24hourcampfire.com
24hourcampfire.com
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Hop To
Page 2 of 13 1 2 3 4 12 13
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 57,377
R
Campfire Kahuna
Offline
Campfire Kahuna
R
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 57,377
Originally Posted by rockchuck828
Originally Posted by dennisinaz
Originally Posted by Dirtfarmer


Would appreciate input and advice.

Thanks,

DF



Out to 500 yds, you can ignore altitude


Bad advice


Actually zone dependant... from where I"m at, like you, I"m 200 feet ASL basically... take that to 12,000 or so... my zero is off enough to miss to my tastes... living at say 8K, going to 12K, out to 500 I"d doubt that altitude makes much difference at all. Elevation angle of shot could always make a difference.

Edit to add, I'm not so sure its the elevation difference that messes my zero's up, I just know to check them, that they are usually hitting about 3-4 inches higher at 100 than at home.... but humidity, temps can factor in of course as well as pressure.


We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
BP-B2

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 16,540
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 16,540
Given a constant temp and just using a .277" 130gr SST with a MV of 3250 the difference in drop at 500yds. from sea level to 5000ft is -1.7", at 10,000ft it is -4.2", at 15,000ft it is -5.6".


The Chosin Few November to December 1950, Korea.
I'm not one of the Chosin Few but no more remarkable group of Americans ever existed.
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 36,824
D
Campfire 'Bwana
OP Online Content
Campfire 'Bwana
D
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 36,824
Yukonal,

Am learning about Leupold's latest offerings. Unless I missed something, I think the VX-3 4.5-14AO is a 30mm scope and I don't see the CDS offered on that model. The VX-3 4.5-14 in 1" tube, for some reason, has only a 19' FOV at lowest power. (See posting on that subject). Whereas, the VX-3 3.5-10 has nearly 30' FOV at lowest power. I know there's a full power difference, but 10' is a lot to give up. I'm trying to avoid 30mm scopes for this rifle due to bulk and weight.

DF

Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 36,824
D
Campfire 'Bwana
OP Online Content
Campfire 'Bwana
D
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 36,824
Right now, I'm leaning toward the VX-3, 3.5-10 CDS if I don't go with a Swaro. I like this simple, compact scope, although I'd be giving up A/O and Euro glass. For my use, 10X top power w/o A/O should suffice for a hunting rifle even at 4-500 yds. and I understand Leupold has done a lot with glass quality on their latest, higher end offerings. For long range targets, or long range game, I'd make a different choice. I know how tough Leupolds are, not sure about brute toughness of the Euro scopes. They may be as tough, I just don't know. Leupold custom turrets are a lot less expensive and I may ultimately want more than one or two.

DF

Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,799
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,799
my 3-10 VX3's w/ CDS have made 6 and 700yds quite easy....though I somewhat prefer MOA. I will say the yardages on my last "custom" turret from Leup is dead on out to 950(where I hit zero stop)....


100% Public land DIY!
IC B2

Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 57,377
R
Campfire Kahuna
Offline
Campfire Kahuna
R
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 57,377
Originally Posted by nsaqam
Given a constant temp and just using a .277" 130gr SST with a MV of 3250 the difference in drop at 500yds. from sea level to 5000ft is -1.7", at 10,000ft it is -4.2", at 15,000ft it is -5.6".


Like I said it can be otehr factors but I"m off more than what your charts show, repeatably over a number of years. Is it altitude only? Probably not, but in one way its not to be ignored that lightly.


We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 36,824
D
Campfire 'Bwana
OP Online Content
Campfire 'Bwana
D
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 36,824
nsaqam,

I thought rifles shot high at higher altitudes due to less friction from the thinner air. I heard approx. 1 MOA change for every 5,000' elev. Your data seems to be going in the other direction.

DF

Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 3,450
C
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
C
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 3,450
I`m sure you considered Ziess? I did a turret for $65 on a 3x9 Conquest. Excellent scope, very dependable movement, and return to zero. Nice trim, bright glass, at $400. My third.
I developed my own drop chart, which you will have to do too...tho you shouldn`t have much problem out to 500+ yrs.
Zeroed at 300, your bullet is going to drop about 26-27 inches at 5. That`s a 5-6 MOA come-up...if my math is correct.

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 16,540
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 16,540
Originally Posted by Dirtfarmer
nsaqam,

I thought rifles shot high at higher altitudes due to less friction from the thinner air. I heard approx. 1 MOA change for every 5,000' elev. Your data seems to be going in the other direction.

