300wsm and RL26 - 24hourcampfire

I asked this question in a different location and didn’t get much for responses and I see much more activity on questions like this under Big Game Rifles so here goes...

Anyone having any luck with the above combo with 150 and/or 165 grain TTSX's or Accubonds?? Currently using RL-15 with good luck just feel like I'm leaving a couple hundred FPS on the table. Thanks for the input

Here's what it looks like with the TTSX:

Code

Cartridge          : .300 WSM (CIP)
Bullet             : .308, 165, Barnes 'TTSX'BT 30368
Useable Case Capaci: 69.910 grain H2O = 4.539 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 2.860 inch = 72.64 mm
Barrel Length      : 24.0 inch = 609.6 mm
Powder             : Alliant Reloder-26 *C

Predicted data by increasing and decreasing the given charge,
incremented in steps of 0.662% of nominal charge.
CAUTION: Figures exceed maximum and minimum recommended loads !

Step    Fill. Charge   Vel.  Energy   Pmax   Pmuz  Prop.Burnt B_Time
 %       %    Grains   fps   ft.lbs    psi    psi      %        ms

-06.6  102    70.50   3026    3355   49868  11625     99.4    1.215
-06.0  102    71.00   3051    3411   51203  11672     99.5    1.200
-05.3  103    71.50   3076    3466   52580  11715     99.6    1.185
-04.6  104    72.00   3101    3522   54002  11753     99.8    1.171
-04.0  105    72.50   3125    3579   55470  11787     99.9    1.157  ! Near Maximum !
-03.3  105    73.00   3150    3635   56983  11817     99.9    1.143  ! Near Maximum !
-02.6  106    73.50   3175    3692   58549  11842    100.0    1.129  ! Near Maximum !
-02.0  107    74.00   3199    3750   60168  11863    100.0    1.115  ! Near Maximum !
-01.3  108    74.50   3224    3807   61836  11879    100.0    1.102  ! Near Maximum !
-00.7  108    75.00   3248    3865   63564  11894    100.0    1.088  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+00.0  109    75.50   3272    3923   65348  11909    100.0    1.075  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+00.7  110    76.00   3297    3982   67195  11922    100.0    1.062  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+01.3  110    76.50   3321    4040   69105  11935    100.0    1.049  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+02.0  111    77.00   3345    4099   71082  11948    100.0    1.036  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+02.6  112    77.50   3369    4159   73128  11959    100.0    1.024  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+03.3  113    78.00   3393    4218   75248  11970    100.0    1.011  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!

Results caused by ± 3% powder lot-to-lot burning rate variation using nominal charge
Data for burning rate increased by 3% relative to nominal value:
+Ba    109    75.50   3326    4052   70441  11706    100.0    1.044  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
Data for burning rate decreased by 3% relative to nominal value:
-Ba    109    75.50   3211    3778   60611  12116     99.9    1.109  ! Near Maximum !

Accubonds not much different:

Code

Cartridge          : .300 WSM (CIP)
Bullet             : .308, 165, Nosler Accubond 55602
Useable Case Capaci: 71.480 grain H2O = 4.641 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 2.860 inch = 72.64 mm
Barrel Length      : 24.0 inch = 609.6 mm
Powder             : Alliant Reloder-26 *C

Predicted data by increasing and decreasing the given charge,
incremented in steps of 0.662% of nominal charge.
CAUTION: Figures exceed maximum and minimum recommended loads !

Step    Fill. Charge   Vel.  Energy   Pmax   Pmuz  Prop.Burnt B_Time
 %       %    Grains   fps   ft.lbs    psi    psi      %        ms

