I have two. The first was 150gr Sierra FMJ out of an Aut6. From top to bottom the smallest group I got was 1.5 inches. Not wanting to give up, I purchased another box. This time I failed to see the text on the box "SP". They were mixed up on the shelves. That load that gave 1.5 inches, gave me .5" from 5 rounds at 100. I called Sierra. They admit that their FMJ is a challenge to load. I probably would have gotten better results using the load that gave the tightest group and then working the OAL.
The second was trying to come up with loads for the 270WSM and 300WSM. At first the Hornady dies were just pieces of junk. I sent those back to Larry Potterfield in exchange for some RCBS. With the new dies and a pound of MagPro, the best I could get was 1" at 100. Scratching my head I thought OAL? Powder? Bullet? Primer? Shooter? Well neither of these were my rifles (but they are in the family) so I tried the simplest and easiest trick. I scrubbed the barrels with bore form and a brush and low and behold, sub MOA. Hey what can I say, I thought everyone cleaned their barrels after a day of shooting. Apparently these two had been cleaned in a while.
Finding the proper Extreme powder to get a fast enough velocity in my US Model of 1917 Eddystone. I needed to have the POI height match with the sight graduations.
I will tell you my easiest! Sako TRG 42 in .300 mag. Ran about 5 different charges of H4831sc with a 180 Acubond. ALL produced groups <.5" Ended up using 76 grains. I couldn't believe how consistent all the loads were.
The most frustration I ever experienced was trying to get cast bullets to shoot out of several .458 Win. Mags. Got nothing but keyholes no matter what I tried, so after only 20 years of trying, I gave up.
I loaded up a 35 Whelen and 250gr. cast bullets to 2,550; the bore needed some work and getting sustained accuracy was kindy tricky.
I gotta say getting cast bullets to jacketed standards with bullets that don't fit a gun's throat worth a hoot can seem almost impossible...but there are ways.
.250 Savage in an well worn 1899 with a 14" twist. Wanted a 100 gr. bullet, and went through all the major manufacturers before deciding on the Speer Hot-Cor (it's the shortest one) Tried 748, 760, 4064, 4320, 3031, and a few others, and three different primers (CCI, FED, WIN) and two types of brass. Finally read Mule Deer's 'Loads that work' article and bought some 4895, tried 33gr. with Winchester brass and the CCI 200 with the Speer bullet and got a consistent 1.5" for three shots at 100 yds. gun. good enough, but I probably tried 200 combinations including with lighter bullets before finding the one that worked. The gun would also shoot the 90 gr. Sierra HP with H4895.
Of all things, it was a Wby Vanguard in .270 Win[one of the early ones]. I couldn't for the life of me to get that damn thing to shoot with ANY type of load! Any other .270, no problem. But that one, geez! Down the road it went; and then obtained my Sako Finnbear in .270. Ahhh, now that rifle shoots!
I tried to achieve the mythical 3200 fps from a 26 inch 264 win mag with 140 gr bullets. (especially elusive with Nosler Partitions) RL25 did really scary things with the 140 partition when loaded beyond 3050 fps, or when going from a 30 degree spring day to a 110 degree summer afternooon, or even between the first shot in a string and the third.
Then I figured out that top MV really did not matter as long as the rifle shot little bug hole groups, and settled with the 140 Sierra spbt over 67 gr of H1000 at 3000 fps.
A factory Ruger #1 with a heavy barrel in .223 of all things! I couldn't find a combination to save my life. Finally got bugholes with 4198, Rem brass, Win primers, and a 50gr V-max.
Just finished it. Frustrating accuracy and inconsistent cold barrel shots, and frequent fliers that would make delta airlines cringe, I finally bedded my Weatherby MkV in 30-06.
Then, realizing that she just doesn't like to be pushed, regardless of having the "strongest factory action in the world" I settled on 58.2gr of H4350 and 165 SGK's just to get me through deer season.
Ruger #1A in 7x57. The rifle, as it turned out had an unusually deep throat, over 2" as determined by my gunsmith via chamber cast. Sent the gun back to Ruger and aver what seemed like forever, actually seven months, I finally got my gun back. Not a true tackdriver but at least most 5 shot groups can be covered by a quarter which is good enough for hunting. Paul B.
