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The US uses the metric system more than a lot of folks realize. Sparkplug threads have been metric since before 1900.
Originally Posted by wabigoon
The US uses the metric system more than a lot of folks realize. Sparkplug threads have been metric since before 1900.

True but the wrench that is needed to turn them is 5/8th's or 13/16's. Metric sucks, an incomplete system that is poorly balanced.
Originally Posted by wabigoon
The US uses the metric system more than a lot of folks realize. Sparkplug threads have been metric since before 1900.
You do a lot of mechanic work, eh?
Who came up with this stupid metric tire-spec system? Because 265/75R16 is awful compared to 32x10.50/16. Next we need pants sizes that also require a calculator to understand.
They tried to force the metric system on us in the early 1970's, it went nowhere.
It won't be long until there is an army of Metric lovers that will rain excrement on this thread. I can do Metric but it's not my favorite way to measure or machine. Metric threads are a PITA to cut on any lathe with an imperial leadscrew. I can and do cut them but have no love for it. Taps and dies are difficult to impossible to find unless you're in a metropolitan area. Everything boils down to decimals anyway. Metric may appear to be simpler but look at a thread chart and you'll go nuts trying to find the right tap drill. I have in my possession a metric tap that in no way taps the M4x.7 that it says it will. Our stuff that comes from China and other metric nations might say an imperial number but it's a metric equivalent. Some closer than others. An m10x1.5 nut from one country may or may not fit the m10x1.5 bolt you may have from another country. The Metric system makes sense in some things like Engineering, Medicine and Astronomy where you are working with very large or very small numbers.
If they'd gone to it before we were born, we'd like it. A friend that ran a motor grader talked about an engineer's foot. 12 inches divided by ten for easy figuring.
It's been a dual system my entire life so 🤷🏻‍♂️ it is what it is. Own both metric and sae tools. Metric won't go away.
Originally Posted by MPat70
It's been a dual system my entire life so 🤷🏻‍♂️ it is what it is. Own both metric and sae tools. Metric won't go away.
The good ole days were when all you needed were SAE and I didn't have to deal so often with two sets of sockets and wrenches. Tool boxes definitely grew in size when that happend. Only thing I hold against Nixon. Add to that all the metric sockets fit on ratchets and extensions that are SAE.
SAE designed and engineered equipment defeated the metrics in 2 world wars and the losers are still trying to make us go backwards…
Two kinds of nations in the world: those on the metric system, and those who have walked on the moon.




P
What do Myanmar, Liberia, and the United States have in common? They are the only countries in the whole world that are not on the metric system. There is a reason practically all the world is metric. It's not because the metric system is less useful than SAE.
I'd much rather say I have a 36 waist than to say I had a 914.4 waist........
God help me, I still have Whitworth tools.

My misspent youth fooling with motorcycles.
I don’t recall using yards, tea spoons, baker’s dozen and hogsheads in chemistry, physics and quant
If the rest of the world came down with AIDS I'm pretty sure there would be those that say we must have it too. Germany and England were British Standard Whitworth for many years. Now they're metric except Britton is slowly going back to imperial.
the French started the metric system. That's all we need to know
I was an apprentice tool and die maker in the early 70's when the metrification push was on. I think a big part of the reason it failed was because industry, instead of teaching the metric system, focused on teaching conversion from imperial to metric and vice versa. People just didn't understand that, if you're using metric tools, instruments and machines all that conversion wasn't necessary. I never had any problem with it. Subsequently, when I worked for the American branch of a Canadian company we had to go over our prints and write in the imperial equivalents to work to, no big deal. Metric is incredibly more logical.
The Imperial System is ten times easier to understand than the metric system.
But the places with metric often have Celsius too. Which is less precise than fahrenheit.

So tell us how it's about precision and accuracy lol

Could be like 3 or four degrees colder or hotter, same temp in C
Metrick...It was originally pushed by an English clergyman...which given his day job raises some red flags...(Kenneth Copeland is worth north of 760 million now). Now if it had been invented by a machinist, or a mechanic or a surveyor or a navigator...I'd pay more attention to metrick. Hand me that 9/16, please.
Napoleon had the metric system developed because every country he conquered had a different measuring system. From there it spread all over the world. French, Spanish, Italian, and German colonies used it. Metric is all based on 10's.

You start with a millimeter; 10 millimeters is a centimeter. 100 centimeters or 1,000 millimeters is a meter (a little longer than a yard), 1,000 meters is a kilometer (about a half mile).

1 cubic centimeter is a gram of water. 1,000 grams is a kilogram dry weight (2.2 lbs) or 1 liter of water. 1,000 liters of water is a metric ton (about 2,200 lbs).

Anything less than 1 liter of liquid weight is a milliliter or say 1 cup is about 300 milliters (ml)

Not hard to remember. Each wrench metric is based on millimeters. So the higher mm the larger the wrench.

