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Originally Posted by 260Remguy
Where do you find the "substantially more case capacity" that you speak of?

The 260 holds 54 grains of H2O and the 6.5x55 holds 56 grains of H2O. What is a 2 grains capacity advantage, 3.57%, going to get you?

Assuming that the 1 to 4 velocity increase to case capacity increase rule of thumb is accurate, a 3.57% increase in case capacity would calculate to a velocity increase potential of 0.89%.

At 3,000 fps, 0.89% is 26.7 fps. Fast barrel verses slow barrel verses higher/lower outside temperature verses ???? territory.

Love the 6.5x55, currently have 9 of them, but the numbers don't lie. The only reasons that I, personally, would opt for the 6.5x55 over the 260 are:

A. The rifle that I want isn't available in 260.
B. I must be able to shoot bullets over 140 grains without having to seat them more deeply into the case. COAL issues you know.
C. I was going to use it in Europe or Africa, where 260 ammo probably isn't commonly available and the 6.5x55 Norma and RWS is more probably available.

JEff
my point was it doesnt have substantially more case capacity


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Originally Posted by JWALL
BobinNH: I wonder where some get the idea that the 270 is boring?

JWALL
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The 280 Remington is overbore.

The 7 Rem Mag is over bore.
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Oh, you were being ironic, I get it now.

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I love the 6.5mm/.264cal and enjoied this whole thread.
I took it apun my self to tally the votes so far.

6.5x55 se received a solid 20 votes +mine =21 votes

260 rem received 3 solid honest votes +4 for action length =7 votes

No difference/ No vote =11 votes

Ramblings =9 votes


Honestly you will be happy with either. I say go for the 6.5x55.
my reasons would be:
1. the 6.5x55 though a very old design and sammi specs, based on origional configurations with turn of the 20th century military rifles, have acceptable pressures rated lower than the very modern 260, the 6.5x55 Se case is actually stronger with a thicker case head. With all modern componets and rifle, the 6.5x55 case will handle HIGHER pressures than the 260.

2. the SMALL case capacity difference (slight advantage 6.5x55) gives this cartridge the advantage in handling the 140gr and up bullets like they were made to be together. The 260 Rem will shoot these heavier bullets too, but will start to drop off in preformance as compared to the old Swede.

3. .264cal bullets have a large selection of "heavy for calibur" bullets to choose from. Therefore, this calibur has a large selection of high BC, High sectional density bullets. These bullets are high BC/ high SD and carry A LOT OF PUNCH ON GAME AND LESS PUNCH ON YOU. (thats exactaly what you are looking for isn't it?) The heavier bullets, higher SD bullets retain velosity better at distance. (all SLIGHT advantage 6.5x55. because remember it handles the heavier bullets better)

**If you are not a handloader and you intend on buying bullets off the shelf, then go with the 260 remington.**

factory bullet for factory bullet you will see NO difference between the two cartridges. Thats because the 260 Rem is normal loaded, and the 6.5 Swede is under loaded. (remember lawsuit, liability, and litigation. factory must have those lower pressures for the swede.) Im ont advocating for reckless powder packing, Im just saying that is what you will find in a factory loading.

+++ IF you are a handloader and want to use 140gr + bullets then go with the 6.5x55. it will absolutely kick the 260 rem's ass in this catagory +++ enough said.

are there other 6.5's/.264's that will out preform the 6.5 swede? YES, absolutely! but I still would go with the 6.5x55 swedish mauser.

Last edited by atomiclab; 01/10/11.

1. I now see the wisdom and merits of much older generations.
2. Technology makes things cheaper, easier, and less labor intensive, but not necessarily better.
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oh and I love my 6.5x55 Swede CZ 550 american classic. It is my favorite in the safe


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2. Technology makes things cheaper, easier, and less labor intensive, but not necessarily better.
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Do you really think an animal will know the difference between these two? I'm thinking if I needed more zip from a 6.5 bullet, why not just build a 6.5-06, 6.5-06AI, or go with the 6.5 win mag?

I seriously doubt the 6.5x55 kicks a 260's ass. That's a stretch, but, are they both fine cartridges, absolutely.

