd
Kudos to you, very few hunters are willing to show beginners around :-)
Ed
A person who asks a question is a fool for 5 minutes the person who never asks is a fool forever.
The worst slaves are those that put the chains on themselves.
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Any excuse to get out for a hike...
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Are you hunting alone or have a partner? My buddy and I started 4 yrs ago with DIY backpack hunts. Been acquiring and upgrading gear ever since. First trip was more to make sure we could survive - 80# packs, way overkill. Getting better with lightweight gear. Don't worry about predators - unless you're in grizzly country. May need to take measures to protect camp but you don't need the spray or a handgun - too much extra weight. Consider building up points to get a limited access type of hunt - much better odds of success. But either way, its beautiful country. You will never be so tired and so happy at the same time. Very rewarding if and when you tag out or put yourself in the game. Have a basic GPS, map and compass - know how to use them. Check your water sources too - didn't plan for that on the first hunt. Good luck and keep us posted on your progress. Consider joining Huntinfool to complement the Eastman's subscription for applying in multiple states.
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