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#7294610 - 01/10/13 w Is it possble to shoot a 4" group at 500 meters with open sights?  
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300Savage Offline
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I was having dinner last night with my son's father inlaw when the toppic of guns and shooting came up. Apparantly in the mid 1960's he was a "sharp shooter" in the South African Army and qualified by shooting a 4" group at 500 meters using an FN rifle in 7.62 Nato with open peep sights. Sounded like a feat of remarkable marksmanship. I could see a scope sighted rifle off bags on the bench doing that kind of grouping, but open sights and prone position left me wondering on the feasibility? I did not challenge his claim, only told him that was some incredible shooting. Any thoughts from competive shooters?

Last edited by 300Savage; 01/10/13.
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#7294814 - 01/10/13 Re: w Is it possble to shoot a 4" group at 500 meters with open sights? [Re: 300Savage]  
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avagadro Offline
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not by me ... but I've seen some folks that rock it on a whole 'nother planet than I.


George
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Order of Sleepless Knights

Originally Posted by GOD
... That is when I carried you ...
#7294877 - 01/10/13 Re: w Is it possble to shoot a 4" group at 500 meters with open sights? [Re: avagadro]  
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rost495 Offline
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At 600 yards we use a 3 inch spotter disc that is put in your last bullet hole, while the previous is taped shut. Target comes up and you can see your very last shot location....

ANyway I've almost never shot anything but the AR15 with iron sights in service rifle, in a jacket prone with a sling all the way to 1000 yards.

I have a spotter disc somewhere from Camp PErry from a 20 shot 600 yard match no sighters, that my pit crew gave me when we swapped relays... had 17 .224 cal holes in the 3 inch disc....

And I've shot a lot of groups that were 5 shot groups off a bench with irons testing different components at 600 yards. Almsot all have been 3-5 inch groups with the right ammo.


We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot....
#7294951 - 01/10/13 Re: w Is it possble to shoot a 4" group at 500 meters with open sights? [Re: rost495]  
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gzig5 Offline
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Absolutely doable and that level of accuracy is exhibited regularly at XTC and LR matches. I'm classified as Master and have shot 100-9x with an AR service rifle on the 600 yd slow fire XTC target which I believe has a 1 MOA X-ring (6"). I've also managed 10 x's at 1000yds in Palma competition which is a .308 with aperture sights. Probably rare to achieve with a service grade rifle, but not beyond possibility.

#7294988 - 01/10/13 Re: w Is it possble to shoot a 4" group at 500 meters with open sights? [Re: gzig5]  
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rost495 Offline
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Would be rare with a service grade rifle and service grade ammo, but not at all rare with a service rifle and match ammo.

HM with Service rifle both XC and LR.

Last edited by rost495; 01/10/13.

We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot....
#7295180 - 01/10/13 Re: w Is it possble to shoot a 4" group at 500 meters with open sights? [Re: rost495]  
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avagadro Offline
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Originally Posted by rost495
... but not at all rare with a service rifle and math ammo. ...


That adds up wink



George
Associate Gypsy
Order of Sleepless Knights

Originally Posted by GOD
... That is when I carried you ...
#7295352 - 01/10/13 Re: w Is it possble to shoot a 4" group at 500 meters with open sights? [Re: avagadro]  
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rost495 Offline
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Editing... good catch


We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot....
#7295381 - 01/10/13 Re: w Is it possble to shoot a 4" group at 500 meters with open sights? [Re: rost495]  
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avagadro Offline
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Thanks ... wanna give me some shooing lessons smile


George
Associate Gypsy
Order of Sleepless Knights

Originally Posted by GOD
... That is when I carried you ...
#7295682 - 01/10/13 Re: w Is it possble to shoot a 4" group at 500 meters with open sights? [Re: avagadro]  
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rost495 Offline
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La Grange, TX
Took too many years to learn how myself... went from can't hit the paper, to hope to hit the black to piss me off if I shoot a 9.... and a 10 is a warning oops...

All I can say about shooting lessons, don't EVER discount hours of dry fire time. Flat amazing how much better I ended up shooting taking that to heart plus seeing what I could see as the hammer fell, vs that being covered up by recoil...


We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot....
#7296009 - 01/10/13 Re: w Is it possble to shoot a 4" group at 500 meters with open sights? [Re: rost495]  
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AJ300MAG Offline
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Originally Posted by rost495
At 600 yards we use a 3 inch spotter disc that is put in your last bullet hole, while the previous is taped shut. Target comes up and you can see your very last shot location....

ANyway I've almost never shot anything but the AR15 with iron sights in service rifle, in a jacket prone with a sling all the way to 1000 yards.

I have a spotter disc somewhere from Camp PErry from a 20 shot 600 yard match no sighters, that my pit crew gave me when we swapped relays... had 17 .224 cal holes in the 3 inch disc....

And I've shot a lot of groups that were 5 shot groups off a bench with irons testing different components at 600 yards. Almsot all have been 3-5 inch groups with the right ammo.