Savage left hand 7-08. I worked off and on for three years trying several powder/bullet combinations. I finally gave up and swapped barrels to a .22-250. As I was putting the action back into stock, I realized the bolt handle had been rubbing the stock. It seems that Savage took a right hand synthetic stock and filled the right hand cut out and then cut a new slot on the left side. Problem was the cut was too far toward the rear.
I didn't change the barrel back until this last weekend. The fouling shot hit high and right from the .22-250 zero. The next two shots went into one hole. Shot another group with two shots almost touching and then ruined the group with a called flier. Both groups still measured under and inch- that is with a fouling shot and a called flier. This weekend it gets another chance to do better.
Ive got two. One is My Rem 700 ADL 243 that I just settled with yesterday evening after trying loads since early this summer. Never could get a group less than one inch and I know it will shoot better. But I ran out of time and settled for the combo that was the most consistant with 1"groups. Antelope season opens tomorrow so I had to figure something out. Went with 95gr Btip, Win brass, CCI 200, and 34.5gr Varget. Ended up having to sight it in this afternoon in the 30mph wind and pourning rain but Im ready!
My second is my new Model 7 7mm-08. I still havent found a handload with 120Btips or 140Accubonds like I want. It shoots 140gr Fusions into about 1.5" so its sighted in with those to use this season and Ill work with it a bunch this winter/spring/summer and figure something out with the little devil.
My 300 Wby Encore took 450 rounds fired to find its sweet spot (desired load combo). Now, it'll put 3 consecutive in a perfect triangle measuring 1/2".
Now I'm happy. I wasn't until the last three shots out of that 450.
Seems to work pretty well in my 700ADL .243. I inherited 2 lbs and didn't have s decent .243 load yet, so I figured what the heck, try what I have on hand. 44 gr with 55 gr Ballistic Tips, 38 with 75 V-Max and 33 with 100 Interlock. So far, it's decent...not great, but around an inch with each of em.
Finding a single load in 300 Savage that worked well in a 99F, a 99E, and a 760 ran me around in circles for a long time. All of the typical loads worked well in two of the three rifles. .308" Sierra SPT/38.5 gr. IMR4895/WLR primers/Remcesteral cases is a load that all three will shoot. I didn't want to stock two or three loads, but it may come down to that because the above load is kind of slow. It works for now, but I'm burnt out on that project for a while.
An old Ruger tang safety 243 Varmint with a 12 twist. Needed a factory class varmint rig that could put 20 shots into an inch @ 300 yrds in 30 minutes plus sighters. Ended up getting it done with 37.5grs H-4895, Sierra 70 gr MK. or Hornady 75gr HP. Rem brass, and CCI primer. Worked 22 years ago, and still works now.
Weatherby UL in 7-08 punched to 284... 3 powder manufacturers, Bazillion bullets, hours of my life... sold it before I snapped... Best group was 2" plus.... Hated that gun...
Remington LH 700 with a factory Take Off in 7-08 to 284 Win never got a load to shoot well in probably 100 plus loads tried. Rebedded rifle 3 or 4 times, sold it with another Take off barrel in 7-08, with full disclosure. Wish I would have kept action but was sour on it.
HaYen: The longest I have ever worked on a "difficult" Rifle has been my ongoing trials with a Ruger #1-B in 22 Hornet! After many years of off and on load testing I finally have it shooting just at and just under 1" for 5 shots at 100 yards in dead calm conditions. If this Rifle was not so beautiful and fun to pull the trigger on it would have been down the road many years ago. My loading log shows I added this then new Rifle to my arsenal back in 1997. I consider my efforts with this Rifle to be "considerable" and "difficult". Hold into the wind VarmintGuy
Paul- better practice more if you need 5 shots in that single shot rifle Seriously, if you get the first shot out of a cold bbl, consistent POI, I'd not worry more than a 2nd or 3rd 'just in case' but I bet it shoots as good as you can away from bags now.
[quote=Swifty52] Needed a factory class varmint rig that could put 20 shots into an inch @ 300 yards in 30 minutes plus sighters. Ended up getting it done with 37.5grs H-4895, Sierra 70 gr MK. or Hornady 75gr HP. Rem brass, and CCI primer. Worked 22 years ago, and still works now.
65BR brings a good point. One of the first statements make when training someone new is "the first shot out of a cold barrel is your money shot, the rest are just practice". And the 6.5x55 has been killing Mice to Moose :-)
"What was the hardest load development you ever did?"
