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Is there any issue with importing diesel engines from abroad and dropping them into our old Toyotas?

Japanese import motors used to be big business. But I do not hear so much about it the last few years.

If we could get our hands on the engine and controls, it could be installed in a weekend and no one would ever be the wiser.
People do engine swaps from 'salvage' engines in performance applications all the time.

Big 3 rotor mazda Rotary engines are a popular swap and street legal.
I knew a guy from Oregon who had a volkswagon diesel in a suzuki samurai 4x4, 35+mpg.
Originally Posted by Idaho_Shooter
Is there any issue with importing diesel engines from abroad and dropping them into our old Toyotas?

Japanese import motors used to be big business. But I do not hear so much about it the last few years.

If we could get our hands on the engine and controls, it could be installed in a weekend and no one would ever be the wiser.

Good luck finding parts if something goes wrong. You might have to order parts from Down Under..... If you can fix everything yourself, great, but you'll never find a mechanic that knows the engines. I'd love to have a diesel Highlux with the snorkles, but stuff always breaks in time.
Nothing the simple application of money wont fix. There are Diesel engines available for my 2017 Tacoma.
Originally Posted by wyoelk
Nothing the simple application of money wont fix. There are Diesel engines available for my 2017 Tacoma.

Are they available in the US?
Except they aren’t weekend swaps.

Take much longer typically. Require lots of custom pieces, adapters,and fabrication from what I’ve seen done with fj40 and others.

You have to change a lot more than just simply motors. Fuel tank, lines, inline fuel filters, fuel pumps, ecm, wiring harness may need mods, transmission may need a adaptor.
There are thousands of Japanese box trucks on the road with 4 cylinder Diesels in them- - - -Nissan Toyota, Isuzu, etc. All a transplant takes is a healthy dose of time and money, and the stupid conviction that "I'm smarter than the engineers who built this vehicle!" Hotrodders have been doing it for decades. "There's no substitute for cubic dollars!"
My 2016 f 150 4wd with a 5.0l v8 runs better on gas than a buds 2015 tacoma with a 4l v6. After all the yups wanted autos and v6 power the tacoma went to hell for mileage. My 95 tacoma has a 2.7 4 cyl and a 5spd runs 20-25 mpg day in and out just turned 249 k. Buying and paying to install a diesel for it don't cash out for a long time at $5/gallon diesel price even at 35 mpg...mb
You can import whole rigs once they are 25 years old, Canadian diesel Toyota’s are becoming fairly common around here.
Diesel swaps are way more expensive than you would think, easier to import.
I was in Panama for a couple of weeks in March. Seemed as if every other vehicle there was a diesel Toyota Hilux.

I want one bad.
That's a dream I have never had.
Originally Posted by BillyGoatGruff
That's a dream I have never had.

+1
Anyone that is into Landcruisers has thought about it.
25mpg would give a cruiser a 600 mile range per fill up.
Never messed with a Toyota swap. But my buddy and I swapped a diesel into his GMC 3/4 T 4x4. It was not a big deal. Started Sat morning, was done by Sunday evening.

A couple years later we pulled the diesel back out and dropped a 396 back under the hood.

The Toyota might be a bit more difficult. But you sure as heck would not need to change the fuel tank.
I drove a 2021 Toyota Hilux this last January quite a bit in northern Peru. It was a 6 speed stick shift and pretty solid truck. Wasn’t fancy, but it rode great and accelerated ok. Not super quick, but it was a diesel and got pretty good mileage. It was a fantastic sized truck in my opinion for about any kind of hunting.

Trucks these days are way too big and I have two of them. A 2019 Ram 3500 crew cab Cummins dually long bed. Best damn towing truck I have ever owned for the open road. And a 2022 Ram crew cab Cummins 6.5’ bed daily driver. Super nice truck, but wouldn’t be as good for me when I hunt as the Hilux in my opinion.
I'm seriously toying with the idea of dropping a 12v in my 80 series.....
Originally Posted by Backroads
Anyone that is into Landcruisers has thought about it.
25mpg would give a cruiser a 600 mile range per fill up.


As if the venerable Land Cruiser isn't already good enough, THAT would be awesome.
The question remains. Does anyone import the HiLux or LC diesel powerplant? Would Customs let you bring one over the border?

Once the engine is here, nobody knows or cares what is under the hood of my rig.
[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]
Originally Posted by high_country_
I'm seriously toying with the idea of dropping a 12v in my 80 series.....


This has been done many times, the main issue is depth of engine.

Pretty sure a minimum 6" lift is required.. The 4BT is similar
Originally Posted by Idaho_Shooter
The question remains. Does anyone import the HiLux or LC diesel powerplant? Would Customs let you bring one over the border?

Once the engine is here, nobody knows or cares what is under the hood of my rig.


Google JDM imported half cuts. You get everything you need, except the resale value.

What rig are you thinking about diesel swapping?
Hilux in New Zealand first time in 1986. immediate reaction: holy wowzer what a great truck. and double cab short box. mine company trucks.....

the answer to so many questions: why has toyota NOT done this? it is either politics or eco-extremism. which are really about the same thing.

anyway there is a company in business to supply such to the mining industry for underground use. no gas engines underground due safety. some suggest diesel not much better, but that aside, diesel changovers for 45 K or so. also must be upgraded to meet MSHA safety rules...... like the old mules underground, these do not resurface for a bunch of reasons.
Originally Posted by reivertom
Originally Posted by wyoelk
Nothing the simple application of money wont fix. There are Diesel engines available for my 2017 Tacoma.

