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I would like to eventually get a second shotgun, probably a semi-auto. I have heard the Beretta 391 and the Benelli are great. I have owned a bunch of Italian black powder revolvers and the quality was so poor I sold off everything, and their cars are known for being junky. How many Fiats and Alfa Romeos do you see around? I am down to one black powder Italian pistol, a single shot Lyman plains gun which does work, with a single shot it is more forgiving over the numerous moving parts of other Italian guns.

With the fall of Italy's economy I have read of alot of stupidity there, where it is "easier to get a divorce from your wife than it is to fire a bad worker".

Why is it that the Italian semi-auto shotguns don't seem to have the bad rap, or is it that they do but it is not talked about? Are they made in the US plant or Italy?

Last edited by HE112; 06/12/12.
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There are 6 or 8 Beretta 391's in my core group of family/friends that hunt. We all love them. After fighting a Remington 1100 dad went back to a pump for 30 years before buying a Beretta after seeing the luck we'd had. He said he waited 30 years too long to try an Italian auto.

Benelli is just as good, most of the hardcore waterfowl hunters carry Benelli and put them through tough conditions.

What autos are the hardcore clays shooters using? Beretta and Benelli.

Most are made in Italy. I believe (would have to double check), that the newest entry-level Beretta is made in the USA.


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Beretta, Benelli and Franchi are all great guns, and they are made in Italy. Like many other commodities, there are high, middle and low ends. The Italians are no different. The best shotguns in the world today are Italian (Fabbri, Bosis, Bertuzzi, FAMARS, F.lli Rizzini, etc.), with superb guns from high to lower middle end (Beretta, Perazzi, B. Rizzini, Cesar Guirrini, Franchi, Fausti). There is also lots of junk made to compete at the lowest price points.

As to the automotive industry, hare also to say the Italians aren't in the game...Ferrari etc., though it's true they don't export middle class cars of quality.

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Show me a semi-auto shotgun made anywhere that can remotely hang with a Benelli or a Beretta.

If gas operated is what you want then the Beretta is your gun.

If inertia operated is what you want then Benelli is your gun.


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Originally Posted by MontanaCreekHunter
Show me a semi-auto shotgun made anywhere that can remotely hang with a Benelli or a Beretta.
If gas operated is what you want then the Beretta is your gun.
If inertia operated is what you want then Benelli is your gun.

Well said. I believe that very thing.


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Benelli, and beretta rule the semi auto clay and bird worlds for a multitude of reasons. I have a few of each an have never regretted the cost for a second. If money was tight I would shoot a Franchi gas gun. Have seen buddies totally abuse them in the duck marshes and goose fields to the point the guns should just flat fail or blow up yet they just keep ticking. All good guns

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Originally Posted by MontanaCreekHunter
Show me a semi-auto shotgun made anywhere that can remotely hang with a Benelli or a Beretta.

If gas operated is what you want then the Beretta is your gun.

If inertia operated is what you want then Benelli is your gun.


Not to quibble as I agree with you on the quality of the Benalli and Burrito but my Winchester Super X2 has more than just a few rounds thought it. I'd put it on par with the 391 in the stable.



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Originally Posted by MontanaCreekHunter
Show me a semi-auto shotgun made anywhere that can remotely hang with a Benelli or a Beretta.

If gas operated is what you want then the Beretta is your gun.

If inertia operated is what you want then Benelli is your gun.


3+

One of those two will fit you better, find out and buy that one.

I have a 12 GA BUL that I LUV, best handling semi-auto ever and I've shot them all. I bot that gun to take Out West (SoDak) each fall but find myself using it more and more in the grouse woods, over much more expensive doubles.

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Originally Posted by teal
Originally Posted by MontanaCreekHunter
Show me a semi-auto shotgun made anywhere that can remotely hang with a Benelli or a Beretta.

If gas operated is what you want then the Beretta is your gun.

If inertia operated is what you want then Benelli is your gun.


Not to quibble as I agree with you on the quality of the Benalli and Burrito but my Winchester Super X2 has more than just a few rounds thought it. I'd put it on par with the 391 in the stable.



How many is more then a few. As Beretta's and Benlli's will easly do 20K plus a year no problem. I would not put the X2 in the same stable not even the same farm. But thats just me.


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It's got somewhere around 30k or better through it and it's not been babied. Not a single breakage of any sort. Sporting clays, trap, skeet, ducks and geese - including shooting 6 3.5 inch mags as quick as I can pull my finger with an extended mag for snows....

And yes - there are 391s in the safe too with high mileage so I've compared side by side. Father has a K80 with well over 400k through it, an Ultra Sporter with over 100k through it, our shotguns get shot.

Didn't say it was better - did say it's been just as good. Your average shotgunner isn't going to put 30k rounds down the tube of a shotgun. If a guy's looking for a field gun - yes the pasta shooters are EXCELLENT - no doubt but others can and do hang with them.