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Yes, the reason far more long-range target shooters are using .260 Remingtons rather than the 6.5x55 Swede is that the Swede "absolutely kicks the .260 Rems ass in this catagory (sic)" I know there are other issues involved in this department, but there isn't a critter on the planet that will know if it's been killed with a .260 or a 6.5x55. I'd love to add a 6.5x55 Swede to my collection, but for now I'm settling with my two .260 Remingtons and they harvest deer as reliably as anything out there.


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I have no idea to where you are measuring the water capacity of the two cases but it does not really reflect how much powder you can put in a 260 in a short action vs a 6.5x55 in a long action.
That pesky little thing called OAL will get you every time.
Back when I had a SA 260, a 140 took a lot of powder space. In a properly throated 6.5x55 in a LA, that 140 would allow a lot more than a 2 gr difference as it would only take 2/3s of the neck.
BTW the 6.5x55 holds 58 gr of water. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/6.5x55mm
Insofar as 1000 yard shooting goes, the 6.5x284 not the 260 rules the roost.


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The base of any 6.5mm bullet takes up the same amount of space, whether it's inside or below the neck.

I recently measured the water capacity of fired .260 and 6.5x55 brass, with a 120-grain bullet seated to the SAAMI overall cartridge length for each round (2.825 for the .260, 3.15 for the 6.5x55) and the difference was indeed about 2 grains.

It doesn't matter if the bullet is a 100, 120 or 140-grain. The difference in powder space inside the case will be the same amount, as long as the same bullet is used.


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I don't recall mentioning the 6.5x284 in my post? Did I miss something? It was about the inane comment about the 6.5x55 and .260 with 140 gr. bullets. For me to make a statement like that I'd have to be comparing a .264 Winchester Mag or 6.5-06AI to the .260 Remington, and then it's still only a couple hundred fps. For hunting purposes, the critters won't know the difference. Drop a 140 gr. Partition into the vitals with a .260 Rem and it will be just as dead as one hit with a .264 Win. Mag or 6.5x284 for that matter. Flatter trajectory with more energy? Yes. More deader? No.


Selmer

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Well since Savage is bringing out several rifles in .260 Rem this year, it may catch on with other companies again as well. Heck, if I can get one before I leave for Germany in May, I'll buy one.

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John,
You are absolutly right as long as the bullets are the same. Now lets talk overall COL, and lenght of throats. That is where there is a differance. A 6.5X55 Swede will allow a longer COL and most (never seen one that did not) will have a longer throat than a 260 Remington. Bottom line the bullet in a 260 will have to eat into the area that could be full of powder. Below 140g I have not seen a differance. 140g and above the Swede will win ever time.

Funny post for me.. Coming back at someone I respect and admire.

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Smithrjd,
you said it better than me.

Maybe I shouldn't have said "kick ass" in reference to the 6.5x55 beating the 260rem in the heavier bullet category, but it still stands. All day everyday, the 6.5 swede handles the heavier bullets better. thats its advantage, mild yet does better with the heavier bullets.

Long range shooting (bench rest) is an exercise in consistency. the more consistent you are the tighter groups you have and greater accuracy.
Flat trajectory is not of great importance in 1000 yard shooting. Consistency is!

in hunting where shots might be made and many different ranges, flat trajectory starts becoming more important.

the 2 rounds in question are very similar (OBVIOUSLY) that is the whole point of the discussion. but the 6.5 Swede does handle the heavier bullets b e t t e r than the 260 rem especially when hand loaded!!!!


just like another example
308 vs 30-06
both spit 150gr, 160gr , 168gr, bullets like rockets
but load both with a 200gr+ projectile on then end and 308 just can preform like the 06.
will the 308 with 210gr bullet go bang? yes. will it come out the end of the barrel? yes. will it be going so fast you can't see it? yesss. will it kill something at 100 yeards??? yesss!
will your hold over point of impact have a more dramatic variation over various distances as compared to the 06 same bullet YESS!!


Don't get mad when a slightly bigger cased cartridge eeks out a little more Umph!
They physics are what they are and we all know it.


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Dude, there is a 2 grain difference in case capacity between the 260 and 6.5x55. 2 grains = less than 4%. A <4% increase in case capacity will generate a <1% increase in velocity, assuming all other factors are equal. I think that when I ran the numbers, the potential velocity difference for a load at 3,000 fps would be about 28 fps.