Are they available in the US?


Yes. About $30k
Originally Posted by BillyGoatGruff
That's a dream I have never had.



Me either.

😂
Originally Posted by ol_mike
People do engine swaps from 'salvage' engines in performance applications all the time.

Big 3 rotor mazda Rotary engines are a popular swap and street legal.
I knew a guy from Oregon who had a volkswagon diesel in a suzuki samurai 4x4, 35+mpg.



I've seen the VW Diesel swap in the Samurai 4 x 4.. that is pretty cool...

knew a guy up in Washington, that had a VW Karman Ghia, and mounted a Mazda Rotary engine in it...
plenty of room back there for that little Wankel engine.. and a radiator with electric fan...

fastest like Karman Ghia I ever saw....

Some guy over in Bend, will import Toyota Diesels from Australia or Japan, and put them in 4 Runners is his thing...
will do that or install Mercedes Small Diesels in them.....

Conversion was $15K, installed into your 4 Runner....haven't seen him advertise tho on line, in quite a while....

In Phoenix, I've seen Toyota trucks and 4 Runners with Mexican plates on them with Diesel engines.... factory installs..

we can't get them here due to the EPA, but in Mexico they can get all sorts of cool stuff.....
landcruisers are the choice 4x4 vehicle in Australia being the remote areas they are used , you need a vehicle to last. Hiluxes are more common being a more affordable unit. When I was in afghanistan the main up-armoured( B6 and B7 class) suburban vehicles were the big fords and the landcruisers, usually 200 series .Ultimately, many groups ended up with all landcruisers. They had the power to still move the extra tons of armoour at decent speeds, modest width, didnt sink into sand like the bigger trucks, more economical, lasted longer.
some of us wouldnt drive a toyota if they were free. there are still a few real americans left.
Originally Posted by srwshooter
some of us wouldnt drive a toyota if they were free. there are still a few real americans left.

Just curious... Would you rather have:

> A Toyota Tundra made in San Antonio TX? Or a Dodge Ram heche en Mexico?
> A Toyota Corolla made in Blue Springs MS? Or a Chevy Aveo made in South Korea?
> A Toyota Camry made in Georgetown KY? Or a Ford Mustang that does not have enough U.S. content to be labeled "Made In America"?

The single largest cost going into the manufacture of a vehicle is Labor $$$'s. I will support the companies that spend their Labor $$$'s on the American worker...
There is a diesel hi-lux for sale here locally. It’s right hand drive tho. Make a nice mail truck!
You might want to look at WildVeld4x4.com. They specialize in Landys and Cruisers and export 25 year + totally refurbished examples to the US. They ain't for free but they are reconditioned from the frame up.
You can get service at any Cummins dealer -

R2.8 Diesel

310 lbs torque
No thank you. Edk


I had a Toyota Station Wagon with a diesel motor years ago. I bought it in Great Falls MT. A returning soldier brought it back from Germany.

Ran it for a few years and sold it. It was under powered for the hills. Great MPG .
Didn’t they put a diesel in Jeeps recently?
I was looking at swapping out the 3.4L on my '91 with the 3.0L.

The engine swap itself wasn't bad, but the wiring harness had to be replaced. You could either make your own or buy one and it wasn't cheap. Then you had to address the hood clearance, and do some custom welding on the manifold.

Many people did it, which is why there was so much information out there about it, but in the end, I decided against it and sold the 3.4L motor to someone. I really wanted a Toyota pickup with 190HP though.
Not I.
Ah, the ubiquitous Hi-Lux. I have literally seen them world wide. Deserts to jungles, mountains to sea side. Even had a few "issued" to me for use. Always overloaded and a bit underpowered but damn near unbreakable (easy to fix when they do). The entire planet has them, except us.
They are as close as Panama most people are driving a diesel Toyota Hilux or a Diesel Ford Ranger
I understand the Toyota "Tundra" is now equipped with a Cummins diesel.
Kid has a '17 Dodge 1500 w/"Eco- diesel". Super mileage, a great ride and plenty of pep.
I'm still driving my '01 Dodge 3500 w/Cummins! +400K miles and still getting 17 mpg!
I understand the Toyota "Tundra" is now equipped with a Cummins diesel.
Kid has a '17 Dodge 1500 w/"Eco- diesel". Super mileage, a great ride and plenty of pep.
I'm still driving my '01 Dodge 3500 w/Cummins! +400K miles and still getting 17 mpg!
Originally Posted by martinstrummer
I understand the Toyota "Tundra" is now equipped with a Cummins diesel.
Kid has a '17 Dodge 1500 w/"Eco- diesel". Super mileage, a great ride and plenty of pep.
I'm still driving my '01 Dodge 3500 w/Cummins! +400K miles and still getting 17 mpg!


Negative - Toyota doesn't offer that. Nissan does tho.
Originally Posted by hanco
Didn’t they put a diesel in Jeeps recently?


Yes they did. I just took delivery of a 2022 Wrangler with a 3.0 eco diesel. It's a 180c.i. V-6 with 240 hp and 440 ft lbs of torque. Runs like a raped ape.... and gets 29mpg
Originally Posted by irfubar
Originally Posted by hanco
Didn’t they put a diesel in Jeeps recently?