Seventeen shots and you didn't hit the spindle... Dood? grin

That's some awesome shooting Jeff!!!

#7297387 - 01/11/13 Re: w Is it possble to shoot a 4" group at 500 meters with open sights? [Re: AJ300MAG]  
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rost495 Offline
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yep, just never got that lucky.. grins


We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot....
#7297427 - 01/11/13 Re: w Is it possble to shoot a 4" group at 500 meters with open sights? [Re: rost495]  
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AJ300MAG Offline
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We use 1 1/4" spotters for 600 yard F-Class. I have an uncanny knack of hitting the spindle... when the spotter is in the "9" ring.

Well I guess there IS something out there shocked eek grin

#7297475 - 01/11/13 Re: w Is it possble to shoot a 4" group at 500 meters with open sights? [Re: AJ300MAG]  
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rost495 Offline
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I probably hit most spindles in the 7 ring on "verification" shots.

Yes the wind did change that much you idiot... grins


We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot....
#7298397 - 01/11/13 Re: w Is it possble to shoot a 4" group at 500 meters with open sights? [Re: AJ300MAG]  
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gzig5 Offline
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Originally Posted by AJ300MAG
We use 1 1/4" spotters for 600 yard F-Class. I have an uncanny knack of hitting the spindle... when the spotter is in the "9" ring.



Hey, at least you are being consistent.

#7298563 - 01/11/13 Re: w Is it possble to shoot a 4" group at 500 meters with open sights? [Re: 300Savage]  
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BarryC Offline
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Originally Posted by 300Savage
qualified by shooting a 4" group at 500 meters using an FN rifle in 7.62 Nato with open peep sights. Sounded like a feat of remarkable marksmanship. I could see a scope sighted rifle off bags on the bench doing that kind of grouping, but open sights and prone position left me wondering on the feasibility?

Was the rifle a FAL (L1A1)? Lots of different FN rifles. The differences are important.

Is the group possible with a FAL? Yeah, one lucky group. Likely? Probably less likely than getting hit by lightening.

The FAL is a nice battle rifle, but it sure isn't an AR nor is it an M14.


Islam is a terrorist organization.

#7303587 - 01/12/13 Re: w Is it possble to shoot a 4" group at 500 meters with open sights? [Re: BarryC]  
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sharps4590 Offline
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I'm going to say yes, it's possible and probably consistently doable.


NRA Benefactor 2008

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There is no right way to do a wrong thing
#7315696 - 01/15/13 Re: w Is it possble to shoot a 4" group at 500 meters with open sights? [Re: sharps4590]  
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rgrx1276 Offline
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Israel, Florida
I've shot several 16X cleans at 600 yards with Iron sights on a match rifle, several 14 and 15x cleans at 600 yards with a service rifle.
I think your sons FIL is probably not bullish*tting.


[Linked Image]


#7315797 - 01/15/13 Re: w Is it possble to shoot a 4" group at 500 meters with open sights? [Re: rgrx1276]  
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rost495 Offline
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rost495  Offline
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Now you've gotten a reply from one of the top shooters in the nation....


We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot....
#7315875 - 01/15/13 Re: w Is it possble to shoot a 4" group at 500 meters with open sights? [Re: rost495]  
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rgrx1276 Offline
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I can say the same about you my friend. I hope you and yours are doing well.


[Linked Image]


#7316348 - 01/15/13 Re: w Is it possble to shoot a 4" group at 500 meters with open sights? [Re: rgrx1276]  
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rost495 Offline
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Don't think my skills ever came close to yours, but thanks for the comments.

Same back at ya and Happy New Year.


We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot....
#7321549 - 01/16/13 Re: w Is it possble to shoot a 4" group at 500 meters with open sights? [Re: rost495]  
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ChrisF Offline
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Too many missing bits of information. Rack FAL? Ball Ammo? How many shot group. Even though, I'll call b.s. The FAL is not known for it's accuracy. If some soldier here told me he qualified to be a sniper or DM by doing something like that with a rack M14 or rack M16...I'd call BS as well not only on the feat but the selection procedure as well.

It's possible for folks of the caliber that Rost and RGRX are, but they are highly trained and exceptional riflemen compared to folks like myself or even the great Lee24.

Last edited by ChrisF; 01/16/13.
#7322205 - 01/16/13 Re: w Is it possble to shoot a 4" group at 500 meters with open sights? [Re: ChrisF]  
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rgrx1276 Offline
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Lee 24.....HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!! Good one for sure Chris .


[Linked Image]


#7325273 - 01/17/13 Re: w Is it possble to shoot a 4" group at 500 meters with open sights? [Re: rgrx1276]  
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rost495 Offline
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rost495  Offline
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NOoooooo had to go there eh? Well I guess Mahalo anyway.... grins.



We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot....
#7327303 - 01/17/13 Re: w Is it possble to shoot a 4" group at 500 meters with open sights? [Re: rost495]  
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ChrisF Offline
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Hujambo Jeff?

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