AZ deer apps increase 168,000 over last year. Thats awesome. You're doing a great job. Thanks!

Ya they’re doing great!! Hell I didn’t even draw Montana biggame combo with the purchase of a preference point, first time in almost 20 years!!

Hunting was on the brink of dying until they came along. Such a great thing they're doing.

Randy is a nice guy and fun to watch until he shows up where you hunt and announces it to the rest of the world. The next year you have to share it with everybody from Texas to Alaska...

Ya ol Jim bachital will regret this I’m betting....

Funny..... on one hand we bitch about hunter recruitment, and our need for representation at the local, state, and national levels. We have a desire to protect habitat and devote greater resources to the protection and management of our animals....

Then, we bitch about more hunters applying and hunting in “our” areas.....

We can’t schitt in both hands....

None of my friends have that bitch. Quite the opposite. We laugh at the "hunting is dying" threads. It seems to be dying to those not applying. Point creep is real in every state.

But I do agree with one thing. I bitch about Randy showing up in AZ with a mob of social media "crews" all running cameras trying to earn a $ and pretending they're doing it for me.

I think the guys bitching about hunter recruitment are just upset that their video game playing grandkids don't want to go shoot rabbits with them with their muskets...

😂😂🤣

Exactly Greg!! They would rather go play Fornite!!! Pretty sad.

Yep with flatbills and skinny jeans, 🤣

I suppose we should all get all the tags we want, and be the only ones allowed to hunt in the areas we call “dibs” on... seems fair.... in a 3rd Grade sorta way.

One of the many reasons I like private ground, Texas.

Yes we should... Clint and I drew our unit 168 E Arizona coues tags so we’re good!! Back to 3rd grade!! Carry on

Rub it in.

Best unit in the state.

You guys suck.......

You're right. I should take delight in the Instagram Posse's invasion of our hunting spot, trying to make a living out of it. Thats a good thing. I keep forgetting. Please keep reminding me.

That’s what I’m told!! We’re camping in Williams right??

Get use to it. The more folks that bale out of Colorado's circus, the more headed that direction.

When I was a kid. If you knew someone that made regular trips west to hunt, you were the minority. They were usually men of means. Some were just robust folks that would tent camp in God's country with little more than an outfit of "Hunting" clothes and whatever rifle they owned. Just look at us now! Un fricking real what we need to survive a season of elk hunting.

What use to be a one trip out west dream is now "How many states will we draw this year !? ".

Everybody has a right to make a living, but hunting/fishing shouldn't be a TV/social media spectator sport anyway IMO. It beats watching the Batchelor maybe, but that's about it.

Your exactly right, sad but true...

Look on the bright side most are not willing to work hard for an animal. So get off the roads and hike a little, you'll probably be the only one out there. At least that is how it has worked for me so far.

Absolutely. If you can get the tag, and theres not many roads, a little effort gets you clear of most hunters.

This^^^ There is a lot more to hunting than just killing something. I would rather hunt hard in the mountains and fail than kill a giant critter in Texas.


mike r

Again as Clint said, YOU have to obtain the tag/permit first in most cases.... when I’m hunting, I wanna kill a critter first and foremost, if I wanna hike/experience the country I have the rest of the year to do that without a $500+ tag in my pocket I’ve waited years, maybe decades to obtain... never hunted Texas so I can’t comment on that.

Statements like this show just how ignorant some hunters can be. There are hard hunts, easy hunts, and everything in between here, just like most every other State I would imagine.

Go get em!

Johnny, about that lease......

I need to mooch of you this year, remember?

There are certainly many worthy hunts to be had in Texas. Not everything there is high fence. Just putting out a feeder doesn't guarantee a Trophy animal. Knocking others legal means of hunting is just as harmful as being an anti-hunter. Hunting styles differ for reasons, What works in the hardwoods of the Northeast may not work in Texas or the Northwest. As those in the southwest tactics may not work back East or in the Northwest. We all need to stick together, if a certain hunting style doesn't fit your liking don't partake in it.

Big animals Like to live in one of two places for the most part. Either in town where they know they are safe or way in the backcountry away from people! Can you kill a good animal off the road? Of course. But the truth is roads get hunted hard and the crowds generally don't wander far from the road or easy accessible trails. Any halfway knowledgable Public Land Hunter knows that. I don't knock Ranch hunters, road hunters (provided they follow the laws) or even high fence hunters.

Call me ignorant if it floats your boat. But I stand with any legal hunter no matter his choice of methods. Methods I don't care for I won't partake in it's that simple.

Man you know a year to guys our age is a blink of they eye. I'm talking long term.

Apparently you assume facts not in evidence. I did not comment on how hard or easy, how good or poor are the hunts in Texas. Only my preference. I do not care how others hunt and posted only to say how little the TV hunters have impacted me. If you prefer your style of hunting and being in Texas, enjoy. I promise that watching hunting shows on your favorite lease will not lure me in.


mike r

Doubt it. Not everyone can get up where he goes (or would want to) Lots of mountains around for those willing to climb.

Darn....the whole 2019 TX hunting season may shut down if you don't show up. Please reconsider.

This is a funny old wives tale that get's repeated over and over........

That being said there seems to be a rather small zone between the hike in hunters and the horse hunters (about 3 miles in) but even that is getting discovered......

In 2009/10, permits were easy to get. All we need is another brutal recession.

Yeh, no tags for me, even with 30 bonus points.

It would me, I’d love a giant mule deer.

Next year is YOUR year! Its gotta happen sometime man. This year approx 20 MP holders drew, so that only leaves a handful of you guys.

Preference point systems are pyramid scams IMO.

I participate in them cuz I love to hunt but they’re really taking a lot away from good access to tags and that’s sad.

In spite of all that, however, I’m grateful for the guys who are promoting the sport in various ways as apologists to a new generation of hunters. In a democratic republic we need that...

If I’ve got more than two deer or elk points in CO... I screwed up... I like to hunt way too much.

I’d rather spend a lifetime hunting... than sit on my ass and build points.... hoping to draw that one hunt of a lifetime.

An AZ deer camp of 17, consisting of several crews running cameras, all pinpointing the location, is obviously promoting the sport. AZ deer apps up 168,000. Again, good job. Thank you.

How is the increase bad.... other than making it harder for YOU to get a tag?

Thanks for reminding me again. Lots of hunters in my area is a good thing. They are good guys. Is that rain on my back.........

So if a person appreciates the general attempts by some of these guys to promote our way of life then they have GOT to approve of every thing they do along the way.

Check; sorry my bad.

Hunters are just as selfish as any other group of people out there.

It better benefit me, me, me, me, me: else it's bullshit.

No wonder the world is so jacked up...

More apps doesn’t mean more hunters in your area... they still give the same number of tags. It just means they’re harder to draw.

It don’t make it harder in AZ, if you already have bps built and the new 168,000 have to start at the bottom....you will draw before them.

