Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Handguns Do you carry with a round in the chamber?

Yes. Whatever firearm I am carrying when I leave my home has a round in the chamber.

Why is it that some advocates of Condition 1 carry can�t realize that others can come to a well-reasoned and perfectly logical conclusion that Condition 1 is not right for them? It seems the argument always comes down to those other people must be �scared� of their gun.

Let me point out that even with multiple safeties, every unintentional discharge in the history of firearms have one thing in common � a loaded chamber. By contrast, an unintentional discharge is physically impossible when the chamber is empty.

For me the decision to carry in Condition 3 is not a result of being �scared� of my firearms but I do have a healthy respect for the damage they can do, just as I do tornados, drunken drivers, lightning and other dangers. As I do with those other dangers, mitigating the potential of an unwanted result is a reasonable endeavor � and the very reason you most likely don�t carry in Condition 0.

The �most important� safety you mention is also the one most likely to fail, as it relies on the human brain, and multiple firearm safeties have not eliminated the problem of unintentional discharges in Condition 0, 1 and 2. The possibility of an unintentional discharge is not just lower with Condition 3, it is zero.

The down side of Condition 3 is that it takes a second or so longer to make ready and generally requires two free hands. One upside for me is that regardless of which of my semi-autos I am carrying, the manual of arms is the same � no need to think about whether the safety goes up or down to fire, where a moment�s confusion or fumbling with a small safety could easily cost more time than racking the slide as the weapon is brought to bear.

If I was regularly engaging in activities where the probability of actually needing to draw my carry weapon was higher, I would probably go to Condition 2 or maybe even Condition 1 for my standard method of carry. The fact of the matter, though, is I try hard to stay alert to potential dangers and to avoid environments or situations where my weapon might be needed. The probability I will need my weapon is very low as a result but the possibility of an unintentional discharge is infinitely higher in Conditions 1 and 2.

We all make trade-offs in our carry decisions � whether it is the cartridge of choice, the type of holster, semi or revolver, DA or SA, and so on. Some of us practice with our carry weapons a lot, some very little. I�m somewhere in-between but I�ll probably never shoot my handguns as much as I do my rifles - partly because I expect to go to my grave never having needed to draw my carry weapon. My 9mm (DA/SA, safety up) stays in my car all the time, my .380 (DA/SA, safety up) tends to be in a pocket and when I carry my .45 (SA, safety down) it is usually in the small of my back in an IWB holster. Nothing prevents me from going from Condition 3 to Condition 0, 1 or 2 should the situation dictate but in normal situations I�m quite comfortable with my weapons in Condition 3.

CH...I understand where you are coming from but just totally disagree... One thing you said above was that if you were going somewhere that you considered "dangerous" you would switch from Condition III to I. Do you knoiw what would happen if the S*** actually did hit the fan...you would grab the slide and try and jack a round into the chamber...why...because that is how you train. And if you were carrying a 1911 you would be going nowhere slowly...

My suggestion is go and look at LiveLeak or YouTube videos of robberies and assaults. Unless you have a crystal ball you have no clue when this is going to happen. Walking along a nice woods path and be attacked but a pack of dogs... You want to take the chance of flubbing a "rack". Try turning, running and racking one handed some time...it is hard enough two. Sit in a car, draw and rack while dringing... Just last week RGS posted that video of the car jacking...you want to rack while that is going down...

Kevin...go look at the history of where the gun training came from in Israel you'll find it was developed by an US Army sargent. And why does the Army and Israel public all carry Condition III...because they are UNTRAINED masses.

And then you come to all the unintentional shootings by LEOs especially those using Glocks and other "safe-action" type handguns...and why? Because Gaston Glock designed the Glock to be a military weapn to be carreied in Condition III. Tokarovs are SA firearms that have no manual safety unless imported into the USA...again another gun that was made to be carried Condition III.

I have taught CC and tactical shooting for over 20 years. When students do scenario shooting they ener the scenario just as they carry...don't want to tell you how many I have seen get killed due to flubbing the rack.

When the SHTF it isn't like being on the range....Bob

YeeUP. RIO7

I agree RJM, if he ever has a close encounter where he has to fend off an attacker with one hand, and draw with the other, Condition 3 will have you screwing the pooch. You WILL NOT have an AD in Condition 1 unless you stick your finger in the trigger guard and pull the trigger. I have yet to see a gun fire by itself. Keep your booger hook off the bang switch, till your sights are on the target. As a matter of fact, the AD (accidental discharge) should really be changed to UD (unintentional discharge), because that's what takes place 99.9% of the time!

So you carry in Condition 0 and just keep your finger off the trigger?

Exactly and perfectly stated

Why wouldn't you?

