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The gun runs reliably or it doesn't, which probably is defined by the user as acknowledging a certain gun "scarcely ever jams and am confident clearing one if it happens again," vs. "it jams sometimes, yes, and that's not a confidence booster." Make/model not withstanding.
I acknowledge that other designs have been found to be more reliable. My own ccw 1911 commander has been remarkable, but that proves nothing in the big picture, other than am keenly confident in that particular gun for myself.
Other than "reliability", I think the 1911's main "weaknesses" boil down to how if differs from modern top sellers on basic merits.
Fact: It's SA only and what that entails.
Fact: It has two safeties, one usually transparent, and one thumb-operated. Either could be the source of failure in deploying a 1911, and the user has to be completely cognizant of this.
Growing up with non-semi-auto long rifles/shotguns (and no revolvers or semi-auto pistols), the logic and muscle memory for operating a SA-anything and disengaging a safety while deploying a firearm are engraved and automatic. But they are extra steps compared to other designs, and while under duress could be points of failure it's true. And for that reason, think a 1911 is a step backwards for say a new CCW person, who otherwise doesn't shoot much of anything; wouldn't recommend a 1911 but rather a glock or m&p or whatever as may well be less copmlex, more intuitive to that individual. Point it, shoot, learn malfunction drills, the end. In contrast, those guns give me the heebie jeebies because I feel a bit out of control compared to the 1911. It's all habit.
Those differences, I think, far outweigh "reliability" or "kabooms" or whatever. And sure, it's going to be heavier, and compared to a similar sized competitors gun, it will almost certainly have a smaller magazine capacity.
Golldammed motion detector lights. A guy can’t even piss off his porch in peace any more.
"Look, I want to help the helpless. It's the clueless I don't give a [bleep] about." - Dennis Miller on obamacare.
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Campfire Ranger
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You can also jam the web of your hand in between the hammer and the frame to prevent the pistol from firing.
This could work on anything with an exposed hammer.
That looks much more realistic on paper than in real life.
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Might be worth a try if somebody is trying to shoot you.
I like to do my hunting BEFORE I pull the trigger!
There is only one kind of dead, but there are many different kinds of wounded.
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Campfire Outfitter
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1911's and Glock's are both good guns period.
You have to come full circle to appreciate the 1911 over the Glock for some. Most eventually do.
For 1911's, shoot small. If you want to spray big, shoot the damn Glock.
Gun Shows are almost as comical as boat ramps in the Spring.
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I went to a bowling pin match in the early 80's.
I went with a Series 70 Colt Government Model.
I was not very fast but the pins got knocked off the table. There was a young guy with a Glock who unleashed a hailstorm of 9mm and when he was finished all five pins were still standing although some were wiggling slightly.
I guess he used fmj ?
I like to do my hunting BEFORE I pull the trigger!
There is only one kind of dead, but there are many different kinds of wounded.
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Very entertaining thread. As with most, the most amusing aspect, to me, is how these threads quickly devolve into a 1911 vs. Glock argument, as though those were the only available choices.
I personally don't care for Glocks, but that's primarily due to their ergonomics. The 1911s I own are tight and very reliable, but I take care to keep them clean and lubricated, as I do with all my handguns, and I feed them ammo they like in proven magazines.
When I'm calling predators in the South Texas brush country, the gun on my hip is a full-size M&P .40. The gun that sleeps where I sleep is an H&K P2000 .40. The guns I carry concealed most often are Kahrs and SA XD models in 9 mm and .45. A new pistol that might make my rotation is the new XD Mod 2, which gives you 9+1 .45 capacity, in the standard magazine, in a sub-compact. I just finished reviewing one and likely will not send it back.
The point is simply this:
This is not a two-horse race.
If you're fixin' to put a hole in something,
make it a hole to remember.
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The two choices are the 1911 Colt and the S&W 625.
Both in 45 acp.
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Interesting post, but then I thought it would be. I guess I am in the 1911A1 camp, for myself I shoot it the best of many. Have shot Glock's, nothing wrong with them, I just don't like the trigger or grips. Berretta 92 etc HATE that POS. Just does not work at all for me. Had several "issued" to me. Never got along with any of them. Now a 1911A1, I shot expert all of the time. Just got a CZ 2075, my first sub compact. Having some fun with the trigger, not that it is bad, just the long pull in SA. DA is not bad. Coming from Revolvers and SA 1911A1's it is a difference. To me it is what you are comfortable with and can shoot well with. Any pistol needs a break in. I do not think that a Glock is inherently more reliable than a sorted 1911A1
YMMV
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Campfire Greenhorn
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While I've only owned 5 different 1911s and a few 3'', I've made my CCW a 4" commander.