DF


The numbers are based off of the drop at sea level and the negative numbers is the difference at the specified altitude.

Sea level was 38.4" or something like that and the numbers I posted were subtracted from that 38.4".

So at 5000ft the drop was 36.7" and so forth.


The Chosin Few November to December 1950, Korea.
I'm not one of the Chosin Few but no more remarkable group of Americans ever existed.
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 3,239
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 3,239
Originally Posted by Dirtfarmer
Yukonal,

Am learning about Leupold's latest offerings. Unless I missed something, I think the VX-3 4.5-14AO is a 30mm scope and I don't see the CDS offered on that model. The VX-3 4.5-14 in 1" tube, for some reason, has only a 19' FOV at lowest power.DF


Farmer-I have both, and had M-1's installed on both at the same time, at Leupold. The 1"-4.5-14X40AO has an adjustable objective lens.

The 30mm 4.5-14X40LR has the side focus.

Now, if one or both of them isn't offered w/CDS, you can buy what you can find, and send it to Leupold to have CDS dials installed. I believe they will do it to any VX3 model.

As far as elevation correction is concerned...as the 2 other posters commented, it's a moot point. A quick example, without looking the charts back up, my 708 at 500 yards here in MN (980 elevation) compared to 6000' elevation in Alaska was only 2" different. Moot point. Look around in some ballistic calculators online, and compare some numbers for where you shoot, to where you could possibly go, and see what the difference is.

Also want to add, the only reason I suggested the 4.5-14, is because I like the extra power for target practice at 300 and 400 yards, which is about all I shoot after load developement is done. Didn't mean to sway you that way. 3.5-10 is a super scope. Hold 'em side by side at your dealer, and see which one you like best.

Last edited by yukonal; 01/12/11.

Originally Posted by archie_james_c
I should have just
bought a [bleep] T3...


IC B3

Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 36,824
D
Campfire 'Bwana
OP Online Content
Campfire 'Bwana
D
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 36,824
Thanks for the info. Your 4.5-14x40 A/O must be an older 1" model , as either I missed it in the line up or it has been replaced. I was amazed at the 19' FOV at 4.5 power on the new 1" 4.5-14x40. Is your 1" tube scope like that? I think the 30mm Long Range 4.5-14x40 has a decent FOV at 4.5 power and it has the side focus, which I like. I'm wondering now, if the tube body is long enough to mount on a mag length rifle without offset rings or mounts. The Ed Brown Damara comes with Talley bases, mounted with larger than std. screws. I don't really want to buy an offset set of bases and have to open the new base to receive the #8 screws vs. #6 std. offering.

These things can get complicated. May end up with the Z5 swaro 3.5-18x44 due to glass quality, side focus, 1" tube and adequate tube length. Not that much bigger or heavier and probably a better (although more expensive) scope.

DF

Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 5,749
G
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
G
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 5,749
Originally Posted by rost495
Originally Posted by GeorgiaBoy
I was in your situation just before Christmas. I chose to go with the Leu. CDS and the custom dials.

The reason I chose that system is because of its simplicty. 90% of my shots will be inside 250 yards, I only hunt one elevation, and for hogs and deer, I use but one bullet.

If I expected changes in altitude or bullet selection I would have gone with the M1 turrent.

I'm learning to use M1 type turrents on my hevey barrel rifle, and am enjoying the lessons.

GB



IMHO if your shots are all inside of 250, there is no need for a turret ever.


For hunting situations, "need" was not a factor in my equation.

I joined a shooting range this year that has steel out to 600 yards. I'll play with the turrents there.


Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 36,824
D
Campfire 'Bwana
OP Online Content
Campfire 'Bwana
D
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 36,824
I did some measuring and the VX-3's have relatively short tube bodies. I would have to change around the Talley bases and rings on the Ed Brown Damara magnum length action to accommodate any scopes in this series. Pretty well eliminates them, as I don't want to do that. I like the way these mounts fit and look. Will probably go Swaro. Just save a little longer to get the one I really want. Currently, my choice is the Z5 3.5-18x44 BT with an Outdoorsmans custom turret. Should be a super rig. I'll have it up and running for next season.