And some of you think this is recruiting "new" hunters???? Really????

Child please...... Fuuck

So you guys thinks kids are watching this shiit??? Haha

No it's brokedick dummies that can't\won't do their own research... I see guys at work zooming in on Idaho tags to see what elk tag people buy, guys looking at trailhead signs dumb randy has posted, but boy don't pm randy to ask about a certain unit he's hunted...... He'll sure take handouts though, matter of fact randy will suck miles of cock to do a hunt, and exploit a area.....

Colorado changed their draw last year.... and it amounted to a huge increase in NR apps. I didn’t draw a tag that any other year I would have easily drawn... and I was a little pissed about it. BUT... a bunch of my buddies applied, when they wouldn’t have before.... so I got to help my brother, and a couple other pards, shoot deer.... I wouldn’t have had that opportunity otherwise.

I get it man... often, it’s tough to look at the impact beyond our front door. But, if all hunters felt and acted like you are now... then hunting would cease to exist... as those guys would work very hard to keep it to themselves.

It’s hard to believe it sometimes.... especially when you hump your ass 4 miles into the schitt... only to see a half dozen orange vests scattered around a particular basin.... but we really do need more hunters. Even if that means some of us have to get the occasional short end of the stick.

Furthermore.... just because you don’t have a tag in your pocket... doesn’t mean you don’t get to hunt. I “hunted” at least 15 days last year... where I didn’t even pack a rifle. There’s always a kid to take hunting.... unless you’re trying to keep it all for yourself.

Josh youd probably like at the amount of "first" deer, elk, and bear I've "taken" people too.... Won't say guided, but I took people too, kids and adults..... Time to raise prices I guess....

We can review this again ...... Why is hunting out of state so much popular now than 10-20 years ago??? WHY????

There is a lot of truth in this post.

I know you have Jud.... you’re one of the good guys.

And I hear, and empathize with both sides of this coin.

My kids LOVE watching Randy Newberg... and it’s about the only “hunting” show I’ll let them watch. When my son found out he drew his first CO deer tag (3rd Season Buck)... he went and watched every single one of Randy’s Colorado deer hunts. He sees Randy work hard, and miss, and fail.... as well as succeed. It has sparked his interest, heightened his anticipation.... but also helped to temper his expectations. Not a lot of shows out there do that.

Yes and to think a "new" or "casual" hunter is gonna apply for years, collect points etc , burn vacation time, spend $ for 35-50 lbs of boned out meat is absurd...... These podcast\shows ain't about hunter recruiting, they're about exploiting a resource to fuuckers that are too lazy to do their own homework take their chances making their own news....

I'll agree these shows are not doing much to recruit new hunters....but they're encouraging casual hunters to take advantage of a lot more opportunity, and they're certainly promoting public access to public land. I see that as a good thing.

It does suck watching the draw odds go down. I've seen some of my favorite tags in Wyoming go from 100% odds third choice to less than 100% odds first choice just in the last few years, but it is what it is, and it is generally putting a positive light on the sport of hunting to the fence sitting, non-hunting folks. I am just waiting for some of my favorite general season areas to go to a draw, as more and more hunters buy tags and crowd the woods. It sucks but I can see some good in it. I have also been seeing a lot more people who throw their trash in the woods, 4x4 off road and generally be a complete ass in the hunting grounds.

There's good and bad effects to most all actions, I guess.

Do we need recruitment? Yes.

Is a new hunter going to bail if he can’t draw a tag and doesn’t have the resources to apply in multiple states to up his chances? Hell yes.

Should we be laying out application strategies, naming easier units to draw in a state, showing obvious land marks, trail heads etc? Hell no.

Some may be ok with seeing a sea of orange, that’s not what it’s about for me.

Yes, there is only a limited number of tags, but like you, myself, and many others, we get our fix by tagging along/helping others putting even more in the field. Never really saw “posse” hunting around here till 6 or 7 years ago, now you see it quit a bit in our better units. Saw the first camera on a dirt tank that is pretty remote last year, hiked in with a buddy to look around this weekend and there are 7 on the tank.

Hope I’m wrong, but I don’t think this new age of easy information is going to be good for our sport in the long game

I guess one problem with " on your own adventures " is, it's never "randy" on his own..... Hint

So the only thing it hurts.... is YOUR ability to draw a tag... that’s it.

Doesn’t hurt revenue.... in fact it bolsters it.

Doesn’t hurt the animals... the same number of tags get given out....

Doesn’t hurt the “new” or “casual” hunter... it gives them ideas and areas to attempt to draw, Hunt, harvest....

This whole argument seems pretty selfish and shortsighted to me. I get it... but there’s a lot more to it than how it effects the guys who called dibs on particular areas or tags.

Out of curiosity josh, how many states do you apply for, for big game annually?

None... I have my hands full here in CO... especially with kids of hunting age... I guess I’m just blessed. Not sure what that has to do with anything.

One of the reasons I don’t apply... is I don’t want to pay what it costs to hunt on NR tags. If I did... I’d certainly use all available methods of research I could get my hands on... and appreciate the work guys like Randy, GoHunt, Eastmans, etc. put in to make that info public.

I guess I don’t feel entitled to any particular number of tags in any particular states.... should I?

I have no interest in building points... none. I have no interest in sheep, moose, goats, etc.... should I?

For the guys who do.... you should be ahead of the curve already.... so what are you complaining about? Do you have a right to the tags/areas... just because you’ve been applying longer, or hunting longer, or appreciate them more?

I live in a state that sees more NR hunters, and apps, than any state in the nation.... I deal with their bullschitt constantly... but I also know that’s part of the game. And I appreciate the revenue it provides... because we’ve got game and parks and SWAs and access all over the f’n place. We wouldn’t have a lot of those things without people applying and hunting here.... God knows the hikers/bikers/photographers/trail riders/horsemen/4x4 clubs/etc.... don’t pay for schitt.

I’m still trying to figure out how more apps, and more hunters, is bad for anyone except the guys who don’t draw?

I will be up hunting general season in WA for deer.... the $400+ for that tag seems quite unreasonable given the “quality” of deer hunting opportunities there vs. some other states. But..... I do love hunting blacktails... and love hunting with my buddies... so I’ll pay the piper. If I had to draw that tag... I’d probably pass.

You might want to do a little more research before making this statement which is very wrong!

So in fairness, you don't have any skin in the "game".... I hope your boy smokes a whopper on his tag this year!!

When you come over this year I'd like to have you over if I'm around, "not hunting outta state" and if you have time, everything will be on me, you have a place to stay here....later

About like the celebrities in southern Cali, where it never gets below 60 or above 80, telling us down here in south Bama to turn off our AC's and conserve energy.

Theres a spot we used to kill javelina every year from. Our buddy Newberg decided to blast it all over social media... I haven't seen a javelina in there in 2-3 years.

