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Do any of you guys run a .35 Brown/Whelen ?

If so could you give me an indication of its performance with 225gr projectiles, I have found a little bit of info but it's old and scarce. From what I see it looks to be a bit hotter than the Whelen AI


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Both are a waste of time and will kill the resale of your rifle. If you want more terminal performance, go to a 9.3x62, it has a real advantage.

Don't trust anything you read on improved cartridges unless the pressure and velocity dated is contemporary.

Ackley and most other wildcatters "put their thumb on the scale" when it came to pressure and velocity.

If you have a 35 W leave it alone. It will kill anything in the lower 48 right now.

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I have a very old custom that is marked .35 Apex. I can find no information on it at all... It appears to be a .35 Whelen A.I. with the shoulder moved fwd about .010". Or about halfway to a Brown/Whelen...

I have not chronographed it. But it seems to shoot well with 250 gr. bullets. Sights are receiver sights. And even with my 60 yr old eyes, I can hold 2.5" or so at the proverbial 100 yds.

I have a lot of old reloading manuals. But the velocities listed for the .35 AI and the Brown version are all so old as to be suspect. Back in the day; even the bullet manufacturers didn't have accurate pressure testing equipment.

After playing with 2; .35 Whelen Imp's; 3- .350 Mags; and at least 4 different .35 Whelens, I've come to the conclusion, that the gains are minimum. If you need more that the standard Whelen offers, it's best to just step up to the .358 Norma. The problem therin lies: Most .35 cal bullets are not meant for the velocities that the Norma produces.

And then that creates another instance: If one also owns a .375 H&H, then there is not much sense in building a .358 Norma... (Or vice/versa,for that matter...)

With the possible exception of the big bears of Ak, the standard .35 Whelen will handily take any game in N. America. (If you can shoot accurately... If you can't; no monster magnum is going to offer you anything at all...)

As we all know, each rifle is a law unto itself... One can expect apx 100 f.p.s. gain in an Improved case. (Give or take a bit) In the field, one would scarce notice the differece.

Or to put it another way, If you carry a std .35 Whelen, and Injun up another 20 yds closer, your impact velocity is likely about the same as a Imp case. IMHO, the modest gains are just not worth it.

That said, however; If it takes the Brown/Whelen to scratch your personal itch, than you'd best go for it... Or you'll never be happy any other way. smile

Go ahead and punch your rifle looney card if you must... grin

Just idle thoughts from a mostly idle mind...

GH


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Originally Posted by astralabs


If you have a 35 W leave it alone. It will kill anything in the lower 48 right now.



Just out of curiosity, what will the 35W not kill "right now" in #'s 49 and 50?


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I have both a 35 Whelen and .35 Whelen AI. Both are fine cartridges but loaded to equal pressures there is very little gain to be had from the AI version. And, depending on the rifle, you may lose magazine capacity due to the increaed shoulder diameter. you may also experience feeding difficulty. The feeding can be sorted out but it can be an issue to be contended with and is often overlooked by those wanting to AI an existing rifle.

I agree to stick with the std Whelen or go 9,3x62. I have all three and for max performance would pick the 9,3x62. I like the two Whelens I have because one is all weather the other open sights only.

Of course, if you HAVE to have an AI, I'd opt for the 40� version as dies are typically less, fireforming much easier, and it is more common which would help resale if that is a consideration.

My 40� Ai was just as accurate when fireforming as it was with fireformed cases. I simply fired my standard 35 Whelen load in teh AI chamber and presto, Fireformed cases and sub MOA groups all at the same time.

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I re-chambered a 35 Whelen to Brown-Whelen for a customer about thirty five years ago. Prior to re-chambering, he was getting about 2535 fps with 250's. After the re-chamber, he was getting 2580 with the same bullets. His main reason for doing it was that he had found some dies cheap. The rifle was a nice rifle as a Whelen and it was still a nice rifle as a Brown-Whelen. Back then, I think I charged him fifty bucks for the re-chamber so a little over a buck a foot in velocity increase. GD

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I used to have a 1917 Enfield in .335 B/W with an 18" barrel on it. I got 2450 out of 250 gr. bullets, and nearly lost my eyebrows from muzzle flash with each shot (I used H380). It was accurate. I loaded some 225s and got about 2600 from it, with slightly less accuracy. I'd stick with the standard whelen if you have a 'normal' length barrel.

