Home Forums Hunting & Shooting General Big Game IMR 4350 in the 30/06

"Right now I can shoot a 4" group at 250 yards but my crosshairs cover about 3" X 3" at that distance and it is tough to shoot a<BR>real tight group with those thick crosshairs. "<P>JJ,<P>The crosshair thickness or what they cover is not a problem. Dave7mm listed one method. I use another. Since I don't care for the 4 peice pie method I draw a CROSS or PLUS SIGN, whichever you care to call it, slightly wider then what the crosshair covers at a set distance. It could cover 10" at 100 yards and it really wouldn't matter. In that extreme example all you have to do is draw a CROSS 10.5" wide. Alignment is simple. <P>I would suggest that when you make your own target you use an Orange or bright pink magic marker. The problem with black is that you may just have a bullet hole someplace in that black and you may not be able to see it, thinking you missed the target all together. Another reason is on real sunny days orange and bright pink colors are easy to see. <P>Another method of making a target for long range, past 200 yards, take surveyors tape (the orange tape) and make a square slightly larger then the coverage of your crosshairs. When you sight your crosshairs on the square you are looking for an equal amount of white in all 4 quadrants. I use pink tape once I get beyond 300 yards (making a square) and it works just fine. PLUS if your using a spotting scope, you can see the holes even if the holes are in the pink, so to speak <P>Once I practice beyond 400 yards we made a square with the pink tape about 6" square and used that same square target out to 650 yards without any problems at all. <P>Not saying Dave7mm's method is wrong, just adding 2 additional methods that may work for you. <P>You have 3 variations, pick the one that YOU like the best and enjoy your practice. No need to change scopes.<P>I know you like a short barrel BUT a 24" barrel on your 30-06 would be a real plus. It's to bad factorys don't adopt the 24" barrel as a standard for the likes of a 270, 280, 06 and similar. Then again it's to bad they don't adopt a 26" barrel as standard (some do) for the likes of a 7mm mag, 300 win mag, 338 mag, 375 H&H and so on.<P>Don

Thanks for the target suggestions guys. I have a 3.5-10 VariXIII and the 2.5-8 so I can swap them around as I need to. <P>My /06 came from the factory with a 24" barrel. I had it cut and crowned to 22" I lost about 40-60fps with my loads after it was cut. I checked it before and after. That difference it not going to affect my use of the gun at all. <BR>+3" at 100, +2" at 200, 240 yard zero, -5 at 300, -11 at 350. I never have to hold completely over any animal at 350 yards. <P>The 3.5-10X40mm VariXIII may actually be one of the best scope choices made for a 30/06. Although I have not a single complaint with the 2.5-8 X36 either. Those are both dandy scopes for 25/06 through 300 mag class rifles.jj<P>------------------<BR>The happiest of people don't necessarily have the best of everything, they just make the best of everything they have.

In my 2 .06-s I started out using IMR 4350------I got very good hunting groups. One day for the heck of it I tried H 4831-----it outshot IMR 4350<BR>I have a 22 " barrel that likes 59 gr---<BR>a 24 " barrel that likes 57 gr----I use it strictly now----haven't found anything that comes close.<BR> Neat pic JJ------

Congratulations on finally finding the holly grail of .30-06 powders JJ . This is a bold statement, but it simply is the best powder from 150's up to 180's. RL22 shines brightly in 200-220 grain weights. H414 often spikes randomly in the .30-06 right along with other ball powders and I quit using them because of velocity deviations and various pressure cuve readings that I was getting. I tried 4831 as well and got quite a bit of muzzle blast but great accuracy. Went back to IMR4350 and love the 2-5 fps standard velocity deviations. You just can't beat that. CCI 200 primers have always worked well in a load of 165 grain Hornadys or ballistic tips and 58 grains of H4350. This load gave me right at 3,000 fps out of a 27 inch Pac-Nor pipe and 2,880 out of the factory 24 inch piped model 70. Good powder, stick with it. Flinch

I surely agree that IMR 4350 is an excellent powder for the 30-06. I will not try to dispute or discredit anyone else's experience either and ultimately the choice is up to JJ and his rifle. My experience with IMR 4350 vs. W760 in the 30-06 has been distinctly in favor of W760 as far as accuracy goes. I do not hunt with loads that do not shoot at least MOA in a modern hunting rifle and always strive for 3/4 MOA ( if that gives you any idea of my standards). Though that has been my experience I cannot say that other rifles may not tell a different tale. My 7mm-08 has also favored W760 to the exclusion of many other powders, including IMR 4350. Winchester says their ball powders are specifically formulated for less muzzle flash. <BR>I do not have personal experience with H414 but a number of my friends like it very much. The 1995 Hodgdon manual says concerning H414 "In the 30-06 its superb!"Remember they also manufacture H4350, which is slightly slower than IMR.<P>This is not an attempt to debate but rather to share information that provides other options while still acknowledging that IMR 4350 is very good.

