Some time back, somebody on the forum trash mouthed the Leupold VX2 6-18. I had one, and it worked fine for a few years, but just died. It was on my 223, and the previous scope also died. I shoot the rifle way more than any other rifle I have, so am I just beating up scopes with a puny little 223? Maybe I need something tougher, though I'm not sure exactly what that will be. For the time being, I put an extra Leupold 4.5-14 on it. What say you?

If you want more range out of your 223...AI it...quite throwing your rifle downrange at your target.

try a Bushnell lrhs.

Thanks for the report 603C.

What failed? Zero retention, reticle broke, tracking?

Also curious how many rounds and ring spacing. Was it on a SCAR by any chance

Jason

It was on a Ruger Hawkeye in 223. As for exactly what's wrong, I don't know. I just had a wandering zero. Probably some folks wouldn't have noticed, but I went from 1/2 inch groups to 1.5 inch groups, with no reason for that. Similar to the issue I had with its predecessor, a Nikon Monarch 4-16. Put the 4.5-14 on it and all is well. As for round count, call it 300 or so.

For now anyway...^^^^^^

Now that you mention that both scopes were on a Ruger, my guess would be mechanical stress from the rings.

The fist thing I would do is run a lapping bar through those rings to check alignment.

It likely was me trashing the 6x18s. I have 2 of them. Both have been back to Leopold 3 times each. Mine quit holding zero after about 300 rounds.the cause was a faulty erector spring. They simply weren't,strong enough and there is only a single spring.it isn't strong enough for long term dialing. I also has one scope with a poi problem.from 6x to 18x there was a 2 inch difference at 200yds. The glass was good and I don't hold a personal bent against Leopold. This was simply my experience and 6 combined return trips isn't a fluke.

Long, thin tubes do no favores with zero retention or durability and the Leupold 6-18x is a notorious failure.



Very few scopes are actually meant to be shot. Leupold variables aren't them.

Formidulous: I currently have half a dozen (six!) Leupold 6x18 variable scopes and have owned a few others (3 or 4 for sure) in the past - all have been mounted on Varmint and Antelope Rifles.
I have as yet to notice any kind of failures.
In addition to my first hand experiences the 6x18 Leupolds are a favorite among my sizeable cadre of Varmint Hunting partners - again NO failures to date that I am aware of.
I heartily disagree with your contention regarding the "notorious failure of the 6-18x Leupold"!
IF... the Leupold 6x18 variables actually had a "notorious failure rate" like YOU contend, I doubt that they would retain their re-sale value as strongly as they do!
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

I called Leupold about the scope. As expected they'll fix it. One thing I never really liked about that scope is the LRDV reticle. Nothing really wrong with it, but it just isn't great. I asked for other reticle options, but they don't offer all the ones they'll put in the VX3's. I have my extra Leupold, an old refurbished VariX-III, on the 223 and I think I'll leave it there. I had them put the Varmint Hunter reticle in it last year and they put new guts in it while they had it. The VX2 will become my 'extra' scope now. It's my least favorite of the scopes I have.

Varmint guy, I have 2 6x18s that I will sell you. Let me know if you are interested. Both are just back from Leopold. Glass is good.fine duplex reticle.

I have several Leupold scopes and none have needed service.

Now we have somebody wanting to sell some that are just
back from service.

What is wrong with this story ?

Nothing wrong at all. I simply have 2 of these scopes that have brand new erectors in them because the the others have quit working after some use. They likely will work very well for you since they never fail.$350 each. I will ship. I'm going to take the money and buy another SWFA. They don't break.

LOL!

I've killed schitloads of animals, made my longest shot on a coyote (934), shot amazing groups, and used the exact scope in competition with results that most would envy.

I've got 2. One is on a 17HMR. This is what it does pretty regular like...



More from the "scope that should not be shot"....

565 seated with Sticks...

In defense of Formid--whatever, his criteria is a bit different than most. What fails in his environment may very well last another a lifetime. This does not make his opinion, based on experience, wrong. It does, however, offer a very real benchmark against which to compare ones own experience.

Much like the Mil Spec AR argument, different folks have different needs.

Got a 4 x 16 Tasco on top of one of my 223s....

Its had at least 3,000 rounds fired from underneath it...
and it still works fine...

I must be lucky, we all knowing how Tascos just won't hold up at all....

BINGO, Best bang for buck with target turret, sure a 7 STW, 338 Lapua or 50 cal can shake a 4K German glass scope loose!
very best WinPoor

All VX2 action.

