Anyone else belong to this cult? Maybe it was Jack OConnor, Maybe it was the look of my Dad's old pre-64 Model 70, that he took about 35 Vermont bucks with, or maybe its just nostalgia. But its been years since I've wanted to use anything else on a SERIOUS hunt.

Me
It's all one needs for big game in the lower 48.

Although I have to admit in recent years I've been using a 243 with excellent success more than any other cartridge........

Casey

Count me in. I like it so much that I bought a 270 WSM when they came out and like it too. I have yet to see a deer or hog go anywhere but straight down with a 130 gr .277" Hornady Interbond or Scirrocco out of a 270 or 270 WSM.

One more to add to the list.

I'm in it.But hang with the cooler STW guys.....grin

I am a 270 fan for sure.
My favorite rifle in my collection is a 270win.

My dad is in it, with over 40 years of 1 shot whitetails to his credit- who could blame him.

My first rifle was a 270 and still go for it for PA whitetails.

now this one really is a CULT

Even though I'm currently infatuated with classic african caliber/rounds. I've owned at least one .270 continuously since I was 14.

I've been a mega member of the 06 Improved club for all my life.

Dober

Count me in 100%

I have owned well over a dozen rifles chambered for 270 Win.
I am currently down to two.

But it is the nut behind trigger that is much more important than the actual cartridge.

One of the things I've noticed over the years is that people love to champion their personal pics and love to dog pile those they don't like. Be it cartridges, actions, optics, cars, ponies or whatever.

I've learned that if you sit back and listen you'll find that most of the time you'll find that the CARTRIDGES that they don't like are the ones they've used the least. And or better yet, it is the ones that they've not used any if at all.

I've been incredibly fortunate and blessed to spend a bunch of time in PARADISE (that's Alaska for you Montana boys). I've spent up to 181 1/2 days a year some years out there after it and or taking friends on there first bear hunt, or helping DSMF's figure out that "This ain't New York."

Point being, I've seen a fair amount of game taken each and every year for at least 24 years, 3 months, 2 weeks, 2 days and 11 .3 hours . I say this not to brag but to preface my thoughts with the fact that there is a lot of time and some talking out my ass going behind them.

I've seen a lot of game take with 250AI, 30/06/300Mag/35Whelen etc. I've observed one common thing amongst all of them. If directed in a proper manner they all kill very very well. If not directed in a proper manner you may well have a rodeo on your hands, not that I know anything about rodeos.

I know boys that say the 270 is the 06 improved! Well, I've used the 30/06 Improved a boat load (course I have lived on/near the coast most of my life so I DO know about boats, just not rodeos) and have observed first, 2nd, and 3rd hand and I am here to tell you that if I had to hunt the world with the 270 I wouldn't tell anyone. Mark here has killed more game with 270's than Lee24 has seen.


I'd keep going, but this is pretty boring stuff.

Enjoy the day.

Steelhead,

If Alaska is paradise, why do I know so many people here in Montana who moved here after living there for a few years? (Just kidding, though there are a lot of them....)

At one point until very recently I had taken more big game with the .270 than any other cartridge (won't say what passed it). My wife has surely taken more with it than any other round, especially as her "big" rifle.

I have seen one "failure" with the .270, due to a bullet that was not nearly as good as hyped by several gun writers when it came out. I finally figured out that they never shot anything with it before writing about it, one of the big reasons I spent a lot of time, some years ago, devising ways to test bullets before hunting with them. (Oh, and why I start off with smaller "big" game with any new bullet even then.)

Other than that, it has done everything its proponents have claimed. The biggest game I've seen taken with it is moose, and it still holds the record of "quickest deadest" bull moose in my experience. It shoots flat and doesn't kick all that much, and in my experience is very easy to get to shoot accurately. You can get ammo anywhere. What's not to like?

JB

270..,

Count me in as well. Have owned at least one since I was 16. Also have a .270 Roy and am contemplating a 270WSM just to complete the set.

I owned a .270 Win once for about 15 minutes.

I won it in a drawing at our SCI fund-raiser, and another guy (who really wanted that SS Winchester in .270 made me an offer I didn't refuse).

Seriously, I shot a lot of 6.5-'06, and it is a "skinny .270".

jim

it pays the bills without fail

Since 1971 it has worked for me in one rifle or another!

Ted

I have had a 270 caliber of some sort since I was 16 yrs old.
I now have a stainless BLR 270 WSM and I just traded for a Weatherby Mark V stainless in 270 WBY. AMRA

Wow, this IS a cult!

Do ya'll have shrines to the Grand Poobah of the .270, O'Conner, on your walls? You should if you don't.

Other than smartass comments, I got nuthin' to add since I'm a certified, stamped, signed sealed and delivered member of the cult of the best all-around rifle on the planet, the 30-06.

(I am OUTA HERE!) :-)

-jeff

Hate that dang .270. Owning a good one has kept me from needing a 25-06, 257 Roy, 260Rem, 264WM, a 280 or 7mag of any kind, along with a bigger safe to keep them in. Blasted .270!

My friend Cast, that is why I've never owned one.

I'm in. I'm sure it started as the undue influence of J O'C, but it was my only centerfire for decades - until I signed up as a rifle looney. Now I don't have one, and it's a void I need to (re)fill.

Jaywalker

that's the longest SH post I've every seen! Gotta be some kind of record. I'da thought it'da been about a woman but no! it was about the .270

I guess I would be a member. As would both of my boys

I don't currently even own a .270, which is really ironic since I have had more DRT kills with it than anything else...

John

Actually the above post was one that Mark D. made about bullets, I just inserted Alaska where he had Montana and inserted 270 where he had bullet names.

I was being funny...........

P.S. See Mark's thread 'The Cult of......harvesting game" you'll notice the similarities....grin

I knew it wouldn't last......

Been my favorite for lots of years. It covers lots of ground with plain old 130's zipping happily along killing whatever is in its path.

DJ

I've killed more animals with a 270 than anything else except a 22 and presently have 4......I really can't remember ever shooting an animal with one and having lost it.

I don't necessarily think it's "better" than some other calibers but all things taken into account, it does more things well (read that as covers more range of animals) than just about anything other mid-caliber.

It has modest recoil, usually accurate in most decent rifles, has good bullet selection, adequate for varmints to moose; I draw the line at the bigger bears, and ammo is easily available worldwide.

What's not to like????????

Some calibers do some things better; few do as much as well.

MM

PS: Being in Alaska doesn't make everyone there an expert on anything, tho there are a few there who are.....too bad they don't post here anymore.

Never said being in Alaska does, but I ain't insecure......

P.S. I even shot my first deer of the year with a 270. Guess I'm starting to become as smart as the Montana boys. Looking forward to the day when I have to draw tags.......

But Kev ole buddy, doesn't a good 7X57 like yours have similar powers of acquisition limitation?

Now that I think about it, I haven't bought anything since I got that pesky 7X57!
There might be something to it!

No insecurity here.......tho I'd love to hunt Alaska.



270 Win.; 450 yards; 1 shot; Nosler 150 Partition; exit through off-side shoulder.

MM

I am not really a cult follower, but, I have taken a lifetime supply of critters via 270win. I had a rifle go TU on my spring bear hunt this year. I called my wife and told her to bring me another rifle....my 270. I have 20 or more rifles to choose from and truth be told, if I had to choose one that would be the one.

HC-its because of the rifle not the round right?

Point being, certain rifles that I really perk with within reason I really don't care which round it is chambered for.

Make sense?

Thx

Dober

That 30+ year old 700 in .270 on it's second barrel aught to qualify me for membership. It's what leaves the safe when somethin really needs killin

Alot has to do were you live.The 30-06 is to B.C what the 270 is to the south of the border.The town I live in is 30-06 country.It out numbers most rounds by a good margin.And for good reason.Besides it's really the only one truly worthy of a cult status.

really its the whole package, the gun hadles very well, the cartrige has never let me down. I can shoot middle of the road bullets since they were all developed for it's velocity window, ammo is never far away. it does not eat scopes. it shoots as flat as anything avilable.....a few years ago. really don't have a damn bad thing to say about it

my favorite 270 is in a ti gun and I usually carry it like a pistol....stole a few deer from the boys since it is so fast handling.

I never saw a use for the 270win,so I don't own one.I prefer the 25-06 on deer sized game,and the 7mmremmag on larger game.

I have had 12-15 .270s, love it with 150 NPs over RE-22 and have only my pair of P-64 Fwts.left as I just sold my Husqy 4100 to a friend.

If, there is a "perfect pair" for BC hunting, it's the .270-.338 Win. in good crf rifles using 150 and 250 NPs over RE-22, I could be happy with this combo forever. (well, I DO need my .280 and my........)

Smarter move would be to ditch both and use ONE 270... it definitely does the work of either those two...

I actually wish I had started using the 270 earlier.

Actually I use the 7mmstw which does the job better than any cartridge using a .277" bullet.

I'm down to .270 Win's and a .270 WSM

Na I don't like em!

mike

Sure...

I've never owned a .270 and may never own one. But I always recommend the .270 Win.,especially if the rifle is to be primarily used for deer. When I worked at a shooting range the .270's were the most reliably accurate rifles larger than .22 centerfire. Also, .270 shooters seemed to be among the most level headed and practical of riflemen.

Dober, The other "Cult" post of yours is well thought out and well written. I agree whole heartedly..FWTW.

Steelhead, great plagiarism of same...also well written, and funny as hell if you had read Marks post first. BUT, we're on to you, ya aint foolin no one... You didn't get "bored", you just had a beer run to make.