-06.6  100    70.50   2986    3267   47421  11719     99.1    1.244
-06.0  100    71.00   3011    3321   48654  11773     99.3    1.229
-05.3  101    71.50   3035    3375   49925  11823     99.5    1.215
-04.6  102    72.00   3059    3429   51235  11869     99.6    1.200
-04.0  102    72.50   3084    3484   52585  11911     99.7    1.186
-03.3  103    73.00   3108    3539   53976  11948     99.8    1.172
-02.6  104    73.50   3132    3594   55412  11982     99.9    1.158  ! Near Maximum !
-02.0  104    74.00   3156    3650   56893  12011    100.0    1.145  ! Near Maximum !
-01.3  105    74.50   3180    3706   58422  12035    100.0    1.131  ! Near Maximum !
-00.7  106    75.00   3204    3762   60000  12055    100.0    1.118  ! Near Maximum !
+00.0  107    75.50   3228    3818   61625  12073    100.0    1.104  ! Near Maximum !
+00.7  107    76.00   3252    3875   63310  12089    100.0    1.091  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+01.3  108    76.50   3276    3932   65046  12105    100.0    1.078  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+02.0  109    77.00   3300    3989   66839  12120    100.0    1.065  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+02.6  109    77.50   3323    4047   68693  12135    100.0    1.053  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+03.3  110    78.00   3347    4104   70612  12149    100.0    1.040  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!

Results caused by ± 3% powder lot-to-lot burning rate variation using nominal charge
Data for burning rate increased by 3% relative to nominal value:
+Ba    107    75.50   3283    3948   66409  11868    100.0    1.072  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
Data for burning rate decreased by 3% relative to nominal value:
-Ba    107    75.50   3166    3672   57179  12257     99.7    1.139  ! Near Maximum !

I didn't see the velocity from Reloader-26 I thought I'd see,in fact I was rather surprised it didn't do better.It may be one of those powders that where it works,it really works.I know it worked great in my 7mag.It could be in the 30cal it needs a bigger less efficient case like the 300 Win Mag before it really starts to throttle up.I tried Reloader-26 with a 168gr Nosler Ballistic Tip,this is what I got:
70.0grs - 2900fps
70.5grs - 2936fps
71.0grs - 2969fps
Mine shoots 168grs real well with 69.0grs of Reloader-22 @ 3030fps,but my favorite powder is 64.5grs of Win.760 @3100fps.

Reloder 26 in the .300 WSM looks like a combination that will change your life.

Looks like I may have quit about two grains too soon.My 300WSM doesn't have any freebore so I'm usually maxed out a couple of grains less than book max loads.

Originally Posted by baldhunter

I didn't see the velocity from Reloader-26 I thought I'd see,in fact I was rather surprised it didn't do better.It may be one of those powders that where it works,it really works.I know it worked great in my 7mag.It could be in the 30cal it needs a bigger less efficient case like the 300 Win Mag before it really starts to throttle up.I tried Reloader-26 with a 168gr Nosler Ballistic Tip,this is what I got:
70.0grs - 2900fps
70.5grs - 2936fps
71.0grs - 2969fps
Mine shoots 168grs real well with 69.0grs of Reloader-22 @ 3030fps,but my favorite powder is 64.5grs of Win.760 @3100fps.

Only 71 grains?

Take a look at what I posted above. 71gr is barely a starting load.

Originally Posted by antelope_sniper

Originally Posted by baldhunter

I didn't see the velocity from Reloader-26 I thought I'd see,in fact I was rather surprised it didn't do better.It may be one of those powders that where it works,it really works.I know it worked great in my 7mag.It could be in the 30cal it needs a bigger less efficient case like the 300 Win Mag before it really starts to throttle up.I tried Reloader-26 with a 168gr Nosler Ballistic Tip,this is what I got:
70.0grs - 2900fps
70.5grs - 2936fps
71.0grs - 2969fps
Mine shoots 168grs real well with 69.0grs of Reloader-22 @ 3030fps,but my favorite powder is 64.5grs of Win.760 @3100fps.

Only 71 grains?

Take a look at what I posted above. 71gr is barely a starting load.

Maybe in some 300WSM's.I could probably go up to 73.0grs,but I doubt if I could go much higher.I didn't have any load data to work off of,but I felt I could go a couple grains more than what I was loading with Reloader-22.In mine,I have to use 180gr data for 165gr.To give you an example,I tried Reloader-17 in it.The book max was 68.0grs with a 165gr bullet.I tried 65.0gr and got 3160fps and 66.0grs was 3228fps.I quit at 66.0grs because even though I didn't see any signs of pressure,my groups opened up to four inches and the velocity also told me it was time to quit.Imagine if I would have just started with the book max of 68.0grs.I think I'm going to throat mine about .030 -.050 longer.I'm getting erosion starting to creep up on the leads and I think that might clean up the erosion a little as well as give me a tab more freebore.Maybe then I might be able to increase my loads closer to what book loads are.Just shows every rifle is different.As you can see in the picture,this rifle has no throat.

baldhunter,

Your rifle's "throat" matches the SAAMI specifications for the .300 WSM.