No I carry in Condition 1, cocked and locked, and ready to rock!

I carry six of them.

I honestly believe you could answer, no I carry a revolver so I don't need to and the media would think that's a good answer.

I carry three different pistols depending on dress and such--a Glock 19, a Dan Wesson CCO and a S&W M&P 340. All have a round in the chamber when I'm carrying. The CCO I carry with a round chambered and safety off. I figure the grip safety and me keeping my finger off the trigger is safe enough, but that's just what I'm comfortable with.

I only have one semi-auto, a rimfire, and no, I will not carry it with a round chambered. On 3 occasions I've pulled it from the holster to find the safety already disengaged. I'm real lucky I didn't take a bullet down the outside of my leg.

I would have no issues with a Glock, 1911 cocked 'n' locked, etc. But my little Ruger Mk III ... no.

My carry guns, for now, are all revolvers, current production S&W or Ruger, and I carry all 5 or 6 chambers loaded.

Tom

It's actually quite easy to chamber a round with one hand.

All risk is retaliative, so focusing on only one dynamic may not be the most holistic approach to the issue.

I said modern pistol training doctrine. I really don't give a schitt how the jews do it. Since you brought it up, the so-called "Israeli Method" was actually the result of an American ex-marine contract trainer whose only handgun training/fighting doctrine was the same dumbed down crap the Army and Marine Corps taught for years. Their "method" was actually an attempt to refine and add a level of discipline to what they were taught. The Israelis don't use that dumbassed method any more since learning the modern technique and having the means to arm their people with handgun lots of one make and model rather than a mish-mash of whatever they could scare up.

I can point you to a Soldier of Fortune article that came out about ten years ago on the history of it and dispelled the myths of its supposed superiority.

The title is: The Israeli Method: Or How To Get Yourself Shot Up In Style.

At best it worked until something better came along.

Yes. Don't suppose I've ever gone grouse hunting with an empty chamber either for the same reason: stuff flies up in my face out of the blue, I'd best be prepared if want to do something about it. So while may never draw my ccw, if I did and "lost" there may well be no sitting around the stove later to laugh about my unpreparedness to shoot.

But fair enough, there lies some risk in this and it requires being mindful. To each his own.

p.s. I do wonder as to the "gained safety" of being in the habit of carrying an "empty" chambered firearm. Seems just one error in judgement/memory there could be every bit as dangerous. And why does one perceive it to be safer? Is the weapon's design or one's carry holster that bad, and if so, why have it?

Not criticizing so much as just not following the logic as applies to ccw.

Evidently you missed where I said that I'm not promoting cold carry, or where I quoted myself to make it clear.

My point about the Jewish method is not that cold carry is great, but to point out that cold carry does not = instant death, safety scissors, or paperweights.

And please don't start droning on about the decades old "modern technique".

It's pretty telling that it took almost 70 responses before anyone asked WHY cold carrying is done, instead of just saying "your way sucks".

For a while several years ago I carried a Kel-Tec .380 with a pocket clip, appendix carry because it hid in what I was wearing. The make, model, caliber, and method of carry were all compromises. But they were inexpensive and at the time I couldn't afford to pay attention, so that's what I used.

When appendix carrying a couple of things played into my decision to carry cold.
1) I was really trying to avoid shooting my pecker off, or sending a hydrashok through my femoral artery. Drawing from this carry method was never smooth because I had a tucked in dress shirt and it was just never really comfortable. I wasn't SURE that I could draw under stress in any clothing and avoid snagging the trigger so I carried cold.

2) I used a two hand draw....Left hand pushed up on the muzzle and exposed the grip and the right hand started reaching in and caught it. Both my hands were already at the gun, with my left hand covering it as it came out and it was readily available for charging the pistol. This also allowed me to draw very discreetly since my left palm could completely cover the whole pistol.

I practiced a lot and felt safer carrying cold than hot. I was just as fast carrying cold because the extra care I took drawing while hot took extra time.

Were there issues with this setup? Of course. So please don't bother telling me how I could've carried better seven years ago. If I thought it was the best I'd still be doing it. And I'm sure I can find a hypothetical doomsday scenario where your method of carry sucks too.

There will be compromises with any thing and any way you carry. You just have to look around and decide what the best solution is to the problems that you have. And make your decisions based on actual evidence (putting rounds down range with a timer) instead of preconceived notions about how things have to be done.

If I'm carrying one of my 1911s while hiking or hunting, I carry with a full magazine nothing in the chamber (condition 3). If anything gets my hackles up, I rack the slide and carry locked and cocked with safety on (condition 1). If I'm carrying in town, or on the road or for any reason the concern walks on two legs I always carry cocked and locked (condition 1), same for the gun by my bed ...