Is it better to have no cop than a bad cop? Being in California, how is the average person supposed to exercise their right to defend themselves. What a mess.
Wonder how many law enforcement agencies at all levels have similar test results.
OAKLAND, Calif. (AP) — The Alameda County Sheriff's Office in Northern California has stripped 47 deputies — 10% of the force — of their guns and arrest powers because they failed psychological exams, it was reported Monday.
It was “horrible'' to have to relieve the deputies of their duties, sheriff's spokesman Lt. Ray Kelly told KTVU-TV.
The station obtained a copy of a letter notifying the deputies of their change of status last Friday. The deputies will still receive their pay and benefits.
The move came after the Sheriff's Office conducted an internal audit of deputies' psychological examinations from January 2016 to the present.
The letter from Sheriff Gregory Ahern notified a deputy — whose name was blacked out in the copy — that the deputy had been graded “D. Not Suited" in a psychological evaluation and under state law couldn't serve as a peace officer.
The letter said the Sheriff's Office had previously been operating under incorrect advice received several years ago from the California Commission on Peace Officer Standards and Training, which said it could hire candidates who received such a rating.
Ahern said the deputy can be hired if a second examination declares him or her “suitable" and the office intends to schedule an appointment for such an exam.
“Our intention is to resolve this issue as quickly as possible," Ahern wrote. “We also intend to have you return to full duty status once you obtain a ‘Suitable' finding."
Kelly said he hoped that the retests would occur in the next two months. The tests will be conducted by a psychologist who doesn't work for the sheriff, he said.
Kelly said the audit followed the arrest earlier this month of former Deputy Devin Williams Jr., 24. He is charged with shooting and killed a couple in their Dublin, Calif. home on Sept. 7.
His mother, Anitra Williams, told KTVU-TV that her son had been in a romantic relationship with Maria Tran and he believed she was unmarried.
The station said four sources said Williams had failed his psychological exam, although Kelly previously said Williams, who was hired in September 2021, had passed all psychological tests.
The Ella Baker Center for Human Rights, an Oakland nonprofit that deals with race and criminal justice issues, accused the Sheriff's Office of previously turning a “blind eye" to the problem of unsuited deputies.
“This further highlights the egregious levels of dysfunction and corruption that have plagued the sheriff’s office for years," the center's organizing director Jose Bernal, said in a statement.
Kelly said the department has been under “enormous pressure" to hire more deputies and it was hard to find people for the tough job.
“I know that people are going to assume that all these deputies are killers,” Kelly said. “But that’s not true. This test tries to find out if you are psychologically suitable for the job, to handle all the horrible things we see. At the age of 22, sometimes you’re not. I know this isn’t good. But it’s not as bad as it sounds.”
Gotta think failing a California "psychological exam" might not be a bad thing....
Gotta think failing a California "psychological exam" might not be a bad thing....
Kind of what I was thinking. The headline might should read
Cops fail to pass liberal test..
It would be interesting to know what the psych evaluation entailed. Some companies that market tests and assessments hard sell police departments and state agencies, who tend to look for quick and easy and cheap. Some are decent to good, and some are crap. There are standards, but they are not always followed.
I once received a report from a psych evaluation of an employee in which the psychiatrist said "He's just an azzhole". True story.
You gotta be nuts to want to be a cop, especially in Ca.
They are culling the right leaning officers.
I’m sure FL would be glad to hire those LEO’s who failed the CA “Woke test”. TX probably, too.
I’d be more suspicious of those who passed.
DF
You're probably some kind of a right wing extremist if you say men can't get pregnant.
You're probably some kind of a right wing extremist if you say men can't get pregnant.
For sure.
After all, what is a woman? Left can’t seem to answer a pretty basic question. “Birthing person”?
They’ve gone completely nuts.
DF
The tests are completely arbitrary, based on the individual Psych doctor who interprets the results. Just like the phony polygraph aka "lie detector" tests. Poly tests are about as reliable as a hamster reading your palm and telling you what your future will hold.
