Setting up a gun for my daughter to deer hunt with for the first time this year, .260 Rem barrel on my Encore frame and looking at a low to mid power scope since she will not be shooting over 75-100yds. Thinking of a Burris Fullfield ll 2-7x35 or a Leuplod 2-7x33. any opinions, recent experiences with either good or bad? I love my Zeiss but just can't bring myself to spend that kind of money until I know if she is going to stick with it or not.
Thanks in advance.

Have you considered the Burris Four X 1.5-6x42mm - 3P#4 E Dot Illuminated? It'll give her a wider FOV on closer shots, slightly brighter image and these are on sale for only $259.99 reduced from $499.99

The Burris 3x9 with the Ballistic Plex is a GREAT scope. Excellent eye relief and very usable reticle. The eye relief seems a bit better than their 2x7’s but both are a lot of scope for the money.

I really like Burris and I have the 2x7 and it is a good scope. That said, I’m not overly fond of its dimensions. The Leupold is easier to mount and looks a little better on anything other than the smallest rifles. I have a Howa Mini and the Burris is perfect for that. It looks funny on anything else.

I have all Leupolds. Never a problem with any of them. I have a VX-1 2-7x33 and it's a good one. I have VX2's, VX3's and VX5's. I like them all.

The few Burris' that have been on my rifles didn't turn my crank much at all.

I have a 2-7x33 Leupold VX-II that I’ve had on a lightweight .30-06 and now .308 Win. It has been problem free for 16 years. I’ve owned several Burris scopes and still have them on hard kicking rifles and they are fine. I don’t think there is too much difference in the glass of either one you mention. With all the recent saber rattling of late about Leupold scopes, I might try the Burris even though it is made offshore just like most of the Leupold components. Happy Trails

Ps: Another thought: Buy the scope you would buy for yourself. If she wanders away from hunting, you have a new scope!

Diversion: Which load have you chosen for her to shoot?

I just picked up a Burris Fullfield E1 3-9x50 with the german #4 illuminated dot and I must say its very clear and crisp and also fairly light weight. Would get another.

Thanks for the replies and keep them coming. I like the idea of the 1.5-6x42 as long as doesn't make the gun too heavy, appears to be about 8 ounces heavier than the 2-7x35 and an inch or so longer. Going to load 120 gr. Barnes TTSX at 2500-2600 fps, also having a brake put on the barrel as she is small framed but wanted something she could grow with and since I reload I can go up or down in the load for her. I currently load the 130 gr. TTSX at 2730 fps for my best friend's two sons who both shoot a .260 and it is a killer if the bullet is placed correctly.

Any particular reason for the Barnes at those modest speeds?

I been shooting Barnes X in one form or another for many years, never had one to fail to do the job at modest or ultra high speed and I am not wanting the kick to be an issue for her. I can always speed it up later if she can handle it. I shoot a 300 RUM with 180 gr TTSX, in the past I have shot a 300WM with a 165 gr original X and then TSX and a 30-06 with the TSX, terminal performance has been great with all of them and if you reload and take time to find the sweet spot off the lands they are as accurate as any bullet made. This about a 9 yo girl who weighs 60 lbs. full clothed and soaking wet, MAYBE so why scare her with a hot load?

Or a loaded down cup and core plain Jane bullet.

As far as a scope goes either of the 2 you’re looking at. My wife has a 3-9 loopy on her M7in 260 and I have a 2-7 Monarch on my M7 260. My wife likes the eye box of the loopy and it is better than the Burris in that respect. I have 2 3-9 Burris Tac30s and they’re a good scope especially for what I paid for them.

I have a Burris compact 3-9 and the newer Burris Timberline 4.5-14 both in the ballistic plex. The Burris compact has been to Africa three times and to New Zealand in 2016. Never had them knocked off sighted in. The baggage handlers could not do it. Beating it around the bush all over the U.S. couldn’t knock it off sighted in at 200 yds. Both reasonably priced and will be on my rifles for good.
I do have a Leupold, Swarovski, Weaver and a two more Burris scopes. All seem to be good if taken reasonable care of. But, I do like my Burris. MTG

I strongly agree with using a mild load, it's the Barnes part I'm asking about. For the appropriately modest ranges you mentioned I'd go even milder. Think along the lines of a 100 grain Nosler at 250 Savage speed pushed by something like 4895.

I own Leupolds and Burris Fullfields. I tested my latest Fullfield against my Leupold Vx3 well past sunset -same basic 3-9x40ish config and kept waiting for the Vx3 to outshine it at at well over twice the cost but it never happened. Still love the Vx3 but.... Clicks are identical on both - could be crisper, but are repeatable and I have never lost zero.

I would look Fullfield but of course either will work. 9 year old eyes can do a lot more than most of ours reading this.

As for a load for your little girl- so many here use the 100 grain 6.5 nosler ballistic tips for deer and more. They swear by them and it seems like the perfect bullet choice at the speed you want to drive it. Can't see how you could get less kick using anything else.

