Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters Impact velocity and bullet expansion

But they easily pay for themselves...sorta like a good coon hound.

Their forte is they expand at distance,yet still penetrate well at higher velocity; the point of my post.And they work exceptionally well without concerns about starting them at predetrmined velocities....they work as well from magnum cartridges as from standard cases.

For deer you don't need them.....maybe not for elk either, although they will generally penetrate deeper for you than a standard C&C of the same weight and velocity.So much with the C&C depends on impact speed, jacket thickness and design,hardness of core,etc.Only reason I tout a Partition is because mostly it eliminates all those considerations at "normal" game ranges....about 500-600 yards and as far as I have seen them used.

You can set up a rifle so the NPT impacts with your cheaper bullet,so you use fewer of them (just to check zero and hunt).Obviously they aren't the only thing that will put game on the ground, but they are one of a handful of bullets you can rely on to penetrate deeply.

Personally I worry a whole lot more about bullet performance up close than way out there.

In that regard, they cost sonewhat more,but they aren't really expensive...worth it to some, but not to everybody

Where on the web can we find this document? Steve's page failed to load for me.

Did Gary Sciuchetti, or somebody else, publish an update of this excellent 1998 study?

From those pictures that bigbucl posted, the Rem Core-Lokts seemed to perform well over a very wide range of velocities.

That about says it all.Good thread!

Thanks

Actually, they cost less because you only need one.

My thought is that you throw a big and heavey enough chunk of lead you will only need one as well. I am a huge fan of my 165 Sierra GK in my 30/06. If I was going to hunt elk that rifle, I would step it up to the 180 Sierra GK and call it good.

Okay, I just ran the 180 SGK at 2750 fps in my ballistics program and if those numbers are realistic, I may have to just dump the 165 and go with the 180. That looks like some pretty badazz performance.

I had never heard of Gary prior to seeing this article so I sure don't know. Nor have I ever seen any kind of update to the original. Maybe Mule Deer could shed some light on him or more on the subject.

The graphs I posted are taken from Gary's study.

IIRC, you can buy a poster of Gary's findings for $15.

I tend to be fascinated by the technical aspects of our hobby. But I'll also be the first to say that sometimes we overthink things. There is a lot to be said for a simple hunting trip.

off season, I test a bullets penetration ability thru the local Oregon trees, at certain distances and velocities...

Got started on that by using trees as a back stop when chronographing out in the woods when the range is tied up with some club shoot etc..

taught me a lot and is still teaching me a lot..

some of the highlights I found for my own uses...

1. Ballistic Tips, are an excellent bullet for slower impact velocities

2. Varmint bullets, when an impact velocity is going to be pretty low, their fragility make them still open up, yet their core in the rear is still tough enough to give some pretty deep penetration...holds true for varmint bullets from 20 caliber right up thru 30 caliber...

3. Round noses are better at slower speeds, than are Spire Points...

4. if not using a fragile bullet like a varmint bullet, then sectional density performs better than low sectional density..
example: a 175 grain Hornady RN, with an MV of 1800 fps, managed to penetrate thru 18 inches of Pine, and keep on going at an impact of 100 yds from the Muzzle..

a lot of you know I do a lot of handloading for kids, who are just starting out...teach them to work up...their shooting abilities...

so I have spent time testing this along those lines, for such needed information...

but I also use it myself, to tailor loads to the areas I hunt and the game I am pursing...

since most game ( like 90%) is taken within 100 yds... and like 99% is taken within 200 yds, just how much velocity does one really need?

Not talking antelope in open country for instance, but where I hunt locally, 150 yds is going to be an awfully long shot...

if you take a look at most ballistic charts also, regardless of caliber, almost any Spitzer bullet, if shot at 30/30 velocities of 2250 fps at the Muzzle... when zeroed 3.5 inches high at 100 yds, will be dead on at 200 yds, and will be 3.5 inches low at about 240 yds..

then you take into account, the average white tail deer is 15 to 16 inches, from breastbone to backbone, regardless of weight...

cut that 'window of opportunity' in half, to say 7.5 to 8 inches..

now go back to the formula above about being zeroed 3.5 inches high at 100 yds, being dead on at 200 and 3.5 inches low at 240 yds...

with an MV of 2250 fps, in pretty much any caliber with a spitzer bullet, you have a formula that you can aim on hide at anywhere out to close to 250 yds, and if you hold steady, the bullet will be where it needs to be for a clean kill...

match that up to a bullet that you know will open at that distance reliably, and you should not have much to worry about..


the local kids here have proven that to work pretty darn well.. even beyond 200 yds...

when they ask me my bullet choice, I recommend Ballistic tips, for both accuracy and reliability for expansion at impact velocities as low as the 1200 to 1400 fps range..

as for myself, I've taken several deer with my 7 x 57 Featherweight, with 115 grain Speer HPs,.. the charge was 28 grains of SR 4759, a cast bullet load....but here is how it performed on the second largest black tail I have taken.. this one weighed 210 lbs on the hoof..according to OR F&W...

heart shot... didn't need a second one...quite evident..



and then the donor of the heart picture:



shows the size of the ol boy... his antlers were covered in dried blood also..which don't show up well in the pictures...


and finally a pic of Seafire jr and his other Scout Buddy ( who both recently made Eagle Scout Rank) with the donor of the heart...



so the slower speeds help kids make great shot placements..

the other boy with my son, took a deer next season, with a 270 loaded with a 90 grain Speer HP, behind a charge of 30 grains of IMR 4198...

this in an area that 150 yds is a mega long shot..

Hmmm.. I don't see a tag on that deer.

Probably poached.

Congratulations to the young men on the fine buck and on the Eagle Scout rank as well.

Also to you for getting them there and the loads.

Bullets be some devestating little suckers, eh?

Looks to me like he was roped before he was shot.

Personally I shoot a 180 grain partition at an MV of 3200 (.308 diameter). With this I have 14 one-shot kills in a row, on animals from 100 to 800 pounds (not counting a 5500 pound hippo when I ran out of heavy rifle ammo) and ranges from 50 feet to 275 yards.

The nice part about it is I can simply ignore all other bullets and ignore trajectory as far as I care to shoot. I don't care about impact velocity. All these bullets but one have exited the animal. None have disintegrated.

Cost? It seems foolish to worry about the cost of a bullet when you consider all the other costs of a hunt.

I get UPSET thinking about it.grin

There ya go...simplicity at its' finest.

This stuff will drive the readers and number crunchers crazy.But not if you hunt.It generally does not get a lot better than that.Notions of a a Partition "losing steam" are entertaining.

I printed a color copy of the Best Bullet article on the large plotter at work. It is 36 inches wide and hangs on the wall in my room. I refer to it often.

Open it up at the link in this thread to stevespages. Notice the performance of the Remington SPCL (round nose). Now tell me at what velocity it didn't expand and hold together.