Home
Couple of vids on the poison we're eating too much of. Apparently heart disease and cancer were rare till seed oils came along....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7kGnfXXIKZM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBnniua6-oM
I prefer bacon drippins’ and pure lard!
Seed oils? Wtf. Common sense will tell you people have been eating seed oils for thousands of years.
Originally Posted by OldHat
Seed oils? Wtf. Common sense will tell you people have been eating seed oils for thousands of years.



Nobody died in the old days.
Happy Camper got a sock puppet?
Originally Posted by kaywoodie
I prefer bacon drippins’ and pure lard!


I fry chicken thighs with the skin on mostly to get the rendered fat. 8 big thighs render a lot of fat. Stuff is awesome.
Originally Posted by OldHat
Seed oils? Wtf. Common sense will tell you people have been eating seed oils for thousands of years.




laugh Ok, Doc.
Originally Posted by Ghostinthemachine
Originally Posted by kaywoodie
I prefer bacon drippins’ and pure lard!


I fry chicken thighs with the skin on mostly to get the rendered fat. 8 big thighs render a lot of fat. Stuff is awesome.


Oh I do like me some fried chicken thighs!!!!! With the skin on!!!
Schmaltz
Retard
Originally Posted by Tarquin
Couple of vids on the poison we're eating too much of. Apparently heart disease and cancer were rare till seed oils came along....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7kGnfXXIKZM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBnniua6-oM



Could it be that accurate testing and medical records were also rare?

Are you a graduate of the slappy hampster school of medicine, theology, and martial arts?

LOL


mike r
#friedthighsrus
Originally Posted by Steve
Originally Posted by OldHat
Seed oils? Wtf. Common sense will tell you people have been eating seed oils for thousands of years.



Nobody died in the old days.


Then the OP makes no point.
Originally Posted by lvmiker
Originally Posted by Tarquin
Couple of vids on the poison we're eating too much of. Apparently heart disease and cancer were rare till seed oils came along....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7kGnfXXIKZM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBnniua6-oM



Could it be that accurate testing and medical records were also rare?

Are you a graduate of the slappy hampster school of medicine, theology, and martial arts?

LOL


mike r




So you didn't watch the videos either? I'm just the messenger. If you don't like it, take it up with the docs and researchers who reached the conclusion that seed oils are bad for you.
Or maybe there is what statisticians call confounding factors. Look it up.

I heard ice cream causes crime. People eat more ice cream in the summer and the crime rates are higher in the summer.
Originally Posted by Tarquin
Originally Posted by lvmiker
Originally Posted by Tarquin
Couple of vids on the poison we're eating too much of. Apparently heart disease and cancer were rare till seed oils came along....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7kGnfXXIKZM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBnniua6-oM



Could it be that accurate testing and medical records were also rare?

Are you a graduate of the slappy hampster school of medicine, theology, and martial arts?

LOL


mike r




So you didn't watch the videos either? I'm just the messenger. If you don't like it, take it up with the docs and researchers who reached the conclusion that seed oils are bad for you.

Of course I did not watch the videos. I know for a fact from other sources and research that seed oils are not bad for you.
Just as with animal fats, not all vegetable or seed oils are equal.....or necessarily healthy.
They extract the seed oils using solvents to get the oil out of the pulp of the seeds that they then evaporate off. Then they hydrogenize it to make it stable and have a longer shelf life. So the seed oils we have now are processed and consumed in a way that humans never did before. I’ll stick with lard.
That inflammation is a bad thing.
Eat plants and animals. And eat their fat too.

I don't know what a canola is, but I don't eat that fat.
Don't make it complicated.
I like a steak on the barbecue, with a baked potato, not seeds and oil and some shyte.
Originally Posted by Jim_Conrad
Schmaltz



Oy vey.
Cold pressed, no additives is the way...even then, some, like Soya, are not the best.
Canola makes shallow hard pan cracking easy. So other crops can benifit with deep root growth! Boy that came from way back in ag class, its a wonder I recalled such a tidbit of information!
There could be a little overlooked portion of this being that damn near every plant cut for profit is a gmo project of Monsanto. So while humans may have been eating seed oils forever, seed oils ain't what they used to be.

I had my blood panel done during a hard keto run. I'd eat a solid cup of bacon fat daily and often more. My cholesterol numbers were incredibly low.

I haven't bought a piece of beef since 1993, my red meat consists of elk and deer exclusively.....and the numbers don't make me want to change.
Originally Posted by kaywoodie
Originally Posted by Ghostinthemachine
Originally Posted by kaywoodie
I prefer bacon drippins’ and pure lard!


I fry chicken thighs with the skin on mostly to get the rendered fat. 8 big thighs render a lot of fat. Stuff is awesome.


Oh I do like me some fried chicken thighs!!!!! With the skin on!!!



Ohhh, yeah !
Locally, a 10 lbs bag of legs and thighs for.29 cents/lb.=2.90$/bag.

A Jew’s wet dream come true.
Well it's simple, if you believe that seed oils are bad DON'T use them🤷‍♂️
Don't eat American Bison meat either.

It will cause you to lose your homelands.

And extra virgin olive oil is good for you as it's not a seed oil......................it's basically fruit juice.

and it comes from extra virgins, not the regular kind.

Extra always mo betta.
Originally Posted by high_country_
There could be a little overlooked portion of this being that damn near every plant cut for profit is a gmo project of Monsanto. So while humans may have been eating seed oils forever, seed oils ain't what they used to be.

I had my blood panel done during a hard keto run. I'd eat a solid cup of bacon fat daily and often more. My cholesterol numbers were incredibly low.

I haven't bought a piece of beef since 1993, my red meat consists of elk and deer exclusively.....and the numbers don't make me want to change.


Yeah, it's 2021 and most people still think that eating fat=high serum cholesterol. They never consider cutting out the flour, bread, potatoes and rice and looking at the effect on their serum lipids.
Hard data exists, that shows over 80% of people involved in fatal automobile accidents had consumed eggs in some form within a six month period prior to the accident. I'm going to put consumption of eggs right up there with the dreaded seed oils.

Originally Posted by Tarquin
Originally Posted by lvmiker
Originally Posted by Tarquin
Couple of vids on the poison we're eating too much of. Apparently heart disease and cancer were rare till seed oils came along....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7kGnfXXIKZM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBnniua6-oM



Could it be that accurate testing and medical records were also rare?

Are you a graduate of the slappy hampster school of medicine, theology, and martial arts?

LOL


mike r




So you didn't watch the videos either? I'm just the messenger. If you don't like it, take it up with the docs and researchers who reached the conclusion that seed oils are bad for you.


Are these the same researchers that said eggs and butter were bad a few years ago and are now OK?
I wonder if eating flaxseed is included in this? Not the refined oil, just eating the seeds themselves.
Originally Posted by BRISTECD

Originally Posted by Tarquin
Originally Posted by lvmiker
Originally Posted by Tarquin
Couple of vids on the poison we're eating too much of. Apparently heart disease and cancer were rare till seed oils came along....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7kGnfXXIKZM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBnniua6-oM



Could it be that accurate testing and medical records were also rare?

Are you a graduate of the slappy hampster school of medicine, theology, and martial arts?

LOL


mike r




So you didn't watch the videos either? I'm just the messenger. If you don't like it, take it up with the docs and researchers who reached the conclusion that seed oils are bad for you.


Are these the same researchers that said eggs and butter were bad a few years ago and are now OK?



No. That would be the gubmint---and they still want you to eat vegetable (seed) oil.
Originally Posted by wilkeshunter
I wonder if eating flaxseed is included in this? Not the refined oil, just eating the seeds themselves.