In metric heat and cold, 0 degrees is freezing or 32 F. 100 degrees is boiling or 212 degrees F. There is also the Rankin temperature scale, and the Kelvin scale used in physics and space. 0 in Kelvin is absolute zero where everything freezes and nothing can get colder. This is like deep space far away from the sun or any star.

Fahrenheit was developed first by a Dutch scientist in the 1600's. Most countries have switched to Centigrade metric scale because water is identifiable easier. Kelvin will eventually win out if our species becomes seriously space bearing, like Startrek or Starwars, due to space being so cold between stars.

Eventually we will have to go metric if we continue to trade with other countries.
Originally Posted by slumlord
I don’t recall using yards, tea spoons, baker’s dozen and hogsheads in chemistry, physics and quant


Ha Ha!

Chem teach posts this on the board.

Please draw the formula and name the resulting compound from 1/2 bushell of ................. , 2 grain scoops of ................ and 3 mason jars of anhydrous...............
Originally Posted by denton
What do Myanmar, Liberia, and the United States have in common? They are the only countries in the whole world that are not on the metric system. There is a reason practically all the world is metric. It's not because the metric system is less useful than SAE.

Actually if you had a clue you could see that the Metric system does not have any advantage over SAE, none and there are areas where SAE kicks Metrics azz.
Originally Posted by shrapnel
SAE designed and engineered equipment defeated the metrics in 2 world wars and the losers are still trying to make us go backwards…

Excellent post!
Originally Posted by Dixie_Dude
Napoleon had the metric system developed because every country he conquered had a different measuring system. From there it spread all over the world. French, Spanish, Italian, and German colonies used it. Metric is all based on 10's.

You start with a millimeter; 10 millimeters is a centimeter. 100 centimeters or 1,000 millimeters is a meter (a little longer than a yard), 1,000 meters is a kilometer (about a half mile).

1 cubic centimeter is a gram of water. 1,000 grams is a kilogram dry weight (2.2 lbs) or 1 liter of water. 1,000 liters of water is a metric ton (about 2,200 lbs).

Anything less than 1 liter of liquid weight is a milliliter or say 1 cup is about 300 milliters (ml)

Not hard to remember. Each wrench metric is based on millimeters. So the higher mm the larger the wrench.

In metric heat and cold, 0 degrees is freezing or 32 F. 100 degrees is boiling or 212 degrees F. There is also the Rankin temperature scale, and the Kelvin scale used in physics and space. 0 in Kelvin is absolute zero where everything freezes and nothing can get colder. This is like deep space far away from the sun or any star.

Fahrenheit was developed first by a Dutch scientist in the 1600's. Most countries have switched to Centigrade metric scale because water is identifiable easier. Kelvin will eventually win out if our species becomes seriously space bearing, like Startrek or Starwars, due to space being so cold between stars.

Eventually we will have to go metric if we continue to trade with other countries.


You had me until you made Star Trek and Star Wars one word each.

Zero credibility.




P
Originally Posted by mjbgalt
But the places with metric often have Celsius too. Which is less precise than fahrenheit.

So tell us how it's about precision and accuracy lol

Could be like 3 or four degrees colder or hotter, same temp in C

Another excellent post!
Originally Posted by Dixie_Dude
Napoleon had the metric system developed because every country he conquered had a different measuring system. From there it spread all over the world. French, Spanish, Italian, and German colonies used it. Metric is all based on 10's.

You start with a millimeter; 10 millimeters is a centimeter. 100 centimeters or 1,000 millimeters is a meter (a little longer than a yard), 1,000 meters is a kilometer (about a half mile).

1 cubic centimeter is a gram of water. 1,000 grams is a kilogram dry weight (2.2 lbs) or 1 liter of water. 1,000 liters of water is a metric ton (about 2,200 lbs).

Anything less than 1 liter of liquid weight is a milliliter or say 1 cup is about 300 milliters (ml)

Not hard to remember. Each wrench metric is based on millimeters. So the higher mm the larger the wrench.

In metric heat and cold, 0 degrees is freezing or 32 F. 100 degrees is boiling or 212 degrees F. There is also the Rankin temperature scale, and the Kelvin scale used in physics and space. 0 in Kelvin is absolute zero where everything freezes and nothing can get colder. This is like deep space far away from the sun or any star.

Fahrenheit was developed first by a Dutch scientist in the 1600's. Most countries have switched to Centigrade metric scale because water is identifiable easier. Kelvin will eventually win out if our species becomes seriously space bearing, like Startrek or Starwars, due to space being so cold between stars.

Eventually we will have to go metric if we continue to trade with other countries.

Bullschit, get them to go SAE, much better system.
Originally Posted by blindshooter
God help me, I still have Whitworth tools.

My misspent youth fooling with motorcycles.

Hah me too, got a complete set of wrenches but no sockets when I bought my first Triumph, a 66 Bonneville.
Originally Posted by mjbgalt
But the places with metric often have Celsius too. Which is less precise than fahrenheit.

