24hourcampfire.com
24hourcampfire.com
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Hop To
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3
#7190423 12/16/12
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 7,908
K
Campfire Outfitter
OP Offline
Campfire Outfitter
K
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 7,908
Had a energy audit and found ice in attic where I did not have soffit vents. Spent a miserable day putting in soffit vents and
insulation baffles in the attic. In one day most of the ice was gone.

Have soffit vents and gable vents with ridge vent. Have
heard where having both soffit and gable vents creates short ciruiting. So closed off gable vents. What are others doing
in AK to prevent roof issues?


kk alaska

Alaska 7 months of winter then 5 months of tourists
BP-B2

Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 568
U
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
U
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 568
The house I am in did not have any venting last year and there were moisture problems. Gable vents were put in this summer and so far things are good. The reason given out here for no venting was the constant winds. I do believe a house has to breath somehow or problems will devolop.

The house I have back in northen Michigan has both soffit, gable, and ridge venting and I had no moisture problems

Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,390
B
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
B
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,390
Another source of ice in the attic is caused by attic bypasses. This is where hot air is allowed to escape the conditioned air envelope of your heated space. The large amount of air cannot be dipersed by the attic venting. Examples of attic bypasses include gaps in the vapor barrier around electricle boxes for ceiling fixtures, gaps around plumbing vents and soffits over cabinets or showers. I had a huge bypass over the soffit in a bathroom shower. The dumbazzes that sheetrocked did not put any rock over the top of the soffit. Then the dumbazzes that insulated merely stretched vapor barrier over the top of the soffit and blew in insulation. Staples and plastic did not support the weight of the insulation. I had an impressive pillar of ice that stretched from bathroom ceiling to the roof. Also, make sure your exhaust fans are vented through the roof and the piping is air tight.

Last edited by bobmn; 12/16/12. Reason: spelling
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 13,860
T
Campfire Outfitter
Offline
Campfire Outfitter
T
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 13,860
Originally Posted by bobmn
Another source of ice in the attic is caused by attic bypasses. This is where hot air is allowed to escape the conditioned air envelope of your heated space. The large amount of air cannot be dipersed by the attic venting. Examples of attic bypasses include gaps in the vapor barrier around electricle boxes for ceiling fixtures, gaps around plumbing vents and soffits over cabinets or showers. I had a huge bypass over the soffit in a bathroom shower. The dumbazzes that sheetrocked did not put any rock over the top of the soffit. Then the dumbazzes that insulated merely stretched vapor barrier over the top of the soffit and blew in insulation. Staples and plastic did not support the weight of the insulation. I had an impressive pillar of ice that stretched from bathroom ceiling to the roof. Also, make sure your exhaust fans are vented through the roof and the piping is air tight.


Yes, this is the most current building science, in my opinion. I'd reccommend stapling 6mil plastic sheeting to all ceilings of new construction, then nailing 1x4's over the sheeting to have something to screw the drywall to. Nail the ceiling boxes to horizontal 2x4 blocking and seal the hole for the wire with expanding foam. This helps minimize the "stack effect" in a home.

Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 2,114
C
Campfire Regular
Online Content
Campfire Regular
C
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 2,114
Down here in Colorado we have this dehumidifier called the sun ...

smile

Last edited by colorado; 12/17/12.

Regards,

Chuck

"There's a saying in prize fighting, everyone's got a plan until they get hit"

Ghost And The Darkness

IC B2

Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 2,679
C
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
C
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 2,679
Another cause of improper ventilation is covering the soffit vents with insullation. Many believe the more the better but you need the attic to "breath". Between the siffit, ridge and gable vent you should have more then enough ventilation in the attic.

Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 29,662
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 29,662
A local motel here was built with the swimming pool space vented solely into the attic space. Can we say collapsed roof and ceiling the first winter.

Last edited by 1minute; 12/17/12.

1Minute
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 918
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 918
A lot of sub-par building goes on here in Alaska. I know, you are all surprised....

Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 13,860
T
Campfire Outfitter
Offline
Campfire Outfitter
T
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 13,860
Probably the best way to build for a cold climate is to eliminate the attic entirely and have a vented cold roof. IE, this can be done with 4-6in of polyiso or DOW board on top of a T&G board ceiling. Then nail sleepers with pole barn nails to the ceiling beams/purlins. This space only is vented from the soffit to the attic. Classic Post & Beam in NY used this method and it had held up well

A slightly more expensive, but less labor intensive method to achieve this would be to simply use stress-skin panels and install the sleepers on top of them and deck and shingle/roof.

Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 918
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 918
Hot roofs and heat trace are all the rage here.... crazy

Last edited by UncleJake; 12/18/12. Reason: "and heat trace"
IC B3

Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 8,049
Campfire Outfitter
Offline
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 8,049

You want your attic space cold and well ventilated in the winter. Ice shield and heat trace on the eaves is a good idea to prevent ice damming. Frost is caused by the heat going thru the upper ceiling and going thru the dew point in the attic space. Good insulation and ventilation keep the top of the ceiling surface at, or below, freezing.

Another issue that I'm having a hard time with (and seems to be the rage with energy auditors) is a sealed crawl space under the house. No foundation vents and then a air "conditioning" system. And I don't mean cooling, but a humidity control and/or air exchanger. Anyone run one of these and have an opinion?


Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 13,860
T
Campfire Outfitter
Offline
Campfire Outfitter
T
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 13,860
Originally Posted by UncleJake
A lot of sub-par building goes on here in Alaska. I know, you are all surprised....


When I lived in AK as a young man I barely knew how to build a doghouse, after moving the the 48 and learning to build quality homes, and seeing pictures of stuff that gets built up there, I whole-heartedly agree.

An engineer buddy of mine told me about a house some knucklehead built north of Fairbanks. It was slab-on-grade, like they do in Florida. Everyone told him he was an idiot but he scoffed. The house literally broke in half. The students from U of A would come out to see the carnage.

Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 20,554
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 20,554
Our house was built back in 1978 and they put in a big vent pipe with the rotating cap to vent the attic. 2 years ago we had our roof reshingled and we had them install proper roof ridge vents and got rid of that stupid pipe. Now the attic seems to breathes better.

I do have one question though, I just remodeled our master bath a few months ago and put in a nice quiet Panasonic vent which vents out of the side of the house, above the attic. The vent cover keeps freezing open whenever we use it and I have to close it manually. Is there something we can do to keep this from happening?


That's ok, I'll ass shoot a dink.

Steelhead

Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,319
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,319
Have soffit vents and (****gable vents****) with ridge vent. **** cant have both- the gable has to go ...a bit late with that info i am.


I work harder than a ugly stripper....
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,319
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,319
They built crap everywhere...but alaska and canada are lite years ahead in proper building know now...the trouble is some folks don't have to follow them - and don't.....


I work harder than a ugly stripper....
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 50,592
Campfire Kahuna
Offline
Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 50,592
Originally Posted by AkMtnHntr
Our house was built back in 1978 and they put in a big vent pipe with the rotating cap to vent the attic. 2 years ago we had our roof reshingled and we had them install proper roof ridge vents and got rid of that stupid pipe. Now the attic seems to breathes better.

I do have one question though, I just remodeled our master bath a few months ago and put in a nice quiet Panasonic vent which vents out of the side of the house, above the attic. The vent cover keeps freezing open whenever we use it and I have to close it manually. Is there something we can do to keep this from happening?


There are a lot of options for dampers on vents... I prefer the floating balls.

Insulating the pipe right to the vent will keep the vented air warmer and slow down the frosting at the vent.

If you have a louver style a counterweight (small machine screw should be close to right) can be run through a slat and adjusted to weigh just enough to close the damper when the fan goes off.


Mark Begich, Joaquin Jackson, and Heller resistance... Three huge reasons to worry about the NRA.
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 441
P
Campfire Member
Offline
Campfire Member
P
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 441
Originally Posted by MuskegMan

Another issue that I'm having a hard time with (and seems to be the rage with energy auditors) is a sealed crawl space under the house. No foundation vents and then a air "conditioning" system. And I don't mean cooling, but a humidity control and/or air exchanger. Anyone run one of these and have an opinion?