No. "Seed oil" is a bit to a term of art and refers to oils reduced to consumable form by highly industrialized food processing and specifically: Cottonseed Oil, Canola (also called “Rapeseed”), Corn, Cottonseed, Soy, Sunflower, Safflower, Grapeseed, Rice bran. ALSO TOXIC: Refined Palm oil. These are the main ones.
We’re the y lying before or now when they convinced everybody that canola oil was good and Chris o was bad. Inquiring minds want to know. Edk
Ever see a press?


Man o man. You wanna talk about complex and evil!

The little seeds must be in terrible pain when the oil gets squeezed out.

The Space Program aint got nothing on a oil press.
Originally Posted by Tarquin
Originally Posted by OldHat
Seed oils? Wtf. Common sense will tell you people have been eating seed oils for thousands of years.




laugh Ok, Doc.



If common sense is not enough to persuade you, I have several Indian "Nutting Stone" that was made to grind pecans, maize, chestnuts, hickory nuts and acorns for their oils and to have the paste dried into flour. These are thousands of years old.

Yes, the technology has been around for eons...
Originally Posted by OldHat
Seed oils? Wtf. Common sense will tell you people have been eating seed oils for thousands of years.


Okay then.

Tell me how they got oil from corn, soybeans, cottonseed, and rapeseed thousands of years ago?

Simple answer is that they didn't. That takes industrial processing and has only been in existence for 100 years or so.

Up until then fat was obtained from an animal or pressing something like olives.
I’ve also read that the average life expectancy for those nutting stone using Indians was like 35. They probably didn’t have time to get the heart disease.

I don’t use any oil for cooking besides green box lard or bacon grease, at least most of the time. The main reason being I like the taste.
Originally Posted by RJY66
Originally Posted by OldHat
Seed oils? Wtf. Common sense will tell you people have been eating seed oils for thousands of years.


Okay then.

Tell me how they got oil from corn, soybeans, cottonseed, and rapeseed thousands of years ago?

Simple answer is that they didn't. That takes industrial processing and has only been in existence for 100 years or so.

Up until then fat was obtained from an animal or pressing something like olives.


If they ate the seeds, it would follow that the oil inside the seeds was eaten too.

Maybe not concentrated amounts, but still...
Originally Posted by Jim_Conrad
Happy Camper got a sock puppet?




lol
Pro-tip: we're all going to die


Figure out what you're willing to sacrifice for quality of life, exercise, stay active, and move on with liv'n
Originally Posted by Futura
They extract the seed oils using solvents to get the oil out of the pulp of the seeds that they then evaporate off. Then they hydrogenize it to make it stable and have a longer shelf life. So the seed oils we have now are processed and consumed in a way that humans never did before. I’ll stick with lard.

Thank you for this explanation. I see guys advocating taking shots of olive oil daily and my reaction was - 'no'. I would like to know more on this as I have high cholo and bp and do not want to take statins.

So what is the best thing to use? I never deep fry and hardly ever fry. I do stick to butter over margarine. Trying to cut carbs but can't make the move to light beer. So ....yeah.......first worlder here..

What baby steps? I did just start to eat celery daily. Someone going to tell me that wil kill me too ?
Originally Posted by high_country_
There could be a little overlooked portion of this being that damn near every plant cut for profit is a gmo project of Monsanto. So while humans may have been eating seed oils forever, seed oils ain't what they used to be.

I had my blood panel done during a hard keto run. I'd eat a solid cup of bacon fat daily and often more. My cholesterol numbers were incredibly low.

I haven't bought a piece of beef since 1993, my red meat consists of elk and deer exclusively.....and the numbers don't make me want to change.

That’s a bit of internet lore...been in the seed business for 35 years.
Originally Posted by kenjs1
Originally Posted by Futura
They extract the seed oils using solvents to get the oil out of the pulp of the seeds that they then evaporate off. Then they hydrogenize it to make it stable and have a longer shelf life. So the seed oils we have now are processed and consumed in a way that humans never did before. I’ll stick with lard.

Thank you for this explanation. I see guys advocating taking shots of olive oil daily and my reaction was - 'no'. I would like to know more on this as I have high cholo and bp and do not want to take statins.

So what is the best thing to use? I never deep fry and hardly ever fry. I do stick to butter over margarine. Trying to cut carbs but can't make the move to light beer. So ....yeah.......first worlder here..

What baby steps? I did just start to eat celery daily. Someone going to tell me that wil kill me too ?


Olives are simply pressed right off the trees to extract olive oil. The oil comes from the meat of the olive.
I've asked before Barry, is any of that olive pulp fed to cattle?
Originally Posted by kenjs1
Originally Posted by Futura
They extract the seed oils using solvents to get the oil out of the pulp of the seeds that they then evaporate off. Then they hydrogenize it to make it stable and have a longer shelf life. So the seed oils we have now are processed and consumed in a way that humans never did before. I’ll stick with lard.

Thank you for this explanation. I see guys advocating taking shots of olive oil daily and my reaction was - 'no'. I would like to know more on this as I have high cholo and bp and do not want to take statins.

So what is the best thing to use? I never deep fry and hardly ever fry. I do stick to butter over margarine. Trying to cut carbs but can't make the move to light beer. So ....yeah.......first worlder here..

What baby steps? I did just start to eat celery daily. Someone going to tell me that wil kill me too ?


Celery eh?


Remember those nitrates you read was real bad for you?

Haha!
Originally Posted by wabigoon
I've asked before Barry, is any of that olive pulp fed to cattle?



We don't. Not sure if others do...

I do know cattle love to eat the ends off the olive trees... Leaves and all.

The new growth an olive tree puts on it's branches are what bears the blooms and fruit the following season.

(BTW, the olive trees at the orchard got burnt back seriously in the deep freeze Texas had a few weeks ago. I bet it'll be two years before any orchards in Texas have any olive oil harvested.) Bad setback for the industry here in Texas. frown
That 22 blank cartridge they use to shoot dna from one plant into the seed of a different plant is pure evil also. GMO is the devils tool. Lol edk
Originally Posted by Jim_Conrad
Originally Posted by kenjs1
Originally Posted by Futura
They extract the seed oils using solvents to get the oil out of the pulp of the seeds that they then evaporate off. Then they hydrogenize it to make it stable and have a longer shelf life. So the seed oils we have now are processed and consumed in a way that humans never did before. I’ll stick with lard.

Thank you for this explanation. I see guys advocating taking shots of olive oil daily and my reaction was - 'no'. I would like to know more on this as I have high cholo and bp and do not want to take statins.

So what is the best thing to use? I never deep fry and hardly ever fry. I do stick to butter over margarine. Trying to cut carbs but can't make the move to light beer. So ....yeah.......first worlder here..

What baby steps? I did just start to eat celery daily. Someone going to tell me that will kill me too ?


Celery eh?


Remember those nitrates you read was real bad for you?

Haha!

"F"- I just knew it!!!!


Rocinbbar- thanks for that reminder about olive oil. Forgot that. Still don't think I want to do shots of it every day like I have seen people tout.
Originally Posted by TimberRunner
Originally Posted by high_country_
There could be a little overlooked portion of this being that damn near every plant cut for profit is a gmo project of Monsanto. So while humans may have been eating seed oils forever, seed oils ain't what they used to be.

I had my blood panel done during a hard keto run. I'd eat a solid cup of bacon fat daily and often more. My cholesterol numbers were incredibly low.

I haven't bought a piece of beef since 1993, my red meat consists of elk and deer exclusively.....and the numbers don't make me want to change.


