I've found a VX2 1-4, that I'm considering having a #1 installed in, to ride on a custom .357 Max bbl for deer/hogs at <200. Any further insight on the reticle vs HD, #4, and P&D for speed and low light use, would be appreciated. Already have some HDs on other Leupys, and like them just fine.

I did find some opinion from Chuck Hawks about the German #1, that gave me a chuckle:

At the risk of making you chuckle again, I'm inclined to agree with chuckhawks. I have a Hensoldt with a Nr 1 reticle sitting on the shelf. I found that it was not well-suited to taking precise aim, and while the reticle occupies a lot of real estate it seemed that you don't find the top of the point consistently and quickly like you find the middle with a Nr 4. It seems like a reticle for the person used to open sights with a barleycorn front (an arrangement I'm not keen on either). It may be different with other scopes with this reticle, and YMMV, but that was my experience.

In any case a scope with the Nr 4 reticle replaced the Hensoldt and it has proved (like the others I have with that reticle) to be very good in low light and for speed on flushing and running game. The big side bars lead you to the middle while the crosshair allows good aim without blocking the view. For pigs at <200 (or more, for that matter), quick shots and low light included, it is my choice.

The Leupold version of the G#4, and being unsure of which/what I'd get and what it would look like, has me exploring other options for this 1-4. I've seen pics of Leupold #4s that are either very wide in the middle or thin on the sides and bottom....either of which would have me opt for another HD OR a #1? Also, speed/low light would be worth more than a couple of inches of extra precision, if that's all the fat post of a #1 would cost me on a 357 max to 200. I have a .358 under a low power vx3 with the HD, that is great to as far as I want, but just wondering if the 1 or 4 would be even better. What I've seen of the #1 (pics), makes it appear as if the center post point would act like a trijicon/bindon triangle 'point'? If your experience is that that's not the case, I'm kinda at a continued indecision, until I can look through a #4 and/or #1, first hand. I comprehend it having a precision handicap, but it's hard to fathom it would be 'bad' in low light, or slow to acquire....then again, it's imagined use would be more akin to irons that you could see in low light, w/magnification available in a pinch, so my perspective may be inaccurate to begin with. LOL

Thanks.

I did not like the G#1 that I had, but others love them.

To me, it would seem that you'd have to try it and it will become apparent to you very quickly whether it is good for your situation or not.

I have 4 scopes with the P&D reticle but I admit my hunting ends 1/2 hour after sunset. They work well hunting on overcast days in brush.

I have one in the #1 and don't like it near as well as I do the half dozen I have in #4!

I have one in a Meopro 6x. I had no problems shooting nice groups with it and if it caused me any ill killing a deer last year, I couldn't tell.

If you're the kind of guy that spends lots of time behind the scope trying to get just that right hold, you ain't gonna like it. If you bring a rifle up, but it on the spot and slap the trigger, you'll be fine.

I have an old Zeiss/Jena 6X with the #1 and have taken a few deer with it. IMO, works great for me. If I can see the deer I can see the reticle and I can't say that about all the scopes I own.

I bought a Meopta 6X with the #1 earlier this year. I haven't hunted it yet but shooting good groups hasn't been a problem. I have it sighted in where the bullets hit 2" high above the pointy #1 tip at 100yds.

Thanks for the input. It seems that maybe if you are used to irons or alternate presentations, then a #1 is fine, fast, and good in low light. It seems that if your preference is fine crosshairs and replicating bench practices, it'd annoy you?

Next: WHICH #4?.... Is an issue, and if I can't know/see one, then most any other reticle becomes better, by default.....including a #1.....if a #4 is too open or too thin, it's got to be worse than anything NOT too open or too thin, in low light, brush, etc.....a#4 done right is nice (Zeiss I've seen).

Well, I'm used to irons, have used them for 40 years and continue to use them, and actually don't have a preference for fine crosshairs, nor much use for benchrests, but yet found the Nr 1 reticle didn't suit me.

