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Damn nice bull Ed.

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Yep, damn nice bull!

While I haven't taken any Cape buffalo with my 9.3x62, on one occasion I was invited (actually encouraged) to bring it, loaded with solids, when accompanying the two PH's guiding a friend on a buffalo hunt. The PH's thought it would be a good idea to have as much backup as possible, and though I was going along primarily to take photos they thought my 9.3x62 might come in handy. I didn't have to use it, but....

On another safari I'd already taken one buffalo with my .416, but by that time my PH had seen my 9.3x62 in action on a couple of the tougher species of plains game and was quite impressed. He suggested I use it on my second buffalo and in fact was quite enthusiastic about the prospect. This wasn't strictly legal but the government game scout gave his permission. Unfortunately we didn't find another buffalo anywhere near as nice as my first one, so the "experiment" was never tried.

I do know, however, from practical experience that the 286-grain Nosler Partition (which is what I would have used on the second buffalo) penetrates far better than the 286 A-Frame on larger game. In fact the 286 A-Frame is one of the few premium bullets I've seen absolutely fail on large game, and once but repeatedly.

I also have a friend in Idaho who's taken two bull elephants handily with the 9.3x62. However, he used brain shots on both bullets, with Barnes solids, not body shots--and quite a few elephants have been taken with brain shots from far smaller cartridges.



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Very interesting, that goes double for the Swift bullet, thinkin' my 320 gr Woodleighs at 2400 should penetrate very well.

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Yeah, I have no doubts the 320 Woodleigh would do fine. As I recall at least part of the reason for that particular Woodleigh is shooting water buffalo in the Northern Territories of Oz, and water buffalo are even bigger than Cape buffalo.

The 286 Nosler Partition is one of the newer models with the partition moved forward. It penetrates VERY deeply, like many of the other heavier Partitions, including the 250 .338 and 400 .416.


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That is interesting about the Swift. Used it on two buffalo in both 375 (300gr) and 416 (400gr) with good penetration. Also on Zebra, wildebeest, eland, kudu, with weight retention in the 90s. On the 9.3, our own Hatari loves his and has taken a lot of African head with it. On the other hand our departed member Greg Rodriguez said he'd never use it on Buffalo again.


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I've never seen any problem with the 400-grain .416 Swift A-Frame, and it's worked perfectly on the buffalo I've seen taken with it. Haven't ever seen the 300 .375 used on anything that I can recall, but have seen the 9.3 fail repeatedly, perhaps because (at least for a time) Swift made it by swaging down .375's.

I also tend to give less weight to weight retention than many people do. It's only once factor in bullet penetration, and in my experience less important than frontal area. In general, the lighter Partitions will penetrate just about the same as the lighter A-Frames, and the heavier ones, with the Partition moved forward, will penetrate deeper.


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I completely agree with the weight retention John, in fact one of the reasons I got away from Swifts is that their mushrooms were just too perfect and nice and round. I much prefer the jagged edges of the TSX including broken petals and the shearing off effect the Partitions have or even better the CEB Non-Cons. On the Partitions, when I first started loading the big stuff, the 375 had been discontinued and the 416 did not exist, the Xs sucked so the A Frame was the logical choice for me and at least in the calibers mentioned, they worked very well.
AS far as Woodleighs, great bullets-just as long as you stay under ~2300 fps. Above that and they just don't hold up.
Then I switched to TSXs and even better TTSXs and that's where I am now. Also, call me weird but I really like cannelures on bullets smile

Last edited by jorgeI; 08/06/13.

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If I were to use either my 9.3x62 or 9.3x74R on buff, I think I'd stoke it with 286gr. North Fork SP.

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Jorge,

I've seen the 9.3 A-Frames do everything except what a premium bullet should.

The first hit the big shoulder joint of a water buffalo bull. It did make it through the joint but not the rib-cage. It was found resting against a rib, mashed flat and retaining about 50% of its weight. The big problem was the rear core had busted through the partition.

Many people aren't aware that the rear core on A-Frames isn't bonded--just the core in the front end. This is why the rear end of A-Frames often expands, swelling right behind the partition, which also isn't solid. Instead it has a small hole that's filled with a little copper plug.

Saw several other examples of the same sort of failure with 9.3 A-Frames from the same rifle, chambered for a wildcat 9.3 about like the 9.3x64. Muzzle velocity was around 2650 fps, as I recall, which probably contributed to the problems. Have seen A-Frames in calibers from .270 to .30 work fine on various animals from faster magnums, but none of the animals were particularly large, and no heavy bone was encountered. The 400-grain .416's I've seen in action were all started at 2400 fps or a little less, which no doubt helps.


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I guess I'm safe then because you'll never see a 9.3 in my hands smile


A good principle to guide me through life: “This is all I have come to expect, standard lackluster performance. Trust nothing, believe no one and realize it will only get worse…”
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FOsteology,

Yeah, the North Fork would definitely be one of the better choices in the 9.3 for heavier game. I've used NF's some and like the combination of solid shank and small bonded lead core in the front end. They expand enough to do some damage, but the mushroom isn't so wide that it limits penetration.