Yeah, it's 2021 and most people still think that eating fat=high serum cholesterol. They never consider cutting out the flour, bread, potatoes and rice and looking at the effect on their serum lipids.


Carbohydrates like Rice? So that's what kills the Japanese so young, huh?
Originally Posted by Steve
Originally Posted by OldHat
Seed oils? Wtf. Common sense will tell you people have been eating seed oils for thousands of years.



Nobody died in the old days.


Actually they did die and the average life span was far shorter than it is today.
Originally Posted by Tarquin
Originally Posted by lvmiker
Originally Posted by Tarquin
Couple of vids on the poison we're eating too much of. Apparently heart disease and cancer were rare till seed oils came along....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7kGnfXXIKZM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBnniua6-oM



Could it be that accurate testing and medical records were also rare?

Are you a graduate of the slappy hampster school of medicine, theology, and martial arts?

LOL


mike r




So you didn't watch the videos either? I'm just the messenger. If you don't like it, take it up with the docs and researchers who reached the conclusion that seed oils are bad for you.


Why would we?

People are dying of cancer and heart disease now because we've defeated most of the historically more common causes of death.
We die of Cancer and heart disease because that's about all that's left that can still kill us.
Ive never bought and eaten rapeseeds (canola) or cotton seeds, but this stuff is making me wonder about how if the carbohydrates and seed oils are so bad, how has our life expectancy almost doubled since 1900?

Carbohydrates make people fat and give them diabetes, right? So do the Japanese have those problems?
A hundred years ago all they had to cook in was lard and they didnt live as long as we normally do now, right?
Is it just because we dont step on rusty nails?
Originally Posted by dale06
Originally Posted by Steve
Originally Posted by OldHat
Seed oils? Wtf. Common sense will tell you people have been eating seed oils for thousands of years.



Nobody died in the old days.


Actually they did die and the average life span was far shorter than it is today.


Aaaaaaand there it is........



Happy is a fear-mongering Karen. He ignores inconvenient facts as a rule.

This stuff is killing us, OMG!!!!!!! (But life expectancy continues to rise to the point we have to raise the SS retirement age, lol)
Originally Posted by Jim_Conrad
Happy Camper got a sock puppet?


Yep. He wanted to float some theories that some might think are bordering on conspiratorial.

Without sullying his reputation.
Originally Posted by smokepole
Originally Posted by Jim_Conrad
Happy Camper got a sock puppet?


Yep. He wanted to float some theories that some might think are bordering on conspiratorial.

Without sullying his reputation.

😂
I eat seed oil, animal fat, red meat, candy. An egg McMuffin is a favorite meal. It's upsetting to learn I'm a dead man walking (and I walk a LOT). Just a few more years and I'll be eighty. The way things are going in the world, I may not be all that anxious to live longer anyway. GD
Originally Posted by greydog
I eat seed oil, animal fat, red meat, candy. An egg McMuffin is a favorite meal. It's upsetting to learn I'm a dead man walking (and I walk a LOT). Just a few more years and I'll be eighty. The way things are going in the world, I may not be all that anxious to live longer anyway. GD


Yer tryin ta git us kilt.
Originally Posted by antelope_sniper
Originally Posted by Tarquin
Originally Posted by lvmiker
Originally Posted by Tarquin
Couple of vids on the poison we're eating too much of. Apparently heart disease and cancer were rare till seed oils came along....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7kGnfXXIKZM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBnniua6-oM



Could it be that accurate testing and medical records were also rare?

Are you a graduate of the slappy hampster school of medicine, theology, and martial arts?

LOL


mike r




So you didn't watch the videos either? I'm just the messenger. If you don't like it, take it up with the docs and researchers who reached the conclusion that seed oils are bad for you.


Why would we?

People are dying of cancer and heart disease now because we've defeated most of the historically more common causes of death.
We die of Cancer and heart disease because that's about all that's left that can still kill us.


This, and dimocraps.
My great grandad used to subscribe to a medical journal since he lived out a ways from town and thought it’d be a good idea to have a little knowledge in absence of a handy Dr.

Along about 1930 something this journal claimed that eggs were deadly bad stuff and shouldn’t be eaten regularly. So he gave up his 3 fried egg per morning breakfast habit until a decade or so later when the same periodical had a new study extolling the virtues of eggs an how perfect a food they were. He immediately started eating them again. Another 10-15 years goes by and once again the medicans are talking about the dangers of egg consumption. This time he didn’t fall for it and he continued to eat his 3 eggs per morning.

He used to love telling that story but sadly all those eggs caught up to him and killed him, he was only 98.
Originally Posted by jaguartx
Ive never bought and eaten rapeseeds (canola) or cotton seeds, but this stuff is making me wonder about how if the carbohydrates and seed oils are so bad, how has our life expectancy almost doubled since 1900?

Carbohydrates make people fat and give them diabetes, right? So do the Japanese have those problems?
A hundred years ago all they had to cook in was lard and they didnt live as long as we normally do now, right?
Is it just because we dont step on rusty nails?


You have to factor in infant mortality and death from bacterial infection pre-antibiotics....so yeah the rusty nail analogy is huge. Plus give modern medicine credit, it is very good at helping sick people live longer.

I'm a simple man. I have seen the positive cause and effect from ditching excessive carbs, sugar, and processed food in myself and others....when it comes to lab numbers and weight loss.

I don't care what other people want to do, I am not going Karen on them. They can cook with Mobil 1 if they want to. I just know what I am going to do.
Originally Posted by jaguartx
Ive never bought and eaten rapeseeds (canola) or cotton seeds, but this stuff is making me wonder about how if the carbohydrates and seed oils are so bad, how has our life expectancy almos doubled since 1900?

Carbohydrates make people fat and give them diabetes, right? So do the Japanese have those problems?


Doc,
Hope you're having a good weekend. Prior to 1900 people were much more likely to die of starvation than today, but the incredible American Farms made that a thing of the past. Too many people work in offices, but still eat like they are lumber jacks. I lived in Japan for 4 years, and on average, they do not have the taste for sugar and fats like we do. Their ice cream if very bland, no cream in it, and mostly skin milk. Since the introduction of the benefits of European style nutrition in the form of diets with more proteins and calcium, the Japanese have grown on average an additional inch each generation.

For some Asians, diabetes and the like can be a real issue. I'm pretty sure that's what did in my Mother-in-laws kidneys, but modern medicine saved her until cancer finally took her nearly 20 years later. Of course her husband at the exact same diet and never had any dietary related health issues. Many of the Polynesian's have weight issues as well. As an example, look at the Samoan's. Personally, I think it's a combination of things. Part diet, part genetics, but no body in this country wants to consider the impact of the latter.
Originally Posted by TheKid
My great grandad used to subscribe to a medical journal since he lived out a ways from town and thought it’d be a good idea to have a little knowledge in absence of a handy Dr.

Along about 1930 something this journal claimed that eggs were deadly bad stuff and shouldn’t be eaten regularly. So he gave up his 3 fried egg per morning breakfast habit until a decade or so later when the same periodical had a new study extolling the virtues of eggs an how perfect a food they were. He immediately started eating them again. Another 10-15 years goes by and once again the medicans are talking about the dangers of egg consumption. This time he didn’t fall for it and he continued to eat his 3 eggs per morning.

He used to love telling that story but sadly all those eggs caught up to him and killed him, he was only 98.


Yep.

Definitely the eggs fault.

But on a serious note, lets consider another possibility. Often these studies look at only one aspect of a food. So a food can have both good and bad aspect at the same time. Additionally, may be affected differently. Also, you mentioned fried eggs. What if the eggs are not fried in grease, but poached?

