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Well I have dropped animals at 800 yards with open sights and a Savage 30/30

Newbie here, but not to the forum worlds.


Well here are my questions. I searched and found multiple good and bad, but not everything I need. So here it goes;

I would like to find an inline for next season, now I mean I'll be likely to buy after this Christmas. We have mule deer, elk, moose, bear, well I'm in Utah so there. Anyway, most of the land I hunt is mountainous and draws with a hint of buck brush oak. Long range is a must, as well as good close action so really what I'm looking for a needle in a hay stack. Some of my long range shoots have been at 800 yards, and brush to 50 feet. Now I know 800 yards is out of the question, but even a good 400 yards would be nice. I usually only go for the mulies and elk.

Now here's the kicker; I have a bad right shoulder so I can't take the kick, and from what I've seen I am going to have trouble loading because of the pushing of the ram rod. So any thing out there will help in that area please advise me.

I would like to spend less then $500 for the gun or up to the $600's if it comes with a decent scope. Again, a good all around out of the box gun or combo. Now if I can find a good gun combo for $100, well I don't care as long as it works as intended for my use

Now I know 800 yards is out of the question, but even a good 400 yards would be nice. I usually only go for the mulies and elk.

I have only shot traditional and that was in my childhood, you had about 70 yards and that was it

I know more about the vitals of animals then most if not all the people here, I'm a USDA Meat Inspector for hell sakes. Like I said, it was a clean kill and dropped in it's tracks. Not even one step. I know that gun like the back of my hand and I know what it can do and can't. I just didn't kill the deer for no reason, I was on the hunt and it was a good buck, so I took it. Now I really didn't want to walk from the peak of the mountian to the floor then walk over to my truck around the oppisite side of the mountian and that was the main reason I didn't want to shoot it regardless of mount. But for $50 cash right there and bragging rights on a shot I knew I'd hit, well I don't see that that was a bad shoot.

dvdgeorge<--- I've killed more animals then you can even dream of. I do it every day.

I know more about the vitals of animals then most if not all the people here, I'm a USDA Meat Inspector for hell sakes.

Well I have dropped animals at 800 yards with open sights and a Savage 30/30

Naw, but I was using a 160 spitzer boat tail. Don't remember the power/load/primer, hell that was years ago. Again, can we get back on topic please?


***EDIT***

I don't care whether you put this or that on this page. How I could have or could have not made the shot. The fact of the matter is I made the damn shot. Get over it and lets move on, good hell!

dvdegorge<--- I've killed more animals then you can even dream of. I do it every day. Doesn't matter, I've been secsessful all my life with exception of a single special draw hunt area that the animals where not in at the time of the hunt. 70 yards was a clean paper shot for me at the time, I was only a child like I said. What do you want from me?

This is too unbelievable.

The front sight at 800 yds would be way bigger than the whole deer. Plus you held 30 ft over it. We need to figure in some windage. How could you possibly say you aimed that? You could wave the gun in the air somewhere, and hope for the best.

Bullet energy (fpe) would be at BB gun levels for a 30-30.

Hardly an ethical shot. If you did make it. I'd bet all my savings you couldn't repeat it.

Good hunters don't make 800 yd shots with a high dollar flat shooting gun and very good optics. They can also repeat it, because they practice those shots over and over.

Keep dreaming your dreams.... and all that success form someone that can't spell successful....I don't consider the stomping of cockroaches that live in your double wide kill'in critters

Stick around here you are on track to over take the likes of Swampman or Jeff_O for biggest dolt to add to your impressive resume

Your right, I couldn't see the deer because the sight was WAY too big. Listen, I made the damn shot and I really don't care about it, the fact of the matter that was years ago and I don't shoot every day now like I did back then. I lived in the mountians and did shoot every day. The fact is that was then and today I haven't shot my rifle sense I built it, which was about 2 years ago. I couldn't hit the brod side of a barn now! I bet if I were to go out right now and shoot a set and post em you would then accuse me of cheating. Like I said I'm not going to play that game, now grow up and lets please get back on topic...OMG!

I think the Savage is a great muzzleloader, maybe the best I have found but there is a couple problems. I'm not sure I would get a Savage if you are going to shoot black powder as it is illegal to shoot smokeless in Utah. Also, the Savage ML-II is going to cost you more than you want to spend if you want stainless.


ddj

Bet you always won the state spelling bee too!

So are you stating that if you buy the ML-II Savage or Knight, that you can't shoot regular black power in it?

I'm not going to play your BS games Georgei-Porgei! I'm just going to submit to the likes of your bragging. You have got to be the biggest baddest hunter of all time, in fact dare I say you are even larger then Ted Nugent or that of Jim Shockley. Here, here, the king has spoken and wants to flash his egotistical outcry over the nation! All bow to his Majesty, the Turd!......Grow up!

TFF Was you're only way out

dvdgeorge<--- I've killed more animals then you can even dream of. I do it every day.I know more about the vitals of animals then most if not all the people here, I'm a USDA Meat Inspector for hell sakes.[/

I'm gunna start calling you honey cause you sound like my wife!....Always b!tchin!

All the TC guns will serve you well. I think they're overpriced, but good guns.

The CVA has a bad rep with some guys. They had a problem with weak barrels on an older model. They use Bergara barrels now and don't have a problem anymore. Good straight shooters. The Accura V2 is a good gun with an adjustable trigger.

I've owned a TC Omega, CVA Accura V2, Optima, and some Knights. All good guns. Pick the features and price that suit you.

I've gone to traditional muzzleloaders now. A more limited range, but they suit me better. More of a challenge. More fun for me.

Check out the CVA Optima. They are one hell of a muzzy for a low price and don't need trigger jobs like those $800 TC's!