Jeff, '06! Shame on you! That's why you have to live in Eugene! Buy a .270 and run for the border!!!

I bought my .270 in '69. I wanted a Model 70 like Jack's, but they weren't making them anymore...the new improved M70 fit like poop so I ended up with a 700. No regrets.
It's still killing game today and will be the last rifle to leave my possesion.

OOPS, outa beer. Gotta run. BT

It must be a Texas thing. At the range where I shoot,that certainly isn't the case.

I've had 270 around sence 1973, I have no idea how many deer,elk and antelope I,ve taken with one. I've got 6 other cal in the safe that will be in real good shape when my son gets them, but they do look good.

I've had one since 1975. My favorite rifle.

I own the domain 270win.com. Do I qualify?

Definitely a member of the .270 cult. In my mind it's simply the best medium game round going. Also, one of the most accurate and easiest to reload rounds going.

-Lou

Just what I was thinking...and it'll do the work of a few others, too.

DJ

After I bought my 270WSM I sold everything else.

Where I hunt elk and moose, the chance of running into a grizzly is always present,especially when dressing an animal.I would rather have a 7mm magnum or better yet,an even larger cartridge in the event that I need to defend myself against a grizzly.

It was damn near a novelette for S'Head................maybe he has a girlfriend named 270 or sumthin' ..............


Casey

My first rifle was a .270 but now I have many others to choose from. Somehow I always go back to the .270 when I reach into the gun safe. I guess that puts me in the "CULT"....

30-06 improved... Now that's funny..

Yeah, I know nothing about grizzlies...

1

I have a few .270s and use them more frequently than anything else these days.
I was well aware of Jack's writing, but the real reason I started with a .270 was my old uncle in Colorado recommended it to my dad for me when I was about 14. And I guarantee my old uncle never heard of Jack, but he killed piles of elk, deer and bear in Colorado with his Model 54. He was right. BTW, he did it all with 130 gr Winchester ammo - Silvertips by he time I knew him.

I've mentioned my uncle before (great uncle, actually), but as a partial tribute I'll say again, he was a fine hunter and a great horseman

This was my first 270 and one of the first bucks I killed with it. (1980)


I killed a bunch of deer and other critters with that old Rugger and finally shot the barrel out of it. I wish I'd had it re-barreled and not traded it off. I've owned four other 270's since that one. Still have two in the house right now.

I like to play with other cartridges but a 270 always goes along on a hunt. It's not only my back up rifle but it's the one that gets used when tags need to be filled and there is no tomorrow.

Dam, I was a handsome fellow in 1980! What the hell happened?

For some reason, I like to be a little different. I dumped all my bolt actions and went to Ruger #1s for hunting. I grew up wanting a .280, becuase 30 years ago, it was a lot different than owning a .270 or 30/06. And, if I were to own a bolt, it would be becuase the walnut on it was a real attention getter. To cut to the chase, the last thing I would ever want was a stainless steel bolt action rifle with a no-character, non-wlanut stock and chambered for the go-with-the-crowd .270 Winchester. Well, for our first anniversary, my wife went and bought me a left-handed Ruger - their stainless model with a laminated stock. Chambered for...you guessed it...the 270 Winchester. My wife said to take it back if it wasn't what I wanted, but I read between the lines and realized that would be a foolish marital move. Then I started to shoot the thing. And even though I'm not really big on ballistics, when one looks up the numbers on the .270 and compares it to everything else out there, I believe this cartridge is really hard to beat when it comes to hunting the lower 48. In fact, the more I shoot this cartridge, the more I like it. I hope to never have to give up the Ruger #1s I have left, but if someone were to tell me I had to spend the rest of my life carrying just that .270, I would be just as content as can be. Of course I couldn't give in all together. When most would probably put a 3x9 on this type of rig, I fitted mine with a matte finish, straight 4x Leupold. There, now it's cool enough for me to carry.

yup. got a 270 and a 270wsm. LOVE them both! my 270 is my most important gun

I live outside of the unincorporated little "town" (not even a gas station) of Elmira about 25 miles west of Eugene, just for the record... but Eugene is the economic lifeblood of the area, to be sure!

Heck, I like Eugene. Wacky, fun, stoopid Eugene. Gotta love a fun west-coast college town, right?

Notice how I'm not even pointing out the obvious superiority of the 30-06? I am SO polite. Like any good Eugenian, I believe in diversity and political correctness. So you .270 guys, I FEEL you! I know in my warm fuzzy heart that YOUR way of thinking, (however wrong), is right for YOU! And your self-esteem is what's most important.

-jeff

Nice late 70's haircut! I remember those. I was only 15 in 1980...

:-)

-jeff

Hmmm, killed my first game animal with a 270. A black bear outside of Quesnel, B.C. One is all it took....

Since then, I've graduated to 7mm's and .35's, but both kids have their own 270's, loaded with 130 gr. TSX's. Hard to argue with success, plus used 270's are a dime a dozen, since it apparently just isn't the cartridge it used to be........ JMO, Dutch.

PS, Jeff, Class of '86. Liberal girls are easy......

270GUY knows better than I do how many 270's I've owned because he is my long-time friend and gun dealer, but if I were to guess I'd put the number at around 20+.My first one was a Ruger M77 that I used on my first western hunt to Montana in the early 70's for mule deer and antelope, and I've used the cartridge regularly since then just about everywhere. I suspect the number of rounds I've fired through them numbers way up in the tens of thousands, and I've lost track of how many barrels I've cooked.

I've used a good number of other calibers as well over the years, and seen a good bit of game killed with the cartridge, and although I'm an equally big 7 mag fan, I'd have to say that I cannot see a big difference between it and the 270 on any animals I've shot or seen shot with both.I'd just as soon use one as the other on about anything; for that matter the 270 does about as well on anything as the 30/06, also, provided bullet structure is equal in both.The 30/06 can use heavier bullets, but when was the last time you saw anyone loaded up with 220's?The 280 is the same as the 270, but no better.

As someone else has pointed out, the problem with the cartridge is that, once you've used it a good deal it becomes difficult to justify getting anything else in the same category. I think Kutenay hit the nail on the head when he says that a 338 and a 270 makes about the best big-game combo package for a guy who wants an all-round battery for North America.

I'm down to a paltry 4 270's right now;this needs to be fixed...

Bob - that number of 270s that you have (4) is really too low. No one in the "cult" should ever let the number slip below 5 at a minimum. See me at the shop and we will take care of this problem.

OK!

i started with a 270 in 72' in alaska, shooting 130/150 corelokts and some 150gr partitions. over the years that gun took moose, caribou, black bears, dall sheep, mtn goats, and deer. i shot that same tang ruger for the next 25-30 years, with no regrets. replaced her with a 24" ss model 700 in an hs precision stock that is used only for whitetails these days. there is just something special about the 270 win.

I guess you could say it's one of my favorites. I've owned several, down to one now but it is only because a lack of green backs. My two favorites are the 270 win. and the 35 whelen. I have to say that classic in 8X57 is in there though. I'm really wanting a new 270 now since the CDL SF ones came out. The ruger stainless I have now is a shooter though. But I like wood and blued. I know the SF isn't but it still looks good.

I call BS on that statement 270 or 7 mag, what's the difference?
I would not feel one bit better with a 7mm anything over a 270.

Jeff, What's with this 30-06 stuff? I thought you were 358 cultist?

I am a recovering 270 cultist as I have become very fond of my 338-06's, 416 Rigby and my soon to be built 9.3x64 Brenneke. I also shouldn't forget my 22-250.

But I'll never be without a 270.

You might not feel better,but the extra 300ftlbs of energy provided by the 7mmremmag over the 270win would make me feel a little better if facing a grizzly.The extra 900ftlbs of energy produced by my 7mm stw over the 270win would make me feel better yet in that situation.
For the record,I have been charged by a grizzly,so I do know how it feels to be in that situation.The grizzly is now a rug in my home.

Well, I have to agree with Stubby on a preference for a larger cartridge when hunting in Grizzly country and BC has the largest number of bears anywhere. I don't know that a 7Mag is really better than a .270 for this use and I sold off my 7mags over 25 years ago, after one Grizzly encounter at Whitswan Lake in '79.

A .270 WILL drop a Grizzly, I have witnessed this and also a 7Mag. However, I really do think that .338s and up are better for Elk-Moose hunting when you are backpacking your meat in Grizzly country...why not, if you have a bigger gun use it, IMO.

But, I have and would hunt anywhere/thing in BC with a .270 or .280 and feel OK about it.

Count me in on the cult. Although I don't knock anyone if it's not their favorite (it's not my dad's)!

Bill

I agree 100% with that statement.

Belonged to this cult for a number of years got out will probably never return since I own a 6.5x284 and it will do anything a 270 will do in a shorter package.

I started to read about the 270 Win. while I was still in high school. Then in 1978 I bought my first one, and I've never been without at least one 270 in my battery every since. I've carried a 270 Win. (and Bob, like you, I've owned a bunch of them) on many mule deer, whitetail, elk, pronghorn, and black bear hunts, as well as moose hunts and coyote hunts.

It's been a very "lucky" (for want of a better word) cartridge for me, in that I've used it to take my first black bear, as well as my very best trophy mule deer, as well as my best pronghorn, best Texas whitetail, etc. Actually, I think the real "luck" of the 270 has been that it shoots flat, carries light, kills well, and is easy to hit with.

In fact, I quit using a 7mm Rem. Mag. mostly because as far as I could tell, the 270 killed just as well as it did, shot just as flat, kicked less, was shorter and lighter to carry, and wasn't as loud.

