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#3657853 - 01/08/10 Ruger M77 7X57 Long Throat  
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roundoak Offline
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From time to time there are references to the Ruger M77 in 7X57 caliber having a long throat and some indicate it as a negative. I assume Ruger built these rifles to SAAMI specs. Other manufacturers such as Winchester and Remington for example...would'nt they have built their rifles to the same SAAMI specs?


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#3657895 - 01/08/10 Re: Ruger M77 7X57 Long Throat [Re: roundoak]  
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Magnum_Man Offline
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My M93 Spanish Mauser in 7x57 has a long throat for undoubtably the long 175 gr Rn bullets used in it. The M77 Ruger 7x57 I bought new in the box in 1976 and made in 72 has a long throat. Not been an issue for me, both guns will shoot tolerably well with 139 gr Hornady flat based Spire pts,140 gr Nosler Partitions,154 gr Hornady Spire pts and RN's. Never had to use anything else to get the job done.For a long time back then, WW and RP factory loads featured only the 175 RN. Federal offered the 139 gr Sire Pt as well as heavier loads. Luck to you. Magnum_Man

#3657896 - 01/08/10 Re: Ruger M77 7X57 Long Throat [Re: roundoak]  
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RinB Offline
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There were some early rifles which were made in the 70's I believe which had long and large diameter throats. Norma 205 powder was available. It allowed for high load density. Some of those rifles were loaded to very high pressures and predicably gave very high velocities. One fellow I knew got 3140 with the original 140 Nosler partitions. Probably not too good of an idea then or now.


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#3658129 - 01/08/10 Re: Ruger M77 7X57 Long Throat [Re: RinB]  
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roundoak Offline
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I fully understand the reason Ruger, Winchester, Remington, etc., built the rifles with a throat to accomodate ammunition loaded with the 175 grain bullet and I do not necessarily view it as a negative. As a hunting rifle I seat the the bullets in the case to achieve an C.O.A.L. that will fit in the magazine or just off the lands...which ever applies. In all cases

In addition, my Uncle and Nephew have a Remington 700 BDL and Model 70 respectively. Inverted bullets in cases indicated the following dimensions:
Overall case and bullet length
Ruger - 2.572"

Remington - 2.512"

Winchester - 2.675"

An amigo has a Winchester M70 measuring 2.820"

The 7MM certainly has not been the easiest to load for accuracy, but with persistence it can be achieved.

There are always surprises...the Ruger with a 1 - 8 3/4" twist shoots the 115gr. Speer hollow point like a sub-MOA varmint gun, which blows some theories that light-weight bullets will not shoot well in the 7MM. 48.5gr IMR4320 at 3100fps.


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#3658144 - 01/08/10 Re: Ruger M77 7X57 Long Throat [Re: roundoak]  
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Lou_270 Offline
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I have heard the same about Ruger 7x57s, however, I have had several different rifle makes and caliber combos that had very long throats. Most of them have ended up shooting very well and some exceptionally well.

Lou

#3658519 - 01/08/10 Re: Ruger M77 7X57 Long Throat [Re: Lou_270]  
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BobinNH Offline
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A few guys at our club had these long-throat 7x57's....IIRC these also coincided with the use of the infamous subcontractor barrels.I had a couple in 257 Roberts.....they were one load rifles.

These 7x57's drove some of the guys nuts,as the only thing predictable about them were how unpredictable they were...mostly they struggled and came up with one or two loads that shot well;and it was not always the long bullets...things like 130 gr Speers sometimes shot,despite having to take a long jump to the lands....a guy just never knew.

I watched, listened,and stayed away from them smile




The 280 Remington is overbore.

The 7 Rem Mag is over bore.
#3658540 - 01/09/10 Re: Ruger M77 7X57 Long Throat [Re: BobinNH]  
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RickF Offline
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I bought one new in about '90. Dunno if it was one of "the" long throat jobbies, but it did have an extremely long throat. I forget just how far I had to seat out the 140's but there wasn't much bullet left in the case.

I also can't forget however, that I could load about any medium burning powder (IMR and H 4350, 4064, 3031, H414, 4895, you name it) in there with 140 grainers and they all gave from 2800-2850 fps and shot about 8/10". That of course after the action bedding and barrel float those Rugers seemed to need.

It was a nice rifle I wish I still owned.


Anybody who seriously concerns themselves with the adequacy of a Big 7mm for anything we hunt here short of brown bear, is a dufus. They are mostly making shidt up. Crunch! Nite-nite!