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Originally Posted by jorgeI
I guess I'm safe then because you'll never see a 9.3 in my hands smile


We'll see about that, young Jedi!


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Glad to see you back Doc! I figured that comment would flush you!


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Hopefully Don Heath will find time to wade in here as he has a lot of personal African experience with the 9.3x62.
My experience with it here in Alaska on big bears has shown that there is very little - if any - difference between it and the 375.


Phil Shoemaker
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Phil, I don't think Don visit here much if at all, but yes he does love his!


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Originally Posted by 458Win
Hopefully Don Heath will find time to wade in here as he has a lot of personal African experience with the 9.3x62.
My experience with it here in Alaska on big bears has shown that there is very little � if any � difference between it and the 375.


That is what those of us who use it keep saying. "Ponodoro" Taylor summed it in his "African Rifles and Cartridges" by saying in essence the 9.3 X 62 doesn't generate a lot of discussion or controversy because it does its job well and everybody seems to be in agreement on that.


"The Democrat Party looks like Titanic survivors. Partying and celebrating one moment, and huddled in lifeboats freezing the next". Hatari 2017

"Hokey religions and ancient weapons are no match for a good blaster at your side, kid." Han Solo
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Originally Posted by 458Win
Hopefully Don Heath will find time to wade in here as he has a lot of personal African experience with the 9.3x62.
My experience with it here in Alaska on big bears has shown that there is very little - if any - difference between it and the 375.


Phil,

If you can find Jorge a bear to try it on, I'll get the rifle in his hands! smile


"The Democrat Party looks like Titanic survivors. Partying and celebrating one moment, and huddled in lifeboats freezing the next". Hatari 2017

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Originally Posted by Mule Deer
Jorge,

I've seen the 9.3 A-Frames do everything except what a premium bullet should.

The first hit the big shoulder joint of a water buffalo bull. It did make it through the joint but not the rib-cage. It was found resting against a rib, mashed flat and retaining about 50% of its weight. The big problem was the rear core had busted through the partition.

Many people aren't aware that the rear core on A-Frames isn't bonded--just the core in the front end. This is why the rear end of A-Frames often expands, swelling right behind the partition, which also isn't solid. Instead it has a small hole that's filled with a little copper plug.

Saw several other examples of the same sort of failure with 9.3 A-Frames from the same rifle, chambered for a wildcat 9.3 about like the 9.3x64. Muzzle velocity was around 2650 fps, as I recall, which probably contributed to the problems. Have seen A-Frames in calibers from .270 to .30 work fine on various animals from faster magnums, but none of the animals were particularly large, and no heavy bone was encountered. The 400-grain .416's I've seen in action were all started at 2400 fps or a little less, which no doubt helps.


John,

I watched a big Masailand buffalo get shot with a 9,3X64 Brenneke with 250gr A-frames...16 times! The PH finished it off with a 416 Rem. The hunter was a pompous sort who maintained his rifle with that combination was more than sufficient, as it had killed a bunch of elk, deer, and antelope. smirk


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Originally Posted by jorgeI
I completely agree with the weight retention John, in fact one of the reasons I got away from Swifts is that their mushrooms were just too perfect and nice and round. I much prefer the jagged edges of the TSX including broken petals and the shearing off effect the Partitions have or even better the CEB Non-Cons. On the Partitions, when I first started loading the big stuff, the 375 had been discontinued and the 416 did not exist, the Xs sucked so the A Frame was the logical choice for me and at least in the calibers mentioned, they worked very well.
AS far as Woodleighs, great bullets-just as long as you stay under ~2300 fps. Above that and they just don't hold up.
Then I switched to TSXs and even better TTSXs and that's where I am now. Also, call me weird but I really like cannelures on bullets smile



WHAT, is a ...CEB Non Con...?

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Originally Posted by realitycheck
African hunters: Is the 9.3x62 round with its heaviest bullet of around 300 grains considered sufficient for cleanly taking all the "big 5"?


I've never killed any of the "big five"....but here is something I can attest to....On my one and only safari, I was up close and personal with elephants.....and they are scary animals.....scary because their immense size is truly intimidating.

These is an old saying....."once you've been amongst them, there's no such thing as too much gun" and that is something I discovered in very short order.....

Is the 9.3 X 62 adequate?.....I can't say....but I certainly wouldn't be there hunting stuff that can "stomp me into a raspberry jelly" using a 9.3 if I could have used something with more authority.

IMO the confidence level one has in his firearm is critical to good shooting when the "rubber meets the road".....and while the .375 H&H isn't an enormous amount more.....it would take that as a minimum to get me to anything approaching a comfort level that I'd require as the threshold. In that light the 9.3 isn't adequate.....but for me!.....There's more to consider than merely ft-lb of energy!

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