Mostly, I've used a 130 gr. Nosler Partition loaded to around 3140 fps. or thereabouts for just about everything I've shot with the 270 Win., and I'll take the same load after mule deer this year.

The only hunters I know who put the 270 down have either very little or no experience with it, or else they have used poor bullets, anemic loads, or they just can't shoot so they blame the cartridge instead of themselves.

My favorite two-rifle North American hunting battery would consist of a 270 Win. and a 338 Win. Mag.. If I could have only one rifle for our continent, I'd go with a 300 Win. Mag..

One of my real ambitions is to take a 270 Win. to Africa along with a 375 H&H, and one year, I'll devote an entire safari to those two cartridges. Since I grew up reading about Jack O'Connor and John Jobson using that very two-rifle battery in Africa on more than once occasion, I have to do it at least once myself and realize yet another a hunting dream from my youth......

If I lived in primarily a whitetail state and/or hunted little else other than antelope, deer, etc., the 270 Win. would likely be the only big game rifle I'd own or would want to own.

The 270 Win. is hardly the only cartridge I use or have used, but it is one of my favorites, and I am a member of "The Cult of the 270"

AD

SU- I am this week ordering another 270 Lilja tube for my lil G33 want me to get you one coming as well....grins

I once had a bumper sticker made up that said "if you don't have a .270 you don't have caca"

Me thinks that makes me a card carrying member of the 270 cult.

Dober

LOL!!!

I love it! I'm surprised you don't have Lic. plate # 270 WIN.



Mark you can call me "Caca Head"

who said I didn't......grins

I could always help you buy your plates next time as well.

Dober

I've got all of JOC's books and a complete set of 1955 - 1963 Outdoor Life mags. And, I am down to seven .270's at present.
The caliber will take care of most all NA big game!

Only SEVEN 270s??
WOW!!

Yup and that doesn't count the pre 64's.

Wowsers,
P64s in 270winny? I am envious!

love the .270 win
love the .270 wsm even more!

now if only i could afford the .270 wby!

Allen: I'm a bit late reading your post, and as usual you are spot on. Back in the eighties a buddy asked me to help him put together two rifles for any hunting he would do in North America; Africa was not in the game plan. I speced two rifles for him, both on pre-64 M70's and Kreiger barrels; a 270 and a 338.

O'Connor was a huge influence on people in our age category, and not having anyone to teach me, I turned to reading his stuff to learn, because he LOOKED like a professor, wrote well, made sense and was easy to follow. I did what he said and over the years I learned he was not right about everything,but who the hell is!? Mostly, what he said was true, and is just as valid today as it was 30 years ago, even in light of newer technology.

It is still hard today to put together a better light, portable 22" barreled sporter that does not recoil excessively, shoots flat,has minimal muzzle blast,and enough bullet weight for most things on the continent, than a 270 (or 280-they're the same IMO). Go up in case capacity and recoil, blast, etc go up for a nominal gain in performance; go down in capacity and velocity and trajectory suffers. There may be other things that make as good a package as a light 270, but I have better things to do than waste a lot of time looking for them!

I think that one of the main reasons that JOC influenced so many people, AND in the "right" direction, IMHO, is that he was a VERY skilled writer whose material was SO enjoyable to read. As a "bushman", JOC couldn't carry Elmer's jockstrap,but, Elmer, for all of his hardwon knowledge, tended to "preach" while JOC's wicked Irish humour kept you snickering and learning.

JOC's advocacy of a light .270 as a "mountain rifle" really hit the mark with postwar hunters all over North America and the .270/.280 with good bullets DID what he said it would, consistently. Elmer's stubborn opinion on using nothing less than a .33 cal-250 gr. bullet on Elk struck most guys as overkill and many cannot shoot a .338 Win. with consistent accuracy.

I am "dealing" on a sixth .338 WM, a P-64 that was a .264, with a stainless Shilen, turned down, chopped to 22", equipped with Recknagels, a modified Micky SG stock and Weaver steel Grand Slams/Burris Zee rings...total weight 8lbs-2ozs, with Leupy 4x. This will be my backpacking rifle as my original P-64s are getting too valuable to hunt with in BC's moun tains and it is LIGHT for the chambering, meeting JOC's criteria for a "mountain rifle".

I am going to have my last Brno 21H action built into a 7.25-7.5 lb. .280 to accompany this rifle as my last serious backpack hunting set and I WOULD go with the ".270 cult" if I did not have a pair of .270s, but, only ONE, lonely .280 now. A man can't have too many .270 class rifles, it does the job!

Kutenay: That 338 I talked about above was about 8 1/4 all up with a 4X leup. The barrel was 23". I think a 22-23" barrel on a 338 is an improvement over the pre 64 25" job, nice as they were though.

I'm glad O'Connor and Keith were both around; they were products of their time and experience, and both were "right" in their own ways. Big bores and big bullets really make the fur fly,if you can shoot them straight, as you point out.

I bought into the 270WSM for a couple of years and had 3 rifles in that caliber. However after looking at the velocities vs. recoil, I came to the conclusion that there was nothing that the WSM could do that the 270Win. couldn't also do. I do leave the .270Win. home and bring the 300WM for elk hunting. However there have been 5 cows and 2 bulls taken in our elk camp over the years with the .270Win and 150gr. Partitions.

I came to a similar conclusion concerning the 270WSM.
I figure my 270wby will work with heavier bullets, my 270Win for everything else.

Allen,

I must admit that it is very difficult to find anything to argue about in your writings. I beat you to the punch with the 270 as I got my first one in about 1962 or 63. In my gun safe as I write this, there are four 270 winchesters, and a 270 Weatherby. There are also three 375s in the safe. How could I possibly argue with your choices. Not that I wanted to, mind you.

My first Safari was in 1987 in Zimbabwe. I took two rifles, a Heym 470 NE double, and my David Miller 270. I shot a buffalo with the 470, and used the 270 for everything else. I've not taken a 270 again to Africa, relying more on a 30-06, but wouldn't hesitate to take it back with me. If I have learned one thing in a lifetime of hunting, it is this. It doesn't make a lot of difference what cartridge one is using, but it makes all the difference where the shooter places the bullet.

Tom

That is an excellent way of explaining it........


Casey

While I agree that Elmer was a better "outdoorsman" than JOC,

Elmer was so full of schitt that it ran out his ears.

The old saying of believing none of what you hear and half of what you see applies to Elmer.

As far as info on shooting goes, he wasn't even in the same ballpark as Hagel.

MM

Well, the men of his generation whom I knew as friends 30-50 years ago who actually knew Elmer personally had great respect for him; some of these guys also knew JOC and had little time for him, so it seems to go. I agree that much of Elmer's rhetoric on many issues and his never-ending references to Civil War veterans plus his rather large ego could be tiresome, but, his serious comments on rifles always impressed me.

As to Bob Hagel, well, he is STILL, always has been and probably will continue to be my favourite gun writer. Probably only Finn Aagaard and Phil Shoemaker impress me as much, I wish I had known Bob personally. Nobody is perfect and Elmer was a pretty impressive guy,, especially considering his background and level of education...like most of us, once past 60, he could be a mite stubborn and opinionated.......... "grin"

I have killed more game with the 270 Win than anything else but only deer and antelope, perhaps 20-30 or so but...presently own a 270 Wby and 30-06 in that category.

I do believe it-the 270 win-is balanced about right along with a couple of others perhaps considering the physical laws governing ballistics and with an appropriately built rifle is admittedly hard to beat for NA game esp the medium game.

But I've never been one to hold on to firearms until now in the middle ages, having traded or bought this or that to try many. It was Hagel and later Seyfried who got me started on the 340 but have also come back to the '06 and milder cartridges like the 6.5x55.

My Dave Gentry 270 Wby in a 700 aside from needing at least a 24" tube is almost like and as light as a moderately heavy 270 Win at 8lbs with a Leup 4.5-14 and while the Win is flat the Wby is almost laser flat. Recoil for me is just to the left of a "normal" '06 and I think it is a highly overlooked cartridge. I included these comments because the thread title mentioned "270", not specifically the Win version although I'm sure it was meant.

Gdv

I like the .270 win. Used it alot more when I was younger. Now I only carry it when I am covering a large field (s) or powerlines or something when a far shot is a good possibility. Other than that it's my 35's in the woods. There really is no need for anything else with this combo.

Goodnews: The 270 Weatherby is hell on wheels! It really is a fabulous cartridge; and is very accurate and flat shooting. I built one...please don't ask what happened to it........

You traded it off on a 308 win, come on Bob we know you did

Powerguy: Ha, ha, ha......very funny!...............how'd you know..............

The 308 win is fine but.....I feel your pain!

Gdv

I LIKE that 270wby!
Mine is just a garden variety Weatherby ultralight.
It shoots the 140gr TSX @ 3300fps with under 1 inch groups common when "bozo" can remember how to pull the trigger!


I guess this is a one load rifle, you might say.
~grin

Goodnews: I didn't REALLY trade it for a 308.........

Actually, it was a caliber-reduction move. With my handloads in the 7 mag, I get 3250-3300 with a 140 gr bullet; it was so similar to a 270 Weatherby I could not see having both, so I sold the Weatherby.Drop to 500 yds was about the same, etc. Course, this does not mean the 270 Weatherby is not a fabulous round, cause it is. Just too much overlap with the 7 rem mag...