So tell us how it's about precision and accuracy lol

Could be like 3 or four degrees colder or hotter, same temp in C
Is there an issue with measuring Celsius to the 0.001 degree C?

Please explain the rationale of having water freeze at 32 degrees vs 0 degrees.
Originally Posted by Valsdad
Originally Posted by mjbgalt
But the places with metric often have Celsius too. Which is less precise than fahrenheit.

So tell us how it's about precision and accuracy lol

Could be like 3 or four degrees colder or hotter, same temp in C
Is there an issue with measuring Celsius to the 0.001 degree C?

Please explain the rationale of having water freeze at 32 degrees vs 0 degrees.

Why is that significant?
Originally Posted by rickt300
Originally Posted by Dixie_Dude
Napoleon had the metric system developed because every country he conquered had a different measuring system. From there it spread all over the world. French, Spanish, Italian, and German colonies used it. Metric is all based on 10's.

You start with a millimeter; 10 millimeters is a centimeter. 100 centimeters or 1,000 millimeters is a meter (a little longer than a yard), 1,000 meters is a kilometer (about a half mile).

1 cubic centimeter is a gram of water. 1,000 grams is a kilogram dry weight (2.2 lbs) or 1 liter of water. 1,000 liters of water is a metric ton (about 2,200 lbs).

Anything less than 1 liter of liquid weight is a milliliter or say 1 cup is about 300 milliters (ml)

Not hard to remember. Each wrench metric is based on millimeters. So the higher mm the larger the wrench.

In metric heat and cold, 0 degrees is freezing or 32 F. 100 degrees is boiling or 212 degrees F. There is also the Rankin temperature scale, and the Kelvin scale used in physics and space. 0 in Kelvin is absolute zero where everything freezes and nothing can get colder. This is like deep space far away from the sun or any star.

Fahrenheit was developed first by a Dutch scientist in the 1600's. Most countries have switched to Centigrade metric scale because water is identifiable easier. Kelvin will eventually win out if our species becomes seriously space bearing, like Startrek or Starwars, due to space being so cold between stars.

Eventually we will have to go metric if we continue to trade with other countries.

Bullschit, get them to go SAE, much better system.

Yes, because 16ths, 32nds, and 64ths are so much easier to deal with than everything being in 10ths?
You can tell who's never worked on equipment made outside of the USA... 😁😅😅🤣🤣🤣
Originally Posted by Tide_Change
The Imperial System is ten times easier to understand than the metric system.
Agreed. And SAE also has a simple method for fractions.
Originally Posted by rickt300
Originally Posted by Valsdad
Originally Posted by mjbgalt
But the places with metric often have Celsius too. Which is less precise than fahrenheit.

So tell us how it's about precision and accuracy lol

Could be like 3 or four degrees colder or hotter, same temp in C
Is there an issue with measuring Celsius to the 0.001 degree C?

Please explain the rationale of having water freeze at 32 degrees vs 0 degrees.

Why is that significant?


Because mjbgalt says Celsius is less precise than Fahrenheit.

I'd like to hear how, and why.
Originally Posted by Valsdad
Please explain the rationale of having water freeze at 32 degrees vs 0 degrees.


Well duh, zero degrees is a lot colder than 32 degrees.

Everyone knows that.




P
Originally Posted by rickt300
Originally Posted by Tide_Change
The Imperial System is ten times easier to understand than the metric system.
Agreed. And SAE also has a simple method for fractions.
Quote
Fine what does 1/3rd of a meter measure?

333.333333333 +/- mm
Originally Posted by Pharmseller
Originally Posted by Valsdad
Please explain the rationale of having water freeze at 32 degrees vs 0 degrees.


Well duh, zero degrees is a lot colder than 32 degrees.

Everyone knows that.




P


Laughin' here.
Originally Posted by Valsdad
Originally Posted by rickt300
Originally Posted by Valsdad
Originally Posted by mjbgalt
But the places with metric often have Celsius too. Which is less precise than fahrenheit.

So tell us how it's about precision and accuracy lol

Could be like 3 or four degrees colder or hotter, same temp in C
Is there an issue with measuring Celsius to the 0.001 degree C?

Please explain the rationale of having water freeze at 32 degrees vs 0 degrees.

Why is that significant?


Because mjbgalt says Celsius is less precise than Fahrenheit.

I'd like to hear how, and why.

Just told you. One degree of C could be several degrees of F...it is less precise.
Originally Posted by Valsdad
Originally Posted by rickt300
Originally Posted by Valsdad
Originally Posted by mjbgalt
But the places with metric often have Celsius too. Which is less precise than fahrenheit.

So tell us how it's about precision and accuracy lol

Could be like 3 or four degrees colder or hotter, same temp in C
Is there an issue with measuring Celsius to the 0.001 degree C?

Please explain the rationale of having water freeze at 32 degrees vs 0 degrees.