From what I've read and experienced with my 1911s, some require SET UP and sorting out before they will just run and run. That entails getting good mags, the guns favorite ammo (some 'care' more than others) and a few other tweeks. However, my two current S&W series E's have always run 110%. I don't run mine hard but I've never had one stop for maintenance issues unless I was shooting soft lead.
If the gun industry hasn't learned to make a better gun after 100 friggin' years with all the advancements in manufacturing and materials...Glocks had damn well be better out of the box.
Personally I won't own a striker gun. I'm just spoiled by the 1911 trigger.
Last edited by Spike12; 03/20/15.
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....But every 1911 fan has never had a single malfunction, I wish I could be so lucky.
Well.....if you had a gun that never had a malfunction, I'd expect you'd be a fan of that gun too. What are you sayin' though? That all those who say they never had a malfunction are lying? For the record - I never claimed I never had or saw a malfunction in a 1911. But my current 1911 has yet to miss a beat. Previous one has been perfect after a little tuning.
Lunatic fringe....we all know you're out there.
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I work PT at my LGS with a range.I am on range a good bit and see lots of shooters.I see lots of guys putting lots of brass on the floor,then I see lots of the old guys shooting little groups with their 1911's.
These iron clad heavy clunkers are well maintained and sharpy accurate,you can tell by the owners respect of the firearm they know what they have.When packing up,the blue steel is wiped down,mags stored away and floor swept for brass.
The plastic gun guys throw it back in a bag(plastic or paper),grab their $12 muffs,kick their brass in the floor to the side and leave...
Come on America,
Athletes and actors are not heroes, only soldiers, airmen,marines and sailors get that respect�and let's add firemen and LEO's
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I would say the weakness of the 1911 is the fact that it is copied so much that there is no way to control the outcome of manufacturing. Clearly, the design works well.
I personally own several 1911's with my favorite being a s&w 1911sc. I have put a lot of ammo through it and have no memory of a failure. I bought it used and have no idea if it has had any work on it, it appears stock.
I would not buy something that runs on any kind of primer given the possibility of primer shortages and even regulations. In fact, why not buy a flintlock? Really. Rocks aren't going away anytime soon.
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Hitting the target with a Glock safe-action trigger is Glock's biggest shortcoming and Kimber's biggest plus. I don't specifically mention the original Colt, as I no longer have this flavor in my collection. I've carried a Colt 1911 for may miles and many years. The originals needed throated, ejector port relieved, new sights, stippling to get a decent grip, change in main spring housing (if you were an arched or flat fan,take you pick), extended slide release, modified grip frame, if it bit you, etc. A Kimber comes with all the necessary items. Glock's suffer from non-adjustable frames, except extensive plastic surgery, and a huge grip frame. The plastic sights are as durable as metal and don't come standard as night sights. With a little maintenance and lubrication they work well, so do 1911s. One other shortcoming of Glock, they are relatively fragile if used to slap someone up side of the head. An ASP does nicely for this purpose, but neither is recommended.
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Other than the Colt 1911 A1A, most Colts in their product lineup have the improvements you talk about. Just like Glock with model improvements. As far as Kimber,I do not play the game of Craps. Their resale value in comparison to Colt reflects this also.
Gun Shows are almost as comical as boat ramps in the Spring.
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Campfire Regular
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Back to the original post: ... are some of the trouble areas or weakness of the 1911's that I should be paying attention to?
Consensus seems to say that 1911's require more attention to maintenance …..as you can see from the previous 14 pages or so…..there's no such thing as "consensus" in the gun community…..and if you've read this thread, you've heard diametrically opposed views from some very qualified, experienced people, some "me-too" comments from some thinking that they're qualified and experienced, and some dogmatic opinions from idiots. Any bad-rep that 1911's have is somewhere between partially-to-largely due to guys like myself that during the early-mid 70's started participating in the newly developed sport which in 1976 became IPSC. In those days, you would buy a new Series 70 Mark IV and trash everything on the gun except the slide and frame; barrel, bushing, trigger, sights, most of the guts were discarded and the skeletal remains were sent to someone like Swenson or Pachmayr and "built" into a "combat" gun. It was expensive and a whole crop of shade-tree, garage-shop, gun-plumbers were germinated. Some were ok and many were not and ALOT of 1911's were ruined. Like Donna Versace, too much surgery often yields hideous results and a lot of DIY guns became inoperable scrap metal. The 1911 (as made by Colt prior to the Series 70) was a superb gun, but it was easy to ruin---and many were. Colt also went thru some tough times and quality suffered for a large part of the 80's---but today's guns are as good, reliability-wise as anything that they've ever made. Probably the weakest part of a new 1911 pattern gun is the magazine---they can be comparatively delicate. The other issue is lubrication; my gut feeling is that stainless-on-stainless needs greater lubrication than blue-on-blue or steel on aluminum, but I could be wrong. I was thinking if compare to similiar price point 1911's, he's probably right but once you move up to the $1,000 to $1,200 price range you would be getting a more reliable 1911... ….well hopefully, but there are some comparatively high-priced guns that I wouldn't own…..I can't speak to other brands, however if you stick to new Colts in Commander length or longer, you'll have as reliable a handgun as any 1911 ever made. Are they as "reliable" as a striker-fired, gun???? I dunno---everyone's experience is different; however, anyone getting too dogmatic about it (pro or con) is a wanna-be-moron…..and I say that dogmatically!! 