270guy: I have several Hunting Rifles in caliber 270 Winchester. I used a 270 Winchester on Big Game for the first time more than 45 years ago!
I have used the 270 Winchester to harvest Antelope, Mule Deer, Elk, Black Bear, Whitetailed Deer, Mt. Goat and Blacktailed Deer!
No problems so far, at all!
This is one caliber that definitely "gets better with age"!
Todays powders, bullet selection and accurate Rifles only enhances this already very fine cartridge.
My latest 270 Winchester calibered Rifle is an ultra-accurate Remington 700 Sendero with a heavy 26" barrel! With it and 130 gr. Nosler Ballistic Tips I have killed a 6x6 Bull Elk, numerous Mule Deer, numerous Antelope and two Whitetailed Deer!
I have killt Antelope out to 450 yards (Leica Laser ranged!) and Mule Deer out to just shy of 400 yards with this Rifle/bullet combo - as well as a couple of Mule Deer at less than 100 yards!
I have 4 pre-64 Winchester Model 70's in caliber 270 Winchester at present - one that gets Hunted with on occassion and three in my collection (Supergrade, Standard and a Featherweight, all of which are in mint condition). I also have Remingtons in Model 700 BDL and 722, in caliber 270 Winchester, that see action from time to time.
Yes indeed I am a member of the 270 Cult - a founding member!
Long live the 270 Winchester!
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Send me that Fwt., I NEED two more to pair with my four .338 Alaskans!!! Good stuff, stout fella!!

Kutenay: You are a M70 maven......

Guess i'm a member of this cult too. I bought my first 270 back in the early 80's and have had one ever since. I've shot lots of deer, whitetail and muleys, a bull elk, sheep, black bears, caribou, and 1 grizzly using 150 grain NP's and it do get the job done. I'll be using it on a couple of caribou come this weekend and maybe a sheep and a black bear come September.

I grew up reading JOC, and bought my first 270 in 1983 when I was 18 years old. I was lucky enough to buy my second 270 the following summer. A 1957 M70 standard rifle, it was a hell of a lot of money for a kid working for 4 bucks an hour. It shot my early, clumsy handloads better than I had any right to expect, and is still in the family all these years later.

I used it exclusively until my father decided he liked it better than I did, so I gave it to him. He considers it a deathray on deer, and still uses it as his open field deer rifle.

Since then I've owned a bunch of 270's, although I must admit I don't own one at present. That said, my pet sheep rifle has 280AI marked on the barrel, but I chalk that up to the gunnut disease. It works almost as well as my 270's did!

Rick: +1....

Can't say as I'm a member here... but my roots are firmly planted in .270 soil. First big game rifle was a .270 Browning A-Bolt. That rifle beat my a$$! Killed one spike Muley with it and traded it down the road for a .25-06 Ruger. Never owned another one, never will... but what I shoot now isn't much more, .280AI. ~JT

Hate to be boring...have not much else to say other than my ol' .270 is the gun I usually reach for out of the safe when I want to fill tags. Am a big fan of the bang flop and have had that happen more often than not when pulling that trigger. Just picked up another that will go to one of the boys when he's old enough. He probably won't hate me for it, I'm thinking.

Count me in as a 270 fan. Speaking of whitetails only - it works.

I've had the same one for 27 seasons and believe that I've killed at least one deer with it every season. That said, I'm going to take a little "internet license" and say that I've killed "dozens" of deer with it and it has been almost totally unremarkable. Unremarkable being a good thing. Shoot 'em through the ribs, they go a ways, then tip over.
The remarkable one has nothing to do with the caliber, rather the deer its self.

I could go on more but it would be more of a commentary about the rifle and scope I'm using rather than on the cartridge.

Mine may miss this season, an 11 yo has his eyes on it to shoot his first deer using some of the reduced recoil loads. I'll gladly use something else this year based on that consideration. Otherwise, I can't think of a good reason to grab anything else for deer hunting.

How could anyone find fault with the .270 Winchester? The round shoots a bit flatter than a 30-06. Hits a little harder than a 7x08 and can be used to take any non-dangerous game in the lower 48 at a range longer than most of us have any business taking a shot.

The .270's recoil is about as much as most shooters can handle without it affecting accuracy.

The .270 Winchester is almost boring because it has been so effective for so long.

In my humble opinion...the .270 WSM and the Weatherby magnum is largely unnessesary needed in those very rare instances for that extra long shot....and only if that rifle is capable of sub .5" MOA and a hunter who can shoot .5" MOA out to extreme ranges.

We are talking about that 1 in a 1000 shot with that 1 in a 1000 rifle not to mention the rare shooter who can make it happen.

In all other instances....the .270 Winchester is more than capable.

Well said.

[quote=AkMtnHntr, 1 grizzly using 150 grain NP's and it do get the job done. [/quote]


Just curious.........where was shot placement?How many shots needed?How far did he go before dying?Did bullets fully penetrate?

Are you insinuating that since I am able to shoot 1/2" groups with the 300ultramag,I should do much better with the 270win?

This sums it up best:

I started to read about the 270 Win. while I was still in high school. Then in 1978 I bought my first one, and I've never been without at least one 270 in my battery every since. I've carried a 270 Win. (and Bob, like you, I've owned a bunch of them) on many mule deer, whitetail, elk, pronghorn, and black bear hunts, as well as moose hunts and coyote hunts.

It's been a very "lucky" (for want of a better word) cartridge for me, in that I've used it to take my first black bear, as well as my very best trophy mule deer, as well as my best pronghorn, best Texas whitetail, etc. Actually, I think the real "luck" of the 270 has been that it shoots flat, carries light, kills well, and is easy to hit with.

In fact, I quit using a 7mm Rem. Mag. mostly because as far as I could tell, the 270 killed just as well as it did, shot just as flat, kicked less, was shorter and lighter to carry, and wasn't as loud.

Mostly, I've used a 130 gr. Nosler Partition loaded to around 3140 fps. or thereabouts for just about everything I've shot with the 270 Win., and I'll take the same load after mule deer this year.

The only hunters I know who put the 270 down have either very little or no experience with it, or else they have used poor bullets, anemic loads, or they just can't shoot so they blame the cartridge instead of themselves.

My favorite two-rifle North American hunting battery would consist of a 270 Win. and a 338 Win. Mag.. If I could have only one rifle for our continent, I'd go with a 300 Win. Mag..

One of my real ambitions is to take a 270 Win. to Africa along with a 375 H&H, and one year, I'll devote an entire safari to those two cartridges. Since I grew up reading about Jack O'Connor and John Jobson using that very two-rifle battery in Africa on more than once occasion, I have to do it at least once myself and realize yet another a hunting dream from my youth......

If I lived in primarily a whitetail state and/or hunted little else other than antelope, deer, etc., the 270 Win. would likely be the only big game rifle I'd own or would want to own.

The 270 Win. is hardly the only cartridge I use or have used, but it is one of my favorites, and I am a member of "The Cult of the 270" grin

AD

It's too bad Allen never made that trip to Africa with just a 270 & 375.

Just a couple months after this terrific post Allen stopped by for a visit with his wife Beth. What a good time we had.

He passed in May of 2010 at 53 years old.

Death certainly brings into perspective arguing ballistic gack on the internet!

Posted this before....my go to rifle for PA and NY bucks is a Remington 700 Classic 270 Win. that I purchased new in 1981....many other options but, I feel really guilty leaving it behind in the safe....it has NEVER let me down.

Since this post originated in 2007 and I had never owned a 270 prior to that time, I could not claim cult status and was unable to participate in this thread. That however, has changed. I was raised on the 30-06 - that is what my Dad shot, and what his Dad shot (sporterized Springfields and Enfields with open sights, and is what I learned on). In 2008, I felt I needed to buy one of the newly introduced M70 Limited rifles under FN manufacture. I was on the hunt for a 30-06, but on a whim came home with a 270 Featherweight instead. Since 2008, I've added more 270's (as well as more 30-06's and others), but tend to grab a 270 more than anything else these days. It's definitely become a "go-to" cartridge for most of my hunting (and I also have a couple of 7x57's... )

Wow. It's interesting you posted this today as I was recently reading some past threads that included some of his posts. In doing so I wondered to myself, "why haven't I seen more posts from AD that are more recent?". There are very few who would elicit such thoughts, some for the extreme loathing they create for themselves in others, and fewer for their friendly and reasoned contributions. I never personally knew him other than through a few pieces of correspondence. He was definitely one whose absence is noted because of his friendly and reasoned contributions. I am saddened to hear of his passing.

Exactly, the spirit of AD is still right on the money.

I still use the same one I bought back in high school about 20 years ago.

I too must confess to being a member of "the cult of the 270". I must also confess to leading my daughter astray with a Model 70 Classic stainless featherweight in .270. I feel better now that I have confessed.

Win fwt 270 looks good, feels good, shoots good, kills great.

I'm building one right now... Classic SS M70 Fwt (6-digit 1996), McMillan Hnters Edge (on order), PT&G 1-piece bottom metal, X-Low Talley Lwt's, 6x36 Leupold LR, Uncle Mike's Mtn Sling... with 4 rounds down should come in 7-lbs 6-ozs give or take.

I have twin daughters so I am working on an exact duplicate of the first one. I will be guilty of leading two young ladies astray.

Sounds awesome Brad. I figured you'd be using a Brown precision or High Tech Specialties stock instead of the edge since the ergos are more similar to the Montana. They also weigh about the same as the micky edge. Why did you decide to go that route my friend? Your build sounds more along the same lines as my pre 64 270 fwt:



This one has made me change my tune about 270's.

Brad;
Good morning to you sir, it's good to see you posting again here at the 'Fire - hopefully you and yours are well this still cold beginning to 2015.