The cartridge was designed that way, I would guess both to guarantee loaded rounds would be short enough to fit in standard factory magazines, and to enhance accuracy.

Your rifle may also have a minimum bore or chamber, which would also affect pressures. Or some other factor in your handloads may be affecting pressures, whether a heavier batch of brass, a different bullet or primer, or a slightly faster-burning manufacturing lot of powder. Generally powder manufacturers blend different lots to approximate the same burn-rate for canister powders sold to handloaders, though they still often vary 2-3%.

But your .300 WSM has a standard throat.

Originally Posted by Mule Deer

baldhunter,

Your rifle's "throat" matches the SAAMI specifications for the .300 WSM.

The cartridge was designed that way, I would guess both to guarantee loaded rounds would be short enough to fit in standard factory magazines, and to enhance accuracy.

Your rifle may also have a minimum bore or chamber, which would also affect pressures. Or some other factor in your handloads may be affecting pressures, whether a heavier batch of brass, a different bullet or primer, or a slightly faster-burning manufacturing lot of powder. Generally powder manufacturers blend different lots to approximate the same burn-rate for canister powders sold to handloaders, though they still often vary 2-3%.

But your .300 WSM has a standard throat.

I think mine is a little short of SAAMI Specs.

Here is a photo with a max length empty case in the chamber.You can see the leads start right at the end of the chamber.According to SAAMI it should have .1884 of freebore.

Here is a 308 Win.According to SAAMI it has a long taper angle on the leads starting at .0900 and ending at .2537.You can see a big difference between the two.

baldhunter: That bore is starting to look a little rough. I would be tempted to fire lap it before the throat is increased if you decide to do that. In some photos the erosion looks minimal but the roughness down the bore may be from the rifling process. If that is a hand lapped barrel then they stopped too soon.
The only issue with fire lapping is it can push the throat forward, in this case not a concern if you do it before the throat job.

Compare how clean the 308 looks, just some tool marks.

I plan on throating it a little longer,especially since now I see the erosion creeping up on the lands.It's the price you pay with magnum rifles.The more powder you burn,the hotter the steel is going to get in the throat area of the barrel.I usually only shoot three,no more than five rounds between cool downs.They say double based powders burn hotter and longer.It's like a cutting torch.If you have the flame set right,it will be hot enough to cut metal,if not the steel just gets hot.

baldhunter,

The SAAMI drawing shows the BEGINNING of the .300 WSM throat, just in front of the chamber, as .3099"--just barely above .308 inch--and less than .001" more than the diameter of many .30 caliber bullets.

The .300 WSM "throat" is actually the taper of the lands, not the rifling-free area many of us consider a "throat." The rear of which, in your rifle, probably disappeared due to the slight amount of erosion.

Again, your .300 WSM has a pretty much normal chamber. I have looked at many a .300 WSM chamber with my bore-scope, and yours is right in there.

The other factor at work may be the slight amount of erosion. More than one ballistic-lab technician I have interviewed notes that pressure tends to increase with the first signs of throat erosion--then drops as erosion becomes more severe. There are various theories about why this happens, but you want a "longer" throat, I would suggest fire-lapping it, which will provide a little more "jump" to the rifling, and smooth the roughened are just in front of the case/chamber.

Originally Posted by antelope_sniper

Here's what it looks like with the TTSX:

Code

Cartridge          : .300 WSM (CIP)
Bullet             : .308, 165, Barnes 'TTSX'BT 30368
Useable Case Capaci: 69.910 grain H2O = 4.539 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 2.860 inch = 72.64 mm
Barrel Length      : 24.0 inch = 609.6 mm
Powder             : Alliant Reloder-26 *C

Predicted data by increasing and decreasing the given charge,
incremented in steps of 0.662% of nominal charge.
CAUTION: Figures exceed maximum and minimum recommended loads !

