I tried the Zeiss V6 and found it underwhelming. The Swarovski Z6 was very similar to my Z3, which apparently is VERY good for it's price. I'm currently using a S&B Zenith which is ok, but want better.
Do I need to buy a ZCO or TT to get the optical performance I want?
Zeiss V8?
Obviously this scope would need to be durable was well. Used primarily for hunting in the dark timber and large fields in the evenings and mornings.
Being into photography, I love a great image with detail and contrast. Large field of view would be great also. Does this scope exist?

I am too poor to be able to help you with this, but I will go ahead and predict that someone will tell you that you don't want what you are looking for.

There is no best of anything! What one guy likes another finds fault with!

If the Zenith doesn't satisfy you then I don't think anything will.

Seems I recall a story about March scopes;

They set out to build the best scope that could be built with the materials & components available at the time. Then, after it was built, they put a price on it, not the usual of just building to a price point.

Did they succeed or at least make a very good attempt?

In terms of image rendition when it comes to a combination of color, contrast, resolution, etc., the very best I have tried has been the 2.3-13x56 Stratos (Schmidt Bender). The high-end Leicas are very, very similar in terms of a beautifully-rendered and vivid image.

But there's more to consider when selecting a hunting scope than what appeals to the eye.

In my opinion and for my money, the older Zeiss victory diavari scopes are about as good as it gets optically. The eyebox is fantastic and the view is immersive. Otherwise the newer Leicas on discount are quite good too.

In my experience once you get into the alphas you are splitting hairs with the optics and it becomes a personal preference for lens coatings and color perception, how they handle chromatic aberration, distortion, flare, etc.

If you are not happy with the zenith then I would not expect much better. I speak from experience of owning several alpha level scopes and binoculars. I am currently selling a SB PMii 5-25x56 that is phenomenal but I wouldn't want it in a dedicated hunting rifle. It's too big as are a lot of the newer top tier scopes with 34mm tubes.

The answer depends on the range of what you are engaging ….

If it’s more an 300 yards - Nightforce Competition is way up the scale

My Swarovski Z3 has slightly better contrast than my Zenith.

lol

If you don’t mind spending the money I would look at the ZCO 420.


Although I haven’t had it long enough to give it a fair review I have the 527. Hopefully I’ll get some time behind it soon.

Purpose for a rifle scope is to clearly see a target and enable the user to hit it, and not used for glassing. I would be more concerned with a quality Binocular suited to your situation.

If S&B won’t do it you might try TT but you’re talking piles of money there. The stratos is about the pinnacle...

Hint.

It took longer than I thought it would, but it was a certainty.

Key word, "Clearly". I prefer to more clearly see my target. Thank you for the lesson.

Nothing on this?

I don't know, thought this might fit the subject. No? A couple of their models have tempted me, even considering their cost.

Check out the March FX High Master. The glass and FOV are definitely there. The reticle options may or may not trip your trigger.

For me, the Tangent Theta LRH is it visually.

No contest. The Veronico Simplex scopes are the absolute very best at anything. Clarity, reliability, hit ability, optics, durability, weight, price. No need to look any further, these scopes are the epitome of everything we are all looking for

Sample variation on top scopes is imo almost more important than the name on the scope, usually as optics go anyway, again I’m talking all top tier glass. Any good sample swaro, zeiss v8, or Schmidt, NF,leica or Steiner will generally be about as good as anything while a bad sample will always seem off. Right now the smaller companies like zco or tt are really consistent from scope to scope, but if you can inspect and get a good sample swaro, Schmidt, Zeiss, Leica magnus, Steiner, it’s gonna be as good as it gets.

Zeiss and Swaro stand out in low light imo, Schmidt’s are awesome but the glare at power thing kills them for me. Minox zp5’s and the Blaser scopes are also tops as glass goes.

If buying sight unseen tt, Minox, zco are all gonna be very consistent, but a great sample of a Zeiss v8 or swaro z8 has no equal imo, especially during low light.

Which Schmidt models did you experience this with, never encountered it with a Classic or Polar? Less than impressed with Swaro Z6 scopes in lowlight but I do own a Z3 and Z5 with 50mm objectives and they are as good as the Z6 is under same circumstances(30 minutes after sunset hunting). I have experience with a Zeiss Victory HT and thought that was a great scope unfortunately I did not hold onto it. I would like to try the Zeiss Z8 and possibly the Swaro Z8 at one point. .

You are welcome. Being able to see the animal clearly is my main objective , I already know if he is shootable because he was glassed with my Binos.