If you're ever feeling in an adventurous mood when starting a build, you might consider a Wildcat Composites stock just for something different.

This one was an honest 21oz without the Decelerator installed and if I'd gone with a lighter pad instead of the Decelerator we could have come in at 23oz including pad and swivel bases.

The Wildcat stocks have a carbon fiber I beam cast into the center of the stock and the two I've worked with were very, very stiff stocks for the weight.



It's a push feed, early '80's Featherweight in .270 and the owner wanted me to prime it only as it was going to be gifted to his son and they were going to rattle can the final pattern together.

Although somewhere I do have a photo of the finished product on a scale I can't find it at present somehow Brad. Anyway if we can trust my increasingly faulty memory I want to say it scaled out very close to your 7� lb target.

Anyway just a thought for a "someday" project Brad. All the best to you and yours in 2015.

Dwayne

I've had 3 Hunters Edges under M70's, 2 featherweights (both 30-06's, a pre-64 and post 64) and one standard weight (300 WSM).

While the comb is not ideal to me, they are lighter than a High Tech, stiffer, require very little work, already have pillars, and most importantly are more svelt in the forearm. If the Banser had the same svelt forearm as the Edge I'd go Bansner hand's-down as they're a fair bit less money and are plenty good enough.

Brown's are grossly overpriced, have no pillars, not as well made IMO, and have an overly long forearm for a 22" fwt bbl.

My life is busy and a McMillan makes it simpler.

Dwayne, Wildcat indeed makes a nice stock. Some years back I talked with the owner about ordering. At the end of the day, when you start going through the list of things you'd want from WCC's, the cost is about the same as the McMillan Hunters Edge, and isn't quite as light.

Best to you my friend...

Brad

As to the 270, the only "first" it holds for me was I used an M70 Fwt to take my first antelope when I moved to Montana in the 90's. I used a 308 to take my first Mule deer and a 338 WM to take my first elk.

At the end of the day, just sticking with that original 270 would have been the wisest thing I could have done... or the 308

That makes a lot of sense Brad. Sounds like a damn fine rifle you'll end up with.

My first big game rifle was a Remington 700 in 270. Got it when I was about 14 and still use it often. Dropped it in a McMillian Edge and had it Ceracoated to make it more user friendly. I've taken caribou, black bear, Dall sheep and many Sitka blacktails with it. I've been wanting a Kimber 84L and the 270 is getting serious consideration.

270 seems to kick less than -06, not really more than a 308, at least to me and my shorter frame. Only shot 4 so har, but all have moved less than 50 ft from hit point so yes, I too am a fan.

Have owned maybe four or five .270's.. The 721 lived here longest.. I shot several whitetails, antelope, and a turkey with it.. Couple years ago I picked up a custom barreled 700 in .270.. (the 721 was long gone) This one had a about a number 5 on it 26" long.. It just felt good so I bought it.. It hasn't quite edged out the old .25-06 in my favorite rifles, but it is close.. So far it has taken coyotes, mule deer, antelope, whitetails, elk and feral hogs.. Certainly one of my favorites, but not in the top three...

I guess I joined the cult today. Traded for a Cross Canyon Arms built Ruger. I think it was built as a raffle gun for the Mule Deer Foundation. Nice Vortex Diamondback scope on it too. What factory loads should I consider for Colorado elk and deer?

Fed Premium 150 gr Partitions, or 130 gr Partitions--if you can get that ammo to shoot well.......

Owned a 270 once that was given to me. I kept it long enough to sell it.

Have no use for one.

I've hunted with a 270 exactly once in my life. End result was a DRT doe at 250yds. The rifle is one of the most accurate I own but it just sits in my safe. Guess I should get it out more often but I just can't warm up to the cartridge.

Have had 3 or 4, sold em all but the one I wish I still had was a Mod 70 push feed carbine. I sold it to a friend when his daughter started hunting 15 years ago and the SOB won't let me buy it back! It would make a GREAT rebored 280 Rem.-Muddy

This one followed me home the other day....




Steyr Mannlicher Classic in 270 Win.

Passed the range test. Took it for a spin at my lease between Christmas and New Year, but the critters didn't co-operate.

Try again soon. See whether I will kill anything.

JAPMF,


GWB

Gee, very sharp .270.. Was it new or used??? When I visit Texas this spring, I must look over the used gunshops.. I have been in several that were just awesome.. One had 3 or 4 of the old style deluxe Anchutz sporters in .22 LR.. Price was excellent, I should have bought one..

Sir,

almost never buy rifles new if I can help it. I try to buy them pre-enjoyed at a value. Hard to lose by making a profit. Collecting rifles is one of the few addictions that can be self-financing.

Snagged the Classic on Gun Broker.

Have owned Merkel, Sako, and Sauer, but never Steyr.

Picked up a Mountain rifle the same week in 308 Win for $550 at a local honey hole.



Its a killer..........



JAPMF,


GWB

Very nice.. When I head that way, I may ask you for some of your favorite used gunshops, if you don't mind and I am close to that area.. Texas is a whopping big place..

All things considered, all things put into a bowl, shaken, stirred, and poured out, I still think the 270 is the best all-around Western cartridge ever for the average citizen.

Back East, I can't see the need for it, though that doesn't mean it doesn't work there too.

Brad works just as well here....very popular!

I agree.

JDK: Knocks their noses in the dirt.

Yes it does.

I'm in.

Goat, deer, antelope and elk.

Been using this old girl since 69, with no regrets or worries.....

The more other stuff I get the more I wonder why I didn't just stop at the .270...just plain gets it done for anything I need(of course I'll have to get a couple more different rounds just to be sure...)

Lemme see. My wife and I have used the .270 on pronghorns, whitetails, mule deer, caribou, elk, moose and bison, with no problems. Didn't use it on the two bighorn ewes we've taken, or any black bears, but did use "faux .270's," including the 7x57, .280 and .30-06. Maybe .270 bullets would have bounced off the sheep and bears, but I doubt it.

Have seen it work in Africa too, even on some supposedly super-tough plains game animals.

What will a long action in 270 do that a short action in 284 won't?

Make finding cases and ammo easy.

My .284 is right where I can find it.

Fit and feed better in a LH Model 70 action.

Here is a convert from .243 to .270

Fit and feed better in most actions--period.....

Casey

Smart lad!

Well yes, but that reality tends to offend people. :-)

+3

On Bison?

I've used the 280 Remington on Bison quite affectively.

Got that right.

idahoguy,

Eileen killed a cow bison weighing around 900 pounds with a single 130-grain Barnes TSX through the lungs. The "buffalo" went went about 40 yards and keeled over. The bullet exited, by the way.

I know a guide on the Ft. Belknap Reservation here in Montana, however, who would think she was way over-gunned. He's killed a bunch of bison with the .25-06.

I'll throw my hat in the ring. Though I do like the single shot approach, which allows a 26" barrel, yet handy overall length.



I had a Remington Mtn Rifle in .270, with 22" barrel. It was rather blasty

270 works great for me.

270 bounces balls off chitt, if it's owners balls aren't worth a chiit.

I have seen a meat ball shot with a 270 on pasta night, we had meatloaf for supper.grin..

I've been a member of the Cult since '75. After shooting a M94 growing up, I purchased my first rifle: Ruger M77 in 270. It flat killed stuff. After going through a couple of #1's and a Sako Classic that I should have never traded, I abandoned the Cult for sexier calibers. Now, 40 years later and after many guns/calibers, I'm back and would show you what arrived yesterday if I only could post a picture...technology and old people..... FIGURED IT OUT.....

[img:center][/img]

Count me in. Have had a .270 in model 700 since i was 14. Just received my NULA in .270.

What barrel length and contour did you get on the NULA?

Agreed, I have owned over a dozen .270s, since 1968 and currently have two original P-64 Fwts. in highend synthetics plus a 1946 action, modded Micky Edge MKIX style stock and Talley QDs holding a Z3-3x9 Swaro, this has a Classic Fwt. sts tube and shoots.

The .338WM/.270WN. combo is still as good as it gets here in BC and this is the last set of rifles I will part with for whatever hunting remains to me.

my '60 model 760 will eat the center out of a 100 yard target all day with 130 CL's. and it does it with a cheap 3-9 on see throughs. friggen thing is boring to shoot. and deer flat out drop and don't move when hit. it is that good. if i HAD to give up all my deer guns but one, it would be that one.

Tough pair to beat.

Sorry, Just saw your post. Got #1 contour 22in barrel per Mr Forbes recommendation. Talked with him about a #2 contour. He said it would just make the rifle heavier and would shoot and handle great just the same. Who am I to argue. Just got it last week and LOVE it. Haven't shot yet. Wind blowing 30mph + now.

Oops, should also add per your recommendation as well. I recall you saying your first NULA was also a #1 22inch barrel. As always, thanks for your advice and guidance.

I recently re-did my rifle collection. Cult member since the 60's. Now it is a pre-64 M70, a Ruger M77, and a Sako 85 Hunter.
I have a .338 BAR, and a Tikka .243. I think that covers the North American continent well enough. Jack O'Connor is on my
bookshelves.

There is no more beautiful wood than that. Im glad its on the best deer cal. A 270 Win. Man, i love that wood.

I'm in. I have taken a lot of critters with it.
I gave one to my son, he loves his. He said, why own all those rifles when you can get it done with a "270".

Thinking about another. Build one, or buy a Kimber 84L

Have a good day.

Add another here. All started with my Grandad's pre-64 and have added 3 more so my boys could join in.

Off the shelf I can't really imagine a better deer rifle than a 270 Win Montana.
(or 260 MT, 7-08 MT, etc...)