Maybe Im a curmudgeon, but I agree 100% with the OP.

“Fairness”.... come on Jud.... you don’t see the irony in that comment? Be up in WA for the last 3-4 days of the season. I’d love to make it down that way... we’ll be on a quick turn around to get back to CO for the 3rd Season opener.

And my bad... we did put in in WY this year... my boy drew an antelope buck tag up there... I didn’t draw schitt. I’m writing this post from our family cabin in Utah, it’s been in our family long enough to be on our second 99 year lease.... and it’s my favorite place in the entire world. I tried to draw an elk tag for this unit for 10 straight years.... before Hush, and Randy, and everyone else that’s getting “blamed” for this increase. I never drew one.... so I quit trying. I’d love to kill a bull in this mountain.... it would mean the world to me... but I’m not chasing the dragon anymore. We all hunt... so we all have “skin in the game”... some a little more than others. I absolutely respect you and ct... you’re good dudes... but I think you’re being a little short sided on this issue... understandably.

Creek... sorry, you’re right.... they do pay a nickel on my dollar. If I’m wrong.... and I’d love to be wrong... please show me where/how those folks pay anything more than a drop in the bucket. Seriously, I’d really like to know.

ct... like I said.... I hear you.... a year ago at this time I was kinda pissed too. But then I came to the realization that the only person this increased draw numbers hurt, was me (the one guy I knew who didn’t draw).... and that there’s actually a benefit to the increased numbers. You’re probably right though... if you’re not from AZ.. there is no bright side... only another hurdle.

I’m going with a selfish response to this Josh...For me as a primarily pub land hunter. When the areas I hunt get’s busier with new tag holders. It can become a schit show because they aren’t familiar with the hunting grounds and do things that run counterproductive (nice way of saying) they can fùck up my hunt by doing things that is only successfull in blowing the critters out, pushing them into deep, thick, dark timbered canyons...Or worse scatter a herd temporarily.

And they’re completely unaware of what they had just done to themselves or me because they don’t know where the beasts were holding up to begin with...

To be honest, the occasional hunts that have been Joked by new hunters are my plan C and D hunts. It’s still frustrating, especially when I’m working with only 4 days to put a critter in my freezer.

Their lack of knowledge, which is often just a case of them trying apply a tactic of hunting that they are used to doing in another part of my state which may be successful for them on the East side....But, it doesn’t translate well on the West side. But they don’t know anything different.

I was chatting with GW about the efforts we both put in to losing hunters who try to locate me, or my truck and follow me into areas while scouting...Because of this I had to make some changes including selling my once dedicated hunting rig and doing away with the vanity “Elk Up” plates.

I have picked up radio chatter when someone had seen my rig and then hearing them trying to explain where I was at to someone else in their crew...Bull season can make some people lose their minds...😎

That’s a little different Mark..... you’re talking public land, OTC tags.... and increased pressure. That schitt happens. If there were no new hunters screwing stuff up... hunting would cease to exist... we need the new ones... so do the critters.

We’re talking about areas that are limited draw... so there is no increase in pressure... as the number of tags is the same. The increased pressure is in on the tags themselves.

Here’s my perspective in a nutshell:

There’s an antelope tag not too far from where I live, that used to take 1-2 points to draw... now you’re lucky to draw it with 5. I drew it last year, finally, and killed a nice buck with my boys at my side. At that point... the years of waiting meant nothing, all that mattered was how enjoyable the hunt was and seeing the joy it brought to my sons. That mount is in my boys’ room, they see it every day and take tremendous pride in it. I’d never shoot another goat in the entire state... if it meant more guys got to share hunts like that with their kids. Maybe I’m an idiot hopeless romantic... but I hope these increased draws, mean more guys get to experience stuff with their loved ones, just like I did with my kids. I think it’s the low-road to believe it’s only Flat-Billed, Mtn. Ops fueled, Browning buckmark tattooed hunters that are snatching up all “your” tags.

You are a romantic, but the right kind IMO...I’m holding 14 points for elk in a unit that I would draw at least every 3rd year. I didn’t get it this year...The only thing that keeps me sane over the higher number of points I’ve collected for hunts in Oregon 16 now for deer and not hitting a tag is like you pointed out... I have access to a decent area that holds an abundance of good animals to hunt...My knowledge and abilities help to take a nice bull almost every year. The same goes for Blacktail which make for a good hunting season for my small family.

OF&G have started discussion on making West Bull Elk a draw at some point. This scares mostly us local boys who would eventually find ourselves without a tag if that happened. I would adapt if it did and look at other opportunities for a hunt. It would feel a lot like starting over in new territory where to get ahead of the learning curve would require efforts that I have already acquired in my lifetime in my current locale...

I’m gonna say I’m grateful that I’ve had really good years hunting some rough but extremely beautiful country. And, now at this time of my life, I’m able to explore hunts outside of Oregon that not that long ago would have been out of my reach.

I just want to hunt, and hunt with good pards over country that holds nice animals for the taking if your willing to put the time, money and effort into helping to put one in front of you...

For Clint, Jud and even you, it would be hard to realize your once successfull draws just became infrequent. Maybe it’s the way in which the discovery of the hunting unit was outted that makes it the most irritating. Via tv or social media in a way removes the difficulty our pards had to go through to find it. Research it and trial and error hunting of it until the unit became a regular producer of filled tags.

The Randy Newman show does leave a bad taste of something once worked for is now just giving away...I’m sure I’ve oversimplified this discussion to a degree, not my intention. I am stoked your ugly ass will be seen more in the Northwest. I’m sure I will be sharing a hunt with you in the future as will others who are happy you maybe coming up for a stay. 😎

If the OP doesn't like the influx of new NR hunters in AZ, maybe he should move to AZ and get in the 90% pool, or perhaps fly out sometime and take a hunter safety course to get a permanent point on top of his loyalty point.... Want to know how I know about these things? Bigfin and Jay Scott have wonderful podcasts that do a great job of explaining it.

What's your deer plan in AZ? Mule deer on the rim or chasing oct or november whitetails every year? If the plan is to hunt whitetails every year, you'll still be able to do it if you have your 2 perma-points. Don't be concerned about the new guys, they're contributing $160 every year to help the game species of the state of AZ. Imagine how much money the state is making from matching federal funds.

Is Short People the theme song?

And you can deer hunt every year in AZ with a archery tag too.

I think you are speaking of money for game management. No they don't pay into that, they aren't hunting and shouldn't have to pay into that. However they pay big time into the local economies. They travel to destinations more than hunters do and over a longer period of time. Places like British Columbia, Colorado and Northwest Arkansas can and will attest to this.

I’ve supported Randy but I think I’m done. Hunting has turned into damn clown show. Instagram hunters abound now. Sickening.. They think they’re helping, they aren’t.

Come to Wyoming! Come to Colorado! And so on.

