Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Africa 168gr Berger VLD

Oh, yeah, and a factory Ruger No. 1 with a 30" barrel....

A couple of weeks ago my deer camp buddy was crushing exit side shoulders and blowing chunks of spine out of hogs with a 308 launching 168 VLDs. The big one was 295 pounds.

I guess that's a puff piece too.

That's called "puff goes the piggie"!

Yeah Larry ..........Bergers don't work......650 yds,, took rib out going in and out. Elk went 15 yds....lowly 6mm 105 gr VLD

Man, you guys need to quit breaking off Larry's root in his ass, then again maybe he swings that way. Good thread, nothing beats slapping around a troll with facts

Thanks for the info guys. Was wondering if anybody has used vld's on African game! Let me know..

A coworker used them in Africa. He used his 270 Win with Berger VLD's on some of the plains game. He was satisfied as was the PH he hunted with. I know he shot an oryx and some type of antelope with it.

Nellie,

You did click on the 24hour link on slg88's post? His was the 5th post on this thread. It has several photos of dead African animals taken with the 155 VLD from his .308 Winchester.

African game die same as American game. Same bullets work for both

Spot on...

John, Thanks for the reference of the vld hunt. Good to know. My only concern is that the animals I hunt compare to the ones in the USA, is that the vitals are a lot further forward and behind a lot of bone. just worried about heating the bone.
But shot placement is everything..
Will be testing the vld on Wednesday and hopefully I can get them to work.
Tx for the advice guys

Actually, the vitals of African animals aren't a "lot" further forward. You can shoot them in the meaty part of the shoulder, and some even slightly behind the shoulder, and do quite well.

Some African PH's are so obsessed with shoulder-shooting that they can't even see this. I once shot a big gemsbok (one of the really tough ones) right in the crease behind the shoulder, and he went maybe 15-20 yards and fell over, before I could even shoot again.

An hour or so later, my hunting partner had to use my rifle to shoot another gemsbok, because the scope on his rifle had gone bad. He shot the bull right through both shoulders, and it staggered around for a while and fell over, if anything going somewhat further than mine had. "See!" the PH said. "If you'd shot yours through the shoulders it wouldn't have gone as far!" I didn't say anything, wondering what the hell he'd been watching.

The lungs of some animals also extend further back than on others. Kudu, for instance, can be shot a few inches behind the shoulder and will still go down quickly, one of the reasons they're considered "softer" than some other animals.

Get hold of a copy of Kevin Robertson's book THE PERFECT SHOT and study it. It's well worth the money.

John tx for the advice. Will def get the book. Tx

.............like I did with my 300 WSM, you can go onto the Berger site and contact them. They will e/mail you all the VLD loading data they have on the 30-06.

I started using 168 VLDs on my hog hunts about 2 1/2 years ago. Now using some 175s as well. The near immediate and immediate bang flops, not to mention the vitals devastation, is very good to see.

The 190 used on one elk so far was textbook.

When I am asked what bullet to use for big game my default answer is North Fork or TSX.

Before all of the Berger experts flame me and call me a troll here is a little background on my experience. I have made four dangerous game hunts in three African countries having the pleasure of killing eight cape buffalo (including a 49" monster in Moz.), elephant, leopard, and more plains game than I care to send to my taxidermist. I have never hunted elk or moose, but have killed a couple of whitetail and even a black bear in Alaska.

With that being said I have never hunted big game with Bergers. I have also never shot a 1000 yard (or even a 200 yard) rifle match with North Forks. I have shot one Axis deer with a 168 grain SMK at about 100 yards with an M1A and a whitetail doe with a 200 grain SMK out of a 30-338 Winchester at 327 yards lasered. Both were DRT. I would expect similar results from Berger.

For big game I look for a bullet that will penetrate deeply, expand, and retain as close to 100% of its weight under any circumstance. Personally I do not want a bullet that explodes after penetrating a couple of inches as the Bergers have been described in this thread.

About two years ago I tested quite a few bullets in a consistent test media in a controlled enviroment to see what penetrated straight, deep, and held together. A lot of the work revolved around solids. I wanted to try some Bergers but nver got around to it. I did test some SMKs and they completely disintegrated. Again I would expect the same results from Berger as the SMK in the test media. I mention this to compare some field results to test results on monolithic solids.

Stick with me there is eventually a moral to the story.



The bullet on the left is a NF Cup Point fired in test media. The bullet on the right was fired in to a large animal in Africa. I have several other similar pictures.

So the moral is I will give up a small degree of accuracy to gain a great degree of toughness. The bullet pictured above give a good example of how tough large animals can be. That shot would have destroyed a Berger and the chances of killing the animal would have greatly be diminished.

Again I am not disputing the Bergers work, just giving my point of view why premium hunting bullets are better for the hunting I do.

Yup - different ends of the spectrum. The Berger isn't a North Fork, or a Barnes. Different ways of doing their work. For heavy game, I choose a heavily constructed, deep-penetrating bullet too.

For elk sized game on down the ladder, the Berger hunting VLDs work. Although I have not been to Africa yet, I would not discount the VLDs for performing extremely well on smaller, medium, and on medium/large African plains game.

No VLDs should ever be used on caped buffs, crocs, elephants, lions, hippos, rhinos, and maybe not on the largest of kudu.

Given everything I`ve seen and from the reports, the VLDs should do well in Africa hunting the "proper" game.

Hey I though you were dead???

So they're okay to use on elk, but not Kudu?
Kudu being roughly the same size as elk if not a tad smaller...
Makes perfect sense to me