Thanks Sam

I know they are very nice these days. I will be in gun store country next Thursday. (Sacramento) I will be looking for a 7-08 or a 270 Win.

I think either one would put a grin on my face.

Have a good day.

Randy, I haven't handled an 84L, curious to hear how it compares to the 84M.

84M feels more "right" in my hands, and the 24" bbl on the 84L needs to be cut to 22 or 23" to feel right as well.

The 84M is spot-on right out of the chute.

But I do like the 84L with a cut barrel...

In general: I don't have a .277 now but did at one time and my memories of using it on SD deer, west river, still warm me. I'm very nostalgic.

I might agree with Brad that it maybe the best choice for the non-loony hunter in the west (maybe the loony hunter too). And Bob says it works in the trees out east too; who knew?

It's just a classic cartridge where the natural laws of this world have provided for a fine combination of velocity, bullet weight, and little recoil for all kinds of soft-skinned game. This is true for some other cartridges too in their own, different niche where the needs are different.

I do have a "270" of sorts in a Rem SA; it's called a .284 and, yes, it feeds fine (no, I'm not offended by the previous cruel and hurtful remarks about the .284). It could be though that the longer case is inherently inclined to feed a little easier with a little less work. Could be.

Can't go wrong with it.

I have been thinkin' hard on a 84L in .270Win., cut to 23" and maybe with Murphy Precision Ti mounts, two sets rings and two Leupy VX3 2.5x8 silver scopes, with HD reticles.

Some 150NPs and BTs, RE-22 and all that is holding me up is this little issue, $$$$$$-damned house renos, cut into a guy's gunbux!

Pretty hard to beat for packing up BC's mountains, which get "taller" every year!!!

Brad, I kinda guessed that's what it'd be like but still need to try an 84L.








George, that is the finest observation I have ever heard.

While the 270 Win got praise from Western hunters it was never seen much here in CT or up North.
The 30-06 Springfield was used for target shooting, hunting and war.

There must have been a thousand times more 30-06 bullets fired than 270's!

When I started out centerfire hunting and handloading in 1953 we got 30-06 ball ammo free for use in our matches and we loaded it for hunting.

The 270 Win is probably the luckiest cartridge of all-time.

....and one of the sexiest.

Here is a Ruger Express 270 with good wood.

Without a doubt.

All true.

If you like to read bunches of numbers and ballistic tables, it's not for you.

If you're a hard core target shooter, or like to shoot gongs in the next zip code in hurricanes, it's not for you.

It isn't suppose to work on elk, moose and grizzlies...but it kills them all,and more.

If you don't want to worry about a bunch of ballistic back, just want a rifle of moderate weight, recoil,ease of hitting,and good to excellent killing effect,that you can grab and safely hunt about anything in North America (and most stuff anywhere),it's a good cartridge to just grab and go. Kind of a no brainer.

"There must have been a thousand times more 30-06 bullets fired than 270's!"

Hello Sam, I'm kinda in the same boat. I have felt the 84L, I thought it was nice. Like Brad said, it could be a bit long, and need to be cut back.
I have yet to feel an 84 Montana.
I own an 84M in 308 Win. Wood stock. This rifle shoots great, has a nice feel to it. Fun to hunt with.
I think, I would really like to put a Kimber 84 Montana in my hands and go from there.

Wishing you the best.

Stay warm.

Geedubya and HEB330, that Steyr and the single shot are very fine looking rifles!

My newest Featherweight in (finally) .270 Win,topped with a Zeiss 4x and Talley lightweight bases/rings.

Friend, that's a nice looking Winchester.

Thank you. Working on some handholds for it right now.

Isn't this cult headquartered in San Fransisco?

Belong to the .270 cult? Not me, although I do have a couple of rifles in .270 MI (Much Improved). They are more commonly known as a 6.5-06 Ackley and .280 Rem.

I�ve always considered the .270 to arguably be the best cartridge for a dedicated deer rifle and still feel that way. Problem is I don�t need a dedicated deer rifle when most of my big game hunting is antelope and elk. Deer are more targets of opportunity, to be taken when it doesn�t get in the way of filling elk tags.

Several years ago I tried to buy a .270 at a gun show. It was a stainless Ruger MKII with the Zytel semi-skeleton �boat paddle� stock. Seller and I were $15 apart on price so I decided to go home and think about it. Then I decided I was stupid to let $15 get in the way and went back the next morning to purchase it. Got to the show about 10 minutes after it opened and was about 10 minutes too late � someone else was already filling out the paperwork. Still kicking myself for being so #@&#$^% stupid.

Last year I sold a Ruger #1 in .280 Rem with the intention of replacing it with a rifle Daughter #1 could use on her first elk hunt this coming fall. A .270 was a top contender for the replacement but I already had a pile of .280 Rem brass and, because I also shoot a 7mm RM, lots of bullets in .284�. Thus the replacement was also a .280 Rem, this time a Ruger All-Weather. (Turns out she likes my .308 Ruger Scout better and wants to use that. Go figure.)

So while a �real� .270 eludes me, my .270 MI rifles have me well covered on both sides.

Sam, that shot went right over his head

Im a 270 WSM fan and it has served me well from NY to Oregon. 150 PTs and now BBCs at 3150 work excellent. Got plenty of others but I still love to hunt with my 270. Easiest rifle I've ever loaded for and the easiest rifle I can sling up and look like a decent rifleman with.

This is a mule of a .270. More of a bench rifle. It has a heavy rem magnum contour barrel but fluted and a heavy mcwoody. Grt shooter.

There are more 270win-chambered rifles in my safes than any other cartridge. My first centerfire was an old ADL. Local store was advertising Rem 700 "30-06" rifles on sale. I went down to pick one up, and the first gun the man threw on the counter for me to look at was a 270. All I said was "I want this one"...I killed literally truckloads of game with that gun topped with an original Redfield Widefield.

My son owns that rifle now, and has killed everything from whitetails to hogs to sheep with it. Still wears that Redfield Widefield.

If I had to own just one rifle, it would be a 270.

That's tempting...

The 270 IS the 06' of the gun world.

W

LOL, a mystery wrapped in an enigma!

Agreed... it's super nice.

The 84L's ejection port is a touch short, and its shank is a bit too long, but neither are a deal killer.

The .270 Cult is the finest non-military round since 1925.

This^^^. I think O'Conner considered it the unbelted magnum. He made that observation by how it ran critters through the chitter.

Fixed it

So after nine pages of praise for the 270, why do they get so much chit here? I know it's some sort of a joke, but fill me in. I'm new here....sorta.

P.S. I also have a 270...one. Can't afford 3-4 and I wasn't even a thought in the 60's and early 70's. I was just an egg back then.

Ya got it figured Dooger....it's a generational thing. When I was growing up after THE WAR, if you saw an MM rifle it was something somebody had brought back from THE WAR. The 250-3000 and the 270 Winchester were the earlier fast stepping, light bullet catridges.

The old MM stuff usually had fast twist barrels to stabilize the extremely long bullets used then and once again the rage for ultra-long-range shooting. There wasn't much out there for fast twist 270s and the longest bullet common was the 160NP, IIRC.

The young metro-sexuals hanging around here think they are on the cutting edge with their metric stuff while the Geezers continue pile em up with 270s.

WWII + Outdoor Life + JOC = 270 following. Ask any WWII vet or his kid. GI's got copies of Outdoor Life, read the stories, followed suit.

Wife's grandfather still worships the guy. It's that simple. Gotta love the greatest generation.

Lots of it is TIC...but among those who criticize it seriously,many have not killed much of anything...with anything. Like Vern says,hunters keep filling freezers and walls with the cartridge.

Mostly the anti-270 stuff is richly deserving of being ignored.

And everyone that poops on em' has at least one... With the bullet crop expanding it gets prettier with age. Heard tell also some folks buy guns and just go shoot them. So it's very appealing to this strange tribe that they can go get any gun configuration they wish.....

Now when someone gets up early and breeds a 27 Nosler I would be up for that....

W

Nice zing

I just got a really nice LH CDL in 270 Win and wondered why I took so long to finally try one, working on a load with the 160 gr Partition right now. Should be quite useful load around here......

Just curious, but, having loaded the 150NP for hunting the same province that you do and exclusively for at least 25 years for about a dozen different .270s I have owned, I have never seen any actual benefit to the 160NP.

It IS heavier, but, given it's profile, it has a lesser "BC" than the 150, so, I chose the lighter one. I am interested in why you choose the 160, maybe for Grizzlies?

I have loaded 270s since March, 1968 and have used RE-22 exclusively since 1990, with stellar results, sub-moa accuracy with the 150 and 2900 fps-mv averaged from my three P-64 Fwts with their 22" tubes.

I am going to try some RE-25 later this year in my various .280 Rems, to see if they will do 2900 from their 23" bbls., with the 160NPs and I think this might well be an excellent choice for the .270-160NP, as well.

JMHO, but, I would be very interested in any results you may have and care to post here.

I used the 160 NP for moose prior to the TSX and I think my load was 55 gr 4831 but one book says that's hot.

I used the 160 because we were still transitioning from old cup & core reasoning into bonded core and monolithic bullets. I've still got several boxes of 160s if someone is in need.

If the new-age, MM users would read J O'C, they would find he also recommended the then new 280 Rem [7MM].....a few did read it and got so upset they had to AI their 280s just to distance themselves from Cactus Jack.

The reason is I think they are a really cool bullet, there is something about a heavy semi spitzer bullet that I really like. It is a good match for this part of B.C. since most shots are at close range, I would think with it's s.d. of .298 those bullets are going to dig really deep I honestly don't think the 150 gr NP would give up much to it when it comes to penetration......