So, eggs are bad for you....ok compared to what? You got to eat something. At some level everything is bad for you, even breathing. The process of respiration ages the body, but it's sure better than the alternative. I'm sure Slappy and Tarq will be along soon to tell everyone to stop breathing, or only do so if you are consuming pure oxygen through 16 masks.
Olive oil what I use. Allah told the muslims to use olives and olive oil so they would live forever and be a plague on the rest of human kind as any can see they are. So I just took a page out of their book.Too damned hard to keep up with all the stuff that 's not good for you but I don't hear or read the medicos bad mouthing olive oil.
We all will die from something you can bank on that. Mb
Originally Posted by wabigoon
I've asked before Barry, is any of that olive pulp fed to cattle?

It is used by the Japanese to feed waygu cattle. Farmers claim it gives their waygu beef part of its unique taste. I’m sure it’s used by other cultures to feed animals also. Agriculture doesn’t reward waste.
Born to die anyways.
What doesn't kill ya to begin with???


They took all the fun outta M&M,s when they did away with that Red dye # what the fugg ever it was.

Maybe the Liberal Socialist Democrats will come up some new tax for "bad foods" to " protect" us since they are soooooooo fugging enlightened about our health.
Didnt they outlaw or tax big fountain soda drinks in their Tard areas awhile back.
You can bet fed sin tax is gonna go up on alcohol and tobacco products too in the near future.

These Liberal Socialist Democrats will tax anything and everything they can or can dream up.
Just a matter of time.........
Originally Posted by renegade50
Born to die anyways.
What doesn't kill ya to begin with???


They took all the fun outta M&M,s when they did away with that Red dye # what the fugg ever it was.

Maybe the Liberal Socialist Democrats will come up some new tax for "bad foods" to " protect" us since they are soooooooo fugging enlightened about our health.
Didnt they outlaw or tax big fountain soda drinks in their Tard areas awhile back.
You can bet fed sin tax is gonna go up on alcohol and tobacco products too in the near future.

These Liberal Socialist Democrats will tax anything and everything they can or can dream up.
Just a matter of time.........



Boulder has a extra tax on soda pop. It's banned from the many schools and government vending machines and on premise food services in this area.
Originally Posted by goalie
Pro-tip: we're all going to die


Figure out what you're willing to sacrifice for quality of life, exercise, stay active, and move on with liv'n


This. Seems like I regularly read that potatoes, bread, rice and pasta are bad for you, and you should eliminate them from your diet. Problem is, I'm a meat and potatoes guy. Most of the meat that I eat is wild game. Have to have potatoes with meat, unless the meat is done with a stir fry over rice or a sauce over pasta. Mashed potatoes and gravy without bread and butter? Why would you do that to yourself?

I'm 60 years old, and in pretty good shape and good health (so far). I'll be damned if I'm going to eat tofu or fake meat just to try to live until I'm 92 instead of 90 or something. One of the things my wife and I enjoy is preparing and eating good tasting food. Not eating crap I don't like just to eke out an extra year or two.
Originally Posted by kaywoodie
I prefer bacon drippins’ and pure lard!

And butter.
Originally Posted by The_Real_Hawkeye
Originally Posted by kaywoodie
I prefer bacon drippins’ and pure lard!

And butter.


Real butter is better for you than margarine anyway....or at least that's what the latest studies said, so I'm going with that one.
Originally Posted by jaguartx
Ive never bought and eaten rapeseeds (canola) or cotton seeds, but this stuff is making me wonder about how if the carbohydrates and seed oils are so bad, how has our life expectancy almost doubled since 1900?

Carbohydrates make people fat and give them diabetes, right? So do the Japanese have those problems?
A hundred years ago all they had to cook in was lard and they didnt live as long as we normally do now, right?
Is it just because we dont step on rusty nails?


The increase in life expectancy is due to the fact that whereas, in 1900 one-half of all children born did not make it to age 5, now 99.5% due.
Originally Posted by RJY66
Originally Posted by OldHat
Seed oils? Wtf. Common sense will tell you people have been eating seed oils for thousands of years.


Okay then.

Tell me how they got oil from corn, soybeans, cottonseed, and rapeseed thousands of years ago?

Simple answer is that they didn't. That takes industrial processing and has only been in existence for 100 years or so.

Up until then fat was obtained from an animal or pressing something like olives.




^^^^^This---and eating lard is way better for you than eating seed oil.
Originally Posted by Tarquin
Originally Posted by jaguartx
Ive never bought and eaten rapeseeds (canola) or cotton seeds, but this stuff is making me wonder about how if the carbohydrates and seed oils are so bad, how has our life expectancy almost doubled since 1900?

Carbohydrates make people fat and give them diabetes, right? So do the Japanese have those problems?
A hundred years ago all they had to cook in was lard and they didnt live as long as we normally do now, right?
Is it just because we dont step on rusty nails?


The increase in life expectancy is due to the fact that whereas, in 1900 one-half of all children born did not make it to age 5, now 99.5% due.

Correct. The argument that the increased cancer and heart disease death rate is due to us living longer is BS. As you say, the extended average lifespan is almost entirely explained by the elimination of most childhood death causes.
Oh for fugg sakes.
Here is the lady's web site. She used to be a vegetarian and now she defends eating meat (because its healthy) and makes a living poking holes in the establishment nutrition dogma.

https://ninateicholz.com/

Summary of her book: the Big Fat Surprise:

The Big Fat Surprise By Nina Teicholz
Why Butter, Meat & Cheese Belong in a Healthy Diet
THE BIG FAT SURPRISE not only reviews thousands of scientific studies but also documents the politics and personalities dominating the last 50 years in nutrition policy, to get behind the flip-flopping headlines and explain some basic truths about nutrition science.

THE BIG FAT SURPRISE is the first publication not only to systematically argue that the saturated fats in animal foods have been unfairly maligned, based on weak, inconclusive evidence, but also to document the highly damaging unintended consequences (the rise of both vegetable oil and carbohydrate consumption).

More than a dozen scholarly review papers over the past five years have confirmed Teicholz’s conclusions on saturated fat. For average people, the implication is that we have been needlessly avoiding meat, cheese, whole milk and eggs for decades and that we can welcome, guilt-free, these “whole fats” back into our lives.
Seeds are so 70s like, the better oils are derived from the buds.
A summary of her diet recommendations:

Questions on key nutrition topics, the latest science & nutritional information

Where does the data now stand on saturated fats?
Is there a short, non-book-length version of this story?
Why, then, do I keep seeing studies saying that saturated fats cause heart disease?
If I eat saturated fats, won’t my cholesterol go up?
Doesn’t it depend on what is eaten to replace saturated fats?
Are there positive arguments for eating butter, meat and cheese?
Where does the data stand on total fat?
Where does the science stand on dietary cholesterol?
Is sugar uniquely unhealthy?
_____________________________

Where does the data now stand on saturated fats?

Since 2014 when my book was published, the data exonerating saturated fats has grown even stronger. There are now more than 17 systematic reviews and meta-analyses of scientific studies looking at the relationship between saturated fats and heart disease. These studies include randomized, controlled clinical trials on more than 50,000 people, which is an enormous amount of the most rigorous kind of data available.

Nearly all of the analyses reviewing this data have concluded that:

Saturated fats have no effect on cardiovascular mortality and/or
Saturated fats are not associated with heart disease.
Don’t these studies conflict with our official nutritional advice?
They do. To understand why, one needs to know the history of why we believe these fats are bad for health.