Eta - Little brother put 3500 rounds through an 11-87 in 4 weeks. Would hardly run - I'd not shoot one unless it was a gift from someone I cared about. I've no love for it. I have seen 391s not run, I've seen Benellis not run - they all break anyone who says different either has an agenda or doesn't shoot much. BUT - ON AVERAGE the Italian semi-auto is very very good - top of the heap most likely. Just that I know my SX2 will run with it. I expect it to break eventually - just hasn't yet and at over 30k rounds through it, I consider that a fair run to the average pheasant, goose, duck hunter.


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I would say for most high volumn clays shooters 30K would only be a year on a gun. I know for a fact I have put 150 flats thru one of my Benelli's in just over a year and thats only counting clays shooting. Not a single hick-up.

I have heard of stories about some Benelli's not shooting but I can honestly say I have never seen or known a single person that has had issues.

Did I mention I only need to clean the Benelli to keep the rust at bay?


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As far as double guns go you get what you pay for in the Italian market. From my experience the lower priced guns are nothing to write home about.


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Originally Posted by MontanaCreekHunter
I would say for most high volumn clays shooters 30K would only be a year on a gun. I know for a fact I have put 150 flats thru one of my Benelli's in just over a year and thats only counting clays shooting. Not a single hick-up.

I have heard of stories about some Benelli's not shooting but I can honestly say I have never seen or known a single person that has had issues.

Did I mention I only need to clean the Benelli to keep the rust at bay?


Agreed - on A gun but when you have 17 12 gauges alone, not counting 20, 28, and 410 and their sub gauge class shoots - A gun doesn't get worked that hard in 1 year. Buying 700x 48 lbs at a time, primers 20k at a time, wads 40k at a time, shot 500lbs at a time and that wasn't near enough for a summer.

The Benelli I saw go down was in a Missouri snow goose field. Fire once and it would FTF after. Our guide wasn't impressed but I can't speak for how he maintained it. If.

Again - my point was the the SX2 IN MY EXPERIENCE which isn't inconsequential, is and has been just as good as the 391 and when you look at their use - it's vastly more than the average 5 boxes of shells a year duck or goose hunter.


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Teal I sorta agree with you. The problem is when you talk reliablity and quality you have to look at the longivity of the gun. To do so you really have to look at high volumes of loads going thru the gun. Not weather or not the average weekend warrior will put that many thru it or not. Also a sample size of one SX2 isn't enough in my opinion to base a conclusion on.

I am sure the SX2 can and will do what most ask it to do. Then again my 1984 Yugo will get me too and from work! smile

I have heard all kinds of BS problems with Benelli's. Then when I have ask more info they all have a story of how they played gunsmith on the gun a time or two. Just because you stayed at a holiday inn express last night doesn't make someone a gunsmith.

I have 5 M1's and I try to buy all I run into for the right price. I have a box of parts I have aquired over the years too. I have yet to need to dig out a part. Knock on wood.


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I have both Beretta and Benelli's in my stable and have had several of both in the past. The Beretta's are top of the food chain in my book. They are built like tanks, they just keep on shooting.


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I have a shotgun so I have no need for a 30-06.....
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But you have to clean Beretta's! I have both too but I perfer not to have to clean mine gun. Call me lazy.


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I have over 120 thousand rounds through my Beretta 391 sporting and it's still going strong.

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And I would be willing to bet it will go another 120K.


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Originally Posted by MontanaCreekHunter
But you have to clean Beretta's! I have both too but I perfer not to have to clean mine gun. Call me lazy.


I can tell you that if I don't clean my Benelli's, they don't run every time. I have had others tell me that they don't clean their guns and they run fine. I can tell you this, my Benelli's will not shoot like my Beretta's do clean or dirty, rain, or shine, snow or dusty.


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The Beretta 391 will be no longer produced in a couple years and will be replaced by the XCell 400. This comes from a high volume Beretta dealer.

Will the XCell out perform the 391? So far from around March of this year I've put approximately 4000 rounds thru mine. It has hiccuped twice. Last run was around 2000 rounds without cleaning, other than wiping it down. No malfunctions. I cleaned it the other day, just because I was starting to feel guilty. The trigger mechanism was remarkably clean. When I used to shoot a SuperX Model 1, the trigger would look like a dirty grease pit after that many rounds. The chamber area had no visible pitting. The new gas piston cleaned up quickly. Essentially doused it in Clenzoil, let it sit for 5minutes and wiped the carbon build up off. Did have to spend some time getting the carbon buildup off the inside of the barrel extension that holds the piston.

Have had 391s that wouldn't hang with this sample of one XCell for malfunctions and staying clean. Although talking with other shooters who are using them, it seems to be typical.

I think Beretta has hit a home run with the new version.

Addition: A guy I was shooting with the other day had some of the Winchester "Feather" shotshells, which are light kickers that only go 980fps. I tried them in the XCell. They functioned. The cycling was definitely slow, but function they did. However, I'm sure they wouldn't function reliably over the long haul.

Last edited by battue; 06/14/12.

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