I've read some posts that say when they moved production of many scopes to China, I've read others that said when Meade bought them, but I'm wondering when you all think it dropped off? Were the Meade ones better than the ones put out today?

The reason I ask this is I'd always assumed when production moved to China. However, I have an older Deerfield 3-9x32 that was made while Meade owned them. Being a lower end model it was made in China, but the quality still seems to be decent. It's held it's zero for years through lots of rough abuse. I've dropped the gun, knocked it over, banged it around, etc and it has always still shot to the same POI. The tracking also seems pretty good on it, and the glass is surprisingly good. Really, just everything about this scope has been good and I wish I had bought 10 of them.

I thought maybe I got lucky, but then started thinking about it, and the majority of guys I hunt with also use Simmons scopes. Most of theirs are also cheaper models from when Meade owned Simmons, and most of them are made in China. A few are Aetec's, etc, but most of them are the Blazer scopes. Surprisingly they have all held up pretty well and most of the owners are extremely rough on their guns. I'm talking being dropped out of trucks, throw around, bouncing around in the truck and tractor for years, and just being extremely rough. These were mostly from around the time period of when mine was made or a little earlier. These things seem to hold the POI from year to year, and also have pretty decent glass. Overall, I've actually had pretty good luck with most of the made in China scopes I've used.

Then fast forward to the recent ones we've used that were made after Bushnell took over. I've had 2 one marked Blazer that came on a gun. The glass was surprisingly decent and it did hold up well and held zero through some pretty rough conditions. However, the tracking was way off. Instead of one click moving it 1/4" at 100 yards it was more like one click per inch. I ended up using this for a while thinking for $40 it was a good scope, and sold it off to upgrade. I later got a like new Simmons 8 Point 3-9x40 in a package when I bought a used Leupold scope. He said it was brand new, but didn't have the box. I have no idea if he was telling me the truth or not, but I had no reason to doubt him as it looked new with no marks on it. I mounted it on a 30-06 and it lasted 6 shots before something that looked like a chip of paint started floating around inside blocking your view. It still held zero, but it was hard to get a good sight picture through it.

Then another friend has one he bought a couple of years ago, but after Bushnell took over, and his is an Aetec. He had trouble trying to sight it in, and come to find out what it is is that the adjustments on it are marked backwards, and it tracks horribly.

So this has gotten me to wondering if the quality dropped off when Bushnell took over, or if we just were lucky with the Meade ones, and not so lucky with the Bushnell ones? The other thing that has prompted me to ask this is every other Bushnell product I've owned has left me disappointed in some way. I've also noticed that Butler Creek flip up caps quality has really deteriorated in the last year or so, and I've seen many other posts claiming it has also. When I looked up a customer service number, guess who owns them now? Bushnell. So I just wondered if you all thought Simmons quality dropped off when Bushnell took over, or if it was before that when Meade took over, or when production moved to China?

From the beginning................

I have 2 of the older Aetec 2.8-10x that were made in the Phillippines. They have always worked OK on the inline muzzleloaders I've put them on.

The older Aetec 2.8-10x44 Phillipines Simmons were the best rifle scope Simmons ever made IMO. I have two of those scopes and rank them right with several much more expensive scopes I own. Those two Aetecs are the only cheap scopes I've ever owned that earned enough confidence to make it above rimfire level. One of those Aetecs is on a smokeless Savage ML10 and has held zero for 10 years on that rifle through some nasty conditions and treatment. It handles rain on the lenses better than my Leupolds or Nikons, works very well in low light, tracks well, and has just plain been tough on many rough hunts.

Most of all the other Simmons I've tinkered with has been junk. Losing zero, terrible glass, yada yada...

I'll throw in the original 44 mag Simmons... had several in my younger (broker) days and they still work 30 years later

slowr1der,

IT makes no difference to me and my son-in-law when Simmons quality was good or not. Every one he or I had went bad right away. Therefore we no longer buy them.

But his brother bought a Savage package deal which included a Simons 3-9X. No problems yet.