OH, Did you find the omega easy to clean, and how did it compare to the CVA Accura in ease of cleaning?

We are talking about hunting Randy. A kill zone is much more forgiving that a paper target.

it isn't hard to understand why some folks want the best equipment available and take pride in it.

just take their word for it, that's your choice.

Good example:
"Jim Shockey now hunt's with a .357 Crossman air rifle"....gimme a [bleep] break.

I however never see you telling folks that Green Mountain and Thompson Center do NOT test every barrel that they produce.

There are standards in firearms testing and design: http://www.chuckhawks.com/muzzleloading_safety_design.htm. The companies that practice them deserve great praise, the ones who put profits ahead of safety deserve condemnation.

So GM and TC don't proof test any of their barrels yet you slam CVA Or Traditions for limited testing out of a bunch? LOL

Here is a Chuck Hawk quote for ya...

I once nailed a coyote at 80 yards (running) with my sling shot.

I don't care what you say, I made the shot, and that's that. So all you girly-men hunting with rifles, get a slingshot.

Reading comprehension, please

If a firearm is more reliable, then let's show it. If a firearm has a faster locktime,let's show it. Merely asserting, claiming, and fawning is what catalogs and marketing departments do.

listen to what Hunters/shooters/'Smiths/powder company's ARE saying.

Holy crap this post has taken a turn....lets get back on task here

We have taken12" long pieces of barrel, threaded
and breeched both ends, drilling a hole in it for a fuse, and blew it up. From what has been said on this subject, one
would think this would act like grenade, blowing shrapnel all over the place. Not so, it merely opened up like a banana
peel. We also did the same thing to a piece of barrel that was made in a foreign country, I won't say which one. Now,
this one did act like a grenade, we found only about 1/3 of the barrel, the rest was blow to god knows where. We also
did a lot of proofing real thin barrels with huge loads, could not get them to blow. Also shot barrels with short started
balls, could not get them to bulge or blow. The only way we could get a bulge in the barrel was to load the barrel with
powder and a patched ball pushed all the way down onto the powder, then short starting a ball on top of all this......
bulged the barrel but did not blow it off. As a result of all of this playing around, I kind of thought to myself that it's
sort of foolish to proof a barrel, at least one of ours which I know how it is breeched. There have been a lot of comments
by people who have never made a barrel, nor did any experimental blow-ups. Unless you know what you're talking about
you are doing a great disservice to the muzzleloading game...............Don

listen to what Hunters/shooters/'Smiths/powder company's ARE saying.

http://muzzleloadertechtips.com/201...istently-make-tight-groups-at-100-yards/
http://www.shootersforum.com/muzzleloaders/59579-cva-apex-acuraccy-problem.html

Does Ardesa , Dikar , did Jukar , proof every barrel . NO .
So why is there a proof stamp . Because they BATCH PROOF thus the proof house has certified the barrels thus clearing the batch to carry thier mark .

They and you are full of $hit.

has it really or is just that one question submitted from a person who may not know better , has been replace by the same standard by someone who IMO twists things for their own betterment .

Does Ardesa , Dikar , did Jukar , proof every barrel . NO .
So why is there a proof stamp . Because they BATCH PROOF thus the proof house has certified the barrels thus clearing the batch to carry thier mark . Now you could argue around the subject of if these marking are provincial markings or actual definitive proofs .

magnafluxing only serves as a Provincial type of proof . IE by magnafluxing they find out if there is any visible reason why the barrel would not pass a Definitive proof ,its not an actual Definitive proof .
Lot by lot testing is just another name for batch testing and does NOT mean every barrel within that lot has been proofed . It only means that �IF� every barrel within that lot , is manufactured to the same standards as the barrel that was tested , then all is relative.

Thus if the US had the same Government enforced laws as many European countries do ,then every one of those barrels within that lot would have to carry a proof mark as the laws accept batch testing as an actual proof .Again under the very same assumption that every barrel made will be identical to the one tested . But the reality of it is we know they are not . Thus there are allowable variables in tolerances that are accepted.

We also must understand that just because a barrel was proofed , it doesn�t mean it stays in proof . Pitting of the barrel is just one thing that removes the proof . If a company like GM were to produce a barrel under English proofing laws , then sold that barrel to a company who cut dove tails , welded , soldered or threaded the barrel for a receiver or lets say they plated the barrel with nickel or chromed it . The barrel is then out of proof and the markings mean nothing .

Now how are you going to proof a barrel that hasn�t been chambered yet .
The answer is you DON�T . A Provincial proof is done. If the barrel blank passes that proof , then you finish the barrel and send it back for a Definitive proof which hopefully it will pass
But concerning muzzle loading , the minute that barrel is bored to a given bore and threaded for a plug , the very same thing has been done as in the chambering process .
IE the finished barrel has been defined . Thus a Definitive proof can then be done .

Lets not also forget that companies here in the US do not have to submit for proof. in fact there is nothing that ensures a company even follows the SAAMI Recommendations when they say they do .All that is just voluntary and we as customers have to accept that they do what they say they do ..

I know for a Fact that one of the best and most reputable muzzleloading barrel makers in the US does very little proofing . The owner has told me so . In fact he has stated this in public and openly that they stopped long ago doing anything more then an accessional batch test.

Most recently in a discussion concerning 12L14 being to soft for safe barrels .
He had this to say .



So what is more surprising? Is it that some company uses batch testing or magnafluxs and calls it a proof or is it a company who allows barrels with installed breech plugs that have the nipples held in by a heli coil to be sold to the public . Maybe its another US company that for a time sold a lot of barrels with the breech plugs that were just under 1/8 off face

The whole thing is nothing more then listening to obama give a speech . Just one spin after another