We haven't done it yet but are thinking about it. We currently have a crawlspace w/ batt insulation in the rim and poly over the dirt floor. We're considering spray foam in the rim and "industrial" batts on the walls with the poly tucked under the bottom (and probably taped at the seams/overlaps.) Basically you're continuing your conditioned space down about 4'. We do have a couple of finned sections of hotwater baseboard in the crawlspace already. We haven't had moisture issues here in Chugiak with the current set-up but we might need some sort of a vent/exchanger if we change.


Support your local brewer.
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 20,554
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 20,554
Originally Posted by Sitka deer
Originally Posted by AkMtnHntr
Our house was built back in 1978 and they put in a big vent pipe with the rotating cap to vent the attic. 2 years ago we had our roof reshingled and we had them install proper roof ridge vents and got rid of that stupid pipe. Now the attic seems to breathes better.

I do have one question though, I just remodeled our master bath a few months ago and put in a nice quiet Panasonic vent which vents out of the side of the house, above the attic. The vent cover keeps freezing open whenever we use it and I have to close it manually. Is there something we can do to keep this from happening?


There are a lot of options for dampers on vents... I prefer the floating balls.

Insulating the pipe right to the vent will keep the vented air warmer and slow down the frosting at the vent.

If you have a louver style a counterweight (small machine screw should be close to right) can be run through a slat and adjusted to weigh just enough to close the damper when the fan goes off.


We have one that has a single louver in it, but never heard of the vents with the floating balls (there's a joke in there somewhere) but that sounds like the ticket.

Going to make changes this coming spring which I think will illeviate this problem too.


That's ok, I'll ass shoot a dink.

Steelhead

Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 807
D
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
D
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 807
There is a book about building practices in the arctic - I believe it is called "Northern Exposure". Spenard builders used to have them up by the registers. Great insight into venting, vapor barriers, cold vs hot roof designs, etc.

Not sure who I loaned my copy out to last, but haven't seen it for a few years.

It was well worth the $40 or so it cost!!!

Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 7,908
K
Campfire Outfitter
OP Offline
Campfire Outfitter
K
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 7,908
Found biggest air leak in garage where forced air furnace exhaust vents outside. Tough to seal as it goes out at an angle and not create a fire hazard. Local fireplace store had a fireproof insulation.

Using a fabric cover over 4" foam block to seal heat loss through skylight no light in winter any way. Stupid skylights those that leak and those that have not leaked yet are the 2 common types here in AK! Have a drop roof between 2 roof lines
with a skylight. Heat loss in winter melts snow that drips on
deck, house entrance, a real pain in the winter. Insulating skylight keeps snow on roof and ice off stairs.

Lots of heat loss on outside wall plugs and switches which are easy to deal with and find in cold temps. Now trying to tighten heat loss on any ceiling penetrations, light fixtures.

Last edited by kk alaska; 12/18/12.

kk alaska

Alaska 7 months of winter then 5 months of tourists
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3

Moderated by  RickBin 

Link Copied to Clipboard
YB23

Who's Online Now
648 members (1234, 257 roberts, 1lessdog, 2500HD, 257Bob, 75 invisible), 2,756 guests, and 1,315 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Statistics
Forums81
Topics1,187,650
Posts18,399,153
Members73,817
Most Online11,491
Jul 7th, 2023


 







Fish & Game Departments | Solunar Tables | Mission Statement | Privacy Policy | Contact Us | DMCA
Hunting | Fishing | Camping | Backpacking | Reloading | Campfire Forums | Gear Shop
Copyright © 2000-2024 24hourcampfire.com, Inc. All Rights Reserved.
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5
(Release build 20201027)
Responsive Width:

PHP: 7.3.33 Page Time: 0.075s Queries: 15 (0.002s) Memory: 0.9002 MB (Peak: 1.0562 MB) Data Comp: Zlib Server Time: 2024-03-28 18:23:16 UTC
Valid HTML 5 and Valid CSS