I can update this thread as I do load development if you want, working with some Ramshot Magnum right now and hop to do a bit more shooting this weekend. I have some RL 22 and 25 waiting in the wings if Magnum doesn't do it, When we see some IMR 7977 show up here I would like to give it a try, it shows some excellent speeds with 140's and heavier.

http://www.hodgdonreloading.com/data/rifle

The 160-grain .277" Partition and the similar 220-grain .308" Partition have been accurate in every rifle in which I've tried them.

Or simply because those of us more interested in hunting rather than long range ballistic charts and uber BC bullets know that it works just fine.

Never read any JOC or much ODL and wasn't around for WWII and still don't feel handicapped one bit with a 270....grin



Of course also I doubt any of us could tell a difference(hunting/shooting at reasonable ranges...) between a 260, 270, 7-08, etc....

Good to hear, I have high hopes for it. I also have found the same thing with the 220 gr Partition, it is very accurate. I used to have a 308 Norma Mag that shot them great and my friend's 300 Win Mag also shoots them very well. I can tell you the 220 gr PT is a hammer on both black and grizzly bears. The 277 160 gr looks like it will be a junior version of that bullet, in around 3 months or so one of those will be meeting a black bear

Guys may look down their noses at the 160-grain Partition because it's "only" a semi-spitzer. But, it has a better BC than either the 130-grain or 140-grain Partitions and it's BC is only a little worse than the 150-grain Partition's BC.

Yes it's not exactly like lobbing rocks out there, I would shoot 300-400 yards with them and be confident, the vast majority of animals taken is much closer than that anyway.

All metro fuggrrs like ingwue and such others know you cant kill no freaking moose with a 270. Thats why they had to invent the mighty mountain shaking elephant killing 280.

Until something runs off, then it's the guns fault.

Yup, that's EXACTLY why I got a .280 instead of a .270.


That, or the Ruger #1 bargain priced in front of me was a .007" overbore...

Of course after I sold the Ruger #1 I could have replaced it with whatever I wanted but got another rifle in .280, an All-Weather Ruger. I chose THAT rifle for the reasons above, too... and the little matter of already having dies and lots of brass for the .280...

But you are right - the fact is a .270 is for girly men and women where a .280 is for men with dongs that reach their knees and a pair of baseballs in their sack...




My only disappointment with the .280 is I thought Daughter #1 would choose it for her first elk hunt this fall - but she prefers my Ruger Scout in .308 Win.

Maybe if I'd gotten a .270 instead... ???

280 doesn't have schit over a 270 until you AI it, shove a 162 in it, or both.

The reverse is equally true with the exception of the availability and prices of factory ammo. Midwayusa lists 56 choices for the .270 Win, starting at $17.49. By contrast, only 18 choices are listed for the .280 Rem and prices start at $30.49.

For handloaders, midwayusa lists 82 choices for the .270 (.277"/6.8mm) and 100 for the .280 (.284"/7mm). Of those, only 50 types are available for the .280 and only 44 for the .270.

Whichever you prefer, living on the on-game difference would make for a pretty meager existence.

But the .270 is still gay...

My dad believed only three men lived the Perfect Life. Jesus, Franklin Roosevelt and Jack O'Connor. In no particular order.

O

That there's funny OUTCAST! THANKS...I needed it.

Well, it should have been Teddy R.

http://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/topics/9585129/1

I did score some Reloader 23 recently. I'm definitely planning to try it first in the 270, to see if it's as good as 22

Keep us posted on your loads, tex.

bought my first 270 around 1977.still my favorite.it was a rem bdl.used it for everything i hunted.90-100-110gn bullets for varmits,140gn for deer. i think the 270 is really over looked as a varmit caliber when loaded with light bullets.i killed a few thousand groundhogs and foxes with that bdl.then i bought my first 22-250 and that ended my shooting lighter bullets in the 270. then a few years back the 6.8 ar15 got popular so having a bunch of left over .277 lightweight bullets i had to build a 6.8. love shooting the .277 bullets.

I'm your huckleberry. My earliest memories of my interest in hunting was when I was very very young and my dad was readying his model 700 in 270 for a pronghorn hunt outside of Saratoga.

My grandfather always had a stack of "Outdoor Life" magazines I would send hours looking through and JOC and the 270 continued it's spell on me from early on.

My first rifle was a 30/30 but my first serious rifle purchase was #1 in 270. I own may rifles in many calibers and cartridges all of which I like, but I find when I grab something to hunt with most of the time it will be one of my 270's.

I am partial to a family 61' model 70 fwt. and it was my companion again this year.

My granddad also had a stack of Outdoor Life. And Field and Stream and Sports Afield. He lived 5 miles away so I spent a lot of time there reading the ever-changing stack.

Can't say as they made me want to buy a .270, but they did make me want to move to elk country. Was offered a job in Colorado in 1981 and went on my first hunt in 1982. Have only missed one or two years since.

Granddad taught my brothers and I how to shoot, hunt small game and fish. Funny thing, he didn't hunt big game when he was farming. Didn't shoot his first deer until he was 83. Shot his second when he was 87 and decided they were "too much work". He helped teach my girls to fish, too, and I'm convinced he is a big part of the reason they like the outdoors so much.

Thank you, Granddad!!!

Very good buck there, SW.

Count me in. Ruger 77 featherweight.

I have three of them. BAR, Rem 700, Ruger no.1. They work.

.280 Rem might be "better!"

I'm going to use my 270 on a nice buck this year!!!!! Count me in on this one. Southwind, cool pic!! Makes me want to use my 270 even more now..

Interesting to read this thread,that goes back to 2007. 270Guy was an old friend of mine and one of the best whitetail hunters I knew,down on the ground, on his feet.

He was very fond of the 270 and the M70 Winchester.

He has passed on since this thread started but I know he'd be tickled that it's still going on!

RIP, Denver!

Yea, count me in on this cult, I purchased my M70 Winchester back
in the 70s,nailed my first buck 205# dressed and scored 151 in MN .
I'm hoping that I will get to use the .270 in the southwest more
now.

Yep. I'm in. Have a minty Husqvarna 9000 in 270. When I pull the trigger I know it's gonna hit and know it's gonna kill. Easy to shoot caliber with a ton of power. Mine has killed many a moose and deer.
Great cult to be associated with as far as cults go.

When it came to picking a common caliber/load for my 3 sons and I for deer, I chose .270. I own/have owned 7 or 8 .270's, and every one has shot well. (can't say this about .308's or .30-06's) Let's see, a Tikka, a couple model 70's, a Rem 700, a couple Ruger 77's, a Savage, a TC Venture.

Our current load is a 150 partition over H4831SC, but I'm looking forward to RE26 when I can find some.

I've never hunted with a 270, but found a nice KS in 270 that shoots incredible groups. I'll be using it this fall. The first load I tried.

Great group. I love my 270 win and I've had great success recently with the Hornady Superformance 130 r. GMX; getting about 3150-ish out of a 24" barrel and knocked down a nice bull elk at 208 yards with it this year.

A great track record exists for the American born cartridge, 90 years old and exclusively designed for big game hunting. With proper bullets and placement, it can handle 100% of all NA big game species.

i'll be using mine tomorrow.

Checked zeros on some rifles recently with my son. The old ADL/Redfield is still dead on after 20 years.

My 16 yr old grandson used a 270, I had bought back in the early 70's, to take 3 whitetails this season. Two bucks and a doe. Three 1 shot kills with 130gr Partitions. Average range was under 50 yards.
This Rem 700 is on its second barrel and 4th stock. This rifle has been very good to me. Sometimes I have been a little rough on it.

I have come to like my .270 better for deer hunting than my .25-06.. Never had one I really warmed up to til this one..
Sometimes I consider another, but have more than I can use now.. Still, a feather wt. would be nice..

New to "the cult" Bought a Weatherby S1 new old stock. Not to sure I'm going to warm up to this rifle, seems a bit heavy but I'm putting a light scope on it (Weaver K4) with talleys so i'll see how I like it when it's put together.

WCH....what is the 270 you warmed up to?

Agreed.

1, A couple years ago I found an ADL that had been custom barreled with a 26" about a #5.. My favorite barrel length and wt.. I bought it out of a pawn shop and it came from an estate.. Over the years I have had 3 or 4 others, but they got traded off for something else.. This one is fast becoming one of my three favorite rifles.. Edging out the .25-06 which has been in the line up since I bought the first one in the late 60's..

I lusted for an M700 African Plains Rifle when they first came out. A 26-in. MR skinny barrel profile would trump a 7RM, I was sure.

What kinda velocities are you getting from your Long Rifle, Wyo?

Never got the APR, but have thought about turning my '88 MR into one in an Edge plus LW parts.

I will have to admit I put the 25-06 up and haven't fired it since I got my first 270. I did get a featherweight and it is now my favorite 270 as well as my favorite deer rifle and favorite model 70...

I know how you feel, except for the favorite model 70 part...

End of thread...

Oh, come on now,


Jerry

Yep, I bought my first 270 @1975. Many rifles, cals, & cartridges have come and gone.....
haven't been w/o at least one 270 Win.


Jerry

I came into the cult 1 year ago (back a couple of pages on this thread) I shot one black bear with the 160 gr Partitions which worked great. Ended up selling the gun but am going to put together a 1 in 9 twist 270 Win this year to replace it. I really enjoy what the round offers and am looking forward to getting it done, it will be the "perfect" mountain gun.....

