Contemplating loading up some 200 grain bullets in a .308 Win.

Even at sedate MV velocity, still would have 2,000 ft/lbs at 200 yards (and 2,100fps). Plenty for hunting the timber. And a .308 200 grain has a tough to beat S.D. of .300+

Anyone have experienced observations on a heavy bullet in .308 Win?

Not a .308, but I developed a 250 grain round nose load for a .35 Remington for short range hog hunting with dogs. Knocked 'em down like bowling pins! The bullet was traveling just shy of 1200 FPS 10 feet from the muzzle. I'd suggest a 220 grain RN for your .308 thumper.

Not 200gr

But I load a few 180s for heavy timber. Most shots are within 100 yards

What would that gain that a stoutly constructed 180 wouldn’t already give you?

Nothing. Won’t kill any better than a 165gr either.

Or a 125 or 150.

Only extra "thump" I can see will be on the back end of the rifle.

Wait here a minute…….


A SupFool post without a news link??


Shut the front door……



But,

For a short range Brush gun.

35 wheeler.

180 TTSX.

I can’t see loading 200 grain bullets in a .308 Win. even 180 grain is pushing it IMO. I wouldn’t go heavier than a 168 gr Barnes TTSX.

I knew a guy who has a Winchester 88 in 308. He shot the Winchester factory loaded 200 grain stuff.. I didn’t know they made one.

Anyway he said his scoped failed on a Muley hunt and he had to use the open sites. He said the buck he shot was the farthest he had ever shot a deer, like 250-300 yards. DRT.

Which 200gr bullet are you considering Pard! 200gr "round nose" and .032" jackets can be ordered from Hawk Precision and Gold Country bullets I believe. The 200 Partition would be great as it has that soft front half. My self I have used enjoyed the older Woodleigh round nose softs in 35 Whelen, shot them in other calibers. I say "go for it", let us know what you learned from the experience? But have a ball!

A 180 gr Remington factory load gets 250FPS out of 20 inch tube. I have yet to recover one from a deer. To date, that load is a death ray from 10 yards out to 212 yards. I see no reason to change anything.

A 200 gr. would be real good for deer and even better for bear . My dad had a 300 Sav. ( that is now mine , thanks dad , RIP. ) He always seemed to like the 180 Gr round nose. A 200 would be just fine. I have some old Win. 180 gr. that I use for the old 300 Sav. They are fine on the bench , I'm sure they are fine in the brush. Say a guy say a guy comes across 500 200gr. 30 cal. , just use them.

mainer in alaska shared his experiences in a thread several several months ago. fyi

Heavy timber? trying to shoot through trees?

Yes 😀

215s in a .303 Brit will do it.

Old man took his on a scout trip to the desert. Set a pie tin on a mesquite. Straight through that one, tumbled, went through and split the next one going sideways.

I've heard some fools try that scheidt when hunting too.

308 is so laid back, cool, unstressed, i can't imagine anything
That would be beyond a 180 Interlock.


We shoot the old 100 count 165gr Ballistic Tips from mine.
A pile of deer have died from them, can't remember finding a bullet,
And they are considered quite soft.

When something really needs to be "thumped" for some reason, my Ruger #1 in .45-70 with 325 grain jacketed softpoints over a good charge of 3031 gets the job done. It's a "cripple and kill" gun, however- - - - -kills what's our front, and cripples the shooter. A friend who fired a few rounds from the bench calls it a "slobber-knocker"!

Krazy kids.

I have inexpensive 200 grain Hot Core for load development, and in this case, they may be fine for meat too.

Also have 200 grain Partitions and A-Frames, that I know work well for meat.

Also have 200 grain Accubonds, but have not shot meat with those.

Also have 200 grain Woodleighs (and 180's). Some for sale since you asked:

https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbt...eldcore-308-caliber-bullets#Post17708727

Ya, I have other .30 caliber rifles, just want to focus on heavies in the .308 win for now.

News to me too. I do know load information is scarce. And so is "on the job" performance information.

Gun goes bang, kills schit.

The rest is tinkering with schit that don't need tinkering. White people...

Last year, I started hunting deer in an area where bear are also in season. I loaded .308 Win with 180 gr ballistic tips of current manufacture. Did not see any bear, but the load worked fine on a couple of deer. Bear are "around" but not seen often.

Looks kind of obscene….

JPro,

Has a 200gr. 308win., I wrote it down but my stuff is packed up ready to move.
I haven't found the powder he used.

Me, I load 208 AMax, >copied the load off of MontanaMarine, maybe they'll see this.