I also have shot a fair number of running pigs, sometimes several one after another before they get away (the odd few running at me too), as well as other game of various sizes, and I do a fair bit of it in poor light. Having tried both types of reticle, I far prefer the Nr 4.

But you may like it. The only way to really know is to get behind one. Preferably shoot it a bit too. I gave mine a fair workout before deciding that no, it is not for me. You may come to a different view.

I like my no.1 in Leupold 1.75-6x. Used to kill couple deer at 70ish yards in deep woods few years back.

Not currently mounted, but trying to get it on my Frontier .358 as BUG for elk this fall.

Really wish Leup folks woul do modern take on old Weaver Post & Crosshair. Son's got mine on his .300 Blackout TC.

ETA: that's the No.1 reticle scope on the CTR in the pic below.

Here's the Nazi #1 in the Meopro 6x42. Bought it for hunting in the 'woods'

Thanks for the pics, steel. IF the Leupold #4 was that thick on the edges, and that tight in the middle, I'd 'think' it would be the better of the two, but I don't know (firsthand), how wide or thin the Leupold #4 is, and I've seen some pics of them, where they looked like a thin, wide duplex.....which would be a no-go for my needs. I'll call them Monday, and maybe they can straighten me out.

Have four with the #1. Two Leicas, one Kahles and one Meopta. I like it. Good for point and shoot. In many ways I like it better than my #4 and plex reticles. Depends on what type of hunting you will be using it for.

Here is a #4 Nazi in the Meopro 6x42, not that it helps you with your current scope, but lets you know what is out there.

I'm assuming your 1-4x is a standard duplex? I'd likely throw a heavy duplex in it and rock on.

A #1 with CDS would be good?

That's a great #4, but I don't think Leupy's remotely resembles it.
I'm tied to tiny scopes, with low power/light weight for this rig....but this is a special 'package' of barrels/optics, for UL, pack/travel. I'd like that in my 6x or 1.5-6/2-8 stuff, though.

Just get the Post and Duplex and have the best of both worlds. powdr

As far as I know, that's just the standard duplex, w/o a top half?

I stole this from someone on the 'Fire. I have some with it and like it as well.

Nothing but love the Leupold Nazi #1.

Great reticle IMO.




Travis

I've used the Leupld Medium Duplex, the "Post & Duplex," the Heavy Duplex, and the German #1 in my 4X Leupolds. I've also used a version of the 4a, as well as the Medium Duplex and the Heavy Duplex in my 6X Leupolds.
In the 4X scopes, the Heavy Duplex was simply too heavy for my tastes. I prefer the Post & Duplex or the Medium Duplex. But, for the shorter ranges, I found no drawbacks from the German #1. It's as fast as anything I've used. It shows up better in bad light than anything I've tried. I've had no trouble shooting the smallest groups my rifle can throw with it. Above all, it works better than anything I've used at night. It's only drawback is that's its awkward to use when one must holdover a target at the plus 300 yd. ranges.
While we are on the subject, I also much prefer the Heavy Duplex in my 6X scopes because the thin opening allows me to range a game animal, like a deer or an elk, with it. Something I couldn't do with the 4A I had at one time. E

What scope ?

Liked the 4x I had on a 357 Marlin - very fast in target.
Steelhead is correct. Bold. Would be good on dark game at dark thirty. Fading light also fades shooting distance.
HD good, like proper G4, the PD is like a D with missing top half - but spacing greater from thin to thick.

Close range dim light and dark game is where
G1 will shine IMO

Well I have a 6 x 42 Leupold with a German # 1 mounted on my old 7 x 57! I never noticed any disadvantage while hunting big game as apposed to the internet rule of thumb! As for Chuck Hawk a legend in his own mind! The Russians still use it on the SVD's, for most big game applications it works just fine! I like it so much that when my current scope gives up the ghost on my 338 I am going to put a sight with a German # 1 on that one too!