The tests are completely arbitrary, based on the individual Psych doctor who interprets the results. Just like the phony polygraph aka "lie detector" tests. Poly tests are about as reliable as a hamster reading your palm and telling you what your future will hold.
Bingo! One department up here would send people to the psych doctor this was the last step, pass this and you were hired. This Psych doctor failed up to 30 candidates a month. Majority of the time it wasn’t because of your psych it was because he didn’t like they way you looked, dressed, talked etc. The department finally found someone else/organization to do the psych evaluation. My psych test with the new organization out of Seattle was 10 minutes long Wizard asked some questions asked what my rank was in the Army when I told her the exam ended soon after. When I asked people how long their psych exam was and they say hour 2 hours I’m like oh boy most of the time they failed. I tell people don’t go off into the weeds. That’s what they are trying to do, hey you off in the weeds. Once they do that you are ph ucked.
Just liking guns and shooting will cause you to fail one of those exams.
They are culling the right leaning officers.
I wouldn’t doubt it.
The tests are completely arbitrary, based on the individual Psych doctor who interprets the results. Just like the phony polygraph aka "lie detector" tests. Poly tests are about as reliable as a hamster reading your palm and telling you what your future will hold.
All a polygraph does is record a physical reaction to what should be a "yes/no" question and compare that reaction against a control question and its reaction.
You don't really beat the machine, it doesn't say anything other than what your body did when you answered a question.
At least when I had mine - that's how the examiner explained it to me. You never beat the machine, it's a measurement device. You beat bad questions/examiners.
I do wonder how society would be were we to simply do away with all law enforcement and let the citizens handle things themselves...
They are culling the right leaning officers.
I wouldn’t doubt it.
Yeah, they failed the "Woke Test".
Dess: I passed a series of pysch tests and background checks many years ago so i could be haired as a police officer in a first class city. I retired 29 years later.
Knowing what I know now about the rabid lunacy that is kalifornicationkopia, I would be PROUD to have "failed" that schitholes "pysch tests"!
Fugg kalifornicationkopia and all the politicians and pyschos therein.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy
Question 1 - If you come upon a black man robbing a convenience store, you:
A). Give him a bag of chips
B). Arrest the white cashier because he’s racist
C). Let him go because he’s oppressed
D). All of the above
What kind of Psych test exactly? It's not that these deputies are brain stupid. What more do they need.
Only 10% of the force, they need to reevaluate there own testing platform.
Had to do a few Psych tests working in a nuke plant, the first one was really weird, kinda felt like I needed a shower after it was done.
I figured they were gonna send me on my way but never even heard anything from it.
the power is in the hands of the folks that get to define the terms.
Probably more suited for politics.
Bb
Just another way to dox the police.
Keep in mind fellas that Deputy Devin Williams is of African descent, a group I am told, that has poor impulse control. Just reporting the facts.
What? These guys believe in the Constitution?
I didn't read the story.
Are those officers going to be medically retired due to ptsd?
Here's a fact, most cops that have been actually working the street (not staff positions or hiding in specialties) would probably fail psychological evaluation because they have post traumatic stress. Their sleep sucks, they develop chemical dependency (alcohol related), etc, etc.
Why? Because unlike the military they aren't deployed for 6 or 8 months, they are deployed 40-60hrs a week 49 weeks a year, every year for 15-20yrs. Between the car chases, foot pursuits, dead bodies, murders, car crashes, etc that stuff adds up. But nobody is willing to acknowledge the effect the job has on people, because that would cost money.
How many dead bodies do you have to see melted into the carpet to phugg you up mentally? Or people hanging from a rope? Or kids ejected from a car and smushed by said car?
Nobody knows and nobody cares. All azzholes want to do is call them cowards when the reality is they don't have the stones to see that schiet
Are those officers going to be medically retired due to ptsd?
Here's a fact, most cops that have been actually working the street (not staff positions or hiding in specialties) would probably fail psychological evaluation because they have post traumatic stress. Their sleep sucks, they develop chemical dependency (alcohol related), etc, etc.