Why is that significant?


Because mjbgalt says Celsius is less precise than Fahrenheit.

I'd like to hear how, and why.

Apparently one Celsius is around 3 times bigger than one degree.

Example

Convert 20 degrees Celsius to degrees Fahrenheit:

T(°F) = 20°C × 9/5 + 32 = 68 °F
Originally Posted by Pharmseller
Originally Posted by Valsdad
Please explain the rationale of having water freeze at 32 degrees vs 0 degrees.


Well duh, zero degrees is a lot colder than 32 degrees.

Everyone knows that.




P


Freezing of water is an arbitrary thing to pick, to ask for a representative number to use to focus a whole system on


Why not burning of paper or the freezing of alcohol or boiling of motor oil lol
Originally Posted by Dixie_Dude
Napoleon had the metric system developed because every country he conquered had a different measuring system. From there it spread all over the world. French, Spanish, Italian, and German colonies used it. Metric is all based on 10's.

You start with a millimeter; 10 millimeters is a centimeter. 100 centimeters or 1,000 millimeters is a meter (a little longer than a yard), 1,000 meters is a kilometer (about a half mile).

1 cubic centimeter is a gram of water. 1,000 grams is a kilogram dry weight (2.2 lbs) or 1 liter of water. 1,000 liters of water is a metric ton (about 2,200 lbs).

Anything less than 1 liter of liquid weight is a milliliter or say 1 cup is about 300 milliters (ml)

Not hard to remember. Each wrench metric is based on millimeters. So the higher mm the larger the wrench.

In metric heat and cold, 0 degrees is freezing or 32 F. 100 degrees is boiling or 212 degrees F. There is also the Rankin temperature scale, and the Kelvin scale used in physics and space. 0 in Kelvin is absolute zero where everything freezes and nothing can get colder. This is like deep space far away from the sun or any star.

Fahrenheit was developed first by a Dutch scientist in the 1600's. Most countries have switched to Centigrade metric scale because water is identifiable easier. Kelvin will eventually win out if our species becomes seriously space bearing, like Startrek or Starwars, due to space being so cold between stars.

Eventually we will have to go metric if we continue to trade with other countries.





Kelvin will eventually win out if our species becomes seriously space bearing, like Startrek






Yeah!
Because of all the countries that use the Metric System and have put men on the moon!
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

Let's list them?
Originally Posted by rickt300
Originally Posted by Valsdad
Originally Posted by rickt300
Originally Posted by Valsdad
Originally Posted by mjbgalt
But the places with metric often have Celsius too. Which is less precise than fahrenheit.

So tell us how it's about precision and accuracy lol

Could be like 3 or four degrees colder or hotter, same temp in C
Is there an issue with measuring Celsius to the 0.001 degree C?

Please explain the rationale of having water freeze at 32 degrees vs 0 degrees.

Why is that significant?


Because mjbgalt says Celsius is less precise than Fahrenheit.

I'd like to hear how, and why.

Apparently one Celsius is around 3 times bigger than one degree.

Example

Convert 20 degrees Celsius to degrees Fahrenheit:

T(°F) = 20°C × 9/5 + 32 = 68 °F


Right. C is imprecise because it has fewer units of measure than F.

And the metric weirdos claim to prefer better precision, while embracing C.

That was the point, btw.
I can't believe some of the irrational bullshit I'm reading here.
Lol I'm sure you mean my poor attempt at expressing my point using correct terminology.
Originally Posted by rickt300
Originally Posted by Tide_Change
The Imperial System is ten times easier to understand than the metric system.
Agreed. And SAE also has a simple method for fractions.


This exchange wins the irony contest...
Originally Posted by Valsdad
Originally Posted by rickt300
Originally Posted by Dixie_Dude
Napoleon had the metric system developed because every country he conquered had a different measuring system. From there it spread all over the world. French, Spanish, Italian, and German colonies used it. Metric is all based on 10's.

You start with a millimeter; 10 millimeters is a centimeter. 100 centimeters or 1,000 millimeters is a meter (a little longer than a yard), 1,000 meters is a kilometer (about a half mile).

1 cubic centimeter is a gram of water. 1,000 grams is a kilogram dry weight (2.2 lbs) or 1 liter of water. 1,000 liters of water is a metric ton (about 2,200 lbs).

Anything less than 1 liter of liquid weight is a milliliter or say 1 cup is about 300 milliters (ml)

Not hard to remember. Each wrench metric is based on millimeters. So the higher mm the larger the wrench.

In metric heat and cold, 0 degrees is freezing or 32 F. 100 degrees is boiling or 212 degrees F. There is also the Rankin temperature scale, and the Kelvin scale used in physics and space. 0 in Kelvin is absolute zero where everything freezes and nothing can get colder. This is like deep space far away from the sun or any star.

