Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters Hiking revolver

First time post. I am going hiking on the Appalachian Trail in 2 weeks, and wondering what some thoughts are on loads and guns for carrying along. I have a Smith 21 .44 Spl and a Smith 57 .41 Mag. I also have a Super Redhawk .480, but I am not considering it (too big and heavy). There is a very slim chance of black bear, which are fairly small in the Southern Mountains, and cougar. More worrisome are the two legged rats on the trail. I had a cousin and her boyfriend murdered in their tent on the trail back in the 80's. No rape, no robbery, just shot in their sleep for the @#$$ of it. No gun in the world would have helped them, but I am still taking one. I went back and re-read some old articles by Brian Pearce, and I am looking for opinions on which caliber and whether to go with some of the hot Buffalo Bore hard cast loads or something like the Hornady XTP loads. I also have my eye on one of the Ruger Blackhawks .44 Spl built on the .357 frame. ( I am basically just looking for a reason to buy it, it seems it would be less bulky to carry. Any help is greatly appreciated.

8 grs Unique 210 grs SWC for your 41 Mag M57 1100-1200fps depending on barrel length. Good DA load and still plenty a power. Magnum Man

I dont think you need to worry about mt lion either

what you mentioned with any ammo will be fine, although a 22 rimfire wouuld be some entertainment.

the little "judge" is fairly popular or the above with some snake shot may come in handy?

its a little late to suggest buying a new gun.. but this is my answer to your question.



12 oz 357, I carry a full power 158g load in it.

Glock 20 (10mm Auto) or Glock 22 (40 S&W) would my choice of a trail revolver.

If you really want to limit how many rounds you've got, get a Kahr P45. Light as a feather, 6+1 of .45 ACP, and a trigger very similar to a DA revolver pull.

Either of your S&W's would be perfect but for a self-defense gun I would take the .44 Special. Plenty of oomph for small blackies & cougars and the lower recoil makes it more controllable if you need to engage anything with two legs.

I would urge you not carry a SA revolver for self-defense. Learn to use one of your DA revolvers accurately (read that as "practice"). In fact, I would carry the S&W that has the DA pull that feels best to you. You also need to put a good number of rounds thru it in DA firing to make sure the main spring tension hasn't been unduly messed with. I have a S&W .357 that was perfect in SA firing but would misfire about 1in 6 in while shooting DA because of light primer strikes.

You also need to make sure the loads you carry will fall out of the chamber. A defensive situation is no time for sticky extraction...ya, and make sure the cylinder is kept clean as well...for the same reason.

Lastly, spend a LOT of time doing dry fire practice so you have the feel of the DA etched into your brain and trigger finger. Most S&W revolvers have a DA pull that if you practice enough can be shot DA but in a manner that is very much like shooting SA. Find an old timer PD who had to carry an S&W that was department modified to shoot "DA-only" and he can show you. There is a point in the DA stroke that the cylinder has fully rotated and "locked" but the hammer hasn't fallen. When learned, you can pull the trigger DA and hold the hammer for a single action feel release...and brought to bear very quckly. Learn to shoot this way and you won't ever need to shoot SA again...or want to.

I would take which ever one is lighter. Load the .44 with a 240-250 grain hard cast SWC and the .41 with a 210-220 grain of the same design. Push either bullet to 950-1000 fps and you will be well protected from 2 or 4 legged threats. Never turn your back to anyone you run into in the back country, no matter how friendly they appear. Have fun!

Ron

How many of the people who've responded so far have actually shot a black bear, mountain lion or 2-legged varmint with their choice of "hiking revolver"?

Just curious, partly because of all the threads on the the perfect deer/elk/Cape buffalo/mongoose cartridge or bullet.

S&W 642 38 Special with Crimson Trace grips.

Although a Ruger SR22 in 22 LR would have 10 plus an extra mag.

I doubt the bears will be impressed with either, but the bandits will.

Even though I've hiked in bear and mountain lion country, the only dangerous animals that I've encountered on the trail were vicious dogs and rattle snakes. It doesn't take that much power to dispatch a dog if you can shoot accurately.

MD,

I've plinked at a few "two legged varmints" but it was not with my hiking revolver, and it wasn't in this country, and it for damn sure wasn't "camping." I carry a Glock 32 in 357 Sig sometimes when hiking, but it's heavy and I don't know if it'd do much on bears or lions if I encounter one.

The AT is a LONG hike and I'm not sure anything other than bear pepper spray is required for any of the circumstances in the OP's original question.

But, he asked about revolvers.

What pistol do you own now?

If your not familiar with any sidearm then the simplest to operate is a medium framed revolver loaded with factory .38 Special Jacketed Hollow Point bullets.

If your intent is to buy one I'd suggest you consider a used Ruger SP101 with a three inch barrel chambered for .38 Special or 357 Magnum.

To answer John Barsnes's question. I've never shot a human and hope that I never need to. Nor have I ever pointed a weapon at someone. I consider a concealed weapon an indispensible tool if I ever need one.