If it has Schmidt + Bender, Kahles, Leica, or Swarovski on it, it’s likely as good or better than the rest out there. Fact

I'm not Xycod but regarding the glare I've only seen it in the 3-12x42 (2 of them) and an 8x56 (only 1). I use several S&B Klassik's in 6x42 and a 1.5-6x42 and it hasn't been an issue in them. I haven't seen it in a 1.1-5 Stratus or multiple 6x42 PMII's. In my experience, it's only been in harsh direct or angled light (setting sun) with the scopes mentioned and a hand over the front objective was the fix. I need to throw a sunshade on to see how much difference it makes but I've not done it yet.

This is spot on. I’ve had Z3 and Z5s that had better optics than Z6s, and one Z3 that reminded me of 30 year old cheap Burris glass. When my expectations are high, I wont mail order unless I know I can return sub par glass—-far better to look through at a store if they’ll let you inspect.

I have seen it only one time and I had a Z3 3-10x42 , the stand was facing west and I could see 10 minutes after sunset and that was it.

Testing is still inconclusive, I have been using Swarovski Z5 3.5-18X44, but Ringman has me convinced the Bushnell is a better scope…

There's a lot of Swarovski box's there. If a scope does not work well for me, I would not buy a second one. I don't think most others would either. Thats a pretty impressive pile of box's.

My 1970's - 1980's vintage Tasco 3-9 kicks arse.

Nightforce scopes are still a better scope just go to a bench rest shoot and see what they use the most for accuracy , Nightforce has the better accurate turrent adjustments and great glass. but there is a cost to use the best too .

It was mentioned by the OP so I'll note it... One thing the NXS scopes I use really stand out on is the ability to fine tune resolution with the parallax adjustment. I mainly use the 2.5-10x42 and the on target resolution can really be set with the parallax. I don't think any of the scopes I use do this as well as the NXS 2.5-10x42. When I was shooting crows yesterday, this really made the scope stand out. It went from a shootable image to seeing the shimmer of the sun on the detail of the feathers.

Pro/con on it - super detailed resolution on target but a limited depth of focus and the need to adjust if you need the finest resolution. In most cases it's plenty fine for shooting without adjusting but the resolution is always impressive to me after adjusting...and the design on the adjustment makes it really quick.

Sounds to me like you are way too picky. As Stick always says,"A scope is a bullet steering device, not a spotting scope".

Only the Tasco scopes with the Antelope on them....lol !

Truer words never spoken!

Say I own an "ABC Brand" 5-10x40 Scope, then watch the chit-storm brew! lol

KB

Oh no, you break my heart not using the scope to glass up a target.

I am convinced those who claim Swarovski z3, z5, z6 are as good as one can get lack experience with them side by side with noticeably better glass. The z8 is another story.

I expected to be getting the pop corn out and watch the show on this thread. This thread has actually turned out to be quite civil, useful, and even amusing in a good way.

The OP obviously has a passion and taste for superb optics, above and beyond most of us do. Passion drives excellence. I am thoroughly enjoying learning about those scopes that exist above the normal suspects in the Alpha Glass category.

There was a mention of the Veronico Simplex earlier in this thread I've never heard of. Google yields nothing on this. Is this a real scope or humor?

+1 did not even know that Zero Compromise even existed.

Damn man. There's some interesting Feng Shui going on in that garage.

Is that anything like Chop Sooey?

Stick envy.

Pretty much this. I’ve used S&B for over twenty years with total satisfaction. There’s a reason they are used as sniper scopes by many military forces around the world. Solid and robust with incredible clarity and resolution.

I have one of their 8 X 80 Hubble telescopes.
.
I also have a very good Swaro.
The March has better Glass even set at the same magnification.

I would Love to have one of the March hunting Scopes but the funds are not in my pocket like they were when I purchased the 8 X 80

I took my March to my favorite Gun Store when I received it.

We compared it to almost every Scope in the Store and they had Nightforce , Swaro's as well as many others.

One of the Nightforce scopes they had was the exact same price as I paid for the March.

Every Sales Rep and even a few Customers agreed that the March had the best glass out of all of the scopes we looked threw that day.

Buy a top-shelf binocular. 🤭

All this fuss about stuff that matters far less than a scope that actually works…

Like a bunch of 80 year old men, that can't see schidt, trying to measure their di cks with a tri square..

Yeah, it's a sighting device for cryin out loud. It ain't for birdwatching.

Can clearly see very distinct solar flares thru my BSA scopes.

It's almost like acupuncture for detached retinas.

Curse me later.

I have looked through most of the top end scopes but when I looked through a March it blew all of the others away. I have never seen such a crystal clear and sharp image as they give, even at the highest power setting there was no degradation.
Lot's of bucks for them and I haven't sprung for one but if I were going for the best it would be my choice.

drover

Could it be possible if you can see better you can aim better???