I might drop back to the 100 gr. TTSX and I have seen several deer shot with ballistic tips over the years in my Dad's 30-06 and they are deadly and very accurate (.3" groups in his gun) but I am just partial to the Barnes. If I have time before the season I might buy a box of Noslers and pop a coyote or small pig to see how it does and go from there. Thanks for all the input, I really like the look of the 1.5-6x42 mentioned above at Cameraland but I think it might be a little bulky on the Encore for her.

Barnes bullets going slow is not a recipe for success.

Yep, go with the 100 BT

That's another way of saying 6.5 Grendel. Difference being you don't have to load for it and there's. $0.25 per round plinking available for it.

being as you expect her to take all shots from a rested aim, the weight of that 1.5-6x will be welcome.

When Burris abandoned the fixed scope market I abandoned them.

If the OP doesn't already have the 260 Rem barrel the Grendel would be a neat option.

This for an Encore so unless going the MGM or Bullberry route the .260 is much easier to find but even then it is not something you run up on every day. Actually bought it off here.

You should have no trouble brewing up an easy going 260 load for your daughter. A 100 grain Ballistic Tip loaded to Grendel speed ought to be a nice way to go.

I was a devout fixed X proponent for years having owned several including Burris. I have more recently found a lot of benefit in the wider field of view going lower than 6x offers in the field- and going higher at the range. Brightness and features are no longer the issue they were (to me) due to the competition that has popped up over the last decade or so. I alerted folks here to some absolute silly deals on Burris variables and none have been disappointed. I still have a fixed Burris on one rifle but my others have moved to variables.

I too would load a cup and core bullet nice and mild. I can see issues with Barnes ad low speeds as they're not really designed for that.

As to your scope options, I would go with the 2-7X LEupold VX-Freedom over the FFII for sure.

What about that Burris 30mm 1.5-6x w illum reticle Cameraland had on special?

Think Doug had em at $259

That particular burris sucks. The eye relief is terrible, making it difficult to get behind. Try the fullfield II 3-9×40 with ballistic plex reticle, or even one of the newer MSR rifle scopes. Youll find those a lot more user friendly.

I've had a Burris 4.5-14x42 FullField Ballistic Plex on my 7 08 for a number of years with no problems or complaints, nice clear optics.

Remember this is for a new shooter who won't be lining up on anything past 100 yards.

If I was setting up a young kid I'd look hard at the 2.5x Leupold.

There's a free Grendel that comes in the box with every bigger 6.5, just like the .30/30 in '06s, .308s, etc. Size and weight in this case are the same too.

If you are worried about a few ounces difference in scope weight, then you have other issues. How old is your daughter? It seems odd that any kid would have issues with the recoil on a .260. If you are going to go with a mild load, there is no earthly reason to go full copper. Use 129 Hornady Interlocks at 2700+ and she will kill every deer that she shoots at, with light recoil. If that is too much recoil, then I don't know what to say.

I have seen very small girls shoot '06s.

From an earlier post:



That's why suggested 100 grains at about 2700 fps. That's mild in a 260, and approximates the 250 Savage which kills deer handily.

So I have purchased a scope from a gentleman on here for the gun, a VX 3 1.75-6x32 seems like a nice compromise for what I am needing. I have also decided to load a 100 gr TTSX with a light dose of RL 17 probably be around 2750-2800 mainly because I have the RL 17 sitting at the house and although many of you don't agree with this choice I prefer a mono bullet and have confidence in them so that is what I am going with for her. It should have mild recoil with the 100 gr. bullet and expand nicely since she will be shooting close range and not 400 yds. where the velocity would be falling off. Thanks for all the input.

AP

Best of Luck Puppy- it should be a GREAT scope for her. I hope your load works too. I am sure I speak for all of us saying a pic of her in November with this rig and a downed deer- and of course a big ole smile- would loved to be seen.

VX 3 1.75-6x32 is a good one.

I'm not so sure a light dose of RL17 is the way to go.

Agreed. An extruded powder would be much safer in reduced loads. 4198 works great for that sort of thing, and will be safer.

Would i look like a di ck if i totally agreed with you and mathman. I dont think the op has listened to a word most are saying. Why ask a question here, if its obvious he has his own agenda?

Actually you do look like a D__K, if you look at my original post it was a question on a scope and I enjoyed the feed back and based on my budget and availability I choice to buy a what I consider a good compromise scope for my daughter. In my original post I never asked anyone's opinion on what load I should shoot, what powder ,bullet type etc, that info was asked of me later in the thread and I chose to answer even though I knew better. I greatly appreciate everyone's opinion on what load I should use, why I should use this bullet Y vs bullet Z, powder type etc but everyone's life/hunting experiences are different and as such I choose to shoot a bullet that most of you wouldn't. On top of that I have been reloading since I was 15 so that is about 33 years worth of experience and I have never flattened a primer, split a case or hurt anyone so even though I may not be an internet expert I do know a little about it. I admit RL17 probably not the best choice but I have it available and have no other use for it so I will see if I can make it work. In a perfect world I would have unlimited resources and could always make the perfect purchase on everything I use and now my daughters will use for hunting but that will never be the case. With that said now I sound like a D__K but so be it, unless someone wants to criticize my grammar I will consider this thread closed.
Thanks again for the truly helpful opinions on the scope choice.