I appreciate all the input. I have considered an SP101 for quite some time now, I just never bought one. I have never owned a 357, but I have used a Smith Model 65 extensively years ago and I enjoyed shooting that. I normally carry a 1911 in 45 acp loaded with XTP's. I occasionally have need to carry a Beretta 84 in 380 and a a SIG P238 as backup, both loaded with XTP's. I am fairly proficient with all my guns, semi's and revolvers, or I would not be around go on a hiking trip to celebrate my 10 year anniversary. I HAVE had the misfortune of dispatching two legged rats both with an M14 and a 1911, in several different s#%@hole countries. The .44 Spl and 45 acp are pretty identical power wise in my book with similar loadings, and I know first hand what a 45 will do to a man. I was mainly wondering whether the loads I would use to stop a man (XTP's, Hydra-Shoks, etc) would provide enough penetration on a bear, even if it is relatively small compared to the bears out west, or to go with the hotter hard cast bullets. I am not much of a hunter, but everything I read leads me to believe that pound for pound, some animals can take a lot more than people. Again, thank you all.

How about that new Ruger SP 100? The five shot, 4 inch "kit gun". Take a few snake shot, a few 38's and a few full power 357's and hit the trail.

If I had to choose from what I have it would be my Taurus 44 mag tracker.

enjoy your trip and leave your heavy metal at home... a portable motion detector available for ~ $20 should let you sleep well...

David,

I figured you might be one of those who'd shot at one of the varmints mentioned.

My question wasn't directed at those with actual experience. Few of us have had to fend off any of the three large varmints mentioned in the original post. I certainly haven't, but the majority still offered firm opinions. Was just wondering about their experience.

As a guy that backpacks on occasion, I highly recommend you carry whatever weighs the least.



Travis

I have killed deer, grouse, snakes, and porcupines with 45 ACP, 38 Special, and .22 Rimfire revolvers on the trail during my 35 years of hiking and woods rambling.

I killed a mountain lion with a 300 Weatherby once, and was glad to have such a powerful arm, but I have tried to stalk them since then carrying a 220 Swift, and would do it with a 22 Magnum lever action rifle, but not a 38 Revolver.

My experience has me carrying a light rifle more often these days. T/C Carbines can be built as light as 44 ounces in 35 Remington, a serious cartridge for any of the mentioned purposes.

Most of my hiking is in the Siskiyous Mountains, and the nearby Marbles and Trinitys.

On long hikes I often carry my Taurus Ultra light Model 85 38 Special. The reason is because weight becomes burdensome on long hikes.

For day hikes I like my Model 625 in 460 Rowland, I loaded a pile of Speer shot capsules up with number 12 shot years ago, and one of them travels in the number one position. Number 12 is the bomb on snakes.

I think the next trail gun I buy will be a Kel-Tec PMR-30 in 22 Magnum. Then I wouldn't have to carry any extra ammo.

What Travis said.

I'm in the mid fifties and everything weighs more after mile ten.

The thing I learned "down range" was that everything is too #%^*in' heavy, even for the young Soldiers and Marines.

Pepper spray works on all concerned and involves less paperwork when effectively employed, I'm told.

I'd hate to have to know how you'd advise the police and what you'd have to do to demonstrate fear of injury.

Also, check the gun laws along the route. Some ain't friendly.

i normally carry a 38 special airweight in non grizzly country with a couple of shot cartridges included for rattlesnakes

or if i think i might need better accuracy i go with my walther pp 32 auto. it's a bit heavier

or in grizzly country i don't leave home without my ruger super blackhawk 44 magnum with hardcast 300 grain bullets

Travis said "As a guy that backpacks on occasion, I highly recommend you carry whatever weighs the least.



Travis"

And I agree one hundred percent, at least. I'm headed for grizz habitat tomorrow and was going to take my heavy Ruger Bisley in .45 Colt but decided to cut back to the old S&W model 19 in .357 loaded with 180 gr. hardcast and probably wont need that. Hope so, anyhow.

Travis, I'm gonna wander up to the lake where you went either later this week or first of next week. Any advice to pass along? Wishin I had some good lookin' chick to carry my pack but no such luck.

I have hiked a bit of the AT and lived for many years along its route, in Hanover, NH, but never encountered anybody or anything that bothered me other than dogs, mosquitos, flies (Black/Deer/Horse). When I go off the beaten track, I generally carry a small Rossi 720 with 2 CCI shot cartridges and 3 240 grain SWCs.

Jeff

Or a Glock 23. The Buffalo Bore .40 +P 180 FMJs and JHPs are listed at 1100.

Expat

Personally, for the AT I'd not be worried about animals other than the two-legged kind. I'd carry an HK P2000SK in 9mm. Small, fairly light and 10+1 ultra-reliable rounds of Peace of Mind.

Yeah, the last mile is a beatch. Go slow. Bring beer.


Travis

Great point and I always carry spray if I remember to bring it.

