Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Predators and Varmints 223 vs the 17 HMR for fun factor...

Was out shooting sage rats this afternoon..

started out with the 10/22 and a 6 power scope...

out to about 75 yds that gave me " bang-flop".. nothing spectacular...so after 50 shots or so..I put that up...

and got out the 17 HMR... out to about 125 yds.. same results...'bang-flop'.. nothing spectacular again..so I put that up after about 10 shots..

Finally pulled out two different 223s...both shooting 46 grain Win Hollow Points at about 3100 fps... and it still allows you to see your hits within your scopes sight picture...

No bag flops here..when those 46 grain HPs hit them, they will literally explode unless you just graze them... and that still kills them...

after walking out in the field to check out some of the hits with the 22 LR, the 17 HMR and then the 223....no question about it... the 223 is like hitting them with a missle...

hand loading the 223 still is cheaper to shoot than the 17 HMR and still shoots further and flatter...

so I am still trying to warm up to the 17 HMR...accurate yes, but fun? not compared to the 223 with a fast Hollow Point..

I think you have the right answer. You do what I do..take them all, shoot them all, and re-evaluate on the next trip...


I see I'm not the only one who does a BDA on occasion....( Bullet Damage Assessment)...

Ingwe

I'll take out my .17 hmr, .22 mag, and .223 for gits and shiggles with the dirt rats.

The 17 is fun when going for head shots only.
The 22 mag gives the best "thwop!".
The .223 is best for gopher explosions.

Used to shoot a lot of $0 gr NBTs in a .223....


Spectacular.....


Ingwe

50 BT's just erases them..

I tend to use both the .17 HMR and a centerfire. I use the .17 to take the innocent ones, then the centerfire to take the longer ones. Especially with prairie dogs, the centerfire seems to spook nearby dogs underground much quicker.

If you buy .17 HMR's in large batches the price is about 20 cents a shot. It's hard to beat that with a .223 even in reduced loads with the cheapest bulk bullets--and then there's the reloading time, one reason I shoot quite a few .17's each year.

Reloading is a hobby.. so I don't look at as time spent doing a job..

I don't buy 17 HMR in bulk and it is 20 cents a shot locally..

however I do buy bulk bullets from Mid South and Hornady Bulk bullets..

my two powders for 223 volume shooting are Blue Dot and SR 4759..

so the price for the 223 in cheaper.. and the explosive factor is what make it fun..

plus using 10 to 15 grains of powder, it doesn't have a big boom compared to regular 223 loads..

Was out for gophers yesterday. First time I'd used the hmr on 'em. I did appreciate the extra distance afforded over the 22lr. My 7 year old son was with me as well and he really enjoyed it when I shot one at 20 yards in the middle of the dirt track in front of us. I didn't expect that I'd see a gopher fly with the hmr but this little guy hit about 5 feet with parts flying everywhere. My son was thrilled, that's for sure! Of course none of the other kills were that spectacular... but he's not afraid of the report of the 17hmr either. He won't come if I pack a centerfire.

Pretty well sums up my feelings too.
I just don't enjoy reloading as much as I did 30 years ago....
It's OK, but the 17's niche is that after the shot the case goes back to the earth.

I also have an intermediary step between regular long rifle and HMR,
a Winchester 52B loaded with Remington Yellow Jackets.

Bang flop fills at 100 yards or a little more on ground squirrels with
very little noise via the 28" barrel.

Seafire,

So what's your favorite powder charge and bullet combo for reduced loads in the .223?

PM sent answering that question...

Im anxious to try some of Seafire's reduced loads for my .223, especially after read posts like this and the previous posts about reduced loads. I have a extra scope setup for just the occasion. I just need to get the components then i'll be well on my way.

Brett (Mac)

That is my experience and base line armament combo as well, although sometimes a 222 will supplant a 223 and I will often have a really long range rig about for some 'watch this' shootin times with the buds.

The 22 MAgnum has it ALL OVER the 17 RF's for a quick death and "THWOP" music.

Seafire, glad you figured it out.