Oh...that was funny...mean...but funny!

I dearly love my el cheapo SWFA SS 6x42s due to their tracking/RTZ reliability, but they have on rare occasion cost me shots at critters due to their sub-par image. Critters I could clearly see and identify through my binocs (even 15X56s) in timber at dawn/dusk, at 50 or less yards. I absolutely couldn't make out the animal at all, let alone get the crosshairs where they needed to be.

I do not have an answer for the OP, but thought I'd throw that out there.

Speaking personally if I encountered this, which I have, (which is possible with any scope BTW), pass, get outta there unscathed, and kill him the next day, or the next, or the next and learn what he does...

The tradeoff is a zero compromise, for me....

That makes sense, and I have done just that. I have also missed on opportunities that just popped up out of nowhere with deer I had never seen before and never saw again.

A fair amount critters I kill are not pre-located, though plenty are.

I have the Polar series and by far its the best optic that my eyes have looked through. Like others have mentioned, if S&B doesn't satisify, then I have no options to give.

Many here don't understand that.

This experience is why I switched from Tasco.

What's your budget for this OP?

March has released the follow on version of your March-X 8-80X56 "Hubble"; it's called the March-X 8-80X56 HM WA Majesta. It features Super ED glass now, compared to the ED glass in your scope. The Majesta also has a wide-angle eyepiece with an AAOV of 24degrees. I've been playinf with a prototype for about a year now and the production model is now available. It's very spendy.

The Swaros, the TTs, the ZCOs, the S&B, the Hensoldts, the Marches, they all have great glass. The differences will be in the tweaks and various features such as knobs, reticles, etc. The one standout will be the Mach Majesta in mirage conditions and for its wide angle of view; it's the widest of any SFP scope I know and the IQ is fabulous. For FFP designs, the ZCOs and the TTs have good angle of view, but the widest is the March-FX 5-42X56 HM at 26degree, followed by the March-FX 45-28X52 at 25degrees. The TTs 3-15X50 are at 24 degrees and the ZCOs are all at 23 degrees. The S&Bs that I've looked at are between 21 to 24 degrees. I should check the Swaros.

When I took my March to the range to sight it in at the end of the day the sun was going down.
Everyone left the range and I was still shooting about 45 minutes to an hour after they were gone.

I could not see threw my Swaro. but that March was great.
I had a couple guys pack up their stuff to leave and stayed to see how long I was gunna shoot.
I let them shoot a couple rounds and they could not believe how well they could see threw the Scope.

March's Claim to fame is that they say that the point of impact does not change between the lowest setting and the Highest.
That was one of the reasons I dropped the money back then.
I was looking at an S&B but their High Power at the time was Gigantic and Heavy Cost and more than the March with lower Magnification.

funshooter I love reading your reports. My first March was the March-X 5-50X56, which is the baby brother of your March-X 8-80X56. I was upgrading from a Nightforce NXS 12-42X56. I found the March to be superior to the NXS in 2 areas: 1- brightness in the early morning competitions and 2- mirage resistance during the day. Also, the colors seemed to pop more.

The OP is a self-confessed photographer so he would be familiar with ED and Super ED glass and what they bring to the IQ table, so to speak. The 5-50X56 did a great job with the IQ, but when I looked through the March-X 10-60X56 HM with its Super ED glass, my photographer's eye could detect the greater contrast (color pop) with the Super ED glass. With the new Majesta (8-80X56 HM WA), the contrast is even better, and the wide field of view is breathtaking. But I suspect that scope is far overkill for the OP and it's SFP.

The S&B Zenith has a AAOV of 22 degrees, somwhat narrow compared to most of the FFP riflescopes I know.

Beyond the twilight factor and the light transmission and all that, I happen to believe that a wider FOV makes the whole view brigther than a narrower FOV. But that's just me.

I am just a low educated shooter.
I know what I have and I try and only state my opinion on what I my self have witnessed.
My March pissed me off real bad the first time I took it out to sight in.

I mounted it on a Custom Built M21 and I put it on a bag to steady it.
I kept loosing the Target when I adjusted the power up to 80.
It took me hours and a great frustration before I realized that at 100 yards i was looking at the Grain Structure of the paper target.

Then there was the Breathing thing and my natural jitter thing to combat when on the high magnification settings.

I found out with my lack of training that my 8X80 Scope was a GREAT spotting scope set at 80X.

The highest setting I was comfortable with shooting was around 60X.

I am not a Great shot for sure and as the light was going away and things were getting hard to see.
I placed 3 shots at 100 yards that I could cover with a nickle about 1/2" off of bulls eye.