But here are a "thousand words" on why guns are more better.



Travis

My answer after having a few is a 357PD 4" in 41 Magnum. Tried the 629 4" really got heavy on the hip. Had a 586 357 Magnum in 6" try sitting down with that on the hip. Given that you have a model 57 then I would pick it. The 357PD is perfect for me, light weight, not brutal to shoot and power enough for anything that should be shot with a revolver.

I agree with those who advocate the lightest gun with adequate power. I just finished backpacking across the Wallowa Mountains in NE Oregon. I carried a Glock 36 .45 ACP. It weighs only 20 oz. (27 oz. w/ a full mag) and has a 3.8 inch barrel with a 6+1 capacity.

Thankfully I have never needed to use a firearm to defend against either an animal or a person but it seems to me that in the case of a problem black bear something that penetrates well would be what you want. Phil Shoemaker has written about handguns for brown bear defense and he advocated loads that penetrate well. Though a black bear is generally smaller I would think the same principles apply. Any load that might work on a bear should be plenty for cougars, wolves, humans etc.

I carried one mag of +P 230 grain truncated cone FMJ (from Buffalo Bore) and another mag of 230 grain Federal HST. Buffalo Bore says this FMJ load was designed with black bears in mind. There are many possibilities but my Glock 36 is light, compact and reliable. I shoot Glocks a lot so this was a natural choice for me.

Phil also advocates for a 357 mag with 180 hardcast, and I believe him. I think his daughter (Tia?) carries a smith in 357 as her backup while guiding.

A heavy bullet with sharp edges punches holes in stuff.

'course, a 357 Sig with the 124 grain, and 14 of them with 13 in the mag and 1 in the pipe ala Glock 32, isn't anything to laugh at, either.

The problem with guns on camping trips where there are a lot of other people is most folks aren't used to knowing where it is, exactly where it is, 24/7. If you misplace the pepper spray, no biggy...the revolver may require a trip back, routing around, calling the PD, etc., etc.

I have spent most of my life in bear country and have killed 2 grizzlies, 3 black bears, one mountain lion, with everything from a 25-35 to a 30-378.

I just bought a 4 inch Python for hunting in bear country, because of the size, manageability and power factor of a fully loaded 158 grain Jacketed bullet. I have a Smith and Wesson model 57, but it is a long barrel at 8 3/8 inches, so I wanted a smaller framed gun, smooth and pointable when firing double action.

I had a Taurus Titanium 41 magnum, but once you fired it, you would rather be mauled by a bear. I sold it and decided to use the Python. I haven't had to, but we did run into a grizzly last fall and the fellow that hunted with us, just bought a 4 inch model 57 in 41 mag just in case. He did mess his pants and you won't find him sleeping in a tent this fall...

When I was a young man, I jumped out of an airplane and landed in strong crosswinds. I panicked and instead of just pulling one of the lines to collapse the chute, allowed myself to be dragged across a road with heavy traffic. The view from ground level of people trying not to run over you is interesting, at least.

When I finally took control of the situation and the chute, a truck with my friends pulled up and I had a wet spot on the front of my jeans.

"Drug you through a puddle?"

"%$^* no," I replied, "I pissed my pants!"

In retrospect, that story is funny. I guess they all are when you're alive to tell them.

The AT goes through New Jersey and you ain't allowed to carry in the Communist State of New Jersey and if your a non resident the cops treat you worse.

Unless New Jersey has changed it's laws. Hollow Point ammo is illegal for civilians.

HPs are legal to possess, just don't use 'em or you'll be in the brown sauce.

I faced the same issue when I hiked the Appalachian and other Trails. I have several S&W "N" frames (44 Mag), too heavy when packing a heavy pack. I found a used S&W Model 64 ("K" frame, 38 Special, +P rated) with a 4" barrel. I carry it in a large fanny pack and load it with Buffalo Bore 38 Special 158 gr. "Ourdoorsman" loads.

With about 475 ft. pounds of muzzle energy, it works well for eastern hiking and kayaking. It is enough for black bear and two legged varmints and, the Model 64 is light and easily to carry.

Buffalo Bore website: https://www.buffalobore.com/index.php?l=product_detail&p=291

As I've mentioned before, I shot a Grizzly in Montana wilderness 52 years ago with a Ruger Blackhawk 44 Magnum. Following a bad bear attack, I bought the pistol for working in the back country. It was light and easy to carry, but the hammer would bloody my hand after a few shots - it was just too light for shooting with heavy loads.

For griz country hunting, I'd consider the 44 Mag as a minimum; but in the East, a 357 Mag or (Buffalo Bore) 38 Special +P load would be enough for black bear.

I am liking my 329pd for hiking.Plenty of power and light weight too!

3" SP101 loaded with the SD load of your choice. The 2-legged threat is far greater than being attacked by a black bear or cougar.