The fact is, when loaded to the same pressure, the 260 and 6.5x55 will produce the same approximate results with all bullet weights up to an including 140 grains. Once you start using heavier/longer bullets, the long action 6.5x55 has an advantage over the short action 260 because of bullet seating depth and COAL issues, but not a lot. Simple solution, build your 260 on a long action and you eliminate the COAL issue, so they are equal again.

Where did you get the idea that the 6.5x55 case is stronger than the 260, such that it will allow the 6.5x55 to "handle HIGHER pressures than the 260"?

This is 2011 and bullet technology has improved to the point where lighter premium bullets will allow a reloader to achieve the sort of penetration on game that used to require a longer cup & core bullet of the sort that made the 6.5s famous. If it wasn't so, Hornady would still be making and selling the 160 grain RN, but they aren't.

Although I think that ESPN's Colin Cowherd is a horse's ass, his pet saying, "Live in the is, not in the was.", seems like an appropriate response on this topic.

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Comparing the case capacity difference of the 260 and 6.5x55, 2 grains, to the case capacity difference of the 308 and 30-06, 13 grains, isn't a legitimate comparison and suggests that you are either ignorant of the facts or you are a disingenuous a$$hole like Bosslady/Oldman1942.

If you are going to cite data, you might want to make sure your data is germane to the discussion and that you are comparing 2 data sets that are similar, rather that 2 that are dissimilar. This is the big leagues and you'll find out pretty quickly that you can't BS the players.

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2% in capacity in an empty case, yes, with no seated bullets.. Is the 6.5X55 a stronger case? I have no idea. A 260 in a long action? Kind of defeats it's purpose. Now for a real rifle loony question, is the 6.5X57 cartridge better than both the 260 Remington and the 6.5X55 Swede? Now we are talking a 4% increase in water capacity. However I have yet to shoot a round with water as the propellent.

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Originally Posted by smithrjd
Now for a real rifle loony question, is the 6.5X57 cartridge better than both the 260 Remington and the 6.5X55 Swede? Now we are talking a 4% increase in water capacity.


I don't believe it's significantly better but I'll find out soon. I'm getting a Walther 6.5x57 bbl screwed onto a Mk X action later in the week. I should have the whole thing up and running by the end of the month.

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It's not really, but at least 2% more capacity than the 6.5X55 and 4% on a 260. It is however a very nice round based on the 7x57 Mauser. Now I guess it's time to consider the 7mm08 and the 7X57. I am certain that one is most certainly better than the other. Especially given modern bullets and powders. What the heck do I know, I have a 338 Federal and think it is great round for it's purpose. Then again the 338WM and the Weatherby will hold at least 1 cup more water.

Last edited by smithrjd; 01/11/11.
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Volume is volume, capacity is capacity, it doesn't matter what media you use to use, as long as you use the same media. Water is a good media to use for measuring smaller volumes, as it fills the space to nearly 100% if you remember to eliminate any trapped air bubbles.

If you look at the common 6.5mm/.264" bore cartridge hierarchy;

The 6.5x55 has more capacity than the 260.
The 256 Newton has more capacity than the 6.5x55 and the 260.
The 6.5-06 has more capacity than the 256 Newton, 6.5x55, and the 260.
The 6.5-06AI has more capacity than the 6.5-06, 256 Newton, 6.5x55, and 260.
The 264 Win Mag has more capacity than the 6.5-06AI, 6.5-06, 256 Newton, 6.5x55, and 260.

But only the 260, 51mm case, fits well in short actions. If you're going to go with a long action, why not maximize the performance potential by going with a larger/longer case than the 6.5x55?

Remember that "better" is never a subjective measurement, but capacity always is.

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Still have not answered the COL issue. Capacity that is "useable" to me would be a rather large factor. Now were back to short vice long action, magazine lenght, and throating. I don't shoot cases full of water with no seated bullets. Still have to match the magazine and throat.
6.5X65 RWS and 6.5X68S have even a larger capacity.
I think the 260 is a great round, is it better than a 6.5X55 Swede? up to 140 I think they are the same. One short action one long. Beyond 140g then no the Swede will do better. Do you need a heavier bullet than a modern 140g in a 6.5? Not sure, but the 6.5X55 Swede will do it better than a 260 Remington.

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