Step    Fill. Charge   Vel.  Energy   Pmax   Pmuz  Prop.Burnt B_Time
 %       %    Grains   fps   ft.lbs    psi    psi      %        ms

-06.6  102    70.50   3026    3355   49868  11625     99.4    1.215
-06.0  102    71.00   3051    3411   51203  11672     99.5    1.200
-05.3  103    71.50   3076    3466   52580  11715     99.6    1.185
-04.6  104    72.00   3101    3522   54002  11753     99.8    1.171
-04.0  105    72.50   3125    3579   55470  11787     99.9    1.157  ! Near Maximum !
-03.3  105    73.00   3150    3635   56983  11817     99.9    1.143  ! Near Maximum !
-02.6  106    73.50   3175    3692   58549  11842    100.0    1.129  ! Near Maximum !
-02.0  107    74.00   3199    3750   60168  11863    100.0    1.115  ! Near Maximum !
-01.3  108    74.50   3224    3807   61836  11879    100.0    1.102  ! Near Maximum !
-00.7  108    75.00   3248    3865   63564  11894    100.0    1.088  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+00.0  109    75.50   3272    3923   65348  11909    100.0    1.075  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+00.7  110    76.00   3297    3982   67195  11922    100.0    1.062  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+01.3  110    76.50   3321    4040   69105  11935    100.0    1.049  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+02.0  111    77.00   3345    4099   71082  11948    100.0    1.036  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+02.6  112    77.50   3369    4159   73128  11959    100.0    1.024  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+03.3  113    78.00   3393    4218   75248  11970    100.0    1.011  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!

Results caused by ± 3% powder lot-to-lot burning rate variation using nominal charge
Data for burning rate increased by 3% relative to nominal value:
+Ba    109    75.50   3326    4052   70441  11706    100.0    1.044  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
Data for burning rate decreased by 3% relative to nominal value:
-Ba    109    75.50   3211    3778   60611  12116     99.9    1.109  ! Near Maximum !

Accubonds not much different:

Code

Cartridge          : .300 WSM (CIP)
Bullet             : .308, 165, Nosler Accubond 55602
Useable Case Capaci: 71.480 grain H2O = 4.641 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 2.860 inch = 72.64 mm
Barrel Length      : 24.0 inch = 609.6 mm
Powder             : Alliant Reloder-26 *C

Predicted data by increasing and decreasing the given charge,
incremented in steps of 0.662% of nominal charge.
CAUTION: Figures exceed maximum and minimum recommended loads !

Step    Fill. Charge   Vel.  Energy   Pmax   Pmuz  Prop.Burnt B_Time
 %       %    Grains   fps   ft.lbs    psi    psi      %        ms

-06.6  100    70.50   2986    3267   47421  11719     99.1    1.244
-06.0  100    71.00   3011    3321   48654  11773     99.3    1.229
-05.3  101    71.50   3035    3375   49925  11823     99.5    1.215
-04.6  102    72.00   3059    3429   51235  11869     99.6    1.200
-04.0  102    72.50   3084    3484   52585  11911     99.7    1.186
-03.3  103    73.00   3108    3539   53976  11948     99.8    1.172
-02.6  104    73.50   3132    3594   55412  11982     99.9    1.158  ! Near Maximum !
-02.0  104    74.00   3156    3650   56893  12011    100.0    1.145  ! Near Maximum !
-01.3  105    74.50   3180    3706   58422  12035    100.0    1.131  ! Near Maximum !
-00.7  106    75.00   3204    3762   60000  12055    100.0    1.118  ! Near Maximum !
+00.0  107    75.50   3228    3818   61625  12073    100.0    1.104  ! Near Maximum !
+00.7  107    76.00   3252    3875   63310  12089    100.0    1.091  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+01.3  108    76.50   3276    3932   65046  12105    100.0    1.078  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+02.0  109    77.00   3300    3989   66839  12120    100.0    1.065  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+02.6  109    77.50   3323    4047   68693  12135    100.0    1.053  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+03.3  110    78.00   3347    4104   70612  12149    100.0    1.040  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!

Results caused by ± 3% powder lot-to-lot burning rate variation using nominal charge
Data for burning rate increased by 3% relative to nominal value:
+Ba    107    75.50   3283    3948   66409  11868    100.0    1.072  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
Data for burning rate decreased by 3% relative to nominal value:
-Ba    107    75.50   3166    3672   57179  12257     99.7    1.139  ! Near Maximum !