I have to qualify this by stating that I've never shot a bear, cougar, or human, but I have had close encounters with two of the three in which having a gun made me more comfortable, and confident in my actions. For trail use I have a Smith model 60 with 3" barrel that I carry with the FBI load, since it is a bit rambunctious with full house .357 loads in DA. I also carried speedloaders, one with more FBI load, and one with wadcutters for small game use. I have used the gun for rampaging squirrel and rabbits, and it works well. I have every confidence that it would work for larger critters, too. It carries well in a good holster, and is light enough for protracted carry.

W/O buying a new gun, the 21 is going to be lighter than the .41 or the .480. Slimmer contour barrel, bigger holes in the steel. I have (and love) a stainless Ruger 4 5/8" .44 special, but I doubt it saves any weight over the 21.

I suppose you could get it somewhere here, but bears are scarce in my normal haunts, so bear spray is not on the shelves. I can tell you that wasp and hornet spray works on other than flying insects-and works well.

While vacationing in Colorado this summer, my wife spotted a bear across the small lake in front of the house. She called me and we watched as it worked its way around the shore line, across a gravel road, and on up the mountain. There were hikers on a trail who never saw the bear. When Mr. Bear saw the hikers, he changed directions to avoid them. The hikers never knew he was there. Now he did come back one night to try the trash (no luck) and he did get into our Mule. I guess he couldn't get it started. Tracks and a few scratches in the paint were evidence.

Best wishes for a fun trip. jack

Good point...but then again I haven't shot a human either. My response was based on the personal recommendations of a guy who runs dogs after bears/lions here in Idaho who has treed and been involved in the killing of probably several hundred of them in the past 25 years...and police officers who have shot two-legged vermin in the line of duty.

When I backpack (usually 35-45 pound pack) a chest rig is what I use to carry my 3" 629. This summer I used a very cheap and simple Blackhawk IWB nylon holster clipped to the inside of my packs sternum strap. Worked great.

My favorite hiking revolvers are my S&W AirLites, a M-360 3" .357, or my M-329 4" .44 Mag.

Very pleasant to carry, yet lots of power available should it be needed. Pleasant to shoot with light loads for practice or vermin. Rust is less of a concern than with blue guns.

No experience shooting bares, katz, or peoples but the SP101 in .357 has been mentioned a couple of times. Since the OP didn't list one....and if he's going to buy one....get the new model with the 4.2 inch barrel. I've been carrying one since early this spring while working on the farm, mainly for gophers and snakes. Great little revolver. Not to heavy to carry in a good holster, heavy enough to shoot mag loads, slim design, great sights, long enough barrel to use the mag loads, sweat resistant finish....

I doubt you have any need for it, but it's a first round pick in the Ultimate Hiking Revolver draft.

Since the greatest threat will be of the two-legged variety the following link should prove interesting to those who carry a gun for defense.

The person writing the article is works for County Medical Examiner in a morgue in Atlanta. He has first-hand experience examining in detail the affects of bullets on flesh and bone.

http://smith-wessonforum.com/concea...t-performance-different-perspective.html

Is the Appalachian Trail that dangerous these days? Last time I hiked it was in summer camp with a bunch of other 11 and 12 year old boys. We went about 50 miles through North Carolina and northern Georgia. The most dangerous weapons we carried were cans of Vienna sausage.

I think we were more terrified of the 16 to 18 year old counselors running us ragged and forcing us to do all of their chores than any wild animals. But then, they were definitely a sadistic and malicious bunch of SOB�s.

We don't have any Mongooses here or Cape Buff but the handgun I carry while hiking without a rifle,will penetrate a Cape Buffalo's shoulders(both) exit and kill the one standing next to it...

Not sure about Mongooses though!

Jayco

Before anyone calls BS and things go South..Here is part of it from Rifle Magazine....



Jayco

I have used a Browning Hi-Power in .40 S&W to dispatch wounded deer, pronghorns and hogs. It worked as good as anything else I have tried and made a compact carry package. A Glock .40 would be comparable. My favorite hiking pistol is an S&W Model 66 with 125-grain CorBons. I have used that pistol and load to take several lions over dogs and to finish off wounded animals.

Of the two that you have, I would choose the .44 Special and load it with Hornady 180-grain XTP factory ammo. These rounds shoot very well in my 4-inch S&W. I would not hesitate to use it on lions, bears or for self-defense.

I would pack a 22 or 22 Mag if hiking the AP. Would work perfect for small game, maybe bring some "snake shot" rounds as well.

I have carried a Ruger Redhawk 5.5 44 mag while hiking and it did fine, but alittle heavy, lately I have been carrying my Glock 21 SF due to the fact I have had to deal with more of the 2 legged problems than the 4 legged ones! Good luck!

Love my new KelTec PMR-30 in .22 mag! I've been carrying it quite a bit for hiking around the ranch while checking fences & hunting arrowheads. it's super light & very accurate. With 2 30 round mags, I feel pretty well armed here in Texas, on private property.

That being said, if I'm bow huntnting in CO or NM, where I might encounter black bears or mountain lions, I like my Glock 20- 10mm w/ 15 rounds of Hornady 200gr XTP's.