Lower velocities, >softer bullets, 208 AMax @ 210yds. 100lb. hog, = golfball size hole in hogs neck, DRT.

I use the Speer 180gr flat base SP. Takes up a lot less case space and shoots in the 2550fps range with W748 or Varget. Very accurate in my Rem 700

I'm going to drop down to 178-180gr. .

Damn, look at the sectional density on that bish!

You may be limited by the rate of twist of your barrel and/or the length of the box magazine,if your rifle has one.

Picked up a 307 win in a m94 AE awhile back only loads I could find were some 180 gr FLAT nose power pts WW factory stuff. Should give real thump with the flat nose , guess I'll find out..mb

Yep, they loaded a 200gr Silvertip until sometime up in the '80s.

Vampire Killers

Long soft bullets.
Just think how wide they could get.

I have a few .308 Win guns, but the one I intend to work up this load for is a Bergara B-14 Hunter -22" barrel, 10" twist and 2.825 magazine. Staying with conventional bullets, Speer Hot Core for load development and substitute a Partition if all goes well and seems worthwhile.

So, should be fine.

I load 48.0gr RL-17 under a 208 AMax. 2580 fps from 20.5" barrel. I'm loading to 3.08" OAL.

The 200gr Speer is fairly short for a 200gr, given the flat base. If you have some RL-17, you might try working up to 48.0gr or so. Be safe, start lower and work up looking for signs of excess pressure.

Wow, thanks MontanaMarine. Just the kind of information I was hoping to get.

Thank you.

He still hasn't discovered the rifles sub-forum.

>.308. Nosler. 180 Protected Point. PARTITION.

Case....closed!

Here's the best way to make a "thumper" from a .308- - - - - - - -

https://www.ballisticstudies.com/Knowledgebase/.358+Winchester.html

Shot several with a different label years ago. Longest shot I know of was a bit past 1,000 yards, maybe 1,100. It was belt fed. Sufficiently effective that it bored me to tears.

Nothing in a .308 will kill better than a 165 (or thereabouts).

I have tried Mt. Marines loads in my 20" 308 and they are damn awesome... I have a stash of 200gr partitions that I am going to try next with his data.
Seems like a useful load for the 308, a medium range hammer

How about in thick woods on bull elk? in grizzly country? hmmm seems the 200gr 308 would be a useful load to me...

Yes I shoot the 200 grain Speer hot core over Varget in my .308 lever gun with Iron sites as a bush gun and bear stand gun. It's reliably accurate, surprisingly mild on recoil and very effective. It's tough to find load data for 200 grain bullets in the .308, so I went with Varget as I have it, and Hodgdon had data for it. Turns out it shoots pretty accurate with the first load I tried so I never fooled with it again.

Just get a 30-30

Sure you did, retard.

MainerinAK has some great posts on this topic. Hopefully he chimes in

After he put a mercruiser V8 engine in a Ford 8N

I loaded up 180 Speer mag tips years ago for my bosses Remington 600, on his first moose hunt, he was so surprised when a moose showed up and one shot and down it went.
He sure liked my reloads and that rifle and caliber after that.

And watched his students use it to win Daytona.

You probably weren't flinging 200 gr pills though..

I would just use a 150 or 165 but not shoot as far.

Whoever I’ve used 180’s it wrecks a lot of meat.

Probably four years in a row. That crew is THAT DAMN GOOD

200 grain Nosler Accubonds have a .588 BC!

300 Savage is shorter.....





























That's what she said.

Hmmm... with a turret scope it may be more than a short range thumper... back to Mt. Marines 208 Amax loads...

The last time I tried 200-grain bullets in the .308 was quite a while ago. Per usual, I looked up all the recently pressure-tested data and Winchester 760 (H414) was listed as getting the highest velocities. The rifle was a Winchester Model 88, and the bullet the Norma Oryx, and it got 2458 fps with 3-shot groups a little over an inch, and NO problems with the lever-action.

These days would probably try Ramshot Big Game or CFE223. Both are far more temp-resistant than 760/414, and would probably get at least 2500 fps in a 22" barrel. With the 200 Partition this would certainly open up at "timber" ranges, and penetrate very deeply. I know this due to using that bullet at around 2550 for timber elk hunting in a 1903 Springfield back in the late 1970s--and never recovered one, even on angling shots. But as somebody already mentioned, the softer front core of the Partition it would open up reliably to at least 300 yards--where with a 200-yard zero it would be about 8 inches low.