The blindness from subjectivity is indistinguishable from the darkness of ignorance.
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I attended the NRA Law Enforcement Armorer School held at Trinidad Colorado.
For anybody who wants to learn how to tune a duty weapon and do repairs. I recommend it.
I attended back in the early 80's.
I went to a bowling pin match afterwards and after it was over an older gentleman
approached me and wanted to know if my Colt was for sale. I asked him why he would want it.
He said that mine was the only one that didn't jam.
whelennut
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I can only think of one weakness in the design of a 1911 pistol.
If you push the pistol until the end of the barrel contacts something it will unlock the pistol and it will not fire. As will any semi-auto with a proper disconnector. FWIW, this can be overcome by holding your thumb against the back of the slide enough to keep it in battery. It obviously won't cycle for the second shot, but if one shot can help you create distance off a bad guy you can clear the malfunction and keep working. An exposed hammer would complicate this, so that seems like a pretty objective potential weakness of the 1911s exposed hammer......In a scenario that has 1/1,000,000,000 chances of happening. Blue...I hope you are kidding...you apparently have never done it..which thumb you going to use, the one wrapped around the gun in a death grip or do you let go of the guys throat with your other hand... As to the 1/1,000,000,000 chance of it happening...you loose... In about 1983 I was with Dallas PD and also had my own gun shop and commercial reloading business. I took a Colt Series Gold Cup in on trade and a very close friend and fellow officer bought it. There was one "problem". When the slide was retracted just slightly the collet bushing would not let the slide go back into battery. It ran 100% but because of the bushing it would not go back into battery if just pressed open. I sold the gun to my friend with the instructions "Before you qualify and carry this GET THE BUSHING CHANGED"!!!!! Well a few weeks go by and he comes over with a "story"... Seems he arrived first at the scene of a violent domestic where it was not prudent to wait for cover. The husband had a gun and fortunately my friend was a life time martial arts practitioner. My friend pins the guy up against the wall and was holding the guys right arm with the gun against the wall with his left hand. He then pulled the 1911, stuck it into the guys gut and pulled the trigger...nothing happened... Realizing that he had tripped the disconnect, he pulled the gun back and pulled the trigger again...nothing... My friend then stuck the gun in his belt just as the guys wife, who the guy was trying to kill, jumped on my friends back. He grabbed the wife by the collar and put her head through the sheetrock wall. He then palm slammed the guy in the face several times until he dropped the gun...about the time cover came through the door... Or...picture yourself nose to nose with a guy you have pinned up against a wall. You have his gun hand pinned up against the wall and your gun is under his chin...which thumb you going to use to push the slide into battery... This was me two days before I left DPD...and fortunately the gun I had under his chin was a 3" Model 24. Been there done that...it don't work...Bob
If you can not deal with reality, reality will deal with you....
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Wow, that was a great story. Tell me more stories of revolvers and 1911s to show what can't be done with a plastic pistol. Or tell me more stories about what you didn't do to prove that something can't ever be done by anyone.
As for 1/1,000,000,000....you can surely take that as a well researched and statistically accurate probability if you want. Or you can take it as it was obviously intended....to represent "highly unlikely".
your flippant remarks which you so adeptly sling
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Campfire Regular
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Back to the original post: ... are some of the trouble areas or weakness of the 1911's that I should be paying attention to?