Maybe I’m selfish, but they’re driving away guys that actually figured this [bleep] out without their spoon feeding .. hope they get it how they want it, it’s a damn joke in the hills anymore.

Haha!
“Got No Reason to Live”.....Newberg
😎

I'm firmly in this camp...

Don’t even want to start with hush! They’ve single handedly ruined a unit in southern Idaho because it all has to be on YouTube you know, gotta make that buck I guess.

Then they wonder why they get harassed by fish and game and the locals.. I’m surprised their camp hasn’t been burned to the ground yet, but sadly it’s probably going to happen.

That said they are likable guys and I don’t have anything bad to say about them personally. They say they’re helping. Helping themselves is more like it.

I’ve never met randy but have met a lot of the others on the mountain, they live and breath hunting and speak my language, I just don’t think they’re the saviors they think they are.

Did hunting need this to fight special interests? I don’t know maybe.

I do know that mine and nearly all of my friends hunting experience has suffered because of it.

Just wanted to add another scattered thought , Guys like David Long and Paul Kendal could be considered pioneers of a lot of this, but they read the writing on the wall, it wasn’t having a positive affect...Don’t hear much from those guys anymore, and it isn’t because they quit hunting.

Maybe some of the aforementioned will too, but I doubt it, it’s a business to them.

Give it a few years...

I don't think there will even be a leftover list from what I'm hearing...

Yep

I don't know if it could be attributed to Randy, HUSH, Eastman's or whomever else....but last season I sat up on a mountaintop in the Wyoming range and started counting camp trailers in the valleys below. I lost count at around 200. UTVs constantly buzzing the road system below, and many making their own, new and illegal roads. Promoting public access to public land is a two way street. There's plenty of people out there trying to block public access to public lands in any way they can.

I still killed a good 4x4 mule deer buck that evening, but it really hit me hard that day, as to how crowded the western woods have become. Good, bad or indifferent, things are changing.

A quick change of tone?

Nope, but I could see it being construed that way.

My first post was pointing out how some on this thread were only bitching about not drawing a tag they want, without seeing the positives of the whole situation.

rosco you bring up a point that has crossed my mind more than once... I'm not real up on who is who among the Youtube hunting stars, but I do see the pictures of vehicles all decked out in camo-wraps and advertising whoever they are, along with all the sponsers. It all screams of "Look at us!"

If it were me, I'd be nervous as hell leaving my 50K truck plastered with advertising, sitting at the trailhead for a week.

Do you see it more as good, or bad?

In the long run, I see more bad.

I honestly can't make up my mind, but haven't thought much about it.

But just a few years ago, people like the Wilks Brothers were making huge legal gains in their quest to block legal access to public land and turn hunting into only the King's sport. With so many people using those lands these days, it is a MUCH bigger force to reckon with with a lot more public support of keeping public lands, public. I do believe that the privatization movement was a big reason why Randy started his show...though his crusade has negatively affected the sport in many ways.

I don’t mean to single Newberg out, I think the whole “hunting entertainment” industry is taking the sport to a bad place.

I don’t think hunting should be a professional sport.

On a different note, I remember as a kid reading huntin magazines , early mid 80’s, the grand slam of sheep was the holy grail, it would take years for guys to complete a grand slam, drawing tags, saving $$ etc. a local guy here a couple years ago booked and killed all 4 in one year... hunting sure has changed that’s for sure. Kinda funny hunter numbers are on a steep decline, animal numbers are supposedly at or beyond all time numbers, but yet tags/permits and public ground are harder to get/more crowded by the year.

If hunters numbers are in a decline I’m not seeing it in NM.

Seems we’re breaking application numbers every year.

Most of our hunter safety classes fill up within hours and I see more people in the field every year.

I think Jud said hunter numbers were down with tongue in cheek.

I know.

I was just commenting on it because many use the argument that it is all a tool to recruit more hunters since numbers are down.

Exactly.

No no no. It cant be true. The blowhards on TV say different........

Some states are setting application records, but hunting is dying.

Dont think newturd give flying [bleep] if he blows up your area. He'll just move on to the next victim area. Laughing all the way to the bank.....oh wait I forgot he loses money....lol.

I know you weren't singling him out, I was just using his show as an example.

I have seen a huge increase in public participation concerning public land issues the last few years, which may or may not be attributed to social media and Youtube. It has had an effect on how some managers make decisions concerning land management too, specifically concerning access issues and land exchanges. I've directly been part of it, which is one of the reasons I am supportive, but cautious of this whole situation.

Exactly why I protect my Montana spot!!! Broadus!!! Hunt broadus is the best locale in Montana!!!170” everywhere!!!! 🤣🤣

They are all out for nobody but themselves. They do what is best for them. I have no use for any of them. I miss the days of looking forward to reading the next Chuck Adams article.

You big ol diesel burnin sumbitch, your coming around!!! Haha

I can't speak specifically to HUSH Or Eastman's, but I would bet wherever they have been the pressure increased tremendously. I do know that Randy posted one of his smiling "Here we are" videos with a panoramic view of the area I have hunted for over 50 years. Not only the view of the area that gives it away to even the most casual observer, but he posted a video of the trailhead sign, giving the location away that even a street bum in Los Angeles could find it.

Worse than that, the area was inundated the next fall with people from all over America, hunting Randy's "secret" spot. That was several years ago, and if you you think they only come the year after the release of the video, you are wrong, they have been coming every year since...

Watch it, he's gonna pm you!!! 😂

This has been an interesting thread to hear the differing perspectives. I primarily hunt the east, but occasionally my compass goes west in the fall. It does seem that drawing tags in the west has become more competitive. On the flip side, I see less and less hunters in the east, including the large tracts of public land. Since these areas are closer to major population centers, this is where the overall reduction in hunter numbers is having the most measurable effect.

I hate the commercialization of anything, but even more so something as near and dear to me as hunting. Pizzing in the cathedral comes to mind. Yet, without public land advocacy, appointed officials are quick to find other monetary purposing of our public land system.

One of the problems with a country as geographically big as USA is statements like "hunting is declining". sorry numbers show it is NATION WIDE. I grew up in the east and it is declining, more and land not being open, lower animal numbers/success etc.

West is now the "in thing" and with the economy being great, more money and possibilities open. It may be shrinking in the east, but if you look at things like tag/points needed, how far out outfitters are booked, hunting in the west is growing.

I see shows like HUSH and Randy as just the next evolution of people like chuck Adams. They are doing the same, but to a faster availability, more widespread media.

Yeah, the probably shouldn't show trailhead signs, but scenery signs of a draw or mountain, probably not as identifiable. No more so than the pictures that are in magazines from "the good old days", just a wider audience.

Yes, maybe they need to adjust, but it's today.

There's also other tools that make "remote scouting" easier for traveling hunters, everything form google earth to OnX type systems, allow an eastern person to scout the west without boots on the ground.

