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#7127126 - 11/30/12 338 Win Mag and Long range hunting?  
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m77 Offline
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Hi there.

In reality a 338 Win Mag is not really a magnum. It Achieves only moderate velocities compared to other magnums.

I would like to know from the experts or regular long range guys here, what is the 338 Win Mag capable of. On large game like Kudu, Oryx, Wildebeest and Eland what is the max distance you would use a 338 Win Mag for? What bullet weight?

I know this is pretty open for discussion, but shooting metal plates and paper at long range is not hunting and I would rather find out from you guys how it performs on game before one try something stupid smile

Thanks

Pieter

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#7127859 - 11/30/12 Re: 338 Win Mag and Long range hunting? [Re: m77]  
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338Norma Offline
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It is capable of some long kills. With that being said there is a lot to take into consideration. Out on the open plains I would take a shot on Wilderbeast or Oryx much further than on a Kudu that could make it to cover. With a good 225 or 250 grain bullet it does a great job even though the case capacity is on the smaller side. I don't like to put a number on long range hunting, after harvesting many animals over the years each shot for me is on a case by case basis. Ive passed many shots on deer with my little 6br and also taken deer far beyond what most would consider within range.
Those are some big animals and under ideal conditions for me the range could vary by 100's of yards.


"Fast is fine accurate is final"
#7127880 - 11/30/12 Re: 338 Win Mag and Long range hunting? [Re: m77]  
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Mark R Dobrenski Offline
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Pieter-I've never hunted any of those critters but I have done quite a bit of work on elk with the big 33's. Right conditions, right scope and gun I have no probelmo going to 500-600 with the big 33's.

The 200 NBT has been my fav but there are a lot of bullets that will do well at range out of the medium or big 33's. Acutally its fairly tough to find one that I wouldn't use at longer ranges on these types of critters.

But the rifleman and the rig and conditions need to be right.

Dober


"True respect starts with the way you treat others, and it is earned over a lifetime of demonstrating kindness, honor and dignity"....Tony Dungy
#7128110 - 11/30/12 Re: 338 Win Mag and Long range hunting? [Re: m77]  
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smokepole Offline
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Originally Posted by m77
I know this is pretty open for discussion, but shooting metal plates and paper at long range is not hunting and I would rather find out from you guys how it performs on game before one try something stupid smile

Thanks

Pieter


I know you didn't ask this question so I apologize for answering the question you didn't ask. I had a 338 WM that I considered for LR, but by the time I'd worked up some good loads and shot it a fair amount, I'd convinced myself that I'd be better off with a big 7 for that application, so I went the re-barrel route.

When you say "long-range hunting" that means (to me anyway) using a bullet that's optimum at bucking the wind, and shooting enough to get really comfortable with the rifle. For me, the 338 WM was not the way to get there. Just my $.02, and worth every penny.

Edited to add, didn't see the part about the game you're interested in, scratch that.

Last edited by smokepole; 11/30/12.


A wise man is frequently humbled.

#7128286 - 11/30/12 Re: 338 Win Mag and Long range hunting? [Re: smokepole]  
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Sheister Offline
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I've shot both of my .338 WM's practicing across canyons using small objects as targets. As long as I know the distance (usually by laser rangefinder, but sometimes estimation) I've found the .338's are easily capable of MOA accuracy out to farther than I would like to shoot game. I've shot very small rocks at 700 yards without too much trouble.

Now, rocks aren't what you asked about but I include that just to show what is possible with a little practice.
The longest shot I've made on game with my .338 was last year's elk. I shot a spike elk across a canyon at almost exactly 600 yards. Two of the shots were in the shoulder and you could cover with a small cup and the third was just 4-6" behind the others on the same level in the lungs.

Just like any rifle you want to use for long range work, being able to know you distance pretty accurately and knowing your ballistics from practice makes it possible. The .33's have plenty of energy at extended ranges to take game cleanly. If you need more, there is always the .338 RUM, if you're up to the practice time with it.....

Bob


Never underestimate your ability to overestimate your ability.
#7128426 - 11/30/12 Re: 338 Win Mag and Long range hunting? [Re: Sheister]  
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rost495 Offline
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I know its not Kudu but its all I have and my longest 2 shots to date...

Mature Alaska caribou bull. 802 yards. 2 shots. 2 hits. Both very vital.

338 win mag and 225 Barnes X reloads. Very dead bull.