After your help with blue dot and the 223, the others just are a let down.

In August of 2008 me and my nephew met a rancher that begged us to come and thin out the PD's on his ranch, the following weekend we went to the ranch and WOW thousands and thousands of prairie dogs. we started out with 223's but being 95 degrees you could only get 7 or 8 shots down the barrel before the barrel got too toasty. we switched to the 17HMR's and between us we shot the entire brick (1000 rounds).
The rancher was disappointed that we did not thin them out enough so we drove 35 miles to the nearest town and bought 1200 more rounds at Wally world, by the time it got to be too dark to shoot me and my nephew had shot 2200 rounds of 17HMR.
To me this was the FUNNEST day of PD hunting I have ever had. no way we could have ever put that many rounds through a 223 even with reduced loads, bash the 17HMR if you like but I think I will keep mine just to save the throat erosion in my 223's
B

Boatanchor..

you haven't tried it evidently...

I set up with two 223s, and alternate between them every 15 shots or so.. I can shoot 3 to 4 shots every 2 minutes and shoot that all day long out of one 223 barrel using Blue Dot without having the barrel heat up so much, that I have to stop using it..

having two side by side off the hood of the truck, I can shoot them all day long without stopping except to eat, use the bathroom. etc... right up to the time I have to stop shooting because I have a headache from Scope Squint...

not bashing the 17 HMR... but I just prefer the red mist factors with the 223..

any day you can shoot 2200 rounds in aday at varmints.. regardless of caliber used is a good day..

may I live long enough and have enough target opportunity to wear out every 223 and 17 HMR rifle I have...

may we all have that opportunity! regardless of what we shoot..

preferring one round over another doesn't mean one is bashing the round they are NOT using..

Seafire; Another question for you regarding your Blue Dot loads in a .223..
I figured they wouldn't heat up as bad as "normal" loads...do you feel they also will add to increased barrel life?
It would make sense, and you sound like one of the folks that does enough shooting to have found out...

Ingwe

definitely adds to the barrel life substantially...

also consider the fact that a pound of powder yields 500 shots or more..

I can attest to one rifle that I did trade off, only because I was offered $100.00 more than I paid for it..had 15,000 rounds down the barrel when I let it go..

10,000 of those were Blue Dot loads with 55 grain bullets on them...

the guy who bought it put another 2000 down the tube, and it would still group that could be covered with a dime at 100 yds with 55 grain Ballistic Tip and 25 grains of H 335.

Handloading to me is a necessary evil to -

A) make my shooting cheaper
B? make my loads more accurate fpor a particular rifle.

It is not a hobby to me. Anytime I load more than 40 rounds at a sitting, it becomes mind numbing work to me.

By my reconing the components alone for your .223 Blue dot loads would cost the following per 100 rounds most places

$3.00 per 100 primers (average price these days with either tax or shipping /hazmat)
$4 powder
$10 per 100 bullets
At least another $2 per loading for brass wear per 100 rounds even the cheapest mill surp brass.

Thats' $19 worth of just materials, not including the amortized cost of equipment and time.

17HMR loads(Hornady V maxes) are available online for $20 to $22 per 100 when you buy a 500 round brick shipped to your door.

I would just as soon buy the 17HMR ammo and have fun shooting. So would many folks and that is why the 17HMR still sells very well.

But, as a .22 Hornet lover, I can also see the attraction of the quiet ,cheap to shoot reduced .223 loads. Especially to someone who actually likes reloading lots of ammunition.

I don't, so to each his own..

It's all good.

Seafire;thanks for the reply...thats also about what I figured. Shooting "normal" .223 loads Ive gotten anywhere from about 4500 rounds to 10,000 through a barrel depending on the barrel and the abuse I give it before I start seeing a fall off in performance.
Presently shooting a Hart bbl and trying not to abuse it, got 7000 through it and nary a sign of wear, even in the throat.
But, at the price of barrels and as you mentioned, the price of powder...
Anyway, thanks much for the input..I gotta go find some Blue Dot!!

Ingwe