Thanks for this. Based off of this it looks like it’s safe to say I’m leaving 100-150fps +/- on the table vs my RL15 loads.

I looked around and found 20 Tubb's fire lapping bullets that I had left from firelapping I've done on some other rifles.I loaded them up and went to the range this morning.After shooting all of them,I checked the velocity on a few rounds with my Magnetospeed.I guess it worked because I saw a full 100fps loss in velocity on several rounds that I knew what the velocity was running.I've fire lapped several rifles,but I never noticed a drop in velocity.I had a couple more rifles with me and checked my readings with them and they were spot on.After I got home I cleaned the rifle and scoped the bore.I could definitely tell there was a difference.I checked how much freebore I gained and it was .100 from what my original notes showed.So I guess that clearly explains the 100fps drop in velocity.So now it's figure out new loads and seating depths for this rifle.Looks like I'll be able to add a couple more grains of powder and be loading much closer to book loads now.Such is the life of a rifle looney.

Before fire lapping

After fire lapping

Looks like an improvement, not a huge one but hopefully enough.

I run VV 550 with 155’s at 3285 fps. Shoots < 1 moa. Love it.

Had to get out today

Shot the new to me 24" ,300 WSM, Tikka LH, B&C Stock, WW brass, CCI Mag primer, RL 26, and Nosler 200 GR Accu Bond best load

200 GR Nosler AB WW Brass CCI 250

RL 26 70.5 GR 2908 FPS 3 @ .81 " at 100 yards
RL 26 71 GR 2911 FPS
RL26 71.5 2943 FPS 72 gr 2933 FPS

Think 70.5 GR is where I am going to try.

Originally Posted by kk alaska

Had to get out today

Shot the new to me 24" ,300 WSM, Tikka LH, B&C Stock, WW brass, CCI Mag primer, RL 26, and Nosler 200 GR Accu Bond best load

200 GR Nosler AB WW Brass CCI 250

RL 26 70.5 GR 2908 FPS 3 @ .81 " at 100 yards
RL 26 71 GR 2911 FPS
RL26 71.5 2943 FPS 72 gr 2933 FPS

Think 70.5 GR is where I am going to try.

2900fps with a 200gr bullet is humping!

Originally Posted by ShortMag11

2900fps with a 200gr bullet is humping!

Sho’ be!

Nosler data shows 2900 FPS at max load with some powders. RL 26 is tricky does not show pressure like other powders.

Would like a quick load to guess pressures on load RL 26 has worked great in some loads like 270 Win 150 gr which some of us tried before there was published data for it.

https://load-data.nosler.com/load-data/300-winchester-short-magnum-wsm/

Originally Posted by ShortMag11

Originally Posted by kk alaska

Had to get out today

Shot the new to me 24" ,300 WSM, Tikka LH, B&C Stock, WW brass, CCI Mag primer, RL 26, and Nosler 200 GR Accu Bond best load

200 GR Nosler AB WW Brass CCI 250

RL 26 70.5 GR 2908 FPS 3 @ .81 " at 100 yards
RL 26 71 GR 2911 FPS
RL26 71.5 2943 FPS 72 gr 2933 FPS

Think 70.5 GR is where I am going to try.

2900fps with a 200gr bullet is humping!

Another 300 H&H mag load in the making maybe.

Originally Posted by kk alaska

Had to get out today

Shot the new to me 24" ,300 WSM, Tikka LH, B&C Stock, WW brass, CCI Mag primer, RL 26, and Nosler 200 GR Accu Bond best load

200 GR Nosler AB WW Brass CCI 250

RL 26 70.5 GR 2908 FPS 3 @ .81 " at 100 yards
RL 26 71 GR 2911 FPS
RL26 71.5 2943 FPS 72 gr 2933 FPS

Think 70.5 GR is where I am going to try.

Shot it again today
RL 26 70.5 GR 200 GR NAB 3 @ .74 " at 100 yards 15F still winter here

Wow, 200 gr @ 2900, that’s a heavy blow on both ends.

Primer looks normal going to load same case,s 5 times and check for expansion and tight primer pockets. Not much fun to test the recoil is fast and snappy in a LW Tikka T3 LH .