It is a simple fact that the population has increased significantly thus a larger pool of potential hunters. Social media is a fact of life and there are those that exploit its' potential as providers and consumers of content. I would love to be able to park at a trailhead and walk to where game was ample and have the area to myself but I no longer know where that spot is. Times change. I have found that snowshoeing into the back country hunting predators is a very solitary pursuit. Lots of folks go home when it gets cold.

Edited to add that I would attribute much of the decline in hunt quality in the west to the widespread use of ATVs expanding the domain of road hunters. Noisy, stinky machines that bring the weak, lame and lazy to spots that they otherwise would never see.


mike r

Well schit, if ya cant beat them, join them. I'll start planning my eastern hunts now...

The orange army in PA is drastically declining, hunters ed classes that used to have 30-40 students have single digits in some cases. I hunted almost every legal day in Pa for spring turkey, many different properties public and private, never met another hunter, period. Last year ran into one. Deer season is more , but not even close to my early years . The economy is good, plenty of expendable income, the once in a lifetime trip can now be an annual event. Since I didn’t draw where I was planning out west, and really want to take my son I might just hunt the PA big woods.

MM

My last yr hunting in Colorado we ran into a lot of guys from Pennsylvania. Saw one fella get his first elk, he was like a kid on Christmas morning. I told them that was one hell of drive, they said they only stopped for gas and food. Great guys glad they got themselves an elk.

Haha did you get the PM too?

Connecticut has no shortage of Deer and Turkey to hunt. Plenty of Public land. Fairly easy Private land to gain access to in the Southern part of the state. Hell you can even use a crossbow in Archery season. When they opened up the Archery season to crossbow hunters the woods got flooded. Bear season maybe coming soon too.

I hope some of these guys read this. What is so difficult about not showing details that give away a specific location? Giving details on a specific location only ensures crowds and a negative experience for all who hunt there including the newcomers who may be turned off for good. I can hear it now: "I tried hunting once and it sucked, there were people behind every tree." In fact, I have heard it before in my own hunting area after some clown in a "major outdoor magazine" wrote an article about it. Why not educate new hunters on how to scout new locations and what to look for? In other words, don't hand them a fish, teach them to fish.

If your goal is to teach new hunters, the most valuable lesson is not "where to go" it's what to look for and how to find your own hunting spots.

This is very similar to what happened years ago with Mark Henckel, Outdoors Writer for the Billings Gazette. Henckel would find out about really good hunting or fishing spots, write up an article with far too many details, and soon after the spot would be inundated with big city Montana A-bags. The guy died around ten years ago, and even today when his name is brought up in certain circles, it's met with curses.

Interesting you should say that... and I agree completely. I don’t know of anyone who does that better than Newberg... he’s got entire series devoted to the use of technology and “e-scouting”. He has podcasts and videos on the different phases of elk hunting, and what terrain to look for depending on where the elk are at in this cycle. I’ve referred this series to several new elk hunters... who have absolutely no desire to find the next “hot unit”... they simply want to learn about elk hunting.

I’ve never watched a hunting show looking for a particular area to hunt... but I definitely appreciate much of the info being relayed. We used to get info like that from magazines.... visa vis the Chuck Adams reference. I devoured Field and Stream, Outdoor Life, American Hunter, and the like when I was a kid. I read everything I could find on hunting, I drove the local library staff nuts. Now, magazines seem to be bullschitt advertising and ambiguous fluff pieces (no offense JB and Phil). The content just isn’t there. This is simply the evolution of the way info is relayed... it ain’t going away. You can cry about it, or you can try to stay ahead of it...

I find it kind of interesting that one of the primary complaints is “they wrecked my area”..... if that truly was the case.... how do these guys continue to hunt those same areas year after year, and be successful? I’ve seen Newberg kill elk and deer in many of the same units for the past 6 or 7 seasons... on public land... that he has been obvious about. He obviously hasn’t pissed too much in his own pool.... or he’d be moving on to more of “your” areas.

You are assuming he is swimming in "his own pool". I'm sure he doesn't get spots from the very folks allowed to grace his majestie's show...lol. Just like they all magically buy the same gear he's sponsored by....hmm quid pro quo?

I’m not assuming anything..., watch the show... you see a lot of the same public ground from year to year. He’s definitely swimming in his own pool a lot.

These shows are not about hunter recruitment, it’s about making $$ plain and simple..

So what does Newberg have to say about it? Does he look at like he's doing everyone a service or what? I don't have a dog in the fight, just curious.

In his mind he is a crusader for public land DIY hunters.

In reality he is a rich guy that found a way to make money off his past time. Nothing wrong with that. As Judman said "These shows are not about hunter recruitment, it’s about making $$ plain and simple.."

But make no mistake about it Randy is in it for Randy, anyone that thinks different is a fool. His political alignment as far as I am concerned sucks! Honestly he is a politician personality wise. So I guess if you like that type of personality you might like him.



In fairness I will admit my bias, I am a staunch Conservative and dislike for those that do not support the 2nd Amendment first and foremost. I unlike Randy am unwilling to defend and support a Democrat in any way. I also do not and will not support BHA in any capacity.

I don’t know about all of that. I think Randy had/has the best intentions for diy hunters, yes a big part of that is on the political side.. The fact that he is political proves to me he’s not in it fo himself or money, who needs that Ass ache!

He’s achieved what he set out to do, kudos to him.. my gripe is there is an effect, weather he planned on it or not I don’t know, but if this is the future of hunting it isn’t an improvement..

honestly I wouldn't give a damn but every time those guys go anywhere they have to show Telling landmarks of where they are exactly at. That's the part that bothers me.

Good point. I will give him credit for that.

I think its this simple:

More location information = more viewers = more dollars.

I am the same as you. I don't advertise that I am driving a hunting truck. That truck spends too many nights in hotel parking lots and public places.
I don't want to be saying hey I got expensive optics and firearms in here.

Do you seriously think that there hasn't been a decline in the quality of hunting in SE MT since Newberg started running his cock holster about it at every opportunity? Try and book a place in Broadus for a Nov hunt, it ain't gonna happen unless you do it on your way out the door the prior year. Hell, even Randy's boytoy Buzz cries about the decline in Custer over on HT; he just doesn't have the balls to call out his sweetheart on his contributions to the problem.

In all fairness to the potbellied ginger, it's not wise to bite the hand that fuc......feeds you.

Free country, people can make shows wherever they legally are allowed to.


Randy did shows with Jim in my area. That particular spot Was already getting hit hard before the shows. Now I get calls to see if I do charter drop offs to that area. Groups of 5 guys. They’ll educate the big bucks and push them off the alpine and we’ll have a chance at a monster during the rut.


Kinda glad though all the attention is being focused on one area.

I've always thought that every resident of any given state that applys should get a tag before any NR. I certainly feel here in my state a NR license should be 20x the cost it currently is...at least to people from Conn. del and NJ. I'm good with 1k for the rest of the states.