Fahrenheit was developed first by a Dutch scientist in the 1600's. Most countries have switched to Centigrade metric scale because water is identifiable easier. Kelvin will eventually win out if our species becomes seriously space bearing, like Startrek or Starwars, due to space being so cold between stars.

Eventually we will have to go metric if we continue to trade with other countries.

Bullschit, get them to go SAE, much better system.

Yes, because 16ths, 32nds, and 64ths are so much easier to deal with than everything being in 10ths?

You bet, not to mention the metric system breaks everything down into millimeters which are a bit smaller than needed for many projects. A 1/2' socket does anything a 12MM or 13MM socket can do. A SAE socket set has fewer sockets in it because the system is more efficient. You do not need sockets or wrenches spaced 1 millimeter apart. 1/16 is much better. You end up with more sockets or wrenches than needed with metric.

1/16 inch = 1.5875 mm
Originally Posted by mathman
I can't believe some of the irrational bullshit I'm reading here.
You shouldn't be...
There are lot's of counties that use the metric system and there is one county that has it's own collection of moon rocks.

Just sayin.
Originally Posted by mathman
I can't believe some of the irrational bullshit I'm reading here.

An interesting thought, tell me how measuring in thousandths of an inch is harder than measuring in millimeters. And tell me how using a Metric steel tape is easier or faster than using one set up for inches.

[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]
...and what size ratchet does a feller use for a 12mm socket?










...3/8" drive, of course.
Originally Posted by JohnBurns
There are lot's of counties that use the metric system and there is one county that has it's own collection of moon rocks.

Just sayin.

Did Wernher von Braun drop the metric system when he worked on the Saturn V? Just askin'.
Originally Posted by Dillonbuck
Yeah!
Because of all the countries that use the Metric System and have put men on the moon!
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

Let's list them?
You probably should check out what measurement system SpaceX uses BEFORE you make stupid comments. Just sayin...

😁😅😅🤣🤣🤣
Ain't my fault. 50 years ago I was in elementary school and they were saying then that we were going to soon change to metric. Ain't happened.
These are two machinists scales, one Metric and one Inch.

[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]

[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]
Originally Posted by mathman
Originally Posted by JohnBurns
There are lot's of counties that use the metric system and there is one county that has it's own collection of moon rocks.

Just sayin.

Did Wernher von Braun drop the metric system when he worked on the Saturn V? Just askin'.

Yes?

Pretty hard to get stuff made back then if you dimensioned drawing in mms.

Maybe he got a waiver like he did for being a Nazi?
I detest the metric system with every fiber of my being. I hate it more than I hate Allen screws... and I REALLY hate Allen screws.
My dad had an 80 Olds station wagon that was metric.
Originally Posted by Stophel
I detest the metric system with every fiber of my being. I hate it more than I hate Allen screws... and I REALLY hate Allen screws.
More than Torx?
Originally Posted by rickt300
Originally Posted by denton
What do Myanmar, Liberia, and the United States have in common? They are the only countries in the whole world that are not on the metric system. There is a reason practically all the world is metric. It's not because the metric system is less useful than SAE.

Actually if you had a clue you could see that the Metric system does not have any advantage over SAE, none and there are areas where SAE kicks Metrics azz.

Well, OK.....

How much heat energy is required to raise one quart of water 10 degrees Fahrenheit?

Vs..

How much heat energy is required to raise 1 liter of water 10 degrees C?

Or....

An object that weighs on pound on Earth is moved to a place in space where there is practically no gravity. How much force must be applied to accelerate it 10 feet/sec/sec?

Vs....

A 1 Kg object is moved to a place in space where there is practically no gravity. How much force must be applied to accelerate it 3 meters/sec/sec?

In both cases, someone who understands metric can answer the second question in 1 second flat. Try the first questions, time yourself, and let us know if it took you less than that.

Metric is vastly easier, and fully as precise as our system. But if you grew up on our system, the transition is painful. The worst situation is a helter skelter mix of the two, which is what we have in the US.
Originally Posted by Valsdad
.... because 16ths, 32nds, and 64ths are so much easier to deal with than everything being in 10ths?


YES. Because everything (within the inch unit of measure) is half of half of half of half..... Half inch, quarter inch, eighth inch, sixteenth inch, thirty second inch, 64th inch, 128th inch (nobody actually uses 128th inch much though...). Dividing in half is natural and relatively easy. It can be figured out with 1:2 dividers.
Originally Posted by mjbgalt
But the places with metric often have Celsius too. Which is less precise than fahrenheit.

So tell us how it's about precision and accuracy lol

Could be like 3 or four degrees colder or hotter, same temp in C

Only time and place where one should use the metric system for temp is when it's -40.

Other wise water at sea level freezes at 32 degrees F like the Founding Fathers decreed.
Originally Posted by rickt300
Originally Posted by Stophel
I detest the metric system with every fiber of my being. I hate it more than I hate Allen screws... and I REALLY hate Allen screws.
More than Torx?