Beginning in the 1950s, University of Minnesota pathologist Ancel Keys, launched the so-called “diet heart” hypothesis, which states that saturated fats and dietary cholesterol cause heart disease. Largely due to his outsized personality, Keys was able to get this idea implanted in the American Heart Association, which in 1961, became the first group in the world to recommend that the public cut back on saturated fat and cholesterol to prevent cardiovascular disease.

In subsequent decades, Governments and public health groups around the world spent billions of dollars on clinical trials (the “gold standard” of scientific evidence) trying to ‘prove’ this hypothesis, but all of these trials had “null” results—which is to say, they could not show that Keys was correct. In some cases, trials showed that reducing consumption of saturated fat and cholesterol (and replacing them wiht polyunsaturated vegetable oils) actually caused harm, including increased death rates from cancer and suicides.

Rather than respond to this ‘inconvenient’ data, however, scientists instead persevered in their belief that saturated fats must somehow be bad for health. These scientists, together with their funders at the National Institutes of Health, the American Heart Association, and elsewhere, ignored or even buried inconvenient data for decades. My book tells this story.

The story is largely one of politics: the influence of the food industry, the inability of large public health institutions, including our own federal government, to back out of a failed hypothesis, and the reality of nutrition experts who are unable or unwilling to change their minds, despite an overwhelming amount of evidence to the contrary.

Recently, however, there has been change. Beginning in 2010 with the work of Ron Krauss, scientists around the world have begun to unearth and reexamine the long-ignored literature on saturated fats, resulting in the 17 meta-analyses and reviews listed above.

Note that in response to this evidence, the Canadian Heart and Stroke Association in 2015 dropped its previous % limits on saturated fats.
_________________________________

Is there a short, non-book-length version of this story?
A short piece I wrote on how we came to believe that saturated fats are bad for health is “The Questionable Link Between Saturated Fat and Heart Disease,” in the Wall Street Journal (behind a paywall; also available here), which is adapted from my book. When it came out, it was the most emailed piece in the newspaper’s recent history.

Another option is an article that I wrote for Men’s Health magazine, “What if Bad Fat is Actually Good for You?” way back in 2007.

Given this enormous reevaluation of the literature on saturated fats over the past five years, why do the 2015-2020 U.S. Dietary Guidelines continue their caps on saturated fats?
The answer is that the expert committee for those Guidelines did not adequately or comprehensively review the recent data on these fats. This fact, which I reported for a 2015 article in The BMJ, was controversial and thus highly contested, yet it has stood up to multiple rounds of peer review, and is now confirmed as correct.

Another important paper on this subject is: “Evidence from randomised controlled trials does not support current dietary fat guidelines: a systematic review and meta-analysis,” BMJ Open Heart, 2016.

Why, then, do I keep seeing studies saying that saturated fats cause heart disease?
These studies are being published by epidemiologists and in particular, the nutrition department at the Harvard School of Public Health, which has published about one paper roughly every six months, based on data from its two epidemiological databases. These studies are flawed in numerous ways, and critiques of them can be found on pubpeer, here, here and here. More importantly, the Harvard studies are contradicted by the earlier clinical trial data reflected in those 17 reviews. That trial data (unlike Harvard’s epidemiological findings) can actually demonstrate cause and effect. It is therefore more definitive.

Indeed, the usual process in science is to start with an epidemiological association, which suggests a hypothesis, and then move on to test that hypothesis in clinical trials. Once properly tested in trials, there is no point in going back to look at hypothesis-generating epidemiological data again. It’s therefore not clear why Harvard keeps publishing these epidemiological associations or why informed reporters keep citing them.

In sum: the question of whether saturated fats cause heart disease has repeatedly been tested in large clinical trials, with null results. There is no need to go back to epidemiological data, which re-suggests a hypothesis that has already been thoroughly tested.
____________________________________

If I eat saturated fats, won’t my cholesterol go up?
The short answer is: Maybe, but not in a way that will increase your risk for heart disease. Saturated fat was originally demonized for its ability to raise total cholesterol. However, researchers in the 1980s discovered that total cholesterol did not turn out to be a reliable predictor of heart attack risk. The conversation then shifted to saturated fat’s tendency to raise LDL-cholesterol (the “bad” kind). However, yet again, clinical trials could not confirm LDL-C’s ability to predict heart attack risk. In many large clinical trials, LDL-C did not turn out to be correlated with the risk of dying from heart disease.

Also, it turns out that LDL-C has sub-fractions: some are small and dense, while others are light and buoyant. The small, dense ones have been found to predict increased risk, whereas the light, buoyant ones predict reduced risk. The kind of LDL that saturated fats cause to increase is the light, buoyant kind. Therefore, saturated fats actually appear to reduce heart-disease risk, not increase it.

Moreover, saturated fats are the only foods known to increase your HDL-C, the “good” cholesterol. When your doctor tells you to raise your HDL, s/he will recommend drinking red wine or getting more exercise, but a far easier way to raise HDL is simply to eat more saturated fats. Saturated fats reliably boost the “good” HDL cholesterol.

The first succinct publication of all this information was in an article that I wrote for Men’s Health magazine, “What if Bad Fat is Actually Good for You?” way back in 2007.

So, in sum, the effects of saturated fat on blood lipids can be said to be positive. Further explanation and references on all of the above can be found in my book.
_____________________________________

Doesn’t it depend on what is eaten to replace saturated fats?
This is an argument promoted by defenders of the diet-heart hypothesis, and it is odd, because these same experts talk about other foods as simply being “good” or “bad” without insisting on a discussion about “what replaces them.” This discrepancy in approach leads me to believe that the “replacement” argument against saturated fats is probably a rhetorical maneuver aimed at creating confusion over the the data on saturated fats.

However, because this argument is being promoted by experts at the highest level, including those directing the review of saturated fats for the 2015-2020 Dietary Guidelines, it deserves a response.

Saturated fats vs. carbohydrates. All reviews agree that replacing saturated fats with “refined carbohydrates” leads to poorer cardiovascular outcomes. This position was confirmed by the expert committee for the US dietary guidelines as well as the latest American Heart Association “Presidential” advisory on saturated fats. However, if you look at data from randomized controlled clinical trials, saturated fats have never been replaced by “refined carbohydrates.” E.g., In no trial did researchers say: reduce saturated fats (in meat/dairy) and replace these foods with cookies, crackers, chips, and white flour. Instead, large clinical trials, including the Women’s Health Initiative (WHI) and the “Boeing Studies” counseled subjects to reduce the fats in meat/dairy and replace these with whole grains, fruits, and vegetables. The WHI, which measured “hard endpoints” (heart attacks and death) found no benefit of this diet. The Boeing Studies, which measured “soft endpoints,” found that the low-fat diet had mixed cardiovascular benefit (it lowered LDL-C but also lowered HDL-C and raised triglycerides).

Thus, the data show that replacing fats with total carbohydrates, including fruits, vegetables and whole grains, does not improve cardiovascular outcomes. Implication: It is healthier to eat a breakfast of eggs rather than whole-grain cereal or
oatmeal; cheese is a better snack option than crackers or fruit.
____________________________________________

On sat fats vs. polyunsaturated vegetable oils. Remember that the original advice by the American Heart Association in 1961 was to replace saturated fats with polyunsaturated vegetable oils, so that hypothesis was tested on a massive scale. Thus, we have a huge volume of rigorous data, from government-funded, randomized, controlled clinical trials, conducted in the 1960s and 70s (which I describe in Ch. 2 in my book). This trial data has been reviewed in at least 9 meta-analyses and systematic reviews. These reviews universally conclude that replacing saturated fats with polyunsaturated vegetable oils has no benefit for cardiovascular or total mortality. Those studies that separately analyze strokes and heart attacks conclude that saturated fats have no effect on these outcomes. Only by ignoring that data and looking instead at the less definitive composite endpoint of “cardiovascular events,” a category that combines heart attacks with more subjective events such as angina, could the AHA arrive at its negative findings for saturated fats. For a full discussion of this issue including a table of the 9 meta-analyses, see this article that I co-authored with cardiologist Eric Thorn for the medical website Medscape.