Consensus seems to say that 1911's require more attention to maintenance …..as you can see from the previous 14 pages or so…..there's no such thing as "consensus" in the gun community…..and if you've read this thread, you've heard diametrically opposed views from some very qualified, experienced people, some "me-too" comments from some thinking that they're qualified and experienced, and some dogmatic opinions from idiots. Any bad-rep that 1911's have is somewhere between partially-to-largely due to guys like myself that during the early-mid 70's started participating in the newly developed sport which in 1976 became IPSC. In those days, you would buy a new Series 70 Mark IV and trash everything on the gun except the slide and frame; barrel, bushing, trigger, sights, most of the guts were discarded and the skeletal remains were sent to someone like Swenson or Pachmayr and "built" into a "combat" gun. It was expensive and a whole crop of shade-tree, garage-shop, gun-plumbers were germinated. Some were ok and many were not and ALOT of 1911's were ruined. Like Donna Versace, too much surgery often yields hideous results and a lot of DIY guns became inoperable scrap metal. The 1911 (as made by Colt prior to the Series 70) was a superb gun, but it was easy to ruin---and many were. Colt also went thru some tough times and quality suffered for a large part of the 80's---but today's guns are as good, reliability-wise as anything that they've ever made. Probably the weakest part of a new 1911 pattern gun is the magazine---they can be comparatively delicate. The other issue is lubrication; my gut feeling is that stainless-on-stainless needs greater lubrication than blue-on-blue or steel on aluminum, but I could be wrong. I was thinking if compare to similiar price point 1911's, he's probably right but once you move up to the $1,000 to $1,200 price range you would be getting a more reliable 1911... ….well hopefully, but there are some comparatively high-priced guns that I wouldn't own…..I can't speak to other brands, however if you stick to new Colts in Commander length or longer, you'll have as reliable a handgun as any 1911 ever made. Are they as "reliable" as a striker-fired, gun???? I dunno---everyone's experience is different; however, anyone getting too dogmatic about it (pro or con) is a wanna-be-moron…..and I say that dogmatically!! Greg, Thanks, once again, for providing some badly needed context, dogmatically or not! This thread is almost as good as the "circumcision" thread from a year or so ago.
There is nothing made by man,
which cannot be broken by woman.
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Back to the original post: ... are some of the trouble areas or weakness of the 1911's that I should be paying attention to?
Consensus seems to say that 1911's require more attention to maintenance …..as you can see from the previous 14 pages or so…..there's no such thing as "consensus" in the gun community…..and if you've read this thread, you've heard diametrically opposed views from some very qualified, experienced people, some "me-too" comments from some thinking that they're qualified and experienced, and some dogmatic opinions from idiots. Any bad-rep that 1911's have is somewhere between partially-to-largely due to guys like myself that during the early-mid 70's started participating in the newly developed sport which in 1976 became IPSC. In those days, you would buy a new Series 70 Mark IV and trash everything on the gun except the slide and frame; barrel, bushing, trigger, sights, most of the guts were discarded and the skeletal remains were sent to someone like Swenson or Pachmayr and "built" into a "combat" gun. It was expensive and a whole crop of shade-tree, garage-shop, gun-plumbers were germinated. Some were ok and many were not and ALOT of 1911's were ruined. Like Donna Versace, too much surgery often yields hideous results and a lot of DIY guns became inoperable scrap metal. The 1911 (as made by Colt prior to the Series 70) was a superb gun, but it was easy to ruin---and many were. Colt also went thru some tough times and quality suffered for a large part of the 80's---but today's guns are as good, reliability-wise as anything that they've ever made. Probably the weakest part of a new 1911 pattern gun is the magazine---they can be comparatively delicate. The other issue is lubrication; my gut feeling is that stainless-on-stainless needs greater lubrication than blue-on-blue or steel on aluminum, but I could be wrong. I was thinking if compare to similiar price point 1911's, he's probably right but once you move up to the $1,000 to $1,200 price range you would be getting a more reliable 1911... ….well hopefully, but there are some comparatively high-priced guns that I wouldn't own…..I can't speak to other brands, however if you stick to new Colts in Commander length or longer, you'll have as reliable a handgun as any 1911 ever made. Are they as "reliable" as a striker-fired, gun???? I dunno---everyone's experience is different; however, anyone getting too dogmatic about it (pro or con) is a wanna-be-moron…..and I say that dogmatically!! Well said gm. There is a lot of information (fact) in what you just said. Read every word people. 4 1/4" is short enough. SS on SS needs specialized lube. Steel on alloy also. Lot of good 1911's are ruined by shade tree smiths. 1911 Mags are a weak point. Buy proven ones and don't drop them on concrete. To expand on the Commander. Look at the Colt 21st Century Commander. (lightweight). The marketing statement from Colt is "Everything you need and nothing you don't". I have two of them and they are a pleasure to shoot and carry. The 1911 is a master of timing in a mechanical device. Don't deviate from it's original design "too much" and everything will be Okay. One more thing. A tight slide is not all that. It is how you fit the slide/frame is what makes a good 1911 with longevity. Some High end 1911 makers have not figured that one out. ...and stick with forged major parts.
Gun Shows are almost as comical as boat ramps in the Spring.
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