I'm not a huge fan of Torx, but it is head and shoulders better than Allen screws. Torx bits/screws don't generally strip out like Allen screws/wrenches do... and they do SO easily.
Originally Posted by blindshooter
God help me, I still have Whitworth tools. My misspent youth fooling with motorcycles.
Nice to hear. Mine are buried somewhere in a corner of the shop - figured I might be the only dinosaur still holding those.
Originally Posted by shrapnel
SAE designed and engineered equipment defeated the metrics in 2 world wars and the losers are still trying to make us go backwards…

Yep, all those Rolls-Merlin engines in the P-51's with Whitworth threads and wrench sizes didn't help at all, right?
Originally Posted by Stophel
Originally Posted by Valsdad
.... because 16ths, 32nds, and 64ths are so much easier to deal with than everything being in 10ths?


YES. Because everything (within the inch unit of measure) is half of half of half of half..... Half inch, quarter inch, eighth inch, sixteenth inch, thirty second inch, 64th inch, 128th inch (nobody actually uses 128th inch much though...). Dividing in half is natural and relatively easy. It can be figured out with 1:2 dividers.

On your precision rule, how far is it from the 17/128ths mark to the 19/32nds mark?

Vs....

How far is it from the .195 cm mark to the .205 cm mark?

If you can do the first one faster than I can do the second, I'll treat you to a root beer.

Is your dial caliper graduated in 1/1024ths of an inch? If it is graduated in 1/1000ths of an inch, it's a decimal system, rather than powers of 2.
Have you ever had an injection?

The precise dose you received wasn't measured in fractions of an ounce... It was in CCs, cubic centimeters.

Imperial makes no sense, example:
A mile is 5280 feet, odd but okay,

A foot is 12 inches, where did 12 come from?

But each inch is not divided by 12 but rather 2,4,8,16,32 and 64,
unless you're a machinist and each inch is divided by 10, 100 and 1000 but inches are still, 12ths of a foot.

P.S, Nasa used Metric for the Apollo moon landings, not Imperial... just sayin..
Originally Posted by 12344mag
I'd much rather say I have a 36 waist than to say I had a 914.4 waist........

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]
The French invented the metric system for the math challenged. I need to convert between the two systems at work. Much more natural for me to think in Degrees F and inches, acres and miles.
When I drove thru Mexico first time a long time ago I was always looking at signs with distances to towns in km and multiplying by 5 and diving by 8 to figure out mph to figure out my eta based on my mph. And then it dawned on me all i had to do was look at the km/h marks on my speedometer duh!

all you guys who want to measure in 64th's go for it. I like 10's anymore
metric systems actually fairly easy .

but I can do inches or metric no big deal but this will blow your mind then a lot of our blueprints are actually in 10th of an foot
so it looks like a lot of people here with short circuit trying to do that..
Originally Posted by rickt300
[quote=wabigoon]Metric sucks, an incomplete system that is poorly balanced.

YGTBSM
Originally Posted by ldholton
metric systems actually fairly easy .

but I can do inches or metric no big deal but this will blow your mind then a lot of our blueprints are actually in 10th of an inch.
so it looks like a lot of people here with short circuit trying to do that..

Engineer scales rock, Architects scales suck hairy donkey balls.
Originally Posted by wabigoon
If they'd gone to it before we were born, we'd like it. A friend that ran a motor grader talked about an engineer's foot. 12 inches divided by ten for easy figuring.

All surveying and grade work is done in Tenths of feet. dumber than either Sae or metric. The federal government uses metric for road work now and it is way easier after a day of getting used to it. Most every vehicle built in the last 20 years is all metric also.....
I have completely conquered the metric system with a set of wrenches and a socket set. No more bullshyte trying a 9/16 on a 13MM, I like metric until I dont have the wrench.
Originally Posted by MuskegMan
Originally Posted by ldholton
metric systems actually fairly easy .

but I can do inches or metric no big deal but this will blow your mind then a lot of our blueprints are actually in 10th of an inch.
so it looks like a lot of people here with short circuit trying to do that..

Engineer scales rock, Architects scales suck hairy donkey balls.
I corrected my post but not soon enough to take care of this it's actually 10th of a foot or otherwise known 10th's
Originally Posted by denton
Originally Posted by rickt300
Originally Posted by denton
What do Myanmar, Liberia, and the United States have in common? They are the only countries in the whole world that are not on the metric system. There is a reason practically all the world is metric. It's not because the metric system is less useful than SAE.

Actually if you had a clue you could see that the Metric system does not have any advantage over SAE, none and there are areas where SAE kicks Metrics azz.

Well, OK.....

How much heat energy is required to raise one quart of water 10 degrees Fahrenheit?

Vs..

How much heat energy is required to raise 1 liter of water 10 degrees C?

Or....

An object that weighs on pound on Earth is moved to a place in space where there is practically no gravity. How much force must be applied to accelerate it 10 feet/sec/sec?