Yes they did. I just took delivery of a 2022 Wrangler with a 3.0 eco diesel. It's a 180c.i. V-6 with 240 hp and 440 ft lbs of torque. Runs like a raped ape.... and gets 29mpg


Now that's an interesting rig.
OP

i owned a diesel yotar in nzed. lusted after one for ages. put almost 60k's on it.

when i came home i went straight to a Toyota t100 with the v6 and long bed.

while i respect what diesels can do in certain scenarios, i'll take a 3.4 v6 for anything i want a "small" truck to do here in the states.

best friend has a land cruiser with the non turbo'd.. right side drive. came from Oz with 400ks on it.
Originally Posted by irfubar
Originally Posted by hanco
Didn’t they put a diesel in Jeeps recently?


Yes they did. I just took delivery of a 2022 Wrangler with a 3.0 eco diesel. It's a 180c.i. V-6 with 240 hp and 440 ft lbs of torque. Runs like a raped ape.... and gets 29mpg


Please tell me, it's got a standard transmission ?
Originally Posted by irfubar
Originally Posted by hanco
Didn’t they put a diesel in Jeeps recently?


Yes they did. I just took delivery of a 2022 Wrangler with a 3.0 eco diesel. It's a 180c.i. V-6 with 240 hp and 440 ft lbs of torque. Runs like a raped ape.... and gets 29mpg



I need one
Originally Posted by New_2_99s
Originally Posted by irfubar
Originally Posted by hanco
Didn’t they put a diesel in Jeeps recently?


Yes they did. I just took delivery of a 2022 Wrangler with a 3.0 eco diesel. It's a 180c.i. V-6 with 240 hp and 440 ft lbs of torque. Runs like a raped ape.... and gets 29mpg


Please tell me, it's got a standard transmission ?

Sorry Paul, only an 8 speed auto is available with the diesel. If a manual was available I would have ordered it that way
It does have roll up windows tho
Diesel sure is high right now.
Originally Posted by irfubar

It does have roll up windows tho


grin

I like the way you think !
Originally Posted by Teal
Originally Posted by martinstrummer
I understand the Toyota "Tundra" is now equipped with a Cummins diesel.
Kid has a '17 Dodge 1500 w/"Eco- diesel". Super mileage, a great ride and plenty of pep.
I'm still driving my '01 Dodge 3500 w/Cummins! +400K miles and still getting 17 mpg!


Negative - Toyota doesn't offer that. Nissan does tho.


I read Nissan is scrapping the Titan, so it might be short lived...
Originally Posted by srwshooter
some of us wouldnt drive a toyota if they were free. there are still a few real americans left.

So what do you drive? A made in Canada Chevy, or a made in Mexico Ford, rather than a made in America Toyota?
When I was in Afghanistan we had some Ford 4 door Ranger pickups. They had a 4 cylinder diesel engine in them. The Border Patrol was issued them. They were some tough little vehicles and the engines were plenty torquey. It's my understanding they came from India. Unfortunately they are not clean enough to run in America. I wish we could get them here. I wouldn't want the 4 door Ranger but it would be nice to have the 2 door with that engine. We could if we could out vote the environmental wackos.

kwg
Originally Posted by Teal
You can get service at any Cummins dealer -

R2.8 Diesel

310 lbs torque


This had me interested a few years ago. Guess it’s a Chinese made POS.
The irony is all the auto makers are publicly traded companies, so there really is no such thing as an American car anymore...
Originally Posted by jameister
Hilux in New Zealand first time in 1986. immediate reaction: holy wowzer what a great truck. and double cab short box. mine company trucks.....

the answer to so many questions: why has toyota NOT done this? it is either politics or eco-extremism. which are really about the same thing.

anyway there is a company in business to supply such to the mining industry for underground use. no gas engines underground due safety. some suggest diesel not much better, but that aside, diesel changovers for 45 K or so. also must be upgraded to meet MSHA safety rules...... like the old mules underground, these do not resurface for a bunch of reasons.


I asked Toyota this after a trip to Costa Rica, the answer was EPA....
Originally Posted by Backroads
Originally Posted by Idaho_Shooter
The question remains. Does anyone import the HiLux or LC diesel powerplant? Would Customs let you bring one over the border?

Once the engine is here, nobody knows or cares what is under the hood of my rig.


Google JDM imported half cuts. You get everything you need, except the resale value.

What rig are you thinking about diesel swapping?

I am just spitballing. I would like to get for Momma the best lowest milage LC, Lexus, or possibly Sequoyia I can get for $40K about this time next year.

A diesel would be even more desirable.

One of the most fun conversions we did was pull a rotary out of a Mazda Sport Truck and drop a 20R into it from a Toyota.

All the sudden, the little truck had some bottom end and lugging ability. But it lost some top end.
Originally Posted by Idaho_Shooter
The question remains. Does anyone import the HiLux or LC diesel powerplant? Would Customs let you bring one over the border?

Once the engine is here, nobody knows or cares what is under the hood of my rig.


You can buy engines on ebay, so a few are getting here somehow.
LOL I don't dream of owning either diesel or Toyota and certainly not combined. Good luck!
Originally Posted by irfubar
Originally Posted by hanco
Didn’t they put a diesel in Jeeps recently?