For Deer, I easily look thru the fixed 3x at 3x100. However, I doubt if any here will understand the wisdom of your words.

I commented that RL17 may not be what you want for your application because it is a "4350 class" burn rate powder and those (and even slower) burn rates are generally to be avoided for reduced loads. (safety)

Puppy,

Evidently in 33 years of handloading you've never run across any mention (and they've been frequent in the literature) about occasional VERY high pressure incidents with charges of slower-burning powders reduced more than 10% from maximum listed charges. They do not happen every time, and there is generally no indication that they might from previous shots--but when they do happen, the pressure often wrecks rifles.

Actually I have and I plan on using exactly 10% less than listed max which is 42.2 gr with a 100 gr bullet. In theory that would produce ~2900 fps with a 24' barrel but since I am cutting 3" off the barrel and adding a brake to further reduce the recoil I figure on losing ~50 fps per inch and I am at the 2750-2800 that I stated in a earlier comment maybe it will be a little faster than that but I doubt it but either way I feel since it is a listed load in the manual it should be safe. I also plan on giving it a .050" jump to the rifling to start which shouldn't increase pressure any and is also what is recommended as the starting point. For a group of people that I have never meet in person I must come off as a pretty sorry individual and lousy father if you think that I would load anything other than a known listed load for my daughter. If I want to experiment with my eyes and fingers that would be one thing but as a father I would never endanger my children.

That isn't the amount of reduction I was considering.

Puppy,

Good!

You first mentioned 2500-2600 as your target muzzle velocity.

Not to be Captain Obvious here, but perhaps a good spot to start is the Nosler or other manual that lists a spread of charges for each powder and indicates the most accurate charge tested for that powder. Sometimes it is the starting charge that is most accurate. Happy Trails

I looked at those earlier. In my estimation they are a bit stiff for the present application.

I stand by my recommendation of 4895 for a mild 250 Savage ballistics duplicate. Believe me, I'm not that flush with cash either, but I wouldn't call a pound of powder an extravagance in this instance.

Agree!

The scope purchased is near perfect for whitetail at the usual ranges. My kids like a scope set to 4x for shooting deer at the expected ranges. I have them practice at lower or no magnification, but the extra mag. helps them place shots better as they gain experience with deer anatomy. I have one of those on one of my favorite deer rifles. It will reach across a clearcut and is peerless in the woods when bucks are chasing.

I think 2700 fps is a little fast. A muzzle brake will tame it obviously, but some kids find the strangest reasons to not like things. They don't see the full picture of situations. I suggest doubling up on plugs and muffs at the range. Plugs on a band are handy when hunting. Another option is just to practice with the 22lr barrel and only shoot the centerfire at deer. That's what I do with my kids.

I wouldn't use a mono bullet for this on a bet. Go soft for deer. It is much easier to teach blood trailing when the ground is painted from an NBT through the lungs.

Gun I put together for my daughter, scope and barrel bought from Campfire members, Encore frame from my SML conversion added brake from JR Shults and adjustable stock so we can both use same frame. She handles it well just haven't given her the right opportunity to take a shot yet. .5" MOA at 100 yds.

Dude! Looks PERFECT. Can't imagine dreaming up a better rig for your purpose.

Don't forget the ear plugs! I always have some ready for the hunt.

Awaiting pics of smiling face and successful hunt.

That’s pretty cool!

I think the 100 TTSX is perfect.

She didn't get is done last year but she finally got her first deer this morning, one happy little hunter.

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30 or so Leupolds of all flavors here (all older gloss). Dependable and to my eye nothing looks better.

I don't think a nine year old new shooter will need a ballistic plex. Keep it simple.

I had a Fullfield II 2-7x35 on my daughter’s deer rifle and one on a Marlin 336. I never noticed the crappy eye relief but then again they weren’t hard kicking rifles. My daughter was happy but I later put a Bushnell Elite 2-7 on her rifle and she liked the glass better. My 336 now wears a VX-3 1.75-6x32 and I believe it’s a significant upgrade over a Fullfield.

I load GameKings for grandkids at slow speeds, buy a scope you like.

Well let me be the first to congratulate your daughter and yourself for the fine venison.

Mega congrats on the deer! Burris FFII is a lot of scope for the money. Perhaps more reliable than similarly priced Reupoles.

I have looked through Burris Fullfield11 and Leupold under hunting conditions the past week. Burris of that flavor is almost as good as a VX1 but the view falls behind the 2 ,3, or Freedom. Burris may be more reliable. Their adjustments seem a little better when zeroing.

huzzah for your youngster!

and i like that super compact carbine you built for her ...

what does that little rig weigh? you've got my brain working over time, puppy ...

A VX-5HD and a VX-3i I’ve played with seem to have pretty good clicks, at least they sighted in without issue. 2-series Leupolds have been spotty in that area. FFIIs and E1s have so far worked as they should. Time will tell how they hold up, but others seem to be happy.

I’l take good clicks and reliability over a bit extra eye-relief and a tiny bit of image quality any day.