It’s easy to blame individuals but I blame the digital age, internet as a whole, social media, smartphones and the ease and instantaneous way information travels these days. If it wasn’t these guys you’d have a target on somebody else’s back. “Social media influencers” and anybody that puts themselves and their best interest in front of what’s best for the sport are the people I have a bone to pick with. I’m not a fan of a self appointed spokesperson trying to speak on behalf of all sportsmen and women

I'm so glad we don't have to draw for anything here, except for a few hunts in parks. Buy a license, pick a public spot, hunt.

Might have been a fluke, but even during the rifle season, there didn't seem to be many hunters, and I live in a "bedroom" county near D.C. Mostly just deer here, but that's fine with me. Doubt I'll run into Randy or Steve, or their posses while I'm out enjoying the woods and hopefully making meat.

Took words out of my mouth

Broadus and SE Montana used to hold nice bucks and deer numbers and a great chance of drawing a non res tag every year until Montana was pimped out on “ hunting shows” now takes about 3 years to draw a non res tag. The locals must be really pissed off.Thank god I went to landowners tag.


The self proclaimed wolf introduction expert buzz should show up shortly to school us all of This hubbub .

A few years ago Rinella was doing a remote Colorado mule deer hunt. His editing wasn’t so great as a night shot showed houses’ porch lights a few hundreds from where he was hunting.

Rinella sure has a lot of rabid fan boys though

Many are quick to point out he is the spokesman for hunters.

Ironically, as JG pointed out, private land is sounding more and more like a bargain. I'm not going to play the points game.

It's amazing the info guys give out on the www. About units locales etc....

It's the best place in montana!!! 😂😂

What cracks me up is all the people that believe they are Public Land DIY hunters. I thought John Lee is a GUIDE! So if you are hunting with John Lee aren't you using a "Guide"? Anyways they are a bunch of blowhards. I know most in the industry that I know tolerate them because they sort of have to. I have never heard a single good word about them from anyone but the people that watch and listen to their show.

Oh I suspect the wrangells are going to get hit hard this yr by NR and residents during sheep season. Ol A-hole Randy first scene of his sheep hunt was down Nabesna road. Hell I know what trail they were on. Granted the wrangells were no secret, but a lot of people did not know about nabesna road. Didn't help both he and his sidekick got real nice sheep..

My buddy ran into rinella at 40 mile air they were both trying to fly out into the Tok management area (TMA) he said ol Steve the friend of the hunters was not very sociable.

Cha ching$$$$$

I never hunted that area around Broadus but buddies did


I prefer more remote areas off the radar with fewer deer numbers

Never been there myself.... Grin

I’ve hunted near broadus one time about 6 or 7 years ago. I shot a good buck there haven’t been back since. I’ve shot a metric [bleep] ton of good mountain white tails in nw Montana... that’s more my deal.

Oh and ribka, I buy my nr Montana deer tag otc every year for half price... bought several for $64 before the fee increase to half price of what you pay. Being a Montana native has its privileges. I’ve had a deer tag in Montana every year since 1979, including another this year. Must suck having to apply.

I was just in Biddle looking around. Stopped at the little store there and got a lot of information and a ice cream. And I’m from Indiana.

See that's where you messed up. The pros sell their soul, and get on their knees....that's how you get your "spots". Or just start handing out free schit...

Alabama cares how many hunters are in Arizona?

Ever wondered what a NON RESIDENT tag was for?

Um I'll go out on a limb here and say for people that want to hunt in said state but do not reside there?

Your $$ are welcome.

C'mon out:

https://app.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=77.32.450

http://www.eregulations.com/oregon/big-game-hunting/license-tag-permit-fees/

I remember back when we were all posting hunting pics.



But damned if any of us gave out locations(on purpose....) and then went on to pimp out the next spot.....




Clownshow, I haven't watched ANY of the 'Sitka' gang in years.



Pro free range buff and wolf idiots.



If I had a nickel for every new pickup pulling a new UTV on a trailer with a couple lumber sexual beard bros from town....

Come on Sam they are just good ole hard working Liberal guys!

In my opinion the reason we have more hunters has everything to do with the solid economy and only a little to do with guys like Randy. So many people have enough disposable income to do a western hunt that the numbers have skyrocketed. If the economy takes a downturn, you will see a drastic decrease in applications across the west. How many people now apply in multiple states? That was virtually unheard of years ago! That alone is a good source of application increases.

As far as Randy goes, I appreciate his public land advocacy a lot! He has put in countless hours of time on conservation as well. I agree with an earlier poster...he hunts the SAME spots year after year and has no trouble...that kind of shoots that theory down considerably. In no way do I think he is getting rich off of his platforms.

It has nothing to do with the economy. People are being spoon fed and encouraged to apply in western states by people who are making money off it....

Plus, there cant be more hunters due to a better economy....we're all being sold the idea that hunting is dying....no matter the economy.

I think people enjoy western hunts because you are in the wild. You can kill plenty of deer in the east, far more than in the west. But few places in the east give you the same gestalt of a hunt in the west.

....and wearing those goofydick flat brimmed hats about two sizes too big. LOL

Yep, there's a whole industry built around it. Reminds me of when I was a kid and bass fishing took off. Prior to that, there was no such thing as a "bass boat." The idea was laughable. After the bass fishing industry took off, you couldn't possibly "chase lunkers" without a "bass boat."





Never heard it put like that, but it fits with the above. Selling "gestalt" is better than just killin' animals.

Happy to say that I do not know who any of the folks, mentioned in the title, are. I have heard of the meateater as a grandson is a fan.
Also happy that so many think they have to go "out west for their big hunt. Got that out of my system back in the 70's and early 80's.
Some of the hunting we have been enjoying here in the east can remain a well kept secret.

Economy has a lot to do with the uptick in outfitter bookings, some with the DIY.

Social media hunters are just the next generation of the Chuck Adams, Dwight Schu (sp?) generation. The media then was magazines, now it's internet, in between were TV shows (Real Tree crew, Waddel etc.)

The draw of the west is the mountains, but also the diversity of species. I grew up in New England (MA/NH) but just moved west. Wife and I now hold tags for 2 big game species and hopefully 3 when the draw comes out today. There's several more we haven't tried for. Eastern hunting is BORING. Sitting in a tree waiting for a random deer! West you go after them, much more fun!

I do believe Newberg and Rinella are positive ambassadors for the sport, but jesus christ guys... can you NOT expose every single possible hidden gem in the west? That would be great.

The crappy part is I'm sure they have locals who are more than happy to help, in exchange for their 15 minutes of fame.

And the Montana alternate list is a all time high!! Wow

Yet somehow... my son drew two NR tags... in two different states.... on 0 points each. The video of him opening his WY draw results, on his birthday.... is priceless... and shows the true essence of what drawing a tag should be about. Maybe I’ll post it... if y’all are lucky.