This is the clinical trial data, which is the most rigorous and is the only kind of data that show cause and effect. There are multiple recent papers, mostly by the Harvard School of Public Health concluding that swapping saturated fats for polyunsaturated vegetable oils, but these studies are based on weak epidemiological data and involve complex modeling involving multiple assumptions. This kind of data can suggest hypotheses but not prove them. Because we have rigorous clinical trial data on this topic, that is far more definitive.

It is not clear why Harvard persists in publishing data on a topic that has already been tested in clinical trials, but one clue is that members of that group report receiving funds from vegetable oil companies, and the Harvard team appears to work closely with Unilever, one of the largest vegetable-oil manufacturers in the world. (Indeed, in one recent Harvard analysis, nearly half the authors were actually employees of Unilever.)

In sum, the extensive clinical trial data on this topic have concluded that saturated fats have no effect on heart attacks, stroke, cardiovascular mortality or total mortality.
___________________________________________

Are there positive arguments for eating butter, meat and cheese?
Yes, there are the three major ones:

These foods are far more nutrient dense than plant foods, and their nutrients have been shown to be more bio-available than those in plant foods. For instance, vitamin B12 is not available in plant foods. Fat-soluble Vitamins A, D, E and K need fat to absorb properly—and this fat comes naturally in animal foods. (The current USDA diet is inadequate in D vitamins without fortified foods.) Choline, lutein, and heme iron are scarce in plant foods while abundant in animal foods–and so on. (I will post more links and information on this later.)
Protein and fat have been shown, in clinical studies, to be far more satiating than carbohydrates. These satiating qualities mean that people are far less likely to “overeat” on these foods. For instance, most people, when they eat bacon and eggs for breakfast, are not hungry until lunch, whereas a breakfast of cereal and low-fat yogurt often has people starving by mid-morning. And as we all know, people “overeat” quite easily on carb-based foods like cookies, crackers, chips, bread, etc. Because protein and fat are found naturally paired together in animal foods, these are the most easily accessible, whole foods that make up this healthy and satiating diet.
Finally, the historical record supports a diet higher in animal foods: One hundred and fifty years ago, we ate far more red meat, cheese, butter and lard than we do today (butter and lard were the principal fats that Americans used for cooking before 1900). We ate this way before the epidemics of heart disease, obesity and diabetes. I provide data on these facts in in my book and also debunk the myth that pre-1900, we just didn’t live long enough to suffer from the chronic diseases that appear later in life.
Where does the data stand on total fat?
It’s clear that a low-fat diet, defined in the scientific literature as between 20 and 35% of calories as fat, is not a healthy diet. This diet has been tested in multiple, NIH-funded clinical trials, on more than 55,000 people, all of which found that the low-fat diet was completely ineffective for combatting obesity, diabetes, heart disease, or any kind of cancer.

Worse than that, the low-fat diet has been shown to worsen various disease risk factors. According to the expert report for the 2015 US Dietary Guidelines, low-fat diets are “associated with dyslipidemia”—meaning that the low-fat diet is linked to heart disease. Worse than that, rigorous evidence shows that the low-fat diet actually causes these harmful effects. Low-fat diets reliably cause HDL-C (the “good” cholesterol) to drop and triglycerides to rise, both signs of increased heart-disease risk. These factors also signal the onset of the metabolic conditions that cause obesity and diabetes.

Given this data, the low-fat diet is no longer officially recommended by our major nutrition authorities. The American Heart Association (AHA) dropped its longstanding limits on total fat in 2013, and the US Dietary Guidelines (DGAs) followed suit by eliminating any reference to limits on total fat in 2015. This doesn’t mean that low-fat caps don’t still exist in the fine-print of the DGA report, but the official, topline advice, to eat a low-fat diet, recommended by the AHA since 1970 and the DGAs since 1980, is gone.

Even so, the government has yet to announce this important change to the public. There have been no press releases to let the American public know that the major dietary policy for disease prevention of the last 35+ years is now over.
______________________________________________

Where does the science stand on dietary cholesterol?
The American Heart Association dropped its caps on dietary cholesterol in 2013. The US Dietary Guidelines followed suit in 2015. Why? Because since the 1950s, rigorous scientific evidence has shown that dietary cholesterol has little marginal effect on blood cholesterol. The more cholesterol you eat, the less your body itself produces. The back story and science on this subject is covered in my book, with references.
____________________________________________

Is sugar uniquely unhealthy?
In his latest book, The Case Against Sugar, science journalist Gary Taubes makes the case that sugar has always been at the “scene of the crime” when populations have become obese/diabetic.

However, as Taubes acknowledges, even if sugar has the unique ability to cause obesity and diabetes, the cure is not the same as the cause. In other words, for people who are already obese or diabetic, many will not be able to manage conditions simply by eliminating sugar–because those people have already tipped over into an unhealthy metabolic state, quite different from that of a healthy person. A metabolically unhealthy person has conditions known as insulin resistance and hyperinsulenemia, which means that s/he can no longer effectively process carbohydrates. A large body of rigorous scientific evidence demonstrates that for these people to recover, they must reduce the total amount of carbohydrates they eat. For these people, even too many “healthy” whole grains cannot be tolerated. The science on this may change, with regard to what type of carbs can be tolerated (glucose vs. fructose, refined, unrefined, and so on), but currently our state-of-the-art understanding of how to reverse these diseases is that total carbohydrates must be restricted.

It is also true that there is not, currently, an adequate body of rigorous (clinical trial) evidence to conclude that sugar is a unique driver of metabolic diseases. As a result, population-wide recommendations limiting sugar intake are questionable. I reviewed this issue for a piece in The Atlantic, “The Limits of Sugar Guidelines.”

No doubt a major reason that the science is still lacking on sugar is that the sugar industry has manipulated the science in a number of ways. To learn more on this issue, you can read work by:

The Case Against Sugar, by Gary Taubes
The Sugar Science group at UCSF
S. Right to Know
TheRussells blog
AP reporter Candice Choi
Nevertheless, I think it would be a mistake to blame the sugar industry for everything that has gone wrong in nutrition science and policy over the past 60 years. Having researched the history and politics of this field for more than a decade now, I know that many industries have played a role in manipulating nutrition science, including the vegetable oil industry, Big Pharma, the soy, grain and corn industries, as well as many manufactured food companies.

I made this point in an op-ed for the L.A. Times, “Don’t scapegoat Big Sugar. Lots of food producers profited from the demonization of fat.”









Too many words
Originally Posted by akasparky









Too many words



I didn't read it all but I know the drill and have been waaaay down this rabbit hole. I'll summarize it for you. Eating less fat and more carbs = more fat on your gut. Eating more fat and less carbs = less fat on your gut. Its paradoxical, but it works and people have known it for at least a couple of hundred years. Atkins certainly didn't come up with the idea in the 60's or 70's but he made a lot of money off of it.