In any area where my main concerns are two- legged varmints, I usually have my Glock 32- 357sig. It holds 13+ rounds of Speer Gold Dot 125 gr HP's. I have killed several feral hogs here in TX with it, & it puts them down on the spot!
Texas State Troopers here have used that same ammo for years to put down numerous bad guys. Even while shooting through car doors!

My last choice is my little S&W .38 BodyGaurd Revolver with Factory Lazer.
I mostly carry it around the house or while working out in my garage late at night. It doesn't pull down my jogging shorts, and it's loaded with Speer Gold Dot 125gr +P 38sp ammo.
I always carry a extra speed loader when jogging around our neighborhood at night.

A good part of comfort is more than sheer weight of the gun. I really like this holster:

http://www.montanaholster.com/

It's not fancy, but sturdy and carries beautifully. I find that I don't even use the belt snap, just let it hang, so to speak. Also, the shoulder rig is usable with other belt-style holsters (I use mine mostly with an old Bianchi flap holster holding a Model 57 S&W). Much more comfortable than either a belt or a typical shoulder holster. I can carry an N frame Smith and Wesson all day with no fatigue (at least from the gun and holster!).

I'll be hiking a piece of the Virginia AT in October. I don't plan on carrying a firearm even though I usually have one handy. Virginia and Georgia don't have a reciprocal carry agreement. For some unknown reason the Constitution only applies in your home state or those that decide that your home state has done enough checking on you to allow you to protect yourself. Evidently Georgia and Virginia don't see eye to eye when it comes to carry permits.

You will find that you can carry your handgun openly in Virginia, no permit of any kind.

That was a question that just occurred to me. Thanks for answering it before I had the chance to ask! So as I understand it even though I am from out of state, it is legal to open carry in Virginia. I guess in areas where I would not want to open carry I would need to have the firearm inaccessible and unloaded so that it would not be considered a concealed weapon. I have never worried much about four legged critters or two legged critters either for that matter, but me having a firearm would offer some comfort to others that will be with me. (They know that I can out run them and there wouldn't be as much need to do so if I was armed.) Thanks again for the information.

I have not made my recommendation yet, but would recommend a lighterweight double action 357 Mag from Colt, Ruger, or S&W with 2 to 4 inch barrel.

I have killed a 250 pound black bear with a 4 inch S&W model 66 with 158 gn SJHP factory loaded Magtech ammo.

In the summer I load "Shot" Ball "Shot" Ball Ball Ball in the cylinder and have them loaded to fire in that order. I figure that a snake up close would need shot quick; a toothy critter should yield enough warning to cycle past the first "Shot" capsule or if that close the shot to it's face should help deter long enough to get a ball in it as a stopper. In fall/winter, I load straight ball ammo, i.e. 158 gn SJHP.

I can give you my opinions, which is based on some experience and actual observations for those who are wondering if I have any. Admittedly I have no experience on bear and cougar with a revolver. I would say just carry whichever is lightest and that you shoot well. If you want to buy another gun, so be it, it's a good excuse. As far as loads go, you will be much much more likely to need the gun on a human so I would go with an expanding type bullet like an XTP that can work on other critters as well if needed. Yes I have seen many people shot with expanding bullets, FMJ bullets and lead bullets from handguns, rifles and shotguns so I do have some experience. The expanding bullets have almost always done a better job of stopping a person because of more trauma, humans need comparatively little in the way of penetration like big game will.

I have seen many people who have been shot with many weapons, usually handguns, and have been in the middle of and actually witnessed a handful of shootings. Luckily I was armed with 00 buck for the most intense, very close range one. If I would have had just a handgun, I would have probably ended up very hurt or killed, even though he would have still likely been killed had I shot him many times with a handgun, he would not have been stopped by any handgun like the shotgun stopped him, which saved my butt.

Handguns are not death rays like on television and in fact in actual shootings, a human shot one time in the torso with a handgun has I believe (I am going from memory from a gunshot wound class from 3 years ago) a 97 percent chance of living. Additional rounds on target increase the chance of killing the subject exponentially. Remember, stopping power and killing power are two different things. Yes big bore revolvers with heavy cast bullets are very good killers even for very large animals, they however lack the high velocity that causes massive trauma that is usually what stops. This does not inclued a proper central nervous system shot, which will almost always stop even with a handgun, almost.

You have to take into account the motivation and state of the animal you are up against. Lucky for us, the vast majority of people who are shot will fall to the ground screaming with even a minor injury to an extremity, because humans are soft. This is where the high percentage of one shot stops comes from associated with the rating of handgun loads in actual shootings. Many of these people were still not killed, just stopped. If you take a motivated, demented, high, mental or deranged subject or just one who is dedicated to the cause, we have a different subject all together. In this case anything short of a central nervous system shot will do nothing until they bleed out or are broken down by hitting pelvis, major bones or other parts of their frame, which will drop them but still not always stop them as they will crawl or fight from the ground if they are dedicated enough.