I bet that’s badass josh!!! Keep him off the trigger and get him a hammer!!! I’m excited as hell for him and I don’t even know him!! 👍🤙

I’d love to see the video but don’t blame ya if you don’t post it

The left, democrats, liberals, communist, socialist, islamites, the news media, and globalist want power/control of the American people. They hate Americans, the Constitution, and the USA. They are all enemies and traitors of America. They are using immigration/illegals to change the demographics of our once great nation. Globalists are turning it into a 2nd rate country they can control. That is the end game! Educated Christians which can think and have guns cannot be controlled by government.

Do you reckon the democrats/commies/globalists watch Newberg, or prefer Meateater instead?

Conservatives dam sure don't watch and listen to their nonsense. At least not any self respecting Conservative. RHINO"S may vary!

Ya....that's all they're exchanging....

I assume you saw who bought meatbeater...

Nope.

Personally I don't care who bought them. What I do care about is they're political stance. Let's be very clear and honest here, if you are willing to go to the dark side for your personal needs you are a big part of the problem. Look at CA they keep voting in liberals because the very liberal base puts up worst than what they already have. So conservatives have to vote for the lesser of the two evils which is the likes of Boxer and friends. So when you start that crap here in Montana you are going down a very dangerous road. To that I say I can not and will not support anything to do with Randy, Steve, Ben, or any of the others and including BHA.

I can't support BHA any more either and I hope some of their people are reading this. I joined early on, when they were a fledgling organization. I still believe in their stated mission, which is preserving roadless areas for hunting and fishing. Those who say that goal is "elitist" and/or "only suitable for physically fit 25 year-olds" are way off base. Putting in the hard work it takes to hike in and pack out your animal so as not to be surrounded by the "Orange Army" is hardly elitist and the vast majority of public lands have roads for people who want motorized access. And I've known more than one 60+ year-old who prefers to "use the quads God gave you," including myself.

Anyway, back to BHA. I joined and contributed for one purpose and one purpose only--keeping roadless areas roadless and open to hunting and fishing. It seems to me that they've lost their focus on that core mission, and decided to become involved with backing candidates, backing initiatives that go beyond hunting and fishing, and just in general becoming a political force. Some might say they've gotten "too big for their britches."

Not for me, any more. And that's a shame because Im sure there are many others who believe in the core mission but not everything else that comes with it these days.

Well Said!

Wow Smoke, I am sort of sorry to hear that.

I have a really hard time articulating what I find so revolting about BHA. I guess the best thing i could compare it to is a combination of:

Hearing a sound that is out of place in bear country and trying to balance your obvious paranoia with your very good reasons for being paranoid.
And...
That slimy feeling you get when you walk onto a used car lot and some lying [bleep] with a fake smile walks up and wants to shake your hand and you just don't want to touch him for fear you'll never get the smell off. And no offense to used car salesmen.

Actually, that wasn't tough to articulate at all. Its just that all of that is gut reaction, and that isn't how I like to make decisions.

Just googled it, they've been keeping that on the DL....

Chris, I don't find it "revolting." There are a lot of good people, volunteers who donate their time for something they believe in like Buzz. Which is more than what most here can say.

It's just that their leadership has gone beyond what I signed up for and left me behind. Backing a particular candidate in a state I don't live in is not what I signed up for. Nor is forming "alliances" with groups I know nothing about and may not agree with.

It seems that they are effective though. When the crowd behind "green decoys" engages you know they've struck a nerve, high-powered Washington lobbyists like Berman don't come cheap.

They're are effective. You dont attract the fat cat donors unless you have something to offer.

I'm sure Tawney isnt hurting to make the rent......

This sounds like a description of Berman and Company, the guys behind "green decoys," the most vocal critics of BHA. The guys who defended the tobacco industry, corn syrup, and fish with mercury. Nothing wrong with defending or lobbying for products using a high-powered Washington lobbying firm, that's capitalism at it's finest. And it's also done through non-profits Berman sets up so that the "fat cat donors" who back him remain anonymous.

Ironic, ain't it?

Yikes! ME bought First Lite over in Ketchum....one of few liberal counties in Idaho.

What is wrong with the tobacco industry, corn syrup, and a lot of big game fish have mercury. How does this pertain to hunting and gun rights?

Last I checked everyone has known for years and years that smoking is bad for you as is corn syrup. You have choices in life to make, it's called personal responsibility.

Also as the old saying goes "two wrongs don't make a right"

I don't think anyone here is saying Rinella, Newburg, and BHA aren't great marketing platforms. Of course they sell a lot of products. That doesn't make them right, and it only goes to show how stupid and divided both the hunting and gun community is. You Live by the Sword so shall you Die by the Sword.

Everyone wants it to be the way they like it, but it doesn't happen that way. You could enlarge that lack of unity to include the NRA as well. Being fractured in our views of what we like has caused us a lot of pain that isn't going to end soon...

I agree

That's right. There's nothing wrong with the products or people making their own choices but that's not what I was talking about.

What I was talking about is PR campaigns designed to promote the message that tobacco, corn syrup, and mercury "really aren't that bad for you," and run through non-profits set up by Washington lobbyists so that the people funding the PR campaigns can remain anonymous.

And the irony that the main talking points used by those same Washington lobbyists to attack BHA is the source of their funding. In other words, pot, meet kettle.

In my opinion, some of the blame needs to be put at the feet of the Realtree, Mossy Oak, Primos, Drury's, etc. They were the ones who really pioneered what I call "whitetail TV" and really ushered in the "Horn Porn" era we currently live in. I believe that they are partially responsible for the decline in hunter numbers, specifically in the Southeast and Midwest. Everyone now wants to kill a giant whitetail and have pushed out a lot of "casual" or meat hunters due to lack of opportunity caused by the privatization of a lot of land or pricing them out of the game for leased land.

When I was a kid, I could go around, knock on a few doors and within a week have permission to hunt a portion of 5-6 farms (I grew up in south-central MN). Now, either the land is being leased to some hunter willing to pay $15/acre, it has been turned into a subdivision, or the owners won't let you hunt it because either 1) they are morally opposed to hunting (Thanks Disney!), or they are "managing the herd" for themselves.

Same thing in the Southeast. When I got out of the Navy and moved to GA, the only way to get on good deer property was to pay upwards of $1000 to get on a lease that would only let you shoot one buck (many have size restrictions way beyond the state's) and a doe or two. Pretty much the same in TX. Here in MO, there are some solid public land opportunities, but most farmers won't just let you hunt their land. Almost all of them want $8-15 an acre to lease all of their property.

So, that leaves guys like me a dilemma. Do I limit myself to archery and hunt mostly public land? Do I spend $2500 on a lease? Or, do I take half of that $2500 and do a public land elk hunt out west? Yes, there is a bit more travel involved, but the scenery is unmatched, there is a ton of open space and public land, and if I get lucky and shoot an elk (even if it is cow or rag-horn), I end up with as much meat as killing three whitetails. And if I am going to do that I might as well apply for a deer tag and antelope tag and make the most of it.