Yes they did. I just took delivery of a 2022 Wrangler with a 3.0 eco diesel. It's a 180c.i. V-6 with 240 hp and 440 ft lbs of torque. Runs like a raped ape.... and gets 29mpg



That's what I have in my 1500 Ram, and I echo your sentiments. Great truck so far, 36k, averaged 23.4mpg over it's life. Amazing for a crew cab 4x4.
Originally Posted by Orion2000
Originally Posted by srwshooter
some of us wouldnt drive a toyota if they were free. there are still a few real americans left.

Just curious... Would you rather have:

> A Toyota Tundra made in San Antonio TX? Or a Dodge Ram heche en Mexico?
> A Toyota Corolla made in Blue Springs MS? Or a Chevy Aveo made in South Korea?
> A Toyota Camry made in Georgetown KY? Or a Ford Mustang that does not have enough U.S. content to be labeled "Made In America"?

The single largest cost going into the manufacture of a vehicle is Labor $$$'s. I will support the companies that spend their Labor $$$'s on the American worker...




The immediate fall back when American built is mentioned.


Toy-Boys are like Libs in their fervor and their Stepford-like programmed
response.

MY Toyota is 71.35787% American built...........

Just own it.

You like Japanese cars.


The most fervent Toy-Boys? They have discussions concerning how
Japanese built Toyota's are better than American built ones.
Some, seek out the imported models exclusively.

Why would anyone want a diesel for offloading? They're really heavy and the torque is all wrong. Good for towing etc, but not best choice for a real hunting rig in my opinion...
Originally Posted by Pharmseller
I was in Panama for a couple of weeks in March. Seemed as if every other vehicle there was a diesel Toyota Hilux.

I want one bad.

I must have just missed you, those are badass and so are the rangers. I'm loving Panama
I'd drive THIS
Originally Posted by hanco
Originally Posted by irfubar
Originally Posted by hanco
Didn’t they put a diesel in Jeeps recently?


Yes they did. I just took delivery of a 2022 Wrangler with a 3.0 eco diesel. It's a 180c.i. V-6 with 240 hp and 440 ft lbs of torque. Runs like a raped ape.... and gets 29mpg



I need one


Brother Hanco.... if you need help spending your money, I'm your huckleberry...... smile








[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]
I've thrown a lot of bucks at vehicles over the years & know that if it's what you really want, go for it.

But some mods just don't hold water for a financial gain. They never see a longer term advantage. Spend 10K on a diesel conversion that might achieve 35MPG, & do the math on the 19 MPG engine that's already under the hood. A ton of miles to use to amortize the initial cost..

Again, iffin ya want it, go for it. But so many conversions just don't make sense.
Originally Posted by gunzo
I've thrown a lot of bucks at vehicles over the years & know that if it's what you really want, go for it.

But some just don't hold water. They never see a longer term advantage. Spend 10K on a diesel conversion that might achieve 35MPG, & do the math on the 19 MPG engine that's already under the hood.

Again, iffin ya want it, go for it. But so many conversions just don't make sense.


Logic has nothing to do with it. smile
Originally Posted by irfubar
Originally Posted by gunzo
I've thrown a lot of bucks at vehicles over the years & know that if it's what you really want, go for it.

But some just don't hold water. They never see a longer term advantage. Spend 10K on a diesel conversion that might achieve 35MPG, & do the math on the 19 MPG engine that's already under the hood.

Again, iffin ya want it, go for it. But so many conversions just don't make sense.


Logic has nothing to do with it. smile


Thank you for that. Maybe I can rest easier over some of the brainstorms I've had over the years.
Originally Posted by OGB
The entire planet has them, except us.


They can be imported.

Originally Posted by dogcatcher223
Why would anyone want a diesel for offloading? They're really heavy and the torque is all wrong. Good for towing etc, but not best choice for a real hunting rig in my opinion...



Not at all true.


Somewhat condition dependent, but diesels produce tons of
torque at the very bottom. Right where it works best, except for
certain mud/snow scenarios where you need throttle response and
high rpm.

My Diesel Dodge is unreal in most conditions.
Just let out the clutch, no throttle at all.
If it spins, pedal it, the wheels grab and off you go.
Steep, tight, no need to match fuel and clutch or heel/toe.
Let out the clutch in 1st or 2nd, and it goes.


Ford/Chevy V8s are not as good in that regard, but they still build
good torque at idle. With a governor to prevent stall.



No idea if you are familiar with semis.
But you do not, ever, need to touch the throttle to get one rolling.
At least nothing built in the last 30+ years.
The only Montanans that drive Jeeps are chicks that just moved here.
Lol
Originally Posted by Backroads
The only Montanans that drive Jeeps are chicks that just moved here.
Lol

GFY..... smile
Originally Posted by Idaho_Shooter
Originally Posted by Backroads
Originally Posted by Idaho_Shooter
The question remains. Does anyone import the HiLux or LC diesel powerplant? Would Customs let you bring one over the border?

Once the engine is here, nobody knows or cares what is under the hood of my rig.


Google JDM imported half cuts. You get everything you need, except the resale value.

What rig are you thinking about diesel swapping?

I am just spitballing. I would like to get for Momma the best lowest milage LC, Lexus, or possibly Sequoyia I can get for $40K about this time next year.

A diesel would be even more desirable.