I’ve loaded Re17 to 48 grains in Winchester cases. It works well with a 200 gr partition and a 200 grain Speer on elk. Velocity is just over 2500 from an 18”.
Have been using military cases and LeverEvolution with both bullets. Velocity is 2435 and excellent accuracy. I cannot tell the difference in wound channels at the two velocities or which bullet made the hole. Cow elk, black bears and mule deer don’t like them much I think.
Read Mainers thread on the alaska hunting forum and that gave me the encouragement to try. Thank you again Mainer

I just found a local stash of 220gr Round nose .30 cal Partitions (iirc) and thought about getting a box for my 30-06 but then sanity and logic took over and I bought 10 more boxes of 250gr .35 Whelen. 😁. I did buy a partial box (12rds + 8 brass)of Federal Premium 30-06 165gr TSX for $8. 👍

With modern metallurgy and bullet construction the need to go up substantially in bullet weight is a thing of the past. Using heavy for caliber bullets with the hope of the bullet penetrating deep and retaining as much weight as possible is not even a worry with most monos. It’s not unusual to recover a TSX that weighs slightly MORE than the original from picking up skin, hair and tissue on its journey.

If retained weight is important then it’s hard to go wrong with the TSX or TTSX…or most monos. A 180gr TSX shot stem to stern through a bull elk was recovered just under the hide and weighed 180.1gr….I couldn’t expect better weight retention or bullet performance…or even accuracy then what I’ve been getting from the Barnes monos. I choose a TSX or TTSX in the weight I desire for a particular chambering and proceed to hunt everything with total confidence in my bullet. It’s not as exciting or as expensive as having multiple boxes of various weights, makers, construction and composition to fret over….😁

Anyone try the heavies in a 16 inch barrel? (GSR)

Sometimes a guy just wants to channel Elmer...and the heavies help us do that.

Tough to beat a 200 grain partition in a 30-06 for deep timber elk. A 308 should be more of the same. Don't discount the 200g accubond either. I once shot one lengthwise through an elk.

Bb

Why not......

Look at what is loaded in the 300 AAC Blackout!

"Can't please everybody, so it's best to please yo'self".


ya!

GWB

GRT estimate, 240gr Woodleigh, 38.9gr Varget, 2257fps, 60000psi, 22" barrel.
GRT estimate, 200gr Barnes TSX, 39.4gr Varget, 2453fps, 60000psi, 22" barrel.

The 150 GameKings kill cshit out of deer and pigs. They are pleasant to shoot. It doesn’t take much to kill a pig. A 223 with a Bear claw lays them low right quick.

Yep, CZ527,in 30 and 338, and 375 Grendel.
Heavies work, fast or slow

A couple of decades before some of you were born, the hot hunting round was the .30-40 Krag. It came almost exclusively with a 220-gr roundnose that witty gun writers called "Blue Whistlers" because of the huge expanse of exposed lead at the nose. It launched at 2400 fps with a sedate "BLAM" as opposed to today's "KABOOM" and it let all the air out of any game it hit, big or small. Hunters carried them, not long-range "snipers" and shots were mostly inside 200 yards. If it was farther, they just held their brass front sight a tad higher.

Yep. Just checked my old notes. Worked up RL17 and a 200gr Gameking with W-W brass in a 20” factory 700. 50gr was a touch over 2600. Good killer. Might not be safe in a tight chamber or tighter bore, so work up for sure!

180yds.

Hey Flave/Clark,

How come that deer is bleeding out of its azz?


I know, I know,

" What happens at deer camp, stays at deer camp."....

From the campfire, lanche's wife didn't seem to have any trouble with a plain-jane 180. If I wanted more than the 165's I use here in Montana, I'd just load up a 180 partition. I really can't see the logic using a 200 gr in the 308 - but you only have yourself to please.

When I want 200 to 250 gr bullets in a short action cartridge my 350 RemMag comes out to play.

Great example there, 'Flave.

I had the pleasure of working with a rifle just like that one for a while. Was working up loads for a friend with his rifle, dies, and components. There are very few "slickerier" actions than a Krag, but loads have to be kept mild due to the single locking lug. If memory serves, I found a nice 150-gr load for him as well as two cast bullet recipes. One of the latter was the amazing 13.0 RedDot "universal" load that put 170-gr bullets designed for the .30-30 into tidy little groups at 1200 fps muzzle zip.

That 13.0 RedDot load works in any .30-cal case of Krag or larger capacity (including the .308) with any gas-checked 150 or 170 cast bullet. Delivers almost the same velocity regardless of case size. I didn't invent it, but I wish I had.