58 grains of IMR 4350 topped with the 165 gameking has been my magic potion for years. Am going to try the 165 gr. nozler bt this season for the "new" of it.<P>------------------<BR>Beware the one-gun man.

I tried IMR 4350 with my 22" Remington and<BR>had better velocity & lower pressure with <BR>RL 15 and 165 grain bullets. I am going to <BR>retry the 58 grain load of IMR 4350 to see if I was wrong. My wife shot a Black Bear<BR>2 weeks ago with 52 grains of RL 15 165 Nosler Partition CCI std. primer out of a <BR>Rem 760 75 yard neck shot from a boat with <BR>wave action. Asked her where she was shooting she replied upper neck nuff said!<BR>Was suprised to see that bullet did not exit!<BR>

Sometimes certain brands of primers work better with different powders. I always start with the Federal 210 (as I have had the best all-round experience with it)and then try others if I am trying to fine-tune a load a little more. The flame temps of some primers offer more consistent ignition when coupled with the burn rates of some powders,especially those that are more dense.

Did you ever feel that you had picked the perfect combination for what and how you hunt? You use IMR4350 in your '06, (and most other calibers) you have a VX-III in 3.5-10x40 on top of said '06, and feel like you've got the world by the tail.<P>Then you hear that some upstart wannabe PH has found out your secret for your success, and almost makes it sound like he thought of the combo himself, and is passing the knowledge around to others it came to him from divine inspiration. <P>All hail the mighty JJWHACK, and his new found amenities for turning his '06 into "all that it can be". We humbly bow in your presence...... <P>COPYCAT, COPYCAT, COPYCAT, "Teacher, Jim's been looking at my rifle!! Make him stay in from recess!!" <P>Seriously, I was going to post earlier, but I didn't think that EVERYONE used IMR4350 in their '06s. But I guess they do. Maybe this thread will help someone who may be having trouble with their '06, or will help to improve their results. Like when Jim posted using RL15 and WLR primers (not magnum) and getting better results from his 375HH. I thought that I was getting good results from my 375, but JJs load was actually better in my rifle than anything I had fed it before. <P>So I guess I will allow him to copy me this time, since I copied his 375HH loads. [img]https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubb/images/icons/smile.gif[/img]<P>Love ya, man. Bill

Bill, funny how the things that work best will usually surface. Even when researched and done by people who don't really know each other or ever talk about this with each other. <P>I always thought it was a bit odd the the Soviet space shuttle looks exactly like ours. I guess there is only one way to build it? <P>I am not a reloading tinkerer or a bench rest shooter. You guys know I only have two guns. I'm far from a "gun nut". I am between hunting seasons and had a hard time finding 4831 locally here. I have wanted to try another powder and knew the 4350 was a bit faster. I reasoned with the 22" barrel it would work a bit better. <P>To my surprise it was actually better. You know the saying "even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in a while". Well that certainly applies to me on this one! AS far as the 3.5-10X40 VariXIII I had loaned it to a freind years ago. I was not using it and had the 2,5X8 on my /06 so I actually forgot about it for a while! Not like me to forget where I put a 400.00 scope but I was not in need of it. <P>Last week when using the 2.5-8 I was having a bit of a struggle to see just how good this reloads wer doing. When I came in to change out the scope I could not find it. The guy who I loaned it to was actually with me and heard me say I want to try the other scope. He must have realized I had forgotten I loaned it to him.<P>About a week later he shows up with a brand new 3.5-10X40VariXIII (in Matte)in the shrink wrapped box and hands it to me. I'm confused and then he says he does not want to have to re-zero his 300 weatherby to put the new one So he replaced it for me. <P>Well I slapped that baby on the /06 and sure enough the groups tightend up. The 3.5-10 is only slightly bigger then the 2.5-8 and nothing to worry about in the weight department. It also allowed slightly better spacing of the 4 rings I use on the one piece base. If that scope gets knocked out of allignment I think the glass will have to break. Those four rings on that solid one piece bridge is really a strong mount. <P>My 2.5-8 will be off to Premier Reticles this week for the German 4 reticle change. The German 4 leupold changed it to is not good for me. The thick duplex is fine but the crosswires are way to thick for my taste. They cover .9" at 100 yards compared to .3" at 100 yards for the standard duplex<P>Premier has a thin or normal crosswire and the thick bold duplex section just like the Germans make them. Thanks for you confirmation of my newly configured system Bill!jj<P>------------------<BR>The happiest of people don't necessarily have the best of everything, they just make the best of everything they have.<p>[This message has been edited by JJHACK (edited June 09, 2001).]