Vs....

A 1 Kg object is moved to a place in space where there is practically no gravity. How much force must be applied to accelerate it 3 meters/sec/sec?

In both cases, someone who understands metric can answer the second question in 1 second flat. Try the first questions, time yourself, and let us know if it took you less than that.

Metric is vastly easier, and fully as precise as our system. But if you grew up on our system, the transition is painful. The worst situation is a helter skelter mix of the two, which is what we have in the US.

If you are pondering theoreticals sure metric is easy but building anything is easier with SAE, every time. You seem to be missing the point. There are things not done on a calculator.
Originally Posted by ldholton
metric systems actually fairly easy .

but I can do inches or metric no big deal but this will blow your mind then a lot of our blueprints are actually in 10th of an foot
so it looks like a lot of people here with short circuit trying to do that..

Odd the blueprints I saw and used at Bell were either metric or inch. We far preferred the latter. Fewer decimals to fool with." is less filling than MM.
Originally Posted by rickt300
Originally Posted by ldholton
metric systems actually fairly easy .

but I can do inches or metric no big deal but this will blow your mind then a lot of our blueprints are actually in 10th of an foot
so it looks like a lot of people here with short circuit trying to do that..

Odd the blueprints I saw and used at Bell were either metric or inch. We far preferred the latter. Fewer decimals to fool with." is less filling than MM.
I'm talking blueprints for subdivisions inner structure sewer , water storm drains , subgrade, asphalt finish grade top of curb grade etc..
Originally Posted by colodog
P.S, Nasa used Metric for the Apollo moon landings, not Imperial... just sayin..

Funny but they used feet and MPH for the approach and landings on the moon.

There is no way to land a lunar lander on the moon if you use meters.

Just won't work and you will be stuck in space.

[Linked Image from imagizer.imageshack.com]
I freaking HATE that pos metric system... Rant over.
Some people love metric some hate it. I can work with either but for my little machine shop in East Texas metric is an unnecessary hazard. There’s no support around here. I can spend a fortune purchasing metric stuff on line or from suppliers or just use what I have. My collets for the mill are imperial. My indicators are imperial mostly. If you’ve ever seen the little Christmas tree thread dial on a metric lathe for threading you’ll faint.
I suppose there are some things where metric measurement may be more convenient or somehow more useful than Imperial measurements. Fortunately, I don't have to do any of those things! So screw it! Inches rule!
Originally Posted by gunswizard
They tried to force the metric system on us in the early 1970's, it went nowhere.


I remember reading about it in a Weekly Reader in about 1964 in the third grade. I laughed.
Originally Posted by rainshot
If you’ve ever seen the little Christmas tree thread dial on a metric lathe for threading you’ll faint.

I haven’t fainted yet and I can go back and forth as needed. Try to explain some reason it makes more sense to specify thread pitch by the number of threads per inch, rather than the actual pitch dimension of the distance from a point on one thread to the same point on another thread.
You guys do know our currency system is metric, right?
Originally Posted by AJ300MAG
Originally Posted by Dillonbuck
Yeah!
Because of all the countries that use the Metric System and have put men on the moon!
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

Let's list them?
You probably should check out what measurement system SpaceX uses BEFORE you make stupid comments. Just sayin...

😁😅😅🤣🤣🤣



Oh, I forgot!

SpaceX has put men on the moon.🙂🙂🙂🙂🙂🙂🙃🙃🙃🙃🙃🙃



Now as to NASA?
They did use some 10ths to get to the Moon.
Inches, feet, and miles too!
They supposedly went all foreign BS about a dozen years ago.
Because the other countries can't do fractions.


I really don't see the big deal.
Either system can measure whatever, the metrics system is easier to calculate,
but cumbersome in other applications.

Our system becomes a unit of tens once you start being precise.
By using decimals. Ever use a machinists ruler.

Which is what happens with metric also.



I'll never use metric, probably.
We use inches and pounds at work. Even for export to Europe and Asia.
Sometimes we have to convert kilos, but we still work in pounds.

I'll never think, "My crank is 25cm long".
The mind just knows 10".
Originally Posted by JohnBurns
Originally Posted by colodog
P.S, Nasa used Metric for the Apollo moon landings, not Imperial... just sayin..

Funny but they used feet and MPH for the approach and landings on the moon.

There is no way to land a lunar lander on the moon if you use meters.

Just won't work and you will be stuck in space.

[Linked Image from imagizer.imageshack.com]

Calculations and functions were metric, Display was in Imperial for obvious reasons.
You know all the thread pitches are in the machinist handbook and the metric ones aren’t any simpler than imperial. As long as the thread is correct there’s no problem.
Originally Posted by cra1948
You guys do know our currency system is metric, right?



If we go metric do we lose nickles, quarters, 5, 10, 20 and 50 dollar bills?
Do it all with one's, tens, and hundreds?