Stolen from an erudite CF member.
#3658783 - 01/09/10 Re: Ruger M77 7X57 Long Throat [Re: RickF]  
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Magnum_Man Offline
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Well I still do own mine. The guy I bought my Ruger from was a dealer and carried that boxed 7x57 around about 3 years of gun shows. I had looked at it several times over the years, the time I actually ended up buying it he said to me "when you gonna buy this so I don't have to haul it around any more?" I said "when you gonna shoot me a good price? he laughed and said $160 no tax one time deal. I paid in cash on the spot. One of the first bought and destined to be one of the last I'll sell. Mine also likes 120 gr Hornady's. Magnum_Man

#3661059 - 01/09/10 Re: Ruger M77 7X57 Long Throat [Re: BobinNH]  
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roundoak Offline
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Originally Posted by BobinNH
A few guys at our club had these long-throat 7x57's....IIRC these also coincided with the use of the infamous subcontractor barrels.I had a couple in 257 Roberts.....they were one load rifles.

These 7x57's drove some of the guys nuts,as the only thing predictable about them were how unpredictable they were...mostly they struggled and came up with one or two loads that shot well;and it was not always the long bullets...things like 130 gr Speers sometimes shot,despite having to take a long jump to the lands....a guy just never knew.

I watched, listened,and stayed away from them smile


Is it fair to say the subcontactors would have been aware of SAAMI specs for the 7X57? Also, Ruger must have had some quality controls in place...after all there name went on the rifles. For that matter, Bill Ruger would most likely see to that.

I am begining to form the opinion that the early 77s in the 7X57 got a bad rap because of a few individuals early on and others just regurgitated the stories with out actually taking the time to wring out the potential of the rifles.


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#3661328 - 01/09/10 Re: Ruger M77 7X57 Long Throat [Re: roundoak]  
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tj3006 Offline
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I am very happy to say that all 3 of my 7X57s have long throat.
My smith has 2 reamers for the round. he calls on the american throat, (short) and one the europian, (long)
I can't say it has ben a negative for me to have long throats, infact just the opisate.
the long throat leavs room for more powder and lowers preasures a little.
My Ruger, (#1A) has a long throat snd I shoot 50 grains of H-414 under a 140 grain balistic tip. I get excelent acuracy. .50 to .75 and velocity straddels the 2900 MK.
My other 2 are custom mauser 98s and they to have the long throat. I hope they shoot even almost as well as my Ruger , but I have not tried them yet...tj3006

#3661834 - 01/10/10 Re: Ruger M77 7X57 Long Throat [Re: tj3006]  
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Seafire Offline
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My Ruger 77 Mk 2's in 7 x 57 both had long throats.

I just seated the bullets to magazine length.

both were picky on loads, but 40 grains of IMR 3031 with ANY bullet weight, turned out to be 1/2 inch loads...

anything else could give groups of 3 to 5 inches at 100 yds.


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#3666827 - 01/11/10 Re: Ruger M77 7X57 Long Throat [Re: Seafire]  
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roundoak Offline
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Originally Posted by Seafire
My Ruger 77 Mk 2's in 7 x 57 both had long throats.

I just seated the bullets to magazine length.

both were picky on loads, but 40 grains of IMR 3031 with ANY bullet weight, turned out to be 1/2 inch loads...

anything else could give groups of 3 to 5 inches at 100 yds.


Seafire, any bullet weight? Wow, that is interesting.


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#3666919 - 01/11/10 Re: Ruger M77 7X57 Long Throat [Re: roundoak]  
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roundoak Offline
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My tang safety M77 has a champagne taste...for bullets 140 gr and above. Prefers Nosler Partitions and Speer Grand Slams, however I am on a beer budget. Many years ago I settled on 154gr Hornady Spire Points for black bear, Whitetail and Mule deer and 160gr Nosler Partitions or Speer Grand Slams for Moose and Elk. For big game I sight in and practice with the Hornady's and shoot the Noslers and Speer if I am after Elk and Moose.

Recently, on a guided black bear hunt in Ontario I struck up a conversation about 7x57s with a married couple from Kansas in camp. The wife was carrying a custom VZ24 rifle chambered for the 7MM Mauser. Handloads were 160gr Speer Grand Slam, which she used on deer, hogs, elk and black bear. I told the couple I was using 154gr Hornady Interlocks but was not happy with them...they did not have the accuracy of the old Spire Points. The gentleman said he uses a Lee Crimp Die on all bullet weights loaded for the 7X57 due to the long throat and suggested I give it a try.

The crimp die has the Ruger M77 shooting the Interlocks just as good or better than the old Spire Points. Happy Days!


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