Inspection showed caliber entry wounds on both, and on both showed exits about dime size or so, IE the bullets did expand even though most say they could not have. Of course no recovery of bullets either.

I"ve shot a lot of deer with same load to around 450 or so.


We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot....
#7129832 - 11/30/12 Re: 338 Win Mag and Long range hunting? [Re: rost495]  
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eh76 Offline
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Not as long as posted above but this raghorn was 200 feet below me and 482 yds out. The scope was a 6x42 Leupold on a M70...it worked. 225 gr Accubond at 2800fps hit him in the chest and took out heart, lings, liver and kept going..could not find the bullet and I fished through the guts looking for it.

[Linked Image]

He was in the center of the picture...

[Linked Image]


Last edited by eh76; 12/01/12.

Liberalism is a mental disorder that leads to social disease.
#7130679 - 12/01/12 Re: 338 Win Mag and Long range hunting? [Re: rost495]  
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m77 Offline
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Originally Posted by rost495
I know its not Kudu but its all I have and my longest 2 shots to date...

Mature Alaska caribou bull. 802 yards. 2 shots. 2 hits. Both very vital.

338 win mag and 225 Barnes X reloads. Very dead bull.

Inspection showed caliber entry wounds on both, and on both showed exits about dime size or so, IE the bullets did expand even though most say they could not have. Of course no recovery of bullets either.

I"ve shot a lot of deer with same load to around 450 or so.


What velocity are you getting with those 225 Barnes? I like the 225s as well. Thanks for the info

Pieter

#7130681 - 12/01/12 Re: 338 Win Mag and Long range hunting? [Re: m77]  
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m77 Offline
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Thanks for the info guys. I find all of it very interesting and helpful.

Pieter

#7130686 - 12/01/12 Re: 338 Win Mag and Long range hunting? [Re: eh76]  
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m77 Offline
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Originally Posted by eh76
Not as long as posted above but this raghorn was 200 feet below me and 482 yds out. The scope was a 6x42 Leupold on a M70...it worked.

[Linked Image]

He was in the center of the picture...

[Linked Image]



I guess hunting Kudu is for me, more or less the same as what hunting Elk is for you.

Would love to hunt one of them one day.

Pieter


#7130802 - 12/01/12 Re: 338 Win Mag and Long range hunting? [Re: m77]  
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Azshooter Offline
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When I think of LR I think of high BC bullets regardless of velocity. Just for grins crunch the numbers for the 300 gr Berger Match Grade Elite Hunter. BC is .818 (G1) or .419 (G7) They just began making this bullet in the hunting version.

Sure you won't get stunning velocities but it will buck wind and have incredible energy downrange. I would estimate velocity from a 26" rifle to be 2650 or more. Crunch those numbers and you might agree.

I built a slower package with this bullet in the OTM configuration as they didn't offer the hunting version at the time. It is a long throated 338 RCM with a 30" barrel. I shot a coues wt at 400 yds with little meat damage. I admit it was a chip shot and the rifle is capable of much longer shots. Vel was a mundane 2550 fps. BUT wind drift at 4000 ft is a mere 8.8 inches in a 10 mph 90 degree crosswind with 3138 ft/lb of energy.

Imagine what the extra 100 fps would do! I crunched a few numbers:

drift under same conditions 8.2" and 3411 ft/lb

If the 300 gr seems too extreme there is always the
250 gr Match Grade Elite Hunter BC of .682(G1) .349(G7)

If there are any doubt as to performance check out this thread where the 300 gr Match Hybrid OTM Tactical version wacks a few animals.

http://www.longrangehunting.com/forums/f19/berger-230-300-otm-hybrid-terminal-results-80283/

Sure the owner used a 338 Lapua with the bullet vel of 2800 fps but if you factor in the distance with some of the shots a 338 win mag will perform similarly at distances 100 yds closer.

Just a thought.

Last edited by Azshooter; 12/01/12. Reason: typo
#7131544 - 12/01/12 Re: 338 Win Mag and Long range hunting? [Re: Azshooter]  
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MontanaMarine Offline
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MontanaMarine  Offline
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I was close to doing a 338WinMag LR rig some years back.

I calc'd 300gr SMKs loaded to 3.55" would fit easily in a Rem magazine, and should make 2550 fps at about 60k psi, via moly, RL22, and a 26" bbl.

The downrange energy/drift numbers are impressive.

Trajectory is not that bad either, beats 308Win/175SMK 2600 fps.