Why? Because unlike the military they aren't deployed for 6 or 8 months, they are deployed 40-60hrs a week 49 weeks a year, every year for 15-20yrs. Between the car chases, foot pursuits, dead bodies, murders, car crashes, etc that stuff adds up. But nobody is willing to acknowledge the effect the job has on people, because that would cost money.
How many dead bodies do you have to see melted into the carpet to phugg you up mentally? Or people hanging from a rope? Or kids ejected from a car and smushed by said car?
Nobody knows and nobody cares. All azzholes want to do is call them cowards when the reality is they don't have the stones to see that schiet
No one makes you be a Cop.I had 4 Uncles on The MPF .They all advised me to be a Cop.Otherwise I would have to get a real job.Their rules:A beat cop is never cold,hungry,broke or tired.
Same thing happened here. Then we realized there was a coincidence….if you were a veteran, you got a substandard rating. Hired a different psych doc, all was well again.
While making $40k/yr, $75k-100 if a northern Statie.
We treat Officers, Teachers, and those that give even more up defending our way of life as worth less than your average Admin Asst. Then wonder why things are so broken. Measure what you want and get the results you want.
Sadly, no one here wants to pay $2k/mos for taxes to truly compensate because all the skimming/corruption involved should go away to pay those salaries out of current taxes.
Like hitting that same pole with a bigger bat thinking you’ll get a better outcome.
Across industries/walks of life I’m privileged to see there’s a common thread sadly.
Are those officers going to be medically retired due to ptsd?
Here's a fact, most cops that have been actually working the street (not staff positions or hiding in specialties) would probably fail psychological evaluation because they have post traumatic stress. Their sleep sucks, they develop chemical dependency (alcohol related), etc, etc.
Why? Because unlike the military they aren't deployed for 6 or 8 months, they are deployed 40-60hrs a week 49 weeks a year, every year for 15-20yrs. Between the car chases, foot pursuits, dead bodies, murders, car crashes, etc that stuff adds up. But nobody is willing to acknowledge the effect the job has on people, because that would cost money.
How many dead bodies do you have to see melted into the carpet to phugg you up mentally? Or people hanging from a rope? Or kids ejected from a car and smushed by said car?
Nobody knows and nobody cares. All azzholes want to do is call them cowards when the reality is they don't have the stones to see that schiet
No one makes you be a Cop.I had 4 Uncles on The MPF .They all advised me to be a Cop.Otherwise I would have to get a real job.Their rules:A beat cop is never cold,hungry,broke or tired.
Yep, many relatives told me being the king of heap at place like Johns/Manville was life’s answer too. Sure, if your a lifer. Changed paradigms and amazing how many of their elite count me as a success story.
I don’t recall any encouraging me to leave. In fact, all told me how hard reality was outside their big brown Kraft paper walls.
Regret it 0 and the old timers treat my life like a fairytale. The one who got out and challenged it all.
Honestly, probably die on Slummies trailer deck trying to get by but nothing easy about the hard road. I refer to my last statement. We ascribe value to all the wrong things.
Same thing happened here. Then we realized there was a coincidence….if you were a veteran, you got a substandard rating. Hired a different psych doc, all was well again.
The Woke mind set is well represented among "shrinks". There are some genuine, good ones; ya just gotta find'em.
Not too unlike pediatricians, some known to ask if there are any "guns in the home". When presented with that question, doctor shop until you find one who doesn't ask stupid, woke questions.
Pediatrics may be one of the most woke, liberal specialties in medicine. Not all, just a bunch. Find the good ones, don't use those woke leaning ones. Let'em practice their stuff on others.
DF
Psychology is not a science.
Why 10% all at once. I doubt 10% suddenly "went crazy".
Having been a combat Vietnam veteran AND a Federal/state agent, I have noticed some peculiar changes.
First, LawEnf administrators hire psychs to be "yes men" like themselves.
IOW: Those who can , do. Those who can't -Teach. Those that can do neither: administrate poorly.
Trust no one and keep your vest on.
Only NY has forgotten that allowing recidivists out
on the streets results in dead citizens. Stop and frisk enforcement works: repeat offenders stop offending when shot.