My 6.5x57R/16 gaugae drilling has a Hensoldt 4x with the #1 reticle. Have found it easy to shoot 1" groups at 100 yards, and big game out to the ranges I usually shoot them. It shows up great in dim light.

Got a couple of Leupolds with the German # 1....

I look at it the same way as a target dot, or a red dot...

you have a big finger pointing right there... put the end of it on what you are aiming at AND PULL THE TRIGGER...

I put one on a varmint rifle for shooting sage rats, which run at 90 mph and switch directions at the drop of a hat and then stop just as quick...

the entire upper end of the scope being clear helps track them and then when they stop, if they are within 200 yds, you just quick put the steeple point on them and pull the trigger...

gave very quick target acquisition...

Looking at Leupold's Webb site, the reticles are shown. If the images are true representations, the #4 is wider than the wide duplex. To me, it is not acceptable.

To my eye, their version of the #1 is good, P&C good, much better than #4, and followed by HD for usefulness for hunting game. Small varmints and target shooting would change that opinion.

In the mid '60s, I had a cheap Japan scope with a #1 on a 6mm 600 carbine. That rig, at less than $90 dealer cost to me was amazing. It was no trouble to shoot 1/2" groups, often less, using a black 1" target paster as the aiming point.

Jack

I believe it was a 2.5-8x. As I said, I 'lifted' the photo from the 'Fire.

If you can access Leupold's subtensions, the #4, the post and duplex, and the duplex are all different in size of wire used, opening width and size of horizontal and vertical posts used. powdr

Think I'll try the #1 on this one, and try the #4 and P&D on my next 1.75-6/2.5-8/or fixed 2.5/4/6 stuff I play with.....just to run the gamut....and compare to meopta and Zeiss #4s. Gives me another excuse to overflow the current safe. 😀

Steely needs to put up his picture w/the #1 aimed at small cans and bottles. That should take away any doubt about it's ability. powdr

I would use the G1 in a 4x and 6x. In 2.5 the FX I had with Wide duplex faded at dusk and was not contrasting on a coon at 70 yes in the woods at dusk. When a doe showed up, same spot I dropped her - But an HD might be the best way in that scope. Not sure if the G1 would be any improvement and would check custom shop to ask what specs. Would want to be sure it was to my liking. Again the 4x I had worked great.

Years ago used an 2.5x M8 std duplex on running tree squirrels on a Marlin 75 HC at dark thirty - granted a clear day looking towards the sky. Did well.

250yds with the Nazi #1.

Accuracy won't be an issue.





Travis

Another group @ 350.

Yeah, I think the guys that overthink everything will have a problem with the Nazi #1. If you're the type that just grabs and rifle and shoots, you'll have no problems.

There's a time for either, but where and how this rig is intended to hunt, having time for much pre-shot thought, is nil.

I tend to shoot a bit high when firing quickly with a #1. I think my eye is telling me to use the thickest part of the post rather than the point.

I've got two of the German #1, both Leupold scopes. One is an FX-3 6 x 42, the other a VX-II 3-9 x 40. I would much rather hunt with these than any thing else, but my hunting is all done without a holdover. Shoot at paper it works as well for me as anything else. On the variable scope the bars get wider and the opening between the two is larger at the lowest power. The bars are thinner and the gate narrower at the highest power. I find it the best at 6X, but just fine throughout the range.

I have two of the old Post with crosswire. I like those, but not as much.

I've got a Kahles Helia L 3-12x56 no.1 and initially worried that shooting it accurately would be an issue. I was pleasantly surprised that it posed no problem shooting paper at 200yrds. I wanted to see how it would do and mounted it on a sub 1/2 MOA .308 that I'm particularly comfortable with—— put the point of the main post in on the same spot and the bullets all land on top of each other. In this particular case the #1 reticle is in the FF making it less than ideal for long range use. As the magnification is increase, the size of the reticle increases. At 12x it's pretty hug. For low light, this setup might be perfect.