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Yes on the Brown-Whelen. Had one made up on a LH Sako about 4 years ago. Used a PacNor in #3 Dakota contour (their description), CM, 12 twist, 24".
Kind of did it on a whim-had the barrel left from a cancelled project and a buddy was getting one done up-so a quick trip to the smith while he had the reamer and gauges rented.
Dies, reamer and gauge rental available from CH4D. Ended up using Norma 35 Whelen brass fireformed. Even though the Norma brass is great, if I was doing it over, I'd buy the 30-06 basic brass (unformed 35W Remington brass I believe) and save the extra work and expense of the first fireform. Correct headstamp brass is available from Quality Cartridge I do believe. None of this is cheap or easy.
The rifle loves Partitions. RL15 with 225s and RL17 with 250s.
Not gonna give loads and velocities, but I think the B-W actually does what people think the AI should do.
I did drop from 5 in the magazine to 4 and had to do a little tweaking on the magazine box to get it to feed ok.
Only you can decide if all the trouble is worth it or not. If you are serious about building one, send me a PM with your address and I'll mail you a couple B-W dummy rounds and you can see what they look like.
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I have acquired a CZ 600 ZKK that I want to re barrel to .35

My reason for wanting to do this is I have around 300 225gr Accubonds and around the same amount of 250 gr Partitions ( left overs from Buffalo culls ) that I can't use in my .358 win as they are to long. As it will be a new barrel I might as well chamber it for the hottest -06 .35 that I can, I don't want a belted cartridge or I would go .358 STA

The Brown version looked a bit interesting, cheers for the input


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The only other thoughts I have for the rifle is to forget the long action .35 and sell the projectiles I have or build another .358 win with a long mag that can deal with them. And I would re chamber to an improved .30 cal such as the Gibbs or ICL Caribou, this might be more realistic and see more use


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Originally Posted by SKane
Originally Posted by astralabs


If you have a 35 W leave it alone. It will kill anything in the lower 48 right now.



Just out of curiosity, what will the 35W not kill "right now" in #'s 49 and 50?


yes,is a 250 at 2550 or a 225 at 2750 somehow lacking in that north state? 9.3x62, euro trash..

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Well I'm not in the US of A, I'm in Australia, the target animals for this rifle would be our 3 wild bovines Bintang, Scrub Bull, and Water Buffalo all 3 are very dangerous and will stomp and gore you and Sambar Deer would also be on the menu they are not as large as your bull Elk but are extremely strong and can take a shot very well and will run even with good placement

The .35 is great for these animals, a long action .358 with 150-200 fps over the .358 win would be good as it would be a custom job why not have a custom chamber ?


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For what your use is and the intended donor rifle, I think the 35 BW would be perfect. I do believe it is the most you can get out of an 06 based 35 cal.
BTW, since you are out of the USA, scratch the offer to mail a couple dummy rounds-probably get me in hot water. If you need any more info, drop me a PM.
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Re: the 9.3x62:
- Far more factory loads available especially if you are over there
- Bigger frontal area and better SD in a 286
- Proven in Africa forever
- Available in many factory rifles, far more than the 35W
- 250 gr TSX @ 2500
- 286 solid Barnes banded solid @ 2350
- Far broader bullet selection than 35s

It's sorta like why the 7x57 is superior to the 7mm08 and the 6.5x55 whups the 260 Remington.

As for Euro trash, yeah sure just like the 375 H&H is Limey trash.

As for what the 35W would not be my first choice in Alaska .... The big bears.
Feel more comfortable with my A Bolt II in 375 H&H pushing a 300gr TSX @ 2700 fps. A good Buff load is a good Bear load.

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astralabs,
If you would actually read Ocean Raiders posts above, I think you would see he will have a hell of a time using those 35 cal ABs and Partitions in a 9.3 or 375.
Now go ahead and tell him that having 600 bullets on hand is not a good reason to select a particular caliber. I know myself and most others have selected calibers for reasons that made a lot less sense than this.
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Originally Posted by astralabs


As for what the 35W would not be my first choice in Alaska .... The big bears.
Feel more comfortable with my A Bolt II in 375 H&H pushing a 300gr TSX @ 2700 fps. A good Buff load is a good Bear load.


I can respect your stance and there's no arguing the 375 is a fantastic and popular choice. I'm aware of a guy that killed a respectable brown bear with a 35 Whelen. IIRC, he said a 225 Northfork pinned the above bear on the spot at 100 yards and he could have saved bullets 2&3.

Had he listened to some of the internet experts (that's not a shot at you) that had never hunted brown bear, he'd have been under-gunned with anything but a howitzer. grin

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A 35 Whelen is the 'biggest' chambering I own and I don't see that changing anytime soon, if ever.


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yes,is a 250 at 2550 or a 225 at 2750 somehow lacking in that north state? 9.3x62, euro trash.. [/quote]

If you are suggesting those velocities are for a .358 win I would like to know your load recipe? Sounds 200 fps faster than what I can achieve for those weights


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Originally Posted by rosco1
9.3x62, euro trash..


Dat be funny right there! grin

Of course I'm putting together a 35W later this year.

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Enjoy your 35 Ws. It will soon revert to wildcat status and all those heavyweight bullets will fade away. The 9.3x62 will keep soldiering on as it has since 1905 before there was even a 30-06 for the good Col. and/or Mr Howe to neck up.

Next time you are hunting anywhere in the world try to buy some 35 Whelen ammo after the airline has lost yours.

I had a beautiful red pad 77 35 Whelen. Nice gun, accurate but not quite a 9.3x62.

So if you want one get one but don't try and blow smoke that it is equal to a 9.3x62.

One gun for anything anywhere ? The 375 Weatherby ..... read the new Rifle magazine.

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