That should be a cool set up Gerry. I really like my 270 WSM. Never owned a 270 Winchester, but when my Dad asked me to set up a rifle for one of my twin little brothers the 270 Win was number 1 in my book. Light recoil, great bullets and they all seem very accurate.

I still would like a Pre64 270 Winchester before too long. Just as Bob and a slew of others said, it just plain works when you use great bullets.

1984, To be honest, I only checked the speed on a couple loads.. The 140 gr. Sierra HPBT is about 3000.. I started with that, 140 SST's and 110 gr. Sierra for varmints.. The SST's didn't group quite as well as the Sierra's, so they have just remained on the shelf.. But I did kill a cow elk, and buck antelope with them.. Mostly I have shot the Sierra's.. Killed several deer and coyotes with them out to about 400 yards+...
I plan to try some 130's this summer and later either 150's or 160's..The trouble is this 140 gr. Sierra and H4831 just works!!! I shot I4350 with the 110's, but a friend gave me a 3# coffee can full of original H4831.. Loaded a few for accuracy, and off we went.. Life should always be so simple..

Card carrying member - know the secret handshake and everything. I do however favor the short fat variety of .277. All my other guns must hate my SS Model 70 in a Bansner stock as it is the one that gets to hunting 95% of the time. The 140 gr .277 Accubond has done everything I've ever asked of it and I can't think of a better all-around combo.

I did shoot a buck with my 25-06 and a 115 gr Partition last weekend just to spread the love around a bit though.

The 140 AB is also very accurate in my pair of 270's.


And it works very well on deer.


After purchasing an 84L 270 MT this past spring I am done buying rifles for a year or two.


My ol' M700 ADL with the 'heavy' 22" sporter barrel and 6x36 weighs a little over 8lbs.

The 84L and a 6x36 weighs about 2lbs less.

I love the Remington for general use(horse/pickup/short hunts) but the 84L rules for an all day carry/hiking rifle.

As Sam has already said, I too have found 140AB's to response very well in my newly bedded 84L. It will likely go with me on my Christmas cow elk hunt in NM.
I should add that the 150NP's are tracking 2 inches lower at 200 yards.

I belong. It kills em dead. Perfect cartridge for 90% of the game we shoot. Everything thing about it is great.
Cheers

thankfully I watched a BIL ruin lots of deer meat with shoulder shots and his 270. Head shots almost took the head totally off.

And his gun kicked way worse than my 06. Reminded me of my 300.

So while I finally won a gun. a damn ruger, and in 270 to boot, I've loaded ammo and zero'd the rifle in, but I'll only loan it out, I'll be damned if I'll ever shoot anything with one...

Aint it grand we dont' all like the same blondes. LOL

I can't imagine that if a 270 Montana feels "whippy" a shorter barrel is the solution? Whippy for me is too light out front. The 24" tube of my 270 Montana feels spot on and will likely have me unloading a half dozen rifles.

Took me a while to warm up to the 270 Win but then realized it was exactly what I was looking for. What's not to like about it? Your little bro is certainly set up well for everything from deer to moose. I could see you behind a pre '64 270 win..........

It just shoots flat and kills stuff without beating you up.

I have four here now.

I'd describe its killing effect as...boring. Same thing happens every time.

I've never owned a 270 but I like them. I've always felt the best 5 rounds going were the 270, 280, 30-06, 7mm-08' and 308. I'd personally never buy a all around rifle in anything else.

That's so freakin funny, I laughed so hard I farted.

S M H. (Shaking my head).


Jerry

While I have many rifles and calibers, I do use the 270 a lot here in Cali- I don't need any thing bigger!

I agree with your picks.

The 270 Winchester is in the middle range of reasonable big game rifle cartridges. It's been popular for a long time.

When I started out in the early 1950's we had the 30-06 as the standard. The 06 had been the #1 military, target and hunting cartridge in our area of CT that included target competition.

The centerfire matches were shot with the 06. We got free 30-06 ammo from our club and the DCM.

It's nearly impossible to beat that. The 06 was #1.

Of course the 270 will take deer just fine and kick a little less. Some bought 270's.

There never was a 270 cult here in the North East. It is a good cartridge however.

I'll get us a gallon of liquid Advil.

That's a good start.

Merry Christmas Gunner.

Merry Christmas Elk!

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/cult

By definition any popular rifle rifle cartridge used to the exclusion of other cartridges would amount to being a Cult Cartridge

The first rifle I ever bought with my own money was a M70 270. It was in 1979 or 1980. The XTR model. When rifles were supposed to be shinny with purdy walnut stocks and bluing you could see yourself in. There has been a 270 of some sort around here ever since. I'd have no problem being held to it alone for my brand of hunting. My oldest is using her Mom's old 270 with great results. If a teenage girl can get the job done with the 270,I'd have to think I could as well.

As an admitted rifle looney I love so many but would consider myself a card carrying 270 cultist.

My 61' Mod 70 fwt gets the call more than any in the stable.

For all those reasons, iconic rifle, iconic cartridge, and a rifle with meaningful family history, let alone being a joy to carry and shoot and having complete confidence in it.

I do own a 270 wsm which I enjoy and if anything has come out of reading this thread is that I need a 270 Weatherby because I have never owned one.

I will continue to shoot and enjoy all the others but I think the trend of me grabbing the fwt 270 is only going to increase throughout the rest of my hunting career.

My very first rifle I purchased was a Ruger .270. Used it for many years for everything from prairie dogs to deer. Like many on here I went through a lot of rifles over the last 35 years since then but just last week I got a Winchester EW in .270. Looking forward to seeing what it shoots like.

I agree 100%.

Having recently rejoined the 270 cult after a 25 year absence, I can't see me needing anything else. I have a 257 robts in a M 84M on the smaller side and a M70 EW 300 WSM on the bigger side. The 270 occupies the 90% middle sweet spot.

One thing I find curious. I see all kinds of wild data and vels for the 280 AI. Look at the Nosler data. The 270 has 2 grains less capacity than the 280 AI. Nosler used a 26" tube on the AI but 0.007" bigger bullets at same pressures don't equate to what Nosler claims. And I've owned a 280 rem for the intervening 25 yr absence. It's possible to juice up standard 280 load data but still can't see getting to the vels Nosler claims with the AI'd version and its 2 extra grains of capacity. I really wish Kimber would have chambered the plain old 280........

My first big game rifle was a 700 ADL in 270 Winnie. Paid a 150.00 for it used from a private party back in 1987. Still have it. It still has the old brass ringed weaver 4x scope that came with it in Buehler mounts. It has a five digit serial number. Bought a 3x9 Leupold for it, but just never mounted it. I have many other rifles in different calibers, some custom, but I seem to use that old rifle and caliber the most.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^THIS^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

The 270 Win. proves itself year over year. Just tonight I spoke with a buddy that I had lost touch with and he's racked up (pun intended) his Grand Slam for the Province of Manitoba, including Eastern Moose and a resident-only draw for Manitoba Elk with a 270 Win. using 140 gr. Partitions. His other choice was to use his Lee Enfiled .303 rifle but he felt the 270 Win packed more punch and was more accurate past 150 yards... Then he proceeded to tell me that both were shot at under 75 yards and he only recovered the partition from the Moose but that the Moose only walked about 15 meters before falling.

I like the 270 and have used it quite a bit for my hunting. It's flat shooting,moderate in recoil and kills convincingly, even on animals a bit out of its class.

But things aren't the same today as they were in 1925,and today there are more cartridges than there were back then that do the same things the 270 does;not like then, when the cartridge was pretty much alone in that category of performance. Some of these cartridges do some things even better,although you will still struggle to see much terminal difference unless you burn more powder and go up the scale in caliber and bullet weight.

Still, for some odd reason the cartridge continues to be among the most popular in BG hunting circles, while a lot of supposedly superior cartridges have fallen by the wayside.

This isn't opinion, just facts,and I don't know why. Some would say it's because 270 hunters are ballistic dummies ( which really isn't true since a lot are very accomplished BG hunters),even if they don't spend much time studying ballistic tables. They just go out and kill animals.

I think it's because it's easy to shoot accurately,and kills well,and handles easily in the hands of lots of people,while still having enough of the right stuff to lay BG animals flat.

I inherited my father's 270, a Sako High Power. It will get carried this Fall.

Bruce Jenner used to shoot a 270.

PURE NONSENSE!!! It's a man's rifle!

Metro's and Jenner types shoot 7mm's

Bruce Jenner was a man!

I have no direct hatred for a .270, but ALL the loud mouth bragging types I grew up hunting with used one and I grew a distaste for because of them , not necessarily any inherit problem with the cartridge. MY dad used a 7x57 ,which I still have and use.

I have noticed the same thing with the 30/06. being as popular as it is, lots of dopes end up with them. Worst shots I have seen, too.

So, I therefore hate the cartridge,and only own one as an ornament.

Based 'solely' on this kind of "logic", I have come to despise the 7X57 MOUSER, and all 'smaller' 6.5 cartridges ! !





In this discussion, logic and appropriate are contradictory words.


Jerry

Just for the sake of clarity --

this smirk icon seems best suited to me to convey 'sarcasm'. I generally follow it with smiley or laugh to convey 'Friendly' sarcasm.

Just FYI


Jerry

Have nothing to add,just want to increase my post count.

If the 270 is wrong, I don't want to be right.

I have 3 .270 Winchesters. A M70 featherweight, a Ruger No1A, and a T/C Encore. I also have 2 .270 Weatherbys, a MKV Delux and a Ruger 1B. So I think a can be a card carrying .270 cult member.

That will do it.