First time out with the scope on the Rifle.

I also had to combat the scope mount loosening up after several shots.
This was not the scopes fault, It was the Mount and I addressed that before the next time I took the rig out shooting.

My rig is a pretty sweet rig between the Custom M21 and the March 8X80.

It took Springfield 2+ years to build my M21 the way I wanted it.
They told me that it had been over 5 years before they had built one the way I wanted it and all I changed was the I had them put the Kreger barrel on it and I upgraded the Trigger to the Whitefeather trigger.

The March Scope was the second one that they shipped into Commyfornia.
That came from the March rep. that I talked to about my Scope when they shipped it.

funshooter, I loved your story. I totally appreciate the fact you only want to talk about stuff you have experienced yourself. I try to do the same, but I also add that I can discuss and compare specifications found at various websites.

I bought my first March from Kelbly's about 10 years ago.

I Purchased mine probably around that time as well.

Back then Kelbly's had GREAT customer service they treated me GREAT and kept me informed with the entire process on getting my Scope.

It has been way to long since I have looked at their web page Years in fact.

Ted you’ve been around here, otc tags, lotsa people, 20 yard visabilty, brushy, wet, even in (open) country around here, you only get 1 chance around here, and western Oregon, western Montana and north Idaho. Better make er count. That said, a “scope” has never costed me an animal. Big bullets, ass shots, do nice things. YMMV

10-60x52

dave

Sweet

I have regrets about a beautiful Leupold VX-7 2.5-10x44mm that I bought from and sold to another here on the fire. I never had it mounted on a rifle or I wouldn’t have sold it. Something about it and my eyes made it truly impressive to me.

I have a Swaro z5 that hasn’t been the start of a beautiful relationship. It wouldn’t focus at 100 meters without adjusting the power ring, the parallax knob, and the eye focus all simultaneously. Bought it brand new from CameralandNY, i was hoping they would swap it out for me and handle issue themselves. Instead I got to deal with Swaro during their “systems” transition last December. Not much luck until CameralandNY gave me a guy’s direct contact info there who really took care of me after that. There was a completely inoperable parallax mechanism inside scope as the culprit. Still took a month though and missed deer season with that rifle Dec 2022. I have high hopes for it this year.

Some will say it is blasphemy, but the Leupold VX-6 3-18x44mm with center dot illumination and windplex reticle never ceases to impress me when I am hunting with it. I have it on my stainless x-bolt in 30-06, my buddy has two of them on Tikkas, one a 30-06 and the other a 300 win mag. We have never lost an animal from any of these rifles, and our shots 80% of the time are in the first or last 15 minutes of daylight. Something about them makes the image seen through it really “pop” for my eyes.

I grab my loaner 30-06 nowdays and the Burris Fullfield II 3.5-10x with LRS illumination on the BDC reticle is a challenge for me in those first or last 15 minutes now that my eyes are 13 years older. That scope was one of my first purchases off the fire when I first joined 13 years ago. Someone recommended it as it was on closeout and being discontinued. Turns out it is kind of a desirable scope still to this day with its electronic illumination control, not a rheostat control on the ocular tube. I have it on a S&W I-bolt 30-06 with the factory T/C made 5r riflined barrel and factory Timney trigger. I call it my “loaner” rifle, seem to hand it out every year to someone who needs it. This past season was a friend of a friend who’s son was obsessed with getting his first deer. I helped them scope an old family hirloom win 94 30-30 with some weird scout rail setup utilizing he rear sight dovetail, a side screw on action and a barrel pressure screw up front o prevent the front 4” of rail from acting like a diving board. Cheap Vortex 2-7x scout scope and we finally got it to hold around a 4” group at 100 yards. I gave the dad my 30-06 loaner just so he would have something also if the opportunity arose. Well i guess the kid looked the “look” of a cheap camo pattern on a plastic stocked beater 30-06 and wanted to use it instead. I got a video a week later of his first kill, man was he excited. To me that is what it’s all about. This family moved to TN from California for a better life. Both parents are school teachers so no guns owned other than the 30-30 and a pump 12 gauge and not a lot of money to spare for a scoped deer rifle. I was tickled happy they were successful, told them they can borrow the rifle every season if they want to. Glad to help someone enjoy the sport. Sorry for the rambling post, let’s see if i can post the video.

Benefit to old age, can't really see the total difference. I like my March 50x52, and my Nightforce competition.

Is that Sako stock off to the right for sale? What action size? TIA.

I have a Z3 it's about the same as my Zeiss 3-9 conquest.

Like another poster has said, this has been a very good thread to read and I have learned much from many here through their experiences.

Thank you.

Thanks for the good input, men.
Take care.