All this said, I am definately not saying I'm an expert, just my experiences. Carry what you are most comfortable with and if in the unfortunate and unlikely chance that you have to shoot, shoot until your gun is empty or until someone is on the ground and no longer a threat.

We all have our opinions, some are based on experience, too many are based on internet forums. There are many answers on here for you to choose from. The most important thing is to have fun on your hike.

Best hiking gun IN THE WORLD! (LCR 22LR)



Second best hiking gun IN THE WORLD! (S&W 396, note the holster)



Travis

As a person who grew up hunting and exploring in the foothills of Appalachia, and packed different handguns over the years, were I to choose a revolver as the OP stated, the 3" version of the S&W 360 would be my ideal choice. (Another poster posted a picture of one earlier in this thread.)

Full disclosure, I haven't had to actually use one on black bear, cougars, or the two-legged varmits, but I'm pretty sure a lightweight 3" .357 would work just fine.

I have no idea what all states the Trail goes through, and someone mentioned NJ, which reminds me of this Ayoob story: http://www.backwoodshome.com/articles2/ayoob105.html
about a lady carrying hollowpoints in NJ who nearly went to prison over the concealed weapon which was legal for her in CT, but not NJ. However, she got off lightly and was "only" fined $1000 per cartridge for carrying HP's.

Goes to a Cabelas and get a large spray can of Bear Spray. I'd still bring a handgun but scumbags hate high concentration pepper spray. I've seen it used multiple times in prison riots. And being a "less lethal" weapon it'll show a jury that you were not inclined to shoot someone. This could save you a trip to prison for manslaughter if you'd ever need to use force.

S&W Mdl 43...

I've never killed a black bear or a lion, but I've had a few close encounters with both. I've had lots of "encounters" with two legged varmits and used a handgun in two such cases.
If you are more worried about two legged varmits, I wouldn't pack a revolver if I had a choice. I'd pack either a 1911 style semi auto or a SIG 220. That's because when you drop them on a hard surface, they work when you pick them up. 50% of the revolvers I've seen so dropped or used as a club in one case, would no longer fire.....
Do make sure you understand and obey the laws in the areas where you'll be. However, frankly, I can explain anything but my own death.
Will a .45 ACP or a 10mm work on a black bear or a Mtn Lion with common expanding ammo ? I understand they will. But, if you insist ona guy who has seen lots of them shot with such guns, ask JJHack. E

Raver,

If you go with your .44 Special I recommend that you consider the Buffalo Bore 255 gr cast SWC load at 1,000 fps.

https://www.buffalobore.com/index.php?l=product_detail&p=88,

Penetration should be excellent. This is the load I carry in my M-329 on the Pacific Crest Trail. Good luck.

When I bum around the place in north Idaho I carry an old Ruger Flattop 44 Mag cut to 4 5/8" loaded with 280 gr WFN's at 1050 fps in a pancake holster. Light enough in weight and easy enough to shoot well with right sized bullets from MBW.

Unfortunately no longer produced...but I got mine.

There is a reason Smith and Wesson made the Kit Gun.

Ok, so let's get real, cougars and bears on the AT? Only a problem in your most fevered fantasies. Two legged varmints will be more than impressed with anything pointed in their direction and even that is a stretch. . Keep it light because you will come to resent every extra ounce in your pack. The most likely use of your handgun will be in taking small game and trout.?????....trout? (The Statute of Limitatation has run out so I am safe in telling you to get close and aim low....trust me.) Take it from one who has been there.

Somehow I feel you would be better off with a LW 22 and a box of hollow points than your 3 pound bazooka's. No I have not killed anything or anybody so my comment is pure Internet malarky.

Not me..I have now shot three eastern black bears, but all those bears where shot when unaware with rifles. I somehow expect that shooting an unaware blackie with a rifle is a bit different from shooting at an unhappy bear 15 feet away with a handgun.

My choice of gun in this thread, a 357 with 158's I have no doubts would be fine shooting the unaware bear from a tree stand, but would no doubt feel small and unimpressive standing 15 feet in front of a pissed off sow. Of course there is something to be said for 12oz handguns when walking for miles and miles. To be frank I am more concerned with threats like people, or unleashed aggressive dogs than with black bears. It wouldn't be my choice if I was in grizzly county, but I spend hundreds of hours in black bear country a year and if I am lucky a week or so in Griz country every year or three.

Carry what you feel comfortable with and can shoot good.Chances of being attacked by a bear are slim to none.I have shot quite a few bears with a revolver,but none were attacking me.

It is a shame that there is not a National CCW permitting process that would allow national carry.

The Second Amendment would serve if we could elect some people that had read it and believed what it said.

Watch out you don`t stumble on a grow site.Things could get sticky and i would want to carry a man stopper.