Wait a minute Rick......I don't see a couch anywhere in those pics. . . lol

I actually have 3. I forgot!

I've used them for years on hunt after hunt, range session after range session, dialing them up and back with no failures.

I did send one back to Leupold once after I fell with an 80# pack full of venison and took a big chunk out of the objective lens.

I have a lot of confidence in the VX2

rcamuglia,

Didn't you have a lot of confidence in the two Leupolds right before they failed earlier this year? Safe to say I've had more than three 6-18x Leupolds.

There's a couple of interesting threads over on snipershide right now..... Crazy what happens when people actually start testing their scopes instead of just believing the hype. So far about 30-40% of Leupolds that have been tested are showing major issues straight out of the box.... Almost like there's an echo.....






lilysdad,


Long, thin tubes do no favors with zero retention and durability. The 6-18x's do not fend abuse well, and consequently tend to show issues more quickly than most.

I am not disagreeing, and I have the same opinion...that being said, the majority of folks I know will shoot a box, maybe two, a year, and twisting turrets only applies when they boresight.

He fails to ever recognize that fact. Which is why, when you said this.....





I had to agree with you 100%.

Indeed.


It's when more is asked of a scope that problems show up like herpes. The two box a year hunter would do well to look towards Leupold's fixed power scopes like the 6x. They work decently well in that regards.


Optic failures cause WAAAY more misses then all other gun problems combined and are a source of daily aggregation and lightbulb moments for most.

JG,

With your vast experience shooting and scopes- how many rounds do you think on average a Leupold 6-18x will go before a "regular" hunter that dials it will have enough of a failure that it would likely be irresponsible to shoot at a deer at 400-500 yards?

I have no clue, and you don't either.

What I do know though, is that since 1970, hunting the way I hunt, I've only had one scope lose zero, a Swaro.

Actually I do. Doing is better than guessing.

The last four I've used-

1) A bit over a thousand before consistent zero shifts.

2) Less than 20 rounds.

3) Less than 60 rounds.


4) Approximately 250.



Are the some that go a long time without issues? Of course. However that has little relevance to someone that has already had one fail or to someone looking to get one. The reality is that when taken in aggregate they fail at a relatively high rate with relatively low round counts.


That Swaro... It's also one that I might have said once or twice that had the exact problem you saw, huh?

I certainly didn't need you to tell me that about the Swaro. Many have said it here. Explain why no other Leupy Vari-X up through the VX6 has ever bobbled in my world, for 40+ years. If you had never twisted any of those 4 scopes, except to zero, they may still be fine and hold POI for the next 30 years. Who can say?

And someone who has had one fail, whatever the model, is of little relevance to someone who has never had one fail.

Fotis had a NF fail, therefore, everyone should beware I guess.

Deja Vu!

Fotis did not have a Nightforce fail. Do you actually read or just make up things to fit what you want?


How many times do you figure that a turrets gets turned in 20 rounds?

Dude...did you load blasting caps in those rife cases?? Nasty!!

Almost paranormal that some people just never have a problem with L scopes and some people do, just down right spooky odd.

He didn't? Guess he made all this up.........3/30/15.. You yourself posted in this thread.

As I went through the routines with both of my 6x18s, I saw somewhat of a pattern. They stayed spot on until about 250 or 300 rnds. Then I would dial for distance, generally between 400 and 500 yds (243) and shoot. It was the return to zero that began to be the issue. When I would check the zero, it would generally be 1 or 2 clicks high. On coyotes at distance that could be a deal breaker. As time went on I would start to get 1 or 2 clicks of horizontal movement, over a couple of weeks. Please understand that I used the rifle for work, and was calling with it 2-4 days a week, and it was in the truck every day. The folks at leupold said the erector spring got weak with that use and or abuse. I believe the newer leupolds have dual erector springs and that may help. I just don't think that the 6x18s were made to hold up to the daily grind I needed out of them. For the hunter shooting a box of shells per year they may work fine.

I've [bleep] Reupie 6-18's for a looonnngggggggg while.

Mainly because they are USELESS pieces of schit,that only satiate THE most fhuqking STUPID Kchuntsumer(s).

Their "tracking" is a fhuqking joke,their subtention follows suit(schit reticles),POA/POI shifts like a dog taking a schit,the erector "travel" is embarassing and they are incapable of holding a zero.

Just for starters.

Hint.






(Addendum...for THE Clueless Kchunt)

'Lia,

Oh myyyyyyyyyyy that is compelling "testimony". Laffin'!

Kudos for really flogging on said glass. Laffin'! You godaaamanned nearly shifted "power" and almost fhuqking nearly,shook the reticle out. Laffin'!!