DF

Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 3,239
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 3,239
dirtfarmer-my 1", 4.5-14AO is a--less than a year old--VX3. Leupold's newest model.

http://www.leupold.com/hunting-and-...-3-riflescopes/vx-3-4-5-14x40mm-adj-obj/

A 20' FOV seems plenty to me.


Originally Posted by archie_james_c
I should have just
bought a [bleep] T3...


Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 5,749
G
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
G
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 5,749
DF,
What is the eye relief of the Z5?

Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 36,824
D
Campfire 'Bwana
OP Online Content
Campfire 'Bwana
D
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 36,824
3.74", evidently at all power ranges as they just give the one value. Not sure how they do that. Only thing kinda weird is .36" POI changes at 100 yds per click. Not sure where they came up with that. Maybe it's a metric value expressed in inches. Also, I like the Z3 4-12x50 BT, but it has no side focus or A/O. It has a 3.54" eye relief and .25" per click at 100 yds. I have around 6 Zeiss scopes of various vintages. Wide FOV and really good glass. Wish they had a ballistic turret set up like the VX-3 CDS or the Z series BT.

DF

Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 36,824
D
Campfire 'Bwana
OP Online Content
Campfire 'Bwana
D
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 36,824
Yukonal,

I guess I'd have to handle them to see what I thought. 20' seems a bit anemic compared with 30'. That's a 10' handicap that could make a difference in certain settings, up close and at low power. I guess I'm guilty of over thinking this, but like to study my equipment up front before a committment. Less chance of me selling a new piece of equipment on Ebay and starting all over, if you get my drift.

DF

Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 3,239
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 3,239
Hey, I follow you. When I went to buy my first "new" VX3, I took a VX3, 3.5-10X40...and a VX3, 4.5-14X40LR outside of Cabela's, and tested them for 20 minutes. I could scan over 400 yards, different terrain.

The 4.5-14 absolutely BLEW the 3.5-10 away. The difference is so huge, it isn't even a comparison. Definiately my favorite Leupold. I hope you find a good one for you.

Take a few minutes and snoop around Nightforce's website. The new NXS 2.5-10X32 is maybe the best all around hunting scope I've ever seen. With the NP-1 reticle.


Originally Posted by archie_james_c
I should have just
bought a [bleep] T3...


Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 36,824
D
Campfire 'Bwana
OP Online Content
Campfire 'Bwana
D
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 36,824
Yukonal,

Only Nightforce scope I ever used was sitting on a big 50 cal. They seem to be tough, big target type scopes. I'm headed the other way with this project. Sleek, light, versatile, simple with long range potential, even though my rifle is slightly over 7#'s. With the Shilen barrel, Jewell trigger and it's supurb accuracy, it could be be pressed into action as a long range rifle in a tight. I want a scope that could fully compliment this rifle if the need for a 500+ yard shot arose. Most shooting will be w/i 400 yds.

Df

Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 35,900
B
Campfire 'Bwana
Offline
Campfire 'Bwana
B
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 35,900
Originally Posted by Dirtfarmer


These things can get complicated.

DF


Only if you want them to... smile

A simple fixed 6X Leupold with LR dots will easily get you and your 300 Win Mag to 600 yards.....and you could add turrets to one if you wanted.500 yards is easily achieved......

A 3.5-10 Leupold should mount up on any magnum length receiver pretty easily.




The 280 Remington is overbore.

The 7 Rem Mag is over bore.
Page 2 of 13 1 2 3 4 12 13

Moderated by  RickBin 

Link Copied to Clipboard
YB23

Who's Online Now
703 members (204guy, 10gaugemag, 007FJ, 12344mag, 10Glocks, 17CalFan, 74 invisible), 2,958 guests, and 1,310 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Statistics
Forums81
Topics1,187,767
Posts18,401,495
Members73,823
Most Online11,491
Jul 7th, 2023


 







Fish & Game Departments | Solunar Tables | Mission Statement | Privacy Policy | Contact Us | DMCA
Hunting | Fishing | Camping | Backpacking | Reloading | Campfire Forums | Gear Shop
Copyright © 2000-2024 24hourcampfire.com, Inc. All Rights Reserved.
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5
(Release build 20201027)
Responsive Width:

PHP: 7.3.33 Page Time: 0.147s Queries: 14 (0.005s) Memory: 0.9097 MB (Peak: 1.0494 MB) Data Comp: Zlib Server Time: 2024-03-29 15:28:50 UTC
Valid HTML 5 and Valid CSS