How about a Charter Arms target bulldog? 23oz. I had to stop this critter with mine while hog hunting a couple of years ago. It wasn't my primery hunting gun. I carried it to have something to carry first day out while my son hunted. Using a 240-250grain cast bullet at anything around 800fps will deal with most problems in that neck of the woods and it is so light you won't even know you are packing. reflex264

I've never shot a bear, but I did poleaxe a 1200 lb cow with a warmly loaded .45 Colt. My neighbor asked me to put down one of his cows that had a distended bowel, as all he had was a .22 rifle and he didn't want it to suffer. I just happened to be wearing a S&W 25-5 at the time, loaded with home-cast 270 gr RCBS SWC's over a fairly stout charge of Unique. Old Elmer was right, a .45 will go through the frontal plate on a cow, traverse the skull and go on back into the neck. In his autobiography he tells of having to rescue the East Helena butcher who had been treed by a bull. Elmer rode up on his horse and shot the bull in the forehead with his Colt SAA .45 as it charged him, dropping the bull right on his nose. In my case I felt bad for the cow, but at least she never knew what hit her.

By the time I was 16 I'd walked just over 1,000 miles of the AT. Never, ever felt the need for a handgun. If I felt the need, I'd resist and carry bear spray. Damn effective on two and four legged beasts. FWIW, I never pack a handgun here in grizzly country, except when packing out bloody elk meat... then it's just a backup to bear spray.

Carrying a handgun is an awesome responsibility. If you've ever taken a human life you'll know what I mean. Unless you're thoroughly trained and have the right mindset, I'd not carry.

What Brad said....

Good points here by Brad and DW. While I can carry, I prefer the chemical irritants.
Pretty dam effective for man or beast and a lot less paperwork and court time.
For protection in my home, "Condition One" is the rule of the day.

I agree. Also, there is the problem of what to do with the gun while in town. You will also likely be violating a myriad of laws. UDAP bear spray weighs 9oz. Bears are an increasing problem in the SE, an AT section in GA now requires you to hike through or have a bear canister if you camp now.

I've never felt the need to carry a firearm or pepper spray when hiking along the AT in Pennsylvania. With that said, I am trying to understand the the train of thought with regard to whether people who are accustomed to using firearms not consider defending themselves with one unless they have received some expert level of training. I believe you and Brad may have experience in such matters that I do not, and so I would value your opinion.

Let's say that I have been in the woods along or near the AT many times since I was a kid carrying a firearm while hunting. Presumably, I would defend myself from a four-legged or two-legged critter with that firearm if the need arose, although honestly, I never really thought about such a far-fetched scenario.

What's the difference between a life-long hunter and shooter walking along/near the AT with a long gun during hunting season versus a life-long hunter and shooter hiking along the AT with a handgun, especially if the hunter/shooter has a fair amount of experience shooting the handgun? Does the difference come down to entirely one of a different mindset where in one instance the primary purpose for carrying a firearm is hunting while in the other instance the primary reason is self-defense? Can't there be some overlap where a person with years of experience handling weapons while hunting and shooting has at least the bare minimum experience needed to be able to defend himself with a firearm if necessary?

I ask this because I have seen threads in the handgun forum and elsewhere suggesting that your run-of-the-mill, life-long "gun guy" really shouldn't even consider self-defense with a firearm unless they have a high level of expensive civilian training or LEO/military training. But I am of the opinion that if I really needed a gun, nothing else would suffice, and I wonder whether being around guns since almost forever, coupled with a dose of common sense, would be "good enough".

I'm not a handgun guy, I would just take a 22 rifle like a ruger 10/22 and a couple of boxes of ammo along with an extra magazine. Most will be able to shoot a rifle a lot better than a handgun. Or a Marlin 336 in 30-30 plenty light and plenty for most pests either four or two legged. I understand the Idea of handguns, I carried one for 30 years. I still carry from time to time, I just can shoot a rifle better. In the end carry what ever it is you want to carry.

I'm sure Hugh Glass would debate the chemical irritant...

Oh, Ravery, I forgot to apologize for the loss of your kin many years ago. We had this handgun topic come up many years ago on Whiteblaze. Someone researched the topic and the vast majority of the murders that have happened in the history of the AT have happened NEAR THE SHELTERS. Smart folks stay away from them. I use a hammock and typically hang somewhere out of view of the trail.

EVERYBODY shoots a rifle better than they do a handgun. That isn't the point, and advising an AT hiker to carry a 30/30 marlin for "self-protection" is about the nuttiest thing I've ever read on the fire.

I can't speak for Brad or others, but I think the difference is consequence management. If you flub a shot on a deer, there's only minor consequences. Outside of sanctioned combat, the consequences of firing on another person are severe, even if you're vindicated, as a civilian. In uniform, we get a pass by the populace because we're shooting at "enemies" and not "people." In every case as a civilian, be prepared to face additional scrutiny from all corners on the use of lethal force.

As Heidi Smith, she of Thunder Ranch, likes to opine, "there's a lawyer attached to every bullet. How many lawyers to you want to let loose?"