Converting .303 Brit cases into long .44 mag handgun cases to form a sort of bottle neck shot shell and then finding a lethal snake load with a decent pattern.
Two,338-06 and a 264,both are without much solid data.So I started from a velocity point,2650 with a 225 and 3200 with a 140.Ranshot powders were the answers.
Regulating a 577 Nitro Express to shoot to the sights, I broke the front trigger hanging on to that shoulder pounding beast, just got it back from JJ in Enid a couple weeks ago.
All is good w/ the TSX and banded solids, with around 100 rounds loaded up.
Getting my 1894CL Marlin in .25-20 to shoot under 1.5 inches at 50 yds. Finally tried magnum small pistol primers and 8 grs. of H110 over an 86 gr. Remington SP. Shoots about .5 inches, or one MOA. Later I found that the 60 gr. Hdy will do almost as well with 13 grs. of WW680 and the magnum primer. The Speer 75 gr. FP's were the worst of all. But did finally find one load that was close. In that case, the magnum primers were the answer. This took over 10 yearsa of on and off effort BTW. Didn't have much trouble with the Hornady 154 Interbond in my .280. But it only comes close to MOA with either 52 grs. of H4350 or 57 grs. of H4831. The Swift A-Frame was much harder to work with. Only 52 grs. of H4350 is any where near MOA. Never had any problems with H4895. I especially like it for reduced loads and in the .308. I've come to the conclusion that bullet choice makes a difference, sometimes a big one. I've had my worst performance in cup and core bullets from Speer's Hot Cores when it comes to the best accuracy. But even those are often acceptably accurate. I'll not be buying any more Swift-A-Frames. I found them to be very expensive and not very consistant. Nosler Partitions are my choice for those premium bullet applications now. Much easier to find accurate loads for, cheaper and they work fine. No more Hornady Interbonds either. They don't penetrate nearly as well as the NP's do. I've sort of lost my enthusiasum for the Barnes bullet as well. They shoot fine, but that 3% failure to open rate bothers me. E
I had a Ruger M77 in .257 RBTS that wouldn't shoot good with anything I tried (all the recommended powders and C&C bullets from 100 grains to 120 grains). Finally I read one of Mule Deers articles in his quarterly newsletter that recommended Ramshot Hunter powder and the Barnes 100 TSX - I was dubious, but damn if I didn't finally get MOA groups after tinkering with loads for over a year.
Much of what passes for "load development" is a Wag the Dog exercise where the shooter spends excrutiating time and money trying to sync a load to a freaky vibrating, poorly assemnled rifle IMHO.
I have spent far too much time and components trying to get poorly assembled rifles to shoot...barrels,bedding,triggers,squared actions,solid scopes and mounts,and straight ammo in no particular order,are all important,and getting a poorly assembled rifle to shoot through extensive load development is like trying to build a house on a crooked foundation...
It can be done....but I have found that load development is easy when the foundation is "right",so the rifle is the first order of business,and if you have to run to the range with 4 different powders and 6 different bullets looking for something that shoots( I refuse to do it anymore),more than likely, you got a rifle issue and not a load issue.
Good rifles shoot most things well,and some things really well,so I would rather put the energy and money into tune up if a rifle is not producing.Once you have a good foundation, tweaking loads is not tough.....JMHO
Had a 270 Wby that was custom or semi- so on a Rem 700, and well put together as far as I could tell. I don't think it was any of the smith's fault--he had a good rep. I had dictated the long Wby throat and went through two pages of load development/loads, none awful, but none stellar either. Bought into the snake oil cryogenic treatment way back and it was no better afterward. It was a 1.5" rifle and not consistently better. It frustrated me to no end. That said I made venison with it at some extended ranges but it never had my confidence.
George a pal had a 280 made of top components (try, like,a Krieger that wouldn't shoot(?)....for 12 years he tried everything,here and there,even some stuff I advised,but nothing worked.
Finally, tired of hearing the complaints, I told him, take it to our smith, tear it down,and have him rebuild it....which he did,with the exact same components.First group was 4 140 TSX's in the same ragged hole.
Another pal 3 years ago with a 700AWR in 300 RUM,stock custom shop....shot aces with 180's....at 3050.But load it like a 300 RUM to 3300 or so, and it scattered everything into patterns.
He sent it to Score High and they provided a laundry list of issues....did the work and the rifle drove tacks at real RUM velocities.