You really get after it!

Wow!

What a phuging idiot.

I might even pay (at least for gas to get there) to see a shoot-off between Rick, Boxer and Formid. It would be especially interesting if at least one phase required 6-18 Leupolds.

I'd pay for gas just to see those guys in the same room.

There's one held every month at NRA's Whittington Center which will expose posers...

I attend regularly.

August SRM Results

I'll cover the hotel accommodations if we can get John Burns in the mix.

How about a phase where 6x was max magnification, whatever the scope?

JG,

That is not a failure. When Leupolds do it, and they do, it is not a failure. Every single scope, from every company can and will have dust that can accumulate on the glass. There is grease in the tube to hold it and he could have smacked it on a book and it would have fixed the issue, as that's more than likely what NF did.....

Hilarious. You should show up too.

I figured that would be your response. But I never claimed 6x was "the best" for your kind of match, or that I was a long range match shooter either.

If we have a "6x beef" it's because you made some pretty strong statements about what couldn't be done with one even at short range, and I simply know better from experience.

I had more problems with Leupold 8.5X20 LRT than my Leupolds 6X18. That's why I sold all my 8.5X25 LRT and bought Nightforce scopes. BTW I have 13 6X18's not one back to the factory, I have the some of the first ones they made and I also have the newer CDS dial ones.

I would pay $100 and drive to some neutral state in a Ford pinto to see the "event". Pinto's never had problems either, great cars.

any one there use the L 6-18?

Ol' hole in the horn Camuglia kicked some arse!

LMAO. Did you hear the one about the Pinto that hit the guy on a bicycle? Guy on the bike rode off, didn't even stop to help.

Well, good day there Boxer. How are you this bright, shiny morn?

I'm curious if there are bending or torsional modes that cause failures with the Leupo 6-18x under 'typical' mounting and excitation conditions, but not in certain other conditions

In other words...

Let's say that Ric's scopes are mounted in such a way that these bending and torsional modes do not stress the scope to the point of failure. Certainly this would make him think the Leupo 6-18x is just fine and dandy. Whereas others have the same scope mounted differently (typical) and with a rifle exhibiting different whole-body recoil characteristics which create different bending and torsional modes... and ultimate failure of the erector system. Note that by "mounted differently" I don't mean inadequate or inferior.

The Leupold 6-18x appears to have a reputation for not being durable in terms of zero retention or repeatability. I've heard this from others besides Formi and Boxer. Any scope could fail, and 603C had one that did. It's anecdotal evidence, but I admit that its created a bias in my mind against the 6-18x since I've heard it from several different sources.

Conversely, there seems to be certain scopes where it appears rare that failures occur in comparison. But regarding the Leupo 6-18x, it seems suspicious that it has the reputation that it does which would lead one to believe that durability depends on response to excitation. Make sense?

All that to say... if a scope only survives under certain "ideal" conditions, it might be best to heed anecdotal evidence that seems to point to the fact that failure is a definite possibility

J

Along those lines, I'd be interested in instrumenting and analyzing different rifle/scope combos to see if we can actually learn something regarding the bending and torsional modes. I don't know much about this stuff, but have a basic understanding which might help confirm or deny the anecdotal observations.

In the interest of full disclosure, I suspect that the Leupo 6-18x doesn't hold up well. Whether this is due to OAL, erector spring design, maintube thickness, mounting conditions, or excitation, I have no clue.

I have the means to collect objective data for a correlation experiment to support or refute the anecdotal evidence, based on the modes. We just need the specimens.

That is pretty much par for that course. Rick has shown time and again that he can shoot, clays or LR.



How about the booze??

You guys got me log back in for this???

This is what comes from using your scope as a carry handle....

David

I missed that thread but will need to check it out

I have a 3X9 Tasco from the 70's, no telling how many rounds and whitetails, super clear glass! Ive photo somewhere! I understand the later ones were cheapened up and trouble! This one is bullet proof, I loaned the rig to a BIL 15 years ago and I check it each deer season, dead nuts and the azz hole uses it as a handle 99% of the time!!! v best WinPoor
I wish I had 5 of em ,just like it! Came on a super accurate 30-06 Weatherby that I hunted 30 years! Its still pilling em up!

They've been on and off of a few rifles. .243 WSSM, .17 HMR, .223 Rem, 7mm Weatherby, but most rounds have been fired with a .300 WM underneath. All mounted in Leupold rings and bases. If they can take that licking and keep on ticking...





Then 'flave would crash the party