I loaded 220 RN at 2375 fps, using 46 grains of 4350. Killed deer and elk with it. All shots were in timber and under 75 yds. Barrel was a 12 twist and accuracy was good. GD

I'm in the camp that the best way to turn a 308 in a "short range thumper" is to neck it to 358 and load it with 250 grain bullets. It makes nice deep holes in animals and not bad to shoot.

2400 fps is the .30-06.

Something always appealed to me about the big, 220 grain, round nose, soft point, bullets in a .30-06 with open sights for short range work, like on boar. Something just says "thumper" about it. I guess this would be along the same lines in a .308 using 200 grain, round nose, soft points.

Might also mention that have seen the .308 work great on a 500-pound cow elk at 250 yards with the 130-grain Barnes TTSX handloaded to 2850 fps--including busting heavy shoulder bone and the penetrating the chest cavity on a frontal angling shot. The elk died promptly--but obviously a 200-grain bullet would HAVE to be "prompter."

This is simply a great picture.

Hodgdon Reloading Data Center - Rifle

I want one of those Ruger light 308's.

I found some Christmas money from a couple years ago that Grandma said I could cash.

Maybe!

Flave,

Nice pic with that old rifle. Do you know if that buck was a hybrid? Looks like it could be.

My dad and other mentors all used 220s in their 06s. Killed one bear with a 130ttsx, thank you John Barnsness. Healed up enough to go back to the 200s in my 308. I feel better running around with 200 and 220 grain bullets in my thirty caliber rifles. I hunt northwest Wyoming and Montana. The Grizzly population here is out of control and they are along the Shoshone river bottom past Powell if anybody wants to hear and see the truth. Even the irrigation materials are full of them.

And that Federal judge in Missoula that stopped the grizzly hunt should be ashamed. Or an angry grizzly pushed into his courtroom and the doors screwed shut.
The wolves and grizzlys are weaponized by the lovely Fed’s. Pretty sad deal for us that live here

I bought one Ruger ultra light in 308 when they first came out and two of the international full wood stocks, one in 308 and one in 243, nice light rifles. and they work well.

Not with .308win, but the utility & economy of heavy-for-caliber conventional cup & core round/soft nose rifle bullets still exists today as it did back a century ago. My experience is more with .375H&H than .308Win, but if I want maximum short/mid-range bang-floppage, I forego the high-tech bullets and opt for a round nose soft point.

I've used 180s in 308s for years. No troubles at all for deer but I'm sure it would work well for moose too.

The current 308 gets the RN version. Accurate load.

My current (last 5 years at least) short range deer load for the .308 is a 170gr Partition RN at 2,450 mv.

Effective on lung shots due to rapid expansion/energy transfer and as you might suspect, can reach the vitals from any angle or even after center-punching a 2" sapling.

Works so well I have 450 of the buggers on the shelf.

Well, I guess you just don't know. Normally when hunting for deer, I run a 165 gr. Speer Hot Core from the 18.5" barrel of my Ruger M77 RSI. Velocity is 2550 FPS on average. I should give it a try on elk one of these days. Velocity from a 22" Barreled M70 is 2610 FPS.

However, curiosity got the best of me one day and I did a load work up using the 220 gr. Sierra round nose bullet. Average velocity from the 22" 1 in 12" twist M70 was 2320 FPS and accuracy ran from .375" to .50". If'n you check it, advertised velocity with a 220 gr. bullet for the 30-06 is only 2400.

Load data for the bullet came from an early one book, one load manual for the .308. Later issues no longer have that data. None for the 220 gr. bullet. I carefully worked up to the book max load using W760. It only had data for W748 and W760.

For W760:
Start: 42.0 gr./2177 FPS/42,000 C.U.P. Max: 44.0 gr./2295/ 46,900 C.U.P.

For W748:
Start: 36.0 gr./2111 FPS/45,000 C.U.P. Max: 38.0 gr./2232 FPS/ 49,900 C.U.P.

My load was slightly faster than the book velocity, most likely because it was a bit over 100 degrees the day I shot the sequence. I think it might be a useful loading in big bear areas. Velocity from the shorter barrel RSI was 2240 FPS IIRC.

PJ

Probably not, but riddle me this: 4,000 rounds/minute for a 3 second burst = how much lead? I dunno, but it was good enough to prevail over 12.7mm AA guns. Twice. Once over 1,000 yds and another at about 30 yards. The country around Hamburger Hill was a barrel of fun!

About 200 rounds, and just over 4 1/4 lbs. if using 150 gr projos.