These and other little experiences make me a skeptic when it comes to finding "magic loads".
Make the rifle right and there are no tough load developments.
My Ruger 77 MKII would not shoot worth a flip with anything. 2 stocks, 3 scopes, 2 sets of rings, recrown, lugs lapped and abut 500rounds later with 150's, 165's, 180's, 190's, 4350, 414, 4831, Rem Brass, Fed Brass, Win Brass. Then I bedded the action via BSA's advice. Hmmm, sub-moa....I wasted a bunch of money......
Weatherby Mark V 300Wby Mag, no combos yet that are a consistent 3" at 100yds. New stock is on the way.
Bearcat it doesn't have to be custom, or expensive, to shoot good....that "stock-to barreled action" connection, may be the biggest bugaboo of all....along with straight ammo.
Yep, I am seeing that now after being here and reading a lot.
I bought a used Accumark stock with the aluminum bedding block from a member here. When it shows I am going to skim bed it and get back to work with the 300. I did not want to fool with the weak tupperwear stock on my Mark V. I sold some stuff and had some extra $$$ burning my pockets, so I spent it.
Ruger 77 257 Roberts Ultralight very long throat, had 5 pages of loads over 10 plus years finally got it to shoot, 10 plus years later found it had a bent factory barrel? no wonder load development was not for the faint of heart! Ruger rebarreled it, no charge, wish I would have found the bent barrel earlier would have made my life easier.
Remington 700 in 17 Remington using 25 grain moly coated Hornady bullets. I got it to shoot, but it took about a dozen tries at the range and never in 100 degree heat! Good shooting, Marcus.
Agreed, Bob. That fincky .25-20 got a little tweaking over the years and that did help. All of my custom built rifles on either McMillian or MPI Kevlar stocks are just as you describe. They shoot alot of stuff well and some loads really well. Bullets can play a part. I've never had a Speer Hot Core shoot really well. OK, yes, but never really well. Their TNT's however, have done really well. I've noticed that with Swift-A-Frames too. In a rifle that has never been finicky, only on load had any real consistancy. I'm going back to Nosler Partitions in that one. E
Ruger no.1 in 243 just about drove me crazy I tried everything i could think of until one night I was looking at the crown of the barrel and put a 100 grain speer boat on the crown it dropped down into the barrel stopping about a inch before the chamber . Turn it over and the bullet rattle down the barrel onto the floor. Two trips back to Ruger and a new barrel it shots like a house afire now.
I have a older Remington 700 in 7MM STW. Has factory stock, pillar bedded, action bedded, accurized, 4 differnt brands of cases, multiple weights and brands of bullet, several different primers, different powders. Sub min of angle last month with both 160 AB (which had been through it with multiple combinations of loads), and 175 gr PT. The key was RL-19, I had already tried 22 but 19 was/is golden in this rifle.
Hardest load development for me was a bum custom barrel. Cost me alot of time, $$, headaches and frustration. I kept records and took pics and came to the conclusion it had to be the barrel. I sent pictures of the targets along with records of the loads to the barrel maker and they not only offered to replace the barrel, they reimbursed my 'smith to install the replacement barrel! They sent the replacement barrel to my 'smith within a week and after one short range session the new tube is shooting about .5"!
MtnHtr:Factory barrels can sorta vary all over but IME when a good custom tube doesn't shoot there's a problem somewhere...
It is just so important the rifle be "right" in the first place;otherwise a guy is just chasing his tail.Seen it so many times as I am sure others have as well.
Problem is so many believe in magic loads that make a sour shooting rifle into a tack driver....I have learned that if a rifle sucks,it sucks and no load development will ever make it really good.Best get it fixed. Range time and components are expensive.
That brings up the question. If you have a rifle that doesn't shoot to your expectations, what specifically is your checklist to make sure the rifle is "right"?
I admit my ignorance in this area, but am always looking to learn more.