Each individual may have to fine tune the above equations based on their own metabolism. If you are a post menopausal female that yoyo dieted for most of your life, you may have to push it to a ketogenic diet of practically no carbs to lose weight and regain health. A non-diabetic male with anything resembling a normal metabolism can cut his carb intake to around 100 net carbs a day and weight will fall off of him in just a few days/weeks/months give or take.

Just make sure the fat you eat comes from a natural source.

Just don’t eat Twinkies and sodas every day. Stay away from the wicked whites as they are called: white rice, white bread, white flour... Exercising helps too. I went for a hike this morning with the dogs ,then got laid. After that a little nap.
grin
Originally Posted by Tarquin
Originally Posted by RJY66
Originally Posted by OldHat
Seed oils? Wtf. Common sense will tell you people have been eating seed oils for thousands of years.



Tell me how they got oil from corn, soybeans, cottonseed, and rapeseed thousands of years ago?

Simple answer is that they didn't. That takes industrial processing and has only been in existence for 100 years or so.




^^^^^This---.


Evidently you have never heard of ancient
civiization use of ~Brassica~ seed oils.

Soyabean oil extraction goes back a few millennia
to oriental cultures.

Originally Posted by Starman
Originally Posted by Tarquin
Originally Posted by RJY66
Originally Posted by OldHat
Seed oils? Wtf. Common sense will tell you people have been eating seed oils for thousands of years.



Tell me how they got oil from corn, soybeans, cottonseed, and rapeseed thousands of years ago?

Simple answer is that they didn't. That takes industrial processing and has only been in existence for 100 years or so.




^^^^^This---.


Evidently you have never heard of ancient
civiization use of ~Brassica~ seed oils.



Why don't you tell us about it? You know you want to.
Due to my interest in all things Roman ..
I will share this ....

"The Last Legionary: Life as a Roman Soldier in Britain, AD 400," (Elliot)
explains;
For troops on the march olive oil was preferred
but being an expensive luxury (shipped from Med.
and difficult to transport), pig fat (lard) became the
staple fat source for troops.
Elliot cites;
Avidius Cassius, (who rebelled against Marcus Aurelius)
ordered that his troops carry nothing except
'laridium ac buccellatum at due acetum',
[i.e.] bacon fat, hardtack and sour wine".

Thanks to the Price Edict of Diocletian
we know the market prices of that time for
different grades of olive oil and Brassica oil
and also various common animal fats.
Originally Posted by viking
Just don’t eat Twinkies and sodas every day. Stay away from the wicked whites as they are called: white rice, white bread, white flour... Exercising helps too. I went for a hike this morning with the dogs ,then got laid. After that a little nap.


Please tell me the wicked whites do not extend to the getting laid part?

Asking for a friend.....
😂. I see where that could be misconstrued.
Originally Posted by antelope_sniper

People are dying of cancer and heart disease now because we've defeated most of the historically more common causes of death.
We die of Cancer and heart disease because that's about all that's left that can still kill us.


Yes , Infectious diseases dominated mortality
of humans making heart disease[deaths] relatively
"uncommon".but the non-existent claim is absurd
...and a number of individuals who studied anatomy
Since the Renaissance in centuries prior to 1900,
made note of arterial blockage and hardening.
One just need look up the records of:
Leonardo Da Vinci,
Giovanni Morgagni (1682 -1771)
William Heberden (1710 - 1801)
Edward Jenner (1729 -1823)
Caleb Parry (1755 -1822)
Rudolf Virchow (1821- 1902)
Heart disease was infrequent prior to 1900---far less prevalent than now.
Problably had something to do with working and busting your ass everyday. Everybody wasn’t 50 pounds overweight either. Kids were mostly skinny. Edk
Originally Posted by Tarquin
Heart disease was infrequent prior to 1900---far less prevalent than now.


Maybe as an actual primary cause of death
coz infectious diseases got many beforehand.

you seem to be relaxing things from non-existent,
to virtually non existent to now infrequent ..

What ballpark death rate/per 100,000 do you mean
by "infrequent" ?

Originally Posted by OldHat
Seed oils? Wtf. Common sense will tell you people have been eating seed oils for thousands of years.

unrefined and gmoed
Originally Posted by ERK
Problably had something to do with working and busting your ass everyday. Everybody wasn’t 50 pounds overweight either. Kids were mostly skinny. Edk



Lotta truth in this, just look at old pictures and you will see dozens of people and not a fat person there. They all died young from something we now don't even consider, like pneumonia or a minor infection.
Whats more dangerous?

Accessed tooth? Or Canola Oil?


You be the judge.....
Originally Posted by Jim_Conrad
Whats more dangerous?

Accessed tooth? Or Canola Oil?

You be the judge.....


Yep. Number one cause of death for the old Egyptians, abscessed tooth.
Originally Posted by Jim_Conrad
Whats more dangerous?

Accessed tooth? Or Canola Oil?


You be the judge.....


Spell check gotcha.
Folks have been dyeing from strokes, and heart attracts for centuries.
Originally Posted by Tarquin
Heart disease was infrequent prior to 1900---far less prevalent than now.


Maybe because the average life span was around 50 yrs old.
Originally Posted by Old_Toot
Originally Posted by Tarquin
Heart disease was infrequent prior to 1900---far less prevalent than now.


Maybe because the average life span was around 50 yrs old.

Accounted for almost entirely by infant mortality.
200 years ago dental infections were one of the leading causes of death in America. Infections in the mouth go rather easily to places like the brain and chest. Still can, but things
have gotten to the point where we are just fussier about what we eat but, not how much. ;-{>8
Do this. Get out a picture of your self when you where 21 to 25. Same body, same bone structure. If there is a large difference, there is a reason. cold be sugar. Joined navy in 54 at 135 lbs. Grew to 170 plus. A year ago, I cut out most sugars. Now, a year later, 147 to 150 and doing Ok.
Originally Posted by The_Real_Hawkeye
Originally Posted by Old_Toot
Originally Posted by Tarquin
Heart disease was infrequent prior to 1900---far less prevalent than now.


Maybe because the average life span was around 50 yrs old.

Accounted for almost entirely by infant mortality.

^^^^^^^^
Infant mortality factored in changes things quite a lot.

Records from over 3 thousand years ago speak of 70+ average life spans.

It's doubtless fluctuated frequently all over the earth due to warfare, slavery, disease, religious practices, economic, climate, and agricultural changes.
Originally Posted by jerrys
Do this. Get out a picture of your self when you where 21 to 25. Same body, same bone structure. If there is a large difference, there is a reason. cold be sugar. Joined navy in 54 at 135 lbs. Grew to 170 plus. A year ago, I cut out most sugars. Now, a year later, 147 to 150 and doing Ok.

Sugar IS a big factor.
It causes gross oxidation and inflammation.
It also leaches vitamins from the diet.
But it tastes sooo good.
Originally Posted by The_Real_Hawkeye
Originally Posted by Old_Toot
Originally Posted by Tarquin
Heart disease was infrequent prior to 1900---far less prevalent than now.


Maybe because the average life span was around 50 yrs old.

Accounted for almost entirely by infant mortality.


Good point.
Originally Posted by oldtrapper
200 years ago dental infections were one of the leading causes of death in America. Infections in the mouth go rather easily to places like the brain and chest. Still can, but things
have gotten to the point where we are just fussier about what we eat but, not how much. ;-{>8


Supposedly the leading cause of death for the early American Indians.
Originally Posted by Tarquin
Couple of vids on the poison we're eating too much of. Apparently heart disease and cancer were rare till seed oils came along....