One of the most fun conversions we did was pull a rotary out of a Mazda Sport Truck and drop a 20R into it from a Toyota.

All the sudden, the little truck had some bottom end and lugging ability. But it lost some top end.

There are ‘06-‘07 100 series cruisers with under 60k miles for sale right now for less than $40k.
Next year? Who knows..
Originally Posted by irfubar
Originally Posted by Backroads
The only Montanans that drive Jeeps are chicks that just moved here.
Lol

GFY..... smile

Just messing around, kinda
Lol
Originally Posted by Backroads
Originally Posted by irfubar
Originally Posted by Backroads
The only Montanans that drive Jeeps are chicks that just moved here.
Lol

GFY..... smile

Just messing around, kinda
Lol

It's gonna look cool towing my gloss black drift boat..... smile
Perfect!
Why,,, the motor will run ...but the body will rust thu...
Originally Posted by Idaho_Shooter
We all dream of owning a diesel Toyota

Nope. I mostly dream of nekkid chicks.
One of Dad's favorite comments had quite a ring of truth to it- - - -"Diesels are just like sex- - - - -highly overrated and stinky!"
Originally Posted by Backroads
Originally Posted by irfubar
Originally Posted by Backroads
The only Montanans that drive Jeeps are chicks that just moved here.
Lol

GFY..... smile

Just messing around, kinda
Lol


Hahaha!
Originally Posted by dogcatcher223
Why would anyone want a diesel for offloading? They're really heavy and the torque is all wrong. Good for towing etc, but not best choice for a real hunting rig in my opinion...


There a number of reasons turbodiesels are by far the popular choice for outback and offroad here in Oz. Among them are the really good torque curve, and the ability to pull at really low revs, which is ideal for gnarly conditions crawling over rocks or pulling through mud, as well as making them feel effortless to drive. They also use a good deal less fuel than a comparable petrol motor, which is not just about saving money but also means a great deal more range for a given size of fuel tank. This makes a difference when it can be a long way between fuel supplies. It is also a good deal safer to carry in jerries, for those times when you need to do so. My last four vehicles have been turbodiesels for these reasons, and they've all done a lot of time on tracks and offroad.

Here in Oz four out of the top five sellers among all cars are 4x4 diesels, month after month. The Hilux, with its turbodiesel motor, is regularly the biggest selling car in Australia.
Originally Posted by Hotrod_Lincoln
One of Dad's favorite comments had quite a ring of truth to it- - - -"Diesels are just like sex- - - - -highly overrated and stinky!"




Listen to this man
Originally Posted by Orion2000
Originally Posted by srwshooter
some of us wouldnt drive a toyota if they were free. there are still a few real americans left.

Just curious... Would you rather have:

> A Toyota Tundra made in San Antonio TX? Or a Dodge Ram heche en Mexico?
> A Toyota Corolla made in Blue Springs MS? Or a Chevy Aveo made in South Korea?
> A Toyota Camry made in Georgetown KY? Or a Ford Mustang that does not have enough U.S. content to be labeled "Made In America"?

The single largest cost going into the manufacture of a vehicle is Labor $$$'s. I will support the companies that spend their Labor $$$'s on the American worker...

anything but a toyota ,weve been feeding the japs way to long
Silverados made in Mexico, Canada and US depending on model.
Fords made in US and Mexico
Ram made in US(new 1500) and Mexico(classic)
Toyota US made with probably more US components then any of the other 3.


Always fun to watch the auctions

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1982-toyota-land-cruiser-bj42-diesel-7/
Originally Posted by wyoelk
Originally Posted by Hotrod_Lincoln
One of Dad's favorite comments had quite a ring of truth to it- - - -"Diesels are just like sex- - - - -highly overrated and stinky!"




Listen to this man


Jeebus.....that makes three of you that are wrong.
I love diesels for pulling stock trailers on chitty two track trails.

We gather a couple CMR pastures horseback and there are few hills involved getting back in there with the ponies.

The torque is handy for taking it easy.



That said I'll take a POS full cab Polaris Ranger for off roading.



Put me in the pass column for a diesel Toyota.
Classic Hilux ads from NZ:



Originally Posted by Jim_Conrad
Originally Posted by wyoelk
Originally Posted by Hotrod_Lincoln
One of Dad's favorite comments had quite a ring of truth to it- - - -"Diesels are just like sex- - - - -highly overrated and stinky!"




Listen to this man


Jeebus.....that makes three of you that are wrong.