I'm not Bob, but I happen to agree with him on this point, so I'll chime in. Here are my first steps in load development:
- Float the barrel (unless it's an U/L barrel) - Bed the stock (stress-free bedding with DEVCON) - Adjust trigger (or replace); zero creep, 3 lbs. - Quality bases and rings (torqued to specification torque) - New, quality scope (Zeiss, Leupold, Swaro) or used scope with a known history (one of mine) - Verify the front base screw isn't bottoming on barrel threads (common) - Verify the magazine box isn't binding between the floor plate and receiver (very common on 700s) - Torque action screws, in the proper order, to specification torque - Clean the barrel thoroughly with a good copper solvent - Start with a powder and bullet weight-class that are known to shoot well in other rifles of the same caliber
Only after this stuff do I begin load development. Going through this ritual has just about convinced me that ANY rifle that doesn't have a problem somewhere can be made to shoot MOA or better. I'm sure there are exceptions, but I've yet to see one.
I often lap my scope rings, and I've lapped a few recoil lugs -- though I can't honestly say that the latter yielded an obvious improvement.
I'm not a machinist, nor a gunsmith, so can't describe all the little magic things a good smith does.And some rifles take very little.A year or so ago, M70 Classic 7 mag shot so-so in a factory wood stock.Redneck on here bedded it in a Rimrock for me, tuned the trigger, floated the barrel, and that's all it took.The rifle is a tack driver with several loads that were so-so in the original stock, factory barrel and all.The "magic" was in good bedding and a barrel that was not banging around in the stock, not in the loads.
But I think lugs should be lapped;barrels should butt up squarely to actions because barrels screwed on crooked won't shoot,bolt faces should be concentric and squared up properly..crowns should be square and clean so bullets exit properly.
Bedding must allow actions to sit stress free.
Over a year ago,a great shooting 270 started to misbehave and go sour....it had been great before,so I was perplexed.It had been shot a bit, about 1500-2000 rounds. I tried everything, including looking for new "magic loads"...nothing worked,so I took it to my smith here.
Larry bore scoped it,said the throat was rough (he says I shoot too much He diamond lapped the throat,and accuracy with the old loads was restored, the first 300 yard group going a bit under 3", but I also noticed accuracy soured after 18 rounds. I cleaned it,and accuracy came right back.
I think I may have mentioned a friends 280, made of good stuff, that would not shoot...Larry fixed it by squaring off the bolt face,and face of the receiver so the barrel /action connection was square; lapped the lugs for better contact,recut the chamber,recut the threads of the receiver,recrowned the barrel,and re-did the bedding.
A sour shooting rifle put 140 TSX's into one ragged hole...it went from sour grapes to tack driver with no load development....
Another reason why I say chasing groups with magic loads is a waste of precious time and money if the rifle is not right.If you are running back and forth to the range with 10 different powders,and a dozen combo's of bullets and charges to get a rifle to shoot, you are wagging the dog.There are many good accuracy smiths today.Some post here....they are your friends! Pay them and be happy!
For a new rifle, my load development starts with one powder and maybe two bullets....I may try at most one more powder and bullet combo...if it doesn't shoot, it's off to the smith for the cure.
Edited to add: Make sure your ammo is straight.....something I learned from Johnny B on here(bless his heart!)...it is astonishing what straight ammo will do and is the only little case prep accuracy trick I pay attention to.I am still sick I was so ignorant about this for so many years....
Going through this ritual has just about convinced me that ANY rifle that doesn't have a problem somewhere can be made to shoot MOA or better.
I'm convinced that even rifles with problems can shoot that well. My Eddystone I mentioned earlier has a barrel so screwy, it looks to be dangerous. Last group was .8moa at 200 yards.
First was a 6.5x284 that would shoot great today, but next week with same loads wasnt so good. I thought it was me, having a bad day, but then the next rifle shot as it should. This went on for several months. Long story short, changed barrels and problem went away.
Second was a Win. 270, stock rifle. Tried several bullets, powders, primers, seating depths, cases, etc... Finally, after a year of experimenting, I bedded the barrel and presto, it went to shooting great!
I think the hardest one I ever eventually succeeded with was a Ruger (tang safety) 77 RL in .257 Roberts.
I shot it for 2 years, well over 1000 rounds, bunch of different bullets, powders, primers, changing OAL, etc, never could get it under about 2-1/2 inches. Finally one day I lost my temper and shot up all the shells I had with me. It got hot, I could smell wood smoke, and I just kept shootin'. Never gave it much thought, tossed it back in the gun rack and it promptly melted the rubber padding on the rack.
I'm not quite sure why it worked, but the next trip out, I managed to stick 5 75 grain Sierras into 9/16ths of an inch at 100 yards with a max load of 4064. That trip or the next, I got 5 120 grain hornady FBHP bullets into 5/8ths of an inch. The gun shot great for the rest of the time I owned it.