I guess it's down to this, in a combat situation and I shoot the guy and its on the edge, it will be perceived to be a righteous shooting unless there's strong evidence otherwise. As a civilian, if I pull my weapon, there had better be a significant amount of evidence that I was in fear for my life or limb before I fire, and the "fear" bar is much higher. The statute of limitations on murder is forever, and if at any time any authority who may have had jurisdiction over the shooting determines there was foul play, you'll have to defend yourself in court again.

Double jeopardy, sadly, has been interpreted as a jurisdictional thing. Meaning, the City gets a shot at you, then the county, then the state, then the US for a civil rights violation.

Extensive training as a civilian is valuable if for no other reason than learning this, paraphrased from Jeff Cooper:

Did you shoot to kill?
"no"
Did you shoot to wound?"
"no."
Then why did you shoot XYZ ### number of times?
"He did ____ that put me in fear for my life."
So you shot him until he was dead?
"No. I shot him until he stopped doing that. Then I called 911 and rendered first aid."

Also, training teaches you to yell things like "Stop! Stop! Drop the knife! Someone call the police." And how to draw your weapon in a manner that causes the aggressor to correctly interpret your willingness to shoot them (not shoot at them, shoot them. They look different) and to cause the aggressor to retreat, which is better for everybody.

Frankly, it doesn't really matter if you shoot first or yell first (well, yell first is preferred), most witnesses will remember yelling and shooting, in that order. Thank God for preconditioning by cop shows.

In a civilian on civilian situation, you're never really done.

Don't even get me started on what happens when you try to return to your "normal" civilian life and everyone knows you shot someone. There's volumes and volumes to suggest you'll never get your life back.

Good post!

Got mine too... perfect for bear country. I know everybody prefers spray.. but it's the last thing I want when something's got me down, chewing on me. Can't say Hi-V ammo is fun to shoot in this though - probably why it's not made anymore. It's got a bite.

I have the pleasure to live in bear. lion and coyote country and walk my dog daily in it. She wears a bell and I carry a Ruger LCR in .38 Spcl with a max load.
The only issue that I have ever had was with some urbanized coyotes in a state park.
Where I go in the back country by my home my friend's Airedale jumped a mountain lion earlier this year. The lion is my biggest fear, more for the dog than me. With the bell, I seldom see anything but an occasional snake.
Last week I was hunting grouse in the Flattops and we came up on a cow and bull moose, the rut had started. Now that is a bigger problem than any black bear that I have ever encountered. Having three rounds of #6 shot is not very comforting. Fortunately, we were able to skirt around them before the bull got too agitated.

Count me as one who is not enamored with the thought of OC spray as a first line of defense. There are a lot of reasons for the popularity of the Taser these days and a big one is spotty results from OC. A meth head with his pain receptors burned out just might not fall to the ground from a shot of spray in his face.

It would also seem less than ideal if said bad guy, bent on destruction, did not have an aversion to firearms. If the bad guys would stick to just packing OC then I might reconsider but I sure would hate to show up at a gun fight with just a spray bottle of hot sauce to hide behind.

Because the OP opened the door to a new gun my choice would be S&W MP in 9MM or the Gen 3 G19. Tupperware pistols are hard to stomach but 17 rnds of very effective ammo in a relatively small and light package seems to me to be the best answer to the question.

With the advances in what is termed �Barrier Blind� defensive ammo no bears skull is going to stop one of the new breed of 9MM +P loads. These loads were developed to not defect on intermediate barriers such as automobile glass and still deliver very good terminal results.

2 legged predators would be more of a concern but keep in mind even coons and skunks can be a problem. 40,000 people a year get treated for rabies here in the good old US of A, and the vectors are almost exclusively bites from wildlife. Hard to bring the skunk in that bit you if you only have OC spray.

I have packed a Scandium 329PD a few miles and it is hard to beat but more and more these days the Tupperware gets carried even in grizzly country.

I must need a different holster because my poor ol 329 sure has a lot of wear compared to some.

John, that looks like a carry gun and not a BBQ gun!

While some of what you write here is true, I am inclined to ask how many times you've been sprayed. And how many time you've been tased?

Also, whether you intend to use it or not, having a can of bear spray on you is simply not a bad idea these days. At least you can spray the dead critter afterward...

Oh and since it is Friday, GFY...


Travis

So, you season your game with pepper spray prior to cooking?

I wish. Bears are my white whale. The only ones I see are the size of my lab, or protected.

I guess I could try it on venison?


Travis

just bought the exact gun, will be packing it theis weekend on a 3day backpack elk archery hunt

DW,

Thanks for the thoughtful response to my questions. There is a lot to process there.

Never been sprayed with real OC but have been in the gas chamber with out a mask and the old MACE. Never been tased.

Never been shot with a 9mm or .45 either if that was the next question.

I fugure I got enough stuff to carry and if I have room for spray I have room for an extra mag instead.

I will take a pistol over spray especially when dealing with 2 legged critters that will most likely have a pistol of their own.