As for the people listed in the title, I have watched some of them, but I do it for the entertainment value and because some of them actually do offer up some good tips and tricks sometimes. For guys like me who grew up hunting the Midwest and Southeast, anything that can improve my learning curve is appreciated. As for hunting in the same locations, I am smart enough to know that is a stupid idea. I may look at the same units they are hunting, but there are a lot of other resources out there that I used to base my decisions on what states, units and hunts to apply for. If I do get drawn, I will damn sure take a trip out there before the season to put the time in to scout, just like I do to hunt public land here, but I will also use any other means available to me such as online maps and even YouTube videos. I want my hunt to be successful, and I want to learn, so I will use everything at my disposal to ensure I do both.

I hate to be the bearer of bad news BUT hunting Leases have been going strong long before the TV shows.

Knew/know what you are talking about. My comment still holds. I could give two if anyone choices to smoke, consume whatever, not wear seat belts or helmets. We all know, it's a choice, and you pay the consequences! Lobbying isn't going away, Gun rights, hunting rights, and the Second Amendment IS! They (anti's) have time, money, and organization, we have very little of those. Think I am Wrong?

I understand that. It wasn't much of a thing in the Midwest in the 80s when I was growing up there. It is now. It has always been a thing in the Southeast, but when lease prices went from $3/acre to $15/acre in the span of 3-5 years, that is when it became a problem. High $ leases have also been going strong in TX for quite a while, but that is mainly due to lots of private land and lots of oil & gas money to pay for the leases.

Again, the point that I was trying to make was that a lot of us Eastern and Midwest whitetail hunters have often thought/dreamed of heading out West to hunt but it has been cost prohibitive when we have good hunting in our own backyards. That "good hunting" is now much more in line, cost wise, to hunting out West, so some of us are taking a year or two off of hunting here to fulfill that dream.

The other thing that I didn't mention in my first post was that more and more sportsmen are being forced out of the Left Coast states and are settling in neighboring states. I also know quite a few people who are leaving CO due to the influx of crazies from CA. And as the need for more infrastructure grows in NM, AZ, UT, ID, WY and MT, more people will be moving in from the east to fill those jobs, quite a few of them will most likely be hunters. This is also increasing the number of people putting in for permits in those states.

You must be confused old timer, you think I give two schits about whatever the [bleep] "green decoys" are.....because I dont.

Ironic, ain't it?

That's funny, you all sing the same tune.

What tune is that smokepole?

I agree with your assessment of BHA.

I don't agree with your lobbying views. I get where you are coming from, but we are here now because we have lost all personal responsibility in our society.

Hope everyone is aware of this


https://thefederalist.com/2019/01/1...big-problems-for-hunter-focused-company/

You are a few days late and many dollars short.

Yes on personal responsibility, no doubt about it. But you're mistaken about my views on lobbyists. Lobbying is a fact of life, all industries do it, and BHA is no different.

I just don't like hypocrites.

I don't believe I said BHA was any different.

Yes, I know. Just acknowledging that lobbyists operate on both sides of the issues. And my posts haven't really been directed to you, more to Handy and his pals.

He says he doesn't care what the lobbyists behind "green decoys" are saying, but he's parroting their BS verbatim.

That's the funny part.

Or flying into Land Locked public land, as if the average hunter can afford to be flown into land locked public land! But he has so many fooled.

A shared helicopter ride is pretty close to the same dough as a pack-in/pack-out drop camp by an outfitter.

Second.... the show is called On Your Own Adventures.... because they're hunts that the common guy can plan, draw, and hunt without the aid of a guide or access to private land.

Some of the hunts are guided.

Haha Some???? How about MOST!

Ok but that isn't Public Land DIY! Having to rent a helicopter, guide, packer negates the DIY. Let me spell it out for you, Do It Yourself! By the way yes or no is John Lee a guide? Last I knew he was!

You contradict yourself here! I don't give a rats ass what the show is called. It is total bullish_t plain and simple. But they sure have a bunch of you all fooled!

No. Wrong again gramps.

Hows this for parroting....bha sucks azzhole because it's made up of flatty and skinny jeans wearing libtards that sit around drinkin micro brews lamenting the next evil Republican "stealing their land". Even though they know damn well that's not going to happen, but playing chicken little gets ol gap toof more $$$. Limp wristed conspiracy theorists...

I would rather light my money on fire than give them a [bleep] nickle.

His ol buddy buzz guided his boy to a Bull last year. Step on it Randy!!! 😂😂

Oh fûck I need a guide like I need a liberal to help me register my AR15.

LOL,"gramps," is that supposed to be an insult? What a skinny jeans, flat-brim kind of thing to say.

But don't worry, you'll get there some day. Then again maybe not, what they say about getting old is true.

JFC Montana.... I could hire a pilot, a guide, and a packer “on my own”.... and have a wonderful adventure. I don’t need your help, or Randy’s help, or anybody else’s help to do that schitt.

Y’all are a bunch of sour-grape mother-fükers...

The toughest hunt I ever went on (by far) was guided. Not that I had a choice.

Smoke, You bought the dang hunt! So, there is that for having a choice...

I suspect, you, like me, once or maybe three times have gotten yourself into some nasty pack outs with nobody to fault but ourselves for killing something we should have pretended we didn’t see...
Grins.
😎

For Dall sheep, unless you're an AK resident you have to hire a guide. The only choice is to not hunt them.

I'm surprised the outrage militia hasn't filed an e-suit against the meanie Alaskan govt for hating on them....

That's a great idea. In fact, I want all my money back because we hunted on federal land and it shoul've been free......

I applied for a special chance to hunt with the God known as BigFin. Sure hope I win, would be must see tv......

2021 proposed regs are out. The archery unit I mule deer hunt in, same area of Randy's, Hush, Brian Call, etc. "promoted" in the their most recent group hunts, are CLOSED to mule deer.

Was I wrong?

https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbt...rizona-coues-quail-javelina#Post13555309

Was it a draw or an OTC hunt?

OTC archery. Been open to mule deer forever. Same hunt that Randy did his 27 part video series.

OTC..

Drought, social media, sponsored hunts, and the like have about ruined my area of the state...

Congrats? But they just do it for the love of the hunt. But every commercial clip on the YouTube feed has 43 sponsers.

The last video series shows them all sitting water during our drought, which is the specific reason for the issue told by the AZGFD due to increased success rates and dink shooting to make a damn video...

Once restrictions are in place by a government entity it's rare to get them back....

Did non resident public hunting in western states even exist before Newberg, Rinella, BHA pimped it out on you tube and social media to lazy clueless urban hunters and while making a boat load of money on tax payer funded public resources? Oh, but without them hunting would be now dead