I'm not sure what problem that excess heat fixed, but probably some sort of bedding issue.
Another tough one was a 700 LVSF in .22-250. I only ever found 3 loads it would shoot. It seemed to need a bit of excessive pressure. I'm not sure where I stumbled over the load, but I wound up running 37.5 grains of Varget under 50 grain SXes or 50 TNTs. Same POI, same groups in the low 0.2s, otherwise it was a 2-1/2 MOA gun. It was real touchy, drop back to 37 grains and it didn't shoot for [bleep]. The other load I found after the throat was shot out enough those first two started hittin' the paper sideways ... 55 grain Trophy Bonded Bear Claw over a max load of H4895. It was only about MOA accurate but I got a nice little buck with it. Then rebarreled the gun. Today it's a 6mm Rem AI.
Bought an M700 in 204. I tried factory loads, and three different bullets and multiple powders. Nothing better than 2.5" at 100. Was thinking of a rebarrel or was going to sell it, and then tried someone's load from here on the fire. Finally 1/2" groups at 100. Haven't even bothered to try another bullet/powder combo since. Had enough experimenting with that thing!
Not the hardest, but the flukiest. My brother gave me a couple handfuls of Remington CoreLokts in .308 -- 180 grainers. I had never tried H414 in a 30-06 before, and I had just bought a pound for my wife's 243. An old Speer manual I had showed the use of CCI 250 primers which I had in stock. They had a load for 165 grainers and for 200 grainers, but not 180's. I split the difference and sent them 180's with a fair ta middlin' charge of the H414 and a 250 magnum primer. First 5 shots at 100 yards went 1 and 1/16" so I took 'em hunting a kilt me a moose with 'em. Used them for a couple years and then Barnes started singing to me, so I moved on.
I had a blued tupperware ADL in .204 about the time they quit making the ADL in favor of the SPS. That SOB beat me. I flat out couldn't get it to shoot well enough. I gave up on the .204 for a couple years because of that. I like .204 a lot, but my .204 successes have both been with PacNor barreled 700s, not factory.
I had a blued tupperware ADL in .204 about the time they quit making the ADL in favor of the SPS. That SOB beat me. I flat out couldn't get it to shoot well enough. I gave up on the .204 for a couple years because of that. I like .204 a lot, but my .204 successes have both been with PacNor barreled 700s, not factory.
Tom
Exact gun I have! Last of the blued/syn ADL's. It is now in a bedded Medalist, and a Rifle Basix trigger. The only load it will shoot is 35gr Bergers + 26.6grs of Benchmark + WSR primer + Win case. I love the gun now...but what a pain in the ass it was prior.
Glad you had success. After my failure I quit the .204 for a couple years and went back to .17 Rem in an LVSF, then had it rebarreled to something like a VSSF, but only 24", in .204. That was a rodent slayin' SOB. I shot the throat out so I got yet another new barrel, this time sporter config. Both from PacNor, both chambered with the same reamer, but very different profile and different stocks, yet after reworking loads for the new barrel, I'm back to exactly the same recipes. Seems statistically unlikely, but y' can't argue much with the shootin' results.
Probably the coolest gun I never could succeed with was a Ruger #1 Varminter in .300 Win Mag that I bought used. It strung very repeatably as the barrel heated and cooled. First shots made a nice group in the .3s. 15th shots made a nice group in the .3s. But 8 MOA higher. Once it got hot, it shot great while it stayed hot, let it cool, POI would drop back down. Sure put a new meaning to making the first shot count, but that sort of interferes with the idea of a heavy barrel for lots of shooting.
Several years back, I bought a new Winchester Mod 70 stainless in 338 Win mag. I loaded up 50 rounds of 250 gr Sierras with MRP and headed off to a spot where I could shoot, about a 75 mile drive. I get out there and set up, shoot all 50 rnds and get no good results, everything pretty much 2.5" - 4" groups at 100 yds. Grrr..., head home scratching my head and rubbing my shoulder. Next weekend, try a couple of different powders with 100 rnds, still no joy and the friggin rifle slipped off the sissy bag and stuck my collar bone hard enough to crack it. Still no groups worth anything. Head home. Get home, look at gun for a while. Hmmm, pull stock and begin looking suspiciously at it. This is one of those cheap POS injection molded stocks with a recoil pad that's no better. I like my Senderos including the HS stock on those so I called HS and ordered one up for my model 70. A few days later, the stock arrives and I mount the rifle in it. Weekend arrives and I take another 50 rnds of 250 Sierras on MRP out to the boondocks and right away I'm getting .75" - 1.25" groups. A little tuning brought that in to more consistant .75" groups and I'm happy.
