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Joined: Oct 2000
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I just picked up a remington 660 that had been rebarreled to 458 x 2" american and haven't been able to find much data out there. I was under the impression that you could use 450 marlin starting loads for it. Any info you might have on the caliber would be apprecieated.

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Josh,

Over the years I have owned three .458x2's. I still own the last one: A M-700 nee; .350 Rem Mag Classic, rebarreled by McGowan. It was built back in the early 90's by a friend of mine. When he passed away, I purchased it from his estate. I have not fired this one.

The 1st one I owned was a M-600 in a MPI stock. It kicked like a Missouri mule. I didn't keep it long. Truly you are correct, there is not much data available.

The .450 Marlin is virtually identical with the exception of a wider belt. (Thus it cannot be chambered in other magnum rifles...) I would not hesitate to start with data for the .450 Marlin. I'd work up loads very carefully, and stop when chronograph readings are reasonable. There is NO need to try to make it a .458 win Mag. If you need more power than the 2" case will provide, then for goodness sake, buy a .458 Winnie.

An astute handloader and shooter, will likely reach his recoil tolerance well before maximum loads are acheived. My best advice is to pick a reasonable velocity goal, and stop when it is reached. Powerwise it is slightly better than a hot loaded .45-70. It's advantage is that it lies in a short, handy, bolt gun. smile

I see no reason to use bullets heavier than 300-350 grs. The heaviest bullets are designed for use in the .458, anyway. The Handloader's Manual of Cartridge Conversions lists only one load: 40 grs. of IMR-4198 with a 350 gr. bullet for a velocity of 1825 f.p.s.

More data is listed in CoTW by Frank Barnes. That book is an invaluable reference to us rifle looneys. Ironically, it was Frank Barnes who initially wildcatted the .458x2. If you don't have that book at your disposal, I can Xerox that page and snail-mail it to you...

My buddy shot at least one deer with the cartridge. He said they dropped like they were struck by the hammer of Thor! I always thought that one day, I might carry his old gun out and take a deer in his memory... smile

Hope this helps...

Grasshopper


"As you walk thru life, don't be surprised that there are fewer people that you encounter seeking truth than those seeking confirmation of what they already believe!"


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Grasshopper I would really appreciate a copy of that page of Frank Barnes book.

I'm not planning on trying to make this thing into a 458 Winnie, haven't had a Lott and several other big bores I've gotten my fill of monster magnums, I was looking for a short, handy, 45/70 clone. I will be happy with 300s at 2200, 350s at 2000, and 405s at 1900-200. I think this should be doable, I shot a lot of 405gr loads out of my 45/70 guide gun at 1925fps.

I have a handfull of 300gr Tipped triple shock that look pretty sporting for it. Other than that I have been impressed by the speer 350gr hot cores in my 458 lott and think they would be great in this 458 american.

I'll pm you with my address, thanks a bunch.

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Josh,

Already in the envelope. I'll drop it in the post tomorrow...

GH


"As you walk thru life, don't be surprised that there are fewer people that you encounter seeking truth than those seeking confirmation of what they already believe!"


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Here are a few pictures of it.

[Linked Image]

Brass has proven very easy to make, here is a cut down 300 win mag and a loaded round.
[Linked Image]


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Neat cartridge and rifle.

I can remember reading about it back in the 70's.

Thanks for posting those pics, very cool.

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Go to Google and type in .458x2" American and you will get more loads and info than you know what to do with ....

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That's a pretty nice cartridge. I haven't had one but a gunsmith friend of mine used to make quite a few on Mauser actions.


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hey Mr. Sorensen,

i was wondering if i might be able to coax you into making and sending me a dummy round for that cartridge?

i collect cartridges you see, and would be honored to have that round in the collection as i do not yet have one, or, for that matter, have i ever seen one.

please let me know via PM what you think.


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I have handled only one 458x2, it was built on a Mexican
Mauser and was a very attractive looking rifle. I didnt
buy it because I didnt know anything about the caliber
at the time. If I remember correctly, the 458x2 was
an experimental caliber used by the military in the
Vietnam War.

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JS,

I know how such rifle handles and in that chambering - it just screems for dense bush brownies (I can hear it, can't you ? )

Hope it will see some action.

Congrats on the snatch.


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It certainly does at that. Now I just have to figure out what way I want to scope it. Looking at the leupold QR base and rings, the one with the little levers on the base. And the warne bases w/ QD rings. Only bonus of the warne is you can get a good backup peep that bolts down to it, and I would have to make a peep for the leupold QR bases. I think it wouldn't be too tought to use a QR ring, like a high ring and cut down and install a ghost ring on top. Just take some playing around on the mill.

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Rifle Sep-Oct 1971, p. 34 "The bestest brush gun" by Will Hafler
Handloader #132, March-Apr 1988, "The .458x2 in an XP-100" by Joseph Donnelly

The latter article shows max loads in 15" barrel of 400 Barnes, 54 gr IMR4198, 2175 fps (2136 hot barrel); 500 gr. Lyman 457406 cast, 48 gr, 1844 fps.


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