Other than a little time out for Uncle Sam, I have been in the heavy equipment repair business for a half century plus. The reputation for longevity, reliability, and thusly economy...was made on the design and engineering of industrial engines. Very heavy engines, with lousy power to weight ratios. But, they ran forever, with minimal maintenance, often in marine and power generation at full rated load. I personally maintained engines that were still reliable at 28,000 hours of near full load service. That is about 1,680,000 miles equivalent. Think about that. So what happened to light truck engines, why such a relatively short life, so many stories of expensive component failure, and in many cases, basic failures of cranks, blocks, heads? Well, I think it was sales departments at the big automakers. The first big gas shortage, 1977, GM puts the 5.7 "diesel" in the Oldsmobile, 1979 Ford puts the International IDI engine in pickups...and the rest is history, but the damn toy diesels never got much better. More power out of already weak designs, lower power to weight ratio's...all at the cost of reliability and longevity. In trucking service, industrial quality engines routinely run 750,000 miles. In toy diesels, guys start bragging at less than half that, in the meantime, they have replaced a turbo or two, rebuilt the injection system and replaced the head gaskets. Large fleet mail contractors keeping track of costs down to the penny determined long ago, there is no financial benefit in toy diesels...they would need to run trouble free for 500,000 miles to break even. And that's before diesel became more expensive than gasoline. Love your toy diesels, it's fine with me, but they don't pencil out.
There's something about a 22:1 compression ratio that makes little Diesels destroy themselves pretty quickly. Lightweight parts, high RPM, and turbocharging all combine to put more stress on them than they can stand long term. First generation GM Diesel V8's had a nasty habit of stretching thecylinder head bolts and leaking coolant between the block and the head- - - -it was actually possible to see the heads bouncing up and down on the block with the engine idling. Cummins, Cat, Detroit, and other full grown Diesels are a completely different ball game. The original compression ignition engine designed back in the late 1800's was intended to burn powdered coal- - - - -the engine exploded and nearly killed the inventor. He re-engineered it to run on lightweight oil.
Originally Posted by flintlocke
Originally Posted by Jim_Conrad
Originally Posted by wyoelk
Originally Posted by Hotrod_Lincoln
One of Dad's favorite comments had quite a ring of truth to it- - - -"Diesels are just like sex- - - - -highly overrated and stinky!"




Listen to this man


Jeebus.....that makes three of you that are wrong.

Other than a little time out for Uncle Sam, I have been in the heavy equipment repair business for a half century plus. The reputation for longevity, reliability, and thusly economy...was made on the design and engineering of industrial engines. Very heavy engines, with lousy power to weight ratios. But, they ran forever, with minimal maintenance, often in marine and power generation at full rated load. I personally maintained engines that were still reliable at 28,000 hours of near full load service. That is about 1,680,000 miles equivalent. Think about that. So what happened to light truck engines, why such a relatively short life, so many stories of expensive component failure, and in many cases, basic failures of cranks, blocks, heads? Well, I think it was sales departments at the big automakers. The first big gas shortage, 1977, GM puts the 5.7 "diesel" in the Oldsmobile, 1979 Ford puts the International IDI engine in pickups...and the rest is history, but the damn toy diesels never got much better. More power out of already weak designs, lower power to weight ratio's...all at the cost of reliability and longevity. In trucking service, industrial quality engines routinely run 750,000 miles. In toy diesels, guys start bragging at less than half that, in the meantime, they have replaced a turbo or two, rebuilt the injection system and replaced the head gaskets. Large fleet mail contractors keeping track of costs down to the penny determined long ago, there is no financial benefit in toy diesels...they would need to run trouble free for 500,000 miles to break even. And that's before diesel became more expensive than gasoline. Love your toy diesels, it's fine with me, but they don't pencil out.


The mileage is much lower than that.

It's closer to 250,000.


If you need or want a diesel...they are absolutely worth it.
Ford F150 for me.
You don't buy a diesel f250 because you think it is a smaller C12.

You don't expect 1.2mm miles and are disappointed at 350k.

You buy it because it's better than what's available in the same chassis but with gas power. It lasts longer than that 351W or 5.4 Triton. You put 300k on it, hard and still have something compared to the gas peers at the same mileage.

Average mpg isn't the only way to calculate ROI when comparing diesel vs gas in sub class 4 trucks.
And besides...the longest lasting "diesel" engines run on natural gas.

The water injection plant on the oil field here used an Ajax pump run by a Waukesha 6 cyl gas engine.

I loved listening to that engine run.
Diesels pull cshit down the road without much strain. That’s my favorite thing about them. My 2004 will pull a 20’ gooseneck, tractor, implements, 80 miles an hour, no sweat. Gassers suck when it comes to pulling unless you want to get 3 miles to the gallon.
Originally Posted by Teal
You don't buy a diesel f250 because you think it is a smaller C12.

You don't expect 1.2mm miles and are disappointed at 350k.

You buy it because it's better than what's available in the same chassis but with gas power. It lasts longer than that 351W or 5.4 Triton. You put 300k on it, hard and still have something compared to the gas peers at the same mileage.

Average mpg isn't the only way to calculate ROI when comparing diesel vs gas in sub class 4 trucks.

Cost per mile...the ONLY number that matters in the business world.
I deliberately didn't mention UPS, 108,000 package vehicles operating a day. Their cost per mile numbers are good solid data. Locally, UPS is using 2007 F250 4x4, 6.2L gassers. The one on my route has 560,000 on the odometer. The driver is a close friend, he got the current pickup with 320,000 on it, it is up to 560k now, no breakdowns, routine maintenance. Every day it goes about 220 miles, from 2,600 ft elev to 5,100 ft, to 3,000 ft, to 6,000 ft to 1,100 ft, to 5,900 ft, to 3,000 ft back to 2,600 ft at the barn. If UPS could save a penny a mile, they would run diesel, but they don't. And not to mention the famous "Hot Trucks" running oilfield service are little 4.7L Toyota gassers with over a million miles each.
What you WANT...trumps all, but cost per mile? Gassers, the clear winner.
UPS has amazing telematics on their equipment but the average UPS package truck isn't towing much of a load and honestly, isn't carrying much weight. Gross weights just 16-24k lbs. Gas works for them on a cpm basis. They also can see purchased contract or house service on those vehicles whenever they need it.