Today my usual big game rifle is my Rem 700 Sendero in 338 RUM. This rifle is a joy compared to what that Model 70 with that injection molded stock felt like. The shape and fit of that stock in combination with a hard rubber recoil pad made that 338 Winny a bear to shoot and I think that the stock offered such poor support for the receiver that it wouldn't shoot.
In the early '90's I bought a new Custom Super Grade M70 in 7mm RM. Shot it and shot it but never got acceptable groups sufficient that I would take it hunting. At just under 1300 rounds one day I discovered a fine longitudinal crack running up the right side of the receiver. After having several people look at it the Winchester warranty gunsmith sent it back to the factory as he said he had never seen anything like it. At the time of sending it in I included a note mentioning the lack of accuracy.
About 8 or 9 months later I got back a new rifle with the same serial number. I assume this was done to avoid having to pay duty a second time. The new rifle shot very well. The company not only replaced the receiver (which was all that I was expecting due to the amount of shooting done) but also the barrel and stock. The second stock was even nicer than the first one.
Took it hunting and killed a moose with it and then it became a safe queen for the last 16 or 17 years. Every once in awhile I take it out and fire a few rounds through it then put it away again.
Very disappointing for that quality of rifle from the custom shop but in the end the company did me right.
A .270 WSM Howa. I never did get it to shoot well enough to suit me. There was always one flyer.... I gave up, sold it and got a Vanguard Sub-MOA in .257 Wthby.
The toughest rifle I had to work with was a Browning BAR in 270. My uncle had won this brand new rifle as some kind of sales award for the company he worked for. It was 2 weeks before the 1991 deer season I told his to go and by a Leupold 3X9 scope and bases and rings. He didn't want to be tied to handloaded ammo I told him to buy a box of 130's and 150's he showed up with the ammo, bases and rings, and a Redfield 3X9. Well I mounted the scope up grabbed a spare 3X9 Leupold that I had just in case and headed to the range.
He had bought Remington core-locks in the 130 and 150's. I fired 5 shots with the 130's first. I had seen better groups fired from a shotgun using buckshot. It was right at 5". I rechecked bases and rings all was tight so I grabbed the 150's and fired 5 of those and the same thing about 5". So I thought it's the Crappy Redfield scope so I grabbed the Leupold mounted it up went back the bench grabbed the 130's fired 5 shots, no change. tried the 150's same thing. I put the Redfield back on ran down to the sporting goods bought some Winchester 130's in powerpoints and 150's in the round nose configuration and swung back by my house to grab some 270 130's that I used in my 270 the were 130 Speer hot-cores and 58 grains of H4831 and CCI 200 primers and Winchester brass.
Back to the range fired all three and the smallest group was 3.5" with Winchester 150 round nose going over my chrono at 2450 + or - 15 feet a second. I called my uncle and told him to sell this piece of crap as fast as he could or trade it for a real rifle.
He had me call Browning which I did and in 1991 their guarantee was 6" at a 100 yards. He took it to a local gunshop and traded it and $20 for a 700 BDL in 270.
Sako L61R 338WM,a bad new Leupold. FN 264WM,bad barrel. Savage 243W,vertical stringing,plastic stock.
When those rifle problems were solved,load development was easy.But a rifle with out problems was the biggest challenge,when I did it,I wanted a 338-06 to do 2650 with a 225 in a inch,little data,some wrong, some wimpy and few case filling powders.
Mine was my 6.5WSSM - when it was in the 6.5WSM chambering it was an awesome rifle. Washed out 4" of barrel, rechambered to 6.5WSSM ,and it all went to hell in a hand cart!! The biggest problem was the brass i was trying to work with - went through a PILE of brass trying to get some uniform cases. Finally gave up after months of frustration. Good accuracy for a big game rifle, but NOT for a long range varmint gun, for sure! Cat
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Seriously, if you get the first shot out of a cold bbl, consistent POI, I'd not worry more than a 2nd or 3rd 'just in case' but I bet it shoots as good as you can away from bags now.
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