You know, for the Simple, math?🙃😉
I spent a third of my thirty year O&G career running metric abroad. Never an issue.
Originally Posted by rickt300
Originally Posted by denton
Originally Posted by rickt300
Originally Posted by denton
What do Myanmar, Liberia, and the United States have in common? They are the only countries in the whole world that are not on the metric system. There is a reason practically all the world is metric. It's not because the metric system is less useful than SAE.

Actually if you had a clue you could see that the Metric system does not have any advantage over SAE, none and there are areas where SAE kicks Metrics azz.

Well, OK.....

How much heat energy is required to raise one quart of water 10 degrees Fahrenheit?

Vs..

How much heat energy is required to raise 1 liter of water 10 degrees C?

Or....

An object that weighs on pound on Earth is moved to a place in space where there is practically no gravity. How much force must be applied to accelerate it 10 feet/sec/sec?

Vs....

A 1 Kg object is moved to a place in space where there is practically no gravity. How much force must be applied to accelerate it 3 meters/sec/sec?

In both cases, someone who understands metric can answer the second question in 1 second flat. Try the first questions, time yourself, and let us know if it took you less than that.

Metric is vastly easier, and fully as precise as our system. But if you grew up on our system, the transition is painful. The worst situation is a helter skelter mix of the two, which is what we have in the US.

If you are pondering theoreticals sure metric is easy but building anything is easier with SAE, every time. You seem to be missing the point. There are things not done on a calculator.

Those are most emphatically not theoreticals. They are everyday practical problems for a lot of technical people, and the metric system makes them MUCH easier, calculator or none. If you want to work in furlongs per fortnight, be my guest. If you think you can beat my time on the questions posed, post your results. If you don't like those, try these two equivalent problems....

What is the slope of a roof that has 3' 4 3/16" rise for 8' 2 1/8" of run?

vs.

What is the slope of a roof that has 1 meter of rise for 2.4 meters of run?

I've already done the second one in my head, while distracted by typing. Your answer for the first one? Quickly! No calculator, or even pencil and paper.
Originally Posted by Dillonbuck
Originally Posted by AJ300MAG
Originally Posted by Dillonbuck
Yeah!
Because of all the countries that use the Metric System and have put men on the moon!
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

Let's list them?
You probably should check out what measurement system SpaceX uses BEFORE you make stupid comments. Just sayin...

😁😅😅🤣🤣🤣



Oh, I forgot!

SpaceX has put men on the moon.🙂🙂🙂🙂🙂🙂🙃🙃🙃🙃🙃🙃



Now as to NASA?
They did use some 10ths to get to the Moon.
Inches, feet, and miles too!
They supposedly went all foreign BS about a dozen years ago.
Because the other countries can't do fractions.


I really don't see the big deal.
Either system can measure whatever, the metrics system is easier to calculate,
but cumbersome in other applications.

Our system becomes a unit of tens once you start being precise.
By using decimals. Ever use a machinists ruler.

Which is what happens with metric also.



I'll never use metric, probably.
We use inches and pounds at work. Even for export to Europe and Asia.
Sometimes we have to convert kilos, but we still work in pounds.

I'll never think, "My crank is 25cm long".
The mind just knows 10".
🤣

10" huh...
That's why women make poor carpenters. They think the length of their index finger is 10" long.

Twas a Toolmaker for forty years. With GM being a global company we had equipment that was manufactured in Germany, Spain and Japan. Metrics was a big nothing burger, I could bounce from imperial to metric and back again at will. While I had metric taps and reamers I used imperial tooling on a cnc mill and set cutter comp when doing precision milling on metric dimensioned parts.
Originally Posted by ldholton
metric systems actually fairly easy .

but I can do inches or metric no big deal but this will blow your mind then a lot of our blueprints are actually in 10th of an foot
so it looks like a lot of people here with short circuit trying to do that..

Somewhere in "the stash of stuff" is my father's stopwatch whose dial shows hundredths of a minute.
Think about it.

“Imperial” sounds so much more American than “metric.”





P
Fahq the Frogs and their made-up system.
Originally Posted by rickt300
Originally Posted by wabigoon
The US uses the metric system more than a lot of folks realize. Sparkplug threads have been metric since before 1900.

True but the wrench that is needed to turn them is 5/8th's or 13/16's. Metric sucks, an incomplete system that is poorly balanced.

Yeah, I hate metric stuff. We convert prints in the shop to decimals all the time. What I always thought was odd but, in a good way is, the ratchets and extensions are 1/4", 3/8". and 1/2".
anyone reloading uses 10th's ... .020 off the lands ...
I get to work in both English and metric systems. There’s no comparison. Metric is vastly superior in every way. Example: how many mm in a kilometer? You should be able to do that without even thinking about it. Now, how many inches are in a mile?
Originally Posted by mathman
I can't believe some of the irrational bullshit I'm reading here.




Many are saying essentially, English system over metric system. What's irrational about that?
Originally