Package delivery operating like a hub and spoke from the FC/DC. Linehaul moves within network are moved on diesel class 8 tractors who, when they have problems may not have access to the same facilities. There's a reason why changes in class 8 is from diesel to hydrogen, electric or CNG and not gas.

For the average person, a gas truck probably makes the most sense.
and TEAL has closed his own message.

great thread.
If you buy a diesel for the cool factor..... well that's not very smart.
Now if you buy a diesel for a specific reason, that makes sense.
For example my Ram diesel hauls my truck camper while towing my boat, or side x side or flat towing the Jeep. In the mountains. The exhaust brake alone is worth the price of admission.
Now the Jeep diesel was also chosen for a specific reason. The diesel option came with a lower final drive ratio and heavy duty axles. I put a lift kit on it with 35" tires, for flotation and ground clearance.
With the gas motor I would have had to re-gear front and rear, $2500. My fuel mileage would have dropped to low teens. And my axles would be marginal strength for the larger tires.
The diesel spins the big tires like nothing, fuel mileage is mid 20's mpg.
Off road the low rpm torque will move me over obstacles with ease. I am talking Moab & Rubicon style trails.
Why in the hell would I want a Diesel Toyota?????
Originally Posted by irfubar
If you buy a diesel for the cool factor..... well that's not very smart.
Now if you buy a diesel for a specific reason, that makes sense.
For example my Ram diesel hauls my truck camper while towing my boat, or side x side or flat towing the Jeep. In the mountains. The exhaust brake alone is worth the price of admission.
Now the Jeep diesel was also chosen for a specific reason. The diesel option came with a lower final drive ratio and heavy duty axles. I put a lift kit on it with 35" tires, for flotation and ground clearance.
With the gas motor I would have had to re-gear front and rear, $2500. My fuel mileage would have dropped to low teens. And my axles would be marginal strength for the larger tires.
The diesel spins the big tires like nothing, fuel mileage is mid 20's mpg.
Off road the low rpm torque will move me over obstacles with ease. I am talking Moab & Rubicon style trails.


If I could get an F250 diesel that sounded like the old 2 stroke Detroits - that would be cool enough to own one.


Lol


I get it and agree. Man, I remember when 35's were considered "big" and now you can get them on factory rigs.
Have you ever run a 2 stroke?


They sucked donkey balls.
"The best engine design ever, for turning fuel into noise!"


They do sound good.
With someone else driving,
from a distance,
And driving away.
That's why I said "sounded" and not "performed".
I like the sound of a deleted 6.7 Powerstroke, da cows like it even more.
Detroits worked just fine.
Perkins make a nice sound.


One of our flood pumps has an old Perkins with a straight pipe.
[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]
Originally Posted by SamOlson
Perkins make a nice sound.


One of our flood pumps has an old Perkins with a straight pipe.


Perkins do sound nice, had backhoes with them
Originally Posted by Jim_Conrad
Detroits worked just fine.




Spent too much time with a 318 to agree.
It ran. Got the job done, eventually. Pretty much sucked.
Would have been ok on flatland, we don't have that.
Dropping gears going uphill empty, sucks.
Admire their service, they kept America moving in all kind of stuff
for decades. Still do in old equipment.


60 Series?
If building a "fantasy" truck, it would have a 12.7L.
Perkins? If they made a tougher diesel, I have never heard of it. When I was working night mechanic at Weyerhaeuser in Orygun, one of the Hyster forklift gals came in at near the end of swing shift, complaining, Paul this thing smokes and stinks so bad, it smells like it's on fire. I raised the seat and looked at the Perkins, the heat resistant paint on the block was curling and smoking (600deg??). Take another forklift Sherry, this thing is fried. It was so hot I couldn't check it out, so I left a note on it and parked it outside. The note blew away, the day mechanic came in the next morning, gave it a quick look over, saw the lower radiator hose had burst, replaced it, checked the levels and sent it back to work. All the paint was gone off the head and down about 3 inches on the block. Not even a cracked head. First chance, I replaced the fried valve cover gasket, and that thing ran reliably for another couple years. I am a died in the wool Perkins fan now.
Originally Posted by irfubar
If you buy a diesel for the cool factor..... well that's not very smart.
Now if you buy a diesel for a specific reason, that makes sense.
For example my Ram diesel hauls my truck camper while towing my boat, or side x side or flat towing the Jeep. In the mountains. The exhaust brake alone is worth the price of admission.
Now the Jeep diesel was also chosen for a specific reason. The diesel option came with a lower final drive ratio and heavy duty axles. I put a lift kit on it with 35" tires, for flotation and ground clearance.
With the gas motor I would have had to re-gear front and rear, $2500. My fuel mileage would have dropped to low teens. And my axles would be marginal strength for the larger tires.
The diesel spins the big tires like nothing, fuel mileage is mid 20's mpg.
Off road the low rpm torque will move me over obstacles with ease. I am talking Moab & Rubicon style trails.


Just admit you’re gay brother Fubar and move on. smile
Originally Posted by hanco
Originally Posted by SamOlson
Perkins make a nice sound.


One of our flood pumps has an old Perkins with a straight pipe.


Perkins do sound nice, had backhoes with them


Always appreciated that sewing machine tick-tock but never owned one. We’re JD folks.
One can purchase Cummins crate engines for swaps. They have an dedicated side business just for supplying these engines.