I agree to an extent.
Seed oils start oxidizing as soon as the seeds are crushed. Most of us don't eat enough raw fresh vegetables and berry fruits to keep up with the stress.
Heating the oils also changes them to harmful forms.
Otherwise, freshly consumed nuts are great nutritional concentrates for the most part. Hemp seeds too. They have a perfect balance of omega 3, 6, and 12s.
If you want the best, I suggest, grinding your hemp, flax, etc just before eating.

Coconuts are exceptionally stable after oil is separated

See Dr. Joel Wallach's books for the best sources on the subject IMHO.
Originally Posted by Old_Toot
Originally Posted by oldtrapper
200 years ago dental infections were one of the leading causes of death in America. Infections in the mouth go rather easily to places like the brain and chest. Still can, but things
have gotten to the point where we are just fussier about what we eat but, not how much. ;-{>8


Supposedly the leading cause of death for the early American Indians.



American Indians had very little tooth decay but a predisposition for periodontal disease, however, when they started trading for sugar, bad things happened. There was a study once that showed the relationship between the distance of Alaska natives from the trading post and tooth decay. Pretty obvious.
As civilization developed, carbohydrates became more and more refined. Around 1800, Dutch colonists in Indonesia started suffering scurvy, while their native servants were fine.

The only substantial difference was that the colonists could afford white rice, while the natives ate brown rice. This “refinement” in our foods has taken place in every food grown. Potatoes are much more starchy than 100 years ago, let alone 200 years. Wheat, you name it, same song, different verse. More carbs, more empty calories, less nutrients and fiber.

200 years ago, sugar was expensive, and pies and such a rare treat, not rarely made with honey. But, now we are “better off” and use pure, crystalline sugar.....

Fruit 200 years ago had much less fructose, and much more fiber than today’s miracles of shippability.

Vegetables? Carrots today have little in common with those 200 or 500 years ago. Name your vegetable, the story is the same. More sugars, more digestible starch, less fiber, less nutrients.

Look up the difference in nutrient density in barn yard eggs vs industrial eggs. The difference is startlingly large.

I’ll admit though, it’s cheap!

Those blaming GMO’s or pesticides or chemical oil extraction are barking up the wrong tree. We’re sickly because we’re under nourished because of the nutrient poor foods we’re choosing to eat.
Originally Posted by viking
I went for a hike this morning with the dogs ,then got laid. After that a little nap.


I bet the dogs had fun. 😁
Originally Posted by Dutch
As civilization developed, carbohydrates became more and more refined. Around 1800, Dutch colonists in Indonesia started suffering scurvy, while their native servants were fine.

The only substantial difference was that the colonists could afford white rice, while the natives ate brown rice. ...


I thought the colonists problem with white Vs brown
revolved around Vitamin B1 deficiency.

Good point and I think farming practices have left a good deal of soil without essential nutrients.

Eat bread, fruits, veggies desserts in other countries, especially outside the urban areas. Taste completely different than in the US and a lot less sweet and better flavor.

The US is the only country in the world with scooters in our stores for the morbidly obese.

Nurse friends tell me stories of all the 400 plus women and men now in hospitals requiring extensive long term care. Again we are the only country in the world with this problem.

Originally Posted by Dutch
As civilization developed, carbohydrates became more and more refined. Around 1800, Dutch colonists in Indonesia started suffering scurvy, while their native servants were fine.

The only substantial difference was that the colonists could afford white rice, while the natives ate brown rice. This “refinement” in our foods has taken place in every food grown. Potatoes are much more starchy than 100 years ago, let alone 200 years. Wheat, you name it, same song, different verse. More carbs, more empty calories, less nutrients and fiber.

200 years ago, sugar was expensive, and pies and such a rare treat, not rarely made with honey. But, now we are “better off” and use pure, crystalline sugar.....

Fruit 200 years ago had much less fructose, and much more fiber than today’s miracles of shippability.

Vegetables? Carrots today have little in common with those 200 or 500 years ago. Name your vegetable, the story is the same. More sugars, more digestible starch, less fiber, less nutrients.

Look up the difference in nutrient density in barn yard eggs vs industrial eggs. The difference is startlingly large.

I’ll admit though, it’s cheap!

Those blaming GMO’s or pesticides or chemical oil extraction are barking up the wrong tree. We’re sickly because we’re under nourished because of the nutrient poor foods we’re choosing to eat.
Originally Posted by Dutch
As civilization developed, carbohydrates became more and more refined. Around 1800, Dutch colonists in Indonesia started suffering scurvy, while their native servants were fine.

The only substantial difference was that the colonists could afford white rice, while the natives ate brown rice. This “refinement” in our foods has taken place in every food grown. Potatoes are much more starchy than 100 years ago, let alone 200 years. Wheat, you name it, same song, different verse. More carbs, more empty calories, less nutrients and fiber.

200 years ago, sugar was expensive, and pies and such a rare treat, not rarely made with honey. But, now we are “better off” and use pure, crystalline sugar.....

Fruit 200 years ago had much less fructose, and much more fiber than today’s miracles of shippability.

Vegetables? Carrots today have little in common with those 200 or 500 years ago. Name your vegetable, the story is the same. More sugars, more digestible starch, less fiber, less nutrients.

Look up the difference in nutrient density in barn yard eggs vs industrial eggs. The difference is startlingly large.

I’ll admit though, it’s cheap!

Those blaming GMO’s or pesticides or chemical oil extraction are barking up the wrong tree. We’re sickly because we’re under nourished because of the nutrient poor foods we’re choosing to eat.

I agree with you about the agricultural changes.
The wealthy who could afford refined grains ended up with nutritional deficiencies.
SAD, Standard American Diet did the same.

That is ONE part of the dietary puzzle, but the toxins, like Roundup and many of the pesticides, plasticisers in packaging are found stored in fatty tissues as well as liver/kidney stressors. Cancer is occurring more in spite of claims of scientific diagnostics.
Originally Posted by Starman
Originally Posted by Dutch
As civilization developed, carbohydrates became more and more refined. Around 1800, Dutch colonists in Indonesia started suffering scurvy, while their native servants were fine.

The only substantial difference was that the colonists could afford white rice, while the natives ate brown rice. ...


I thought the colonists problem with white Vs brown
revolved around Vitamin B1 deficiency.



I’m working off grade school history with that one, so I’ll not quibble.....
Margarine is good for you. The government says so. Oh I’m sorry that was a little while back. Don’t believe all the crap you read. Edk
When I was in school, our favorite day was when they served Sloppy Joes for lunch. Those were the good old days. Today, the kids just get a bunch of healthy crap. Mostly inedible.
Tonight, for supper, I had a couple of chicken pies and washed them down with a Pepsi. For dessert, I had a handful of Goldfish (made with real cheese!). Later, I'll have a bowl of Shredded Wheat before I go to bed. I'm out of Sugar Crisps. GD
Originally Posted by Old_Toot
Originally Posted by Jim_Conrad
Whats more dangerous?

Accessed tooth? Or Canola Oil?


You be the judge.....


Spell check gotcha.

....uh huh - and he got very close veins !!!
Humm, did you mean vanes. My arrows gots vanes. wink
[i][/i]
Originally Posted by greydog
When I was in school, our favorite day was when they served Sloppy Joes for lunch. Those were the good old days. Today, the kids just get a bunch of healthy crap. Mostly inedible.
Tonight, for supper, I had a couple of chicken pies and washed them down with a Pepsi. For dessert, I had a handful of Goldfish (made with real cheese!). Later, I'll have a bowl of Shredded Wheat before I go to bed. I'm out of Sugar Crisps. GD


And dont be saying GD just cause youre outta Sugar Crisps. Dayom. wink
© 24hourcampfire