With the new Berger 250s/300s, and newer powders, it only gets better.

I think the 338WinMag has a lot of potential for LR use, and barrel life should be very good to boot.

#7131604 - 12/01/12 Re: 338 Win Mag and Long range hunting? [Re: MontanaMarine]  
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Mule Deer Offline
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One of the virtues of the .338 RM is the bore/powder capacity ratio is just about like that of the .30-06. Thus barrel life is indeed considerably longer than with "real" magnums.


John

"Gunwriters, as you know, aren't as informed as their readers are and if it wasn't for the readers, there would be no need for writers..."--Shrapnel, May 2015
#7131608 - 12/01/12 Re: 338 Win Mag and Long range hunting? [Re: Mule Deer]  
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Mark R Dobrenski Offline
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I was just gonna say I've used the .340 a lot and yet if I did another 33 of some kind I'd most likely go 338 WM. Reminds me a ton of using an 06 and or a 308 as it's incredibly capable and does well at long range but isn't a caustic bastard in guns of a weight I'd actually port around anymore.

Dober


"True respect starts with the way you treat others, and it is earned over a lifetime of demonstrating kindness, honor and dignity"....Tony Dungy
#7134009 - 12/01/12 Re: 338 Win Mag and Long range hunting? [Re: m77]  
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bigsqueeze Offline
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Originally Posted by m77
Hi there.

In reality a 338 Win Mag is not really a magnum. It Achieves only moderate velocities compared to other magnums.

I would like to know from the experts or regular long range guys here, what is the 338 Win Mag capable of. On large game like Kudu, Oryx, Wildebeest and Eland what is the max distance you would use a 338 Win Mag for? What bullet weight?

I know this is pretty open for discussion, but shooting metal plates and paper at long range is not hunting and I would rather find out from you guys how it performs on game before one try something stupid smile

Thanks

Pieter
..............Very good questions regarding the 338 WM. Aside from the 30 & 375 cals, the 338 cal is another top all around favorite of mine. No doubt the 338 Win Mag is most popular 338 for many reasons.

However I cannot comment on how a 338 WM would do at longer ranges on African plains game because as of yet I haven`t been to Africa yet, and have yet to kill anything with my own 338. laugh laugh

As most everyone would do for re-assurance purposes just as you are doing here; asking viable questions for a potential new rounds usage, there are other 338s where no questions as to capabilities need be asked.

I always thought of owning a 338 but never got around to it until about a couple of years ago.

Although the 338 Lapua and 338 RUM fall into about the same category, the 338-378 Wby is one round where the only questions should be,,,rifle how much?,,,is in my budget to buy and to reload for?

So after 40+ years of hunting and shooting, my first and only 338 rifle to date as of roughly a couple of years ago is the 338-378 Wby Accumark w/brake. Preferred the Wby Accumark`s looks and format vs a Remmy chambered in a 338 RUM. And I can always load it down to medium to high 340 Wby and 338 RUM performance levels if desired and sometimes do.

When it came to the 338-378 Wby, I felt going in, that there were no questions of re-assurances that needed to be asked. I just jumped right in.

There are always opinions for "re-assurance" that are asked for and should be asked for. But then again there are certain rounds that should leave no doubts on the table whatsoever.





300WSM,,,,338-378 Wby,,,,375 Ruger


#7134058 - 12/01/12 Re: 338 Win Mag and Long range hunting? [Re: m77]  
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Sheister Offline
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Originally Posted by m77
Hi there.

In reality a 338 Win Mag is not really a magnum. It Achieves only moderate velocities compared to other magnums.

I would like to know from the experts or regular long range guys here, what is the 338 Win Mag capable of. On large game like Kudu, Oryx, Wildebeest and Eland what is the max distance you would use a 338 Win Mag for? What bullet weight?

I know this is pretty open for discussion, but shooting metal plates and paper at long range is not hunting and I would rather find out from you guys how it performs on game before one try something stupid smile

Thanks

Pieter


Pieter,
I used my Pre 64 Model 70 338 WM in South Africa in 2000. It worked very well on Kudu, Wildebeest, Zebra, Impala, Gemsbok, and every other animal I pulled a trigger on. Eland wasn't on the bag list, but I am quite confident it will easily take an eland with no problem. In fact, where it would be legal I wouldn't feel under gunned using one on Cape Buff.