Ok, everyone talks about engines and what is tough and what is rugged. I'll tell you from deep underground hardrock mining experiance the old Deutz air cooled diesels are about as tough as it gets. They used them for decades in the mining industry and for powering tractors and ag equipment in Europe. They are super tough and operate in temps that would melt down and cook my Cummins. Go to youtube and check out some of the Deutz engine swaps from Latin America.
Originally Posted by BillyGoatGruff
Originally Posted by irfubar
If you buy a diesel for the cool factor..... well that's not very smart.
Now if you buy a diesel for a specific reason, that makes sense.
For example my Ram diesel hauls my truck camper while towing my boat, or side x side or flat towing the Jeep. In the mountains. The exhaust brake alone is worth the price of admission.
Now the Jeep diesel was also chosen for a specific reason. The diesel option came with a lower final drive ratio and heavy duty axles. I put a lift kit on it with 35" tires, for flotation and ground clearance.
With the gas motor I would have had to re-gear front and rear, $2500. My fuel mileage would have dropped to low teens. And my axles would be marginal strength for the larger tires.
The diesel spins the big tires like nothing, fuel mileage is mid 20's mpg.
Off road the low rpm torque will move me over obstacles with ease. I am talking Moab & Rubicon style trails.


Just admit you’re gay brother Fubar and move on. smile



Damn..... first was a Subaru.... then a Jeep.... and Kingston keeps sending me naked guy pic's.... I must be gay.... damn the luck frown doesn't a guy usually know these things first? I am so confused, how does this work? what bathroom do I use? will the government send me money? do they have rehab for this schit? do I start drinking white claw? wtf
Originally Posted by Dillonbuck
Have you ever run a 2 stroke?


They sucked donkey balls.
"The best engine design ever, for turning fuel into noise!"


They do sound good.
With someone else driving,
from a distance,
And driving away.

I run a GM 871 TI with twin 892 turbos in my boat. It's loud but I'm deaf.
Originally Posted by Backroads
Anyone that is into Landcruisers has thought about it.
25mpg would give a cruiser a 600 mile range per fill up.


My FJ40 gets 9MPG no matter what it's doing.
Originally Posted by flintlocke
Perkins? If they made a tougher diesel, I have never heard of it. When I was working night mechanic at Weyerhaeuser in Orygun, one of the Hyster forklift gals came in at near the end of swing shift, complaining, Paul this thing smokes and stinks so bad, it smells like it's on fire. I raised the seat and looked at the Perkins, the heat resistant paint on the block was curling and smoking (600deg??). Take another forklift Sherry, this thing is fried. It was so hot I couldn't check it out, so I left a note on it and parked it outside. The note blew away, the day mechanic came in the next morning, gave it a quick look over, saw the lower radiator hose had burst, replaced it, checked the levels and sent it back to work. All the paint was gone off the head and down about 3 inches on the block. Not even a cracked head. First chance, I replaced the fried valve cover gasket, and that thing ran reliably for another couple years. I am a died in the wool Perkins fan now.


My little Case wheel loader has a Perkins in it. This is the second one of these machines I've had. My only complaint is that it weeps coolant in the winter.
Originally Posted by Dillonbuck
Have you ever run a 2 stroke?


They sucked donkey balls.
"The best engine design ever, for turning fuel into noise!"


They do sound good.
With someone else driving,
from a distance,
And driving away.


They certainly were a chore to drive. Sure seems the 13 speed road ranger was specifically designed for the 318s lack of torque.
Guess I am living the dream [Linked Image]
I drive a diesel F350 when delivering equipment for my bro and I like diesel for one reason and one reason only….when the Tesla or Toyota Pious is on my ass I can step on the throttle and smoke’em out. 😂. In fact tomorrow I’ll have a new Ford diesel truck for running tractors and equipment around which will be fun to compare against the older one.

For regular towing of more than 50% of the rated tow capacity a diesel is hard to beat. It might take decades to realize a cost benefit since the price of diesel is higher than gas and the vehicle value (ie cost) is higher than the comparable gas model but I prefer the diesel for heavy towing. The last truck I used for hauling was a manual 10 cylinder gas F450. That wasn’t a bad rig but I still much prefer the diesels. I’m a Chevy guy while my brother is a Ford guy. I tried to convince him to look for a Chevy for me but he got another Ford….blondes, brunettes or redheads…..Ford, Chevy, Dodge. I’m running a blond at work and a brunette at home…😁
Originally Posted by Castle_Rock
Guess I am living the dream [Linked Image]


Cool ridgeline
That's exactly what I was thinking.
Originally Posted by SamOlson
That's exactly what I was thinking.


I got you broseph.



4.7L Toyoda gasers still work for me.......oh yea...4.6L too.......

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]
Saw a diesel Hilux in Va a few weeks ago while eating lunch in town. It was a good looking midsize truck. Wish I knew how they got it here, even had Va places on it.
You guys don't import diesel Toyota trucks?

If not why not?

I had a Petrol V8 Lexus LX470 as a work vehicle in Tanzania, which was great as a lot of the gas stations doctored diesel with significantly cheaper paraffin, which did not do the diesel engines any good at all. No problem with petrol, and work paid the gas bill.

Here in Aus you would naturally have a diesel 4WD
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