Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Savage Collectors 1941 99EG with Weaver T7 and Weaver 330 - factory? (Pic heavy)

Has anyone with a side mounted scope used it enough to comment on how robust they are? Way back in the Dark Ages I had a whim to install a side mount (not Weaver, rather an Echo) on a pristine 99A. After analyzing the wall thickness of the LH side of the receiver, we decided that it was just too thin to give decent support for the screws. Were we all wet? My then gunsmith suggested we screw and solder on a Griffin&Howe flat side plated QD mount that I had instead. About then I discovered this forum and I changed my mind pretty quickly about the whole thing.

Those old sheet metal T7 mounts always struck me as kind of flimsy. Am I all wet about that too?

Yeah.. we've already discussed that gun in this thread.

Side notes for Keith: Checkering was added in 1938 on the EG, probably close to the beginning of '38. And there were 99's made from 42-46, seems to be low production numbers in 42/43, somewhat more in 44 and then it started going gangbusters again in '45. No work allowed on civilian guns until quota's were met on gov't military contracts, but Savage was very good at meeting gov't contracts.

Bought a 1952 99EG in 250 via Jed with an Echo side mount and Weaver, it was sturdy as heck and shot just fine. I'd say they're as sturdy as any 2 piece scope bases. Hated that Echo side mount though... clunky and ugly. This T7 seems plenty sturdy enough with the screws tightened down, wouldn't expect any problems considering it's a 70+ year old scope.

Hope Wyo1895 pics up this kind of updated info in his book, as it differs from Murray. Seems a lot of this kind of updated info is coming in with the advent of the internet. I've collected military 1911A1s for about 10 years and many details have been identified that differed from Clawson's book (the Murray of 1911s and 1911As).

David should have most of it in the book. Doug Murray did an awesome job back before the internet was even invented, digging information out of catalogs and Roe Clark and various collectors as well as looking at a lot of 99's himself. He defined Savages 99's in quite a few ways including providing model names for the 1899's.

Most of what we do is refined the information he dug up.

The book is mostly written on info from forum members and my own observations. I haven't found much good info from the other printed sources out there. I've updated info as it shows up. At some point we'll have to print what we have. Hopefully there will be a second edition with info that surfaces later.
Just got back from the movie "American Sniper". It was intense and thought-provoking. David

Hi All
Don't know if this is any help
1899F S/n 2797xx
A bit early for the mount
The threads don't appear to have been blued
I could only find a Mossberg M4(b)scope for my T-7 mount I got off fleabay
When I brought the rifle off an old gentleman he stated he had brought it of another person in the early 50's and it was drilled and taped and had the screws as in the photos.
He made his own mount out of a section of ali angle



One thing that I have often wondered do the climbing Lyman sights 21 & 38 fit these hole spacing's
I have one for a Winchester 95 but don't collect those
Cheers Graham

Sorry I forgot to add
This is a 250-3000
Well used and still use it with the T-7 mount usually only takes 1 shot and I cart it around every where in it's box
I assemble it, screw the mount on and go hunting
I have never had to re-sight the rifle as it seems to keep it's centre well
cheers

So as far as this thread goes at least, I'm seeing 3 rifles, at least to the eyeball, identical with the location of the T-7 mount.

I have an unproven theory on the screws, I think they are exactly the same and in almost every application of these mounts they can stay the same, but in some applications one or the other may need to be shortened to clear internal parts, and shortening both to the same length would weaken the mount, hence the markings would only be of use on certain makes & models. I have looked for vintage instructions for these mounts to see if I can find anything to back this.

... but then again it could just be that some engineer figured there will always be some slight variances in any two screws so the same screw should always go in the same hole to eliminate any chance of moving the scope mount.

Steve, I think the three that are close to the same location are all on rifles that were made before the T-7 was in production. The two that were produced in the correct time period do not match in their location.

I find it interesting That there are some mounts around the world with similar screws with F & R on them
where these supplied with the mount?
Do any other rifle makes that mounted the S-7 T-7 have the same screws?
Could these have been Factory holes for another type of mount?
Hence my "Q" on the climbing Lyman sight
Just "Q's"
Cheers Graham

It is common practice for almost any engineer,toolmaler/machinist, or mechanic, for that matter that when disassembling anything to lay the screws out in such a fashion that they be returned to the same location they originated. The only two original screws I have are within .002" of one another in length. I believe Gene's theory to be correct.

It makes total sense to me that screws would be given distinct markings given that the internals of rifles are different at attaching points dictating a need for different lengths. It also makes sense to me that Weaver would do this to all screws as a manufacturing expediency as the screws themselves would have been made for mounts used on all kinds of rifles (lever, bolt, semi-automatic actions, etc...).

I'm sure everyone knows this, but Murray's book has an pre-WWII excerpt from Savage advertising indicating they would drill and tap rifles for no extra charge whenever a scope was ordered with a rifle.

Given that scopes before WWII were not common place items, I would expect inconsistencies in the hole locations, certainly in those that were done by independent gunsmiths but also those did at the factory. I guess the only thing that really counts is if they were done cleanly. Does anybody know if the factory made note of this service in their records - something that should show up in the research done for a factory letter?

Graham,

Yes, the screws were supplied with the mount.

I think the S-7 & T-7 were Savage 99 specific mounts.

I don't have a "Climb'n Lyman at hand but looking at photos it appears that the hole spacing is farther apart on the Lyman.

Were there other side mount sights that used the same hole spacing as the S-7/T-7? Not that I know of. If there are I would expect it to be later production vs. earlier production mounts.

I'll post some other pictures later but here is one. It had a 330 on it when I got it but the cross hair was damaged as I recall so I out a J2.5 on it as it was the only 3/4" scope I had handy.

what makes this gun compelling is that its from the correct time frame, has impeccable overall condition, and even the screws on he mount show their case color beautifully.





Even the bottom of the lever and the bottom and inside show solid case color implying exceptionally little use.

That's the one....

It's a shame that we can't find the original Savage fixture used for D&Ting for the S7/T7 mounts. Steve down in FL had the original for the later top mounts but it has since been passed on to parts unknown. Question is did Savage use a fixture to drill for the side mounts or did they just drill them on the fly as the orders came in like another gunsmith would do?

Yah George, I was wondering the same thing on the T7 jig.

As I recall, 260remguy outbid me on the factory top mount jig many years ago on good old fleabay.