My pre 64 runs a 22" custom barrel and runs about 2680 fps through the chrono. My longest shot in South Africa was about 300 yards for a Blue Wildebeest. I also shot a large moose with it in Alberta Canada (about the size of a large Eland) and it went down like hit with a sledgehammer.

My Classic Model 70 .338 runs a 26" barrel and runs about 120 fps faster. I've shot elk (about the size of a large Kudu) at 600 yards and it punched through just fine using the Nosler Partition. In Africa, I used the Swift A-frames to great affect. They both shoot to the same point of aim, along with the Hornady Spire Points- all in 225 grain.

Hope this helps you out. I would think you would get this type of results with the .300 Win Mag also with good bullets. Using the Ultra Mags, Edge, Lapua, or Weatherby versions will gain you a couple hundred yards ballistically, but I doubt they will kill any better at longer ranges than the good old .338 Win Mag. In fact, I'm wrestling right now whether to build a .338 RUM or just stay with my tried and true old fashioned "Non magnum Magnum" and just keep killing critters with it.

Bob


Never underestimate your ability to overestimate your ability.
#7134151 - 12/01/12 Re: 338 Win Mag and Long range hunting? [Re: m77]  
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Westcoaster Offline
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I'll first off say that I am not an expert but I do shoot my 338wm a fair amount out to 500 yards. The best way I can describe it is that I know where the bullet is going to hit everytime.

My 338wm is a Winchester Model 70 Classic with a #4 weight 26" barrel. I shoot 250 grain bullets. For hunting I use Swift AFrames and I practice with Hornady Interlocks. With 71 grains of H4831sc I'm getting 2600 to 2650 at the muzzle.

I have had good results on game out to 500 yards with this rig. The accuracy is good and the POI does not seem to be affected by wind too much. Bullet penetration has been good at range and too good at less than 300 yards.

The AFrames have held together well in every kind of animal and the more modest velocity does not seem to bloodshot the meat.

I have not hunted Africa but Elk and Moose are what I would call large with a large northern moose going over 1000 pounds for reference. I have taken these and bears out to 400 yards and from the results I have seen I would, under the right conditions, take a 500 yards shot. Having said that the majority of my shots are under 200 yards.

#7153390 - 12/07/12 Re: 338 Win Mag and Long range hunting? [Re: m77]  
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Clarkm Offline
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Find the B.S.:

1) The 338WM is a 400 yard rifle.
2) The 338Edge is a 1600 yard rifle.
3) The velocity of the 338Edge at 200 yards is down to 338WM muzzle velocity, therefore the 338WM is a 1400 yard rifle.


There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self. -Ernest Hemingway
The man who makes no mistakes does not usually make anything.-- Edward John Phelps
#7153718 - 12/07/12 Re: 338 Win Mag and Long range hunting? [Re: Clarkm]  
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Late on the last day of a Wyo deer hunt 20+ yrs ago I didn't hold enuf into the wind with the M70 338 mag, I was shooting 200 gr Speers at max velocity. Hit that buck in the liver on the near side and out the guts on the farside. It made him very sick by the time I got to him he had bled out and died.Some folks don't or won't talk about the shots that didn't hit where they were supposed too, I will. The point?Over here when you wound and lose an animal you only have to live with your own conciousness, in Africa I've allways heard you do that and pay for it as well.Maybe your in a different situation like you allready own the game or your culling and it don't financially make a difference one way or another to you. I don't know and you didn't say. Good luck with deciding between it's too far or it's a chip shot and living with the results when they aren't ideal at all. Magnum Man

#7154650 - 12/07/12 Re: 338 Win Mag and Long range hunting? [Re: m77]  
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rost495 Offline
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rost495  Offline
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La Grange, TX
Originally Posted by m77
Originally Posted by rost495
I know its not Kudu but its all I have and my longest 2 shots to date...

Mature Alaska caribou bull. 802 yards. 2 shots. 2 hits. Both very vital.

338 win mag and 225 Barnes X reloads. Very dead bull.

Inspection showed caliber entry wounds on both, and on both showed exits about dime size or so, IE the bullets did expand even though most say they could not have. Of course no recovery of bullets either.

I"ve shot a lot of deer with same load to around 450 or so.


What velocity are you getting with those 225 Barnes? I like the 225s as well. Thanks for the info

Pieter


Sorry but no clue anymore. I have drop and wind data but I forget the MV pretty quick once I"m set up.

24 inch tube, 73 or 75 of RL19 best I can recall.


We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot....

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