Capital punishment works: On a case-by-case basis. Death or life w/o parole solves the recidivism problem. Especially for the woke mope arrested and convicted.
I wonder what tests they are using, MMPI, CPI? We are required to give our officers that test, but if they fail, its a judgment call (on me) to retain or not. Like McKay says, purely arbitrary and FAR from an exact science.
Psychology is not a science.
Those guys would take issue with that.
But, a lot of it is subjective, even though they've gone to great lengths to make testing and diagnostic criteria more objective, it's still has a lot to do with interpretation.
The DSM (Diagnostic and Statistical Manual) tries hard to set objective criteria for a diagnosis.
But, your point well taken, it's not Physics.
DF
They will have a 100% pass rate on the retest. Guaranteed.
I wonder what tests they are using, MMPI, CPI? We are required to give our officers that test, but if they fail, its a judgment call (on me) to retain or not. Like McKay says, purely arbitrary and FAR from an exact science.
MMPI (Minnesota Multiphasic Personality Inventory) is a very old one with years of upgrades. It’s considered one of the best. CIA and others use it. Still needs data interpreted by a shrink.
DF
Psychology is not a science.
Those guys would take issue with that.
But, a lot of it is subjective, even though they've gone to great lengths to make testing and diagnostic criteria more objective, it's still has a lot to do with interpretation.
The DSM (Diagnostic and Statistical Manual) tries hard to set objective criteria for a diagnosis.
But, your point well taken, it's not Physics.
DF
Lots of open ended questions that are open to interpretation which is probably the point.
My sons mom and I went through a bitter breakup. Allegations went back and fourth, I believe that’s the test that we both took.
I remember one question being something like “you’re waking past a tall building and someone drops a brick that nearly hits you, how would you respond?” No context to how they dropped it. Was it a careless accident, a bizarre accident out of the persons control, or intentional? Just “how would you respond” It was multiple choice only, so without context circling an answer was a pure guess as to how or why it happened and none were how I would have responded in real life.
It was all based on going up and confronting the person that dropped the brick. In the real world I would have looked up and probably said WTF?! The person that dropped it would have had an oh sh1t that was an accident look on their face, said that it was an accident and that would have been it. I’d go about my day to wherever I was walking to. That wasn’t a choice on the test.
I passed with a clean bill of mental health… probably an indictment on the test😂
It's California, they probably were fired for saying on the test there are only 2 genders and men can't get pregnant.
And they still get paid … what a deal.
Psychology is not a science.
Those guys would take issue with that.
But, a lot of it is subjective, even though they've gone to great lengths to make testing and diagnostic criteria more objective, it's still has a lot to do with interpretation.
The DSM (Diagnostic and Statistical Manual) tries hard to set objective criteria for a diagnosis.
But, your point well taken, it's not Physics.
DF
Lots of open ended questions that are open to interpretation which is probably the point.
My sons mom and I went through a bitter breakup. Allegations went back and fourth, I believe that’s the test that we both took.
I remember one question being something like “you’re waking past a tall building and someone drops a brick that nearly hits you, how would you respond?” No context to how they dropped it. Was it a careless accident, a bizarre accident out of the persons control, or intentional? Just “how would you respond” It was multiple choice only, so without context circling an answer was a pure guess as to how or why it happened and none were how I would have responded in real life.
It was all based on going up and confronting the person that dropped the brick. In the real world I would have looked up and probably said WTF?! The person that dropped it would have had an oh sh1t that was an accident look on their face, said that it was an accident and that would have been it. I’d go about my day to wherever I was walking to. That wasn’t a choice on the test.
I passed with a clean bill of mental health… probably an indictment on the test😂
Someone drops a brick barely missing your head.
Options should include, how high up and is it out of pistol range?
Doubt they offer those options.
DF
It's California, they probably were fired for saying on the test there are only 2 genders and men can't get pregnant.
One would need a course in the latest Woke talk to pass. But the MMPI has triggers for lying. So you’d about have to believe a lot of that Woke chit to pass.
DF
Cops don’t fired
They moved them to a another township
Reciprocal agreements with other jurisdictions to swap their dog killers for wife beaters and vice versa