About twenty years ago I purchased a Freedom Arms .454 without sights. I called Simmons and talked with Ernie Simmons. He told me his scope could no handle the recoil of the .454 yet but thought he would have the problem solved in about a year. He went on to inform me if I purchased one he would replace every one I broke with no cost to me.

He and I agreed it would benifit UPS but not him or me.

I think they've always been crappy. I bought an Atec 2.5x10x44 (maybe a 3x9x44) 15 years ago and the reticle changed point of aim 6 inches at 100 yards when going from low to high power. Swore I'd never own one again...and haven't. Personally, I'd choose bushnell or tasco for lowend scopes over simmons everytime.

When was Simmons ever associated with quality? All I've seen were JUNK.

working and quality are 2 different things

In answer to the title of the thread and the OP...I don't think quality was noticeably poor on a Simmons until the first consumer opened the first box and tried to use the first scope....

I agree with those above, the original Aetec and 44 Mag scopes were very optics for the money. Also, their Gold Medal line was comparable to some of the higher priced scopes of the time. Once they went Chinese, though, quality really took a dive.

I don't believe I've ever seen the words "Simmons" and "quality" used in the same sentence.

I remember years ago when they were in Ga. and they blocked my phone, I could'nt call em, he he. So we ain't on speakin terms.

The filippino Aetecs were pretty good and I have 2 Whitetail Expeditions that are as bright and clear as anything I've seen including my Conquest. But these were not your Wal-mart blister pack scopes. I paid about $250 each for them. You can still find them every now and then on ebay and other auctions but be ready to shell out some cash, they ain't cheap.

I have four different Straight 4 power Whitetail Classics..
I am not a big fans of Simmons (although I'd take them over Barska or BSA).. but these 4 power scopes with 40 mm objective are very clear and very rugged scopes..

I bought one, got it home.. after looking at it closer, since they were on sale for $49.00, I went back to the store and bought the remaining three... don't know what their price was new, but these were on close out...

they are better than my Leupold 4 powers for field of view and clarity...

Before simmons went through the run of owners of the brand name they made a few good scopes. I have a early 90's 6x18x40 pro hunter that is a very good scope. A 6.5x20x50 Whitetail classic from the mid 90's that is a good scope. I also have 2 Atec scopes from about 2008 or so. A fair product but not up to the prohunter in real quality.

To be honest I have never thought of Simmons and Quality in the same sentance.

gee, that's what I was gonna say.

There's a reason for that...

the phillipine made aetec was a very scope. i buy them used when ever i find them at a good price. they resell fast. i know guys that use nothing but these scopes and love them.

Between the 44 Mag and "Master Series" would be my guess.

I bought two of the "Master Series" 22 scopes after a well known writer reviewed a similar model, and they have been awful.

Being that I can't afford to put a Leupold of which I own two,on all my rifles, I have about five Simmons Aetecs, two Simmons Whitetail, and a Simmons ATV, and all have worked pretty good for me. I have never seen a good Blazer of which I have one and removed from the rifle that I had it mounted on and the same goes for a Simmons 8 point. Those have always been lousy scopes and were garbage all the time no matter when or where they were made.I also have a few other low end scopes such as Bushnell, and Tasco that have also worked ok for me. The best scope I have is a Weaver Classic Extreme. The Weaver Classic Extreme is better than my Leupold Vari X III's and is comparable in quality to the Zeiss's, and Steiners and the likes. The above mentioned Simmons are not good or great scopes...they are good enough!
My advice is...if the rifle's a good one, get the best optics you can afford to put on it.

I've owned a few Simmons scopes, a couple of 22 Mags (3-9x 32mm and a 3-9x 32 AO) and what was supposed to be their top of the line scope, a Presidential series Target and Varmint 6-20X AO. All were junk, and I've never seen any Simmons scopes owned by anyone that I've personally known that weren't junk. I would have to politely turn down any offer of even a free one, they are trash.

I have a 44 mag that was made in Japan. I bought it new around 1990. I like it better than the Nikon Buckmaster I own. It's been mounted on at least 5 rifles over the years. Still bright and always holds it's point of impact and has no parallax or tracking issues. I wouldn't want to bet on a chinese model.

10-4 that

when they sold the first scope and it had to be returned