<BR> I use IMR 4350 almost exclusively Jim. For my 150grn '06 loads I use H-380, nothing beats H-380 for those lighter bullets.<P> Above 150 grns nothing comes close to 4350, its a great powder for the match bullet loads also. I use 4350 for all .338 loads as well, tho RL-22 is a goodie. I buy the big/big cans of the stuff and Im almost a slave to it.<P> Those critters in Africa with the Rabbit rifle? All 4350&225grn A-frames. Also the ranch owner Bobby and I hunted with for our zebras, W-beast, and Blesbok's ; I gave him a bunch of the 4350 .338 loads AND I gave his young son 3006 165grn A-frame loads with IMR-4350. They had never been able to shoot any loads with that powder, or the A-frame, but they had heard about it often as a great burning powder.<P> To bad we cant sneak cans of the stuff in for our Africa buddy's ; They would love the powder I bet.........10

I shot about a gazillion 30/06 rounds this weekend of every powder recipe and load combination I could think of. I ended up getting the best accuracy and highest velocity with the 4350 powder. I am using more then the book listed max. I was worried about going any higher then I did but the bolt falls open and the primers look perfect.<P> I get just a hair under 2900fps with these 165 grain bullets and 100 yard accuracy is hole touching, fairly consistant.<P>I shot at 200 yards and the groups were still under 3" and at 300 yards about 4-5 inches. At that distance I have about half way between the crosshairs and the bottom duplex holdover. At 400 yards I must slightly hold below the point of the bottom duplex for hits consistant on gallon jug containers. I hit 9 in a row and my barrel needed to cool allowing my friend to finish them off with his rifle. <P>400 yards is a very long shot even on a big animal, or a gallon plastic water filled milk jug! There was about a 10MPH wind(a guess) but it would come intermittantly up the canyon. During that time we could be off by as much a a foot to the left of the jugs. The wind was from the right. <P>This was an interesting weekend to shoot so many different loads, crono all of them, and test them for accuracy potential. I have settled in on a 240 yard zero because I don't want over 3" high at 100 or 200 yards. The gusting wind played a roll in long range accuracy but the potential with a nice calm day shows this 4350 powder and the 165 grain bullets to be a nice combination in the 30/06.<P>I'm sure a heavier bullet or a higher velocity would work better because my 375HH had nearly zero effect from this wind. I did not shoot it much but had a guy who wanted to see QD rings work in person, another disbeliever converted!jj<P>------------------<BR>The happiest of people don't necessarily have the best of everything, they just make the best of everything they have.<p>[This message has been edited by JJHACK (edited June 19, 2001).]

What 165 grain bullets are you using with the IMR 4350 loads. My rifle does not like the 165 Hornaday Boat Tails it prefers the 165 Speer noticible diference in accuracy.<BR>I retried the IMR 4350 with my rifle and several bullets and my rifle prefers RL 15. <BR>Switched primers and will try again.

I use lots of RL15 in my 375HH I must give it a try. What amount of powder are you using, what barrel length and what is your velocity? <P>I'm shooting Midways bulk 165 grain bullets(Remingtons I think) and Hornady flat base bullets. However I only hunt with Swift A frames.jj<P><P>------------------<BR>The happiest of people don't necessarily have the best of everything, they just make the best of everything they have.

I use lots of RL15 in my 375HH I must give it a try. What amount of powder are you using, what barrel length and what is your velocity? <P>I'm shooting Midways bulk 165 grain bullets(Remingtons I think) and Hornady flat base bullets. However I only hunt with Swift A frames.jj<P><P>------------------<BR>The happiest of people don't necessarily have the best of everything, they just make the best of everything they have.

Glad to hear you found your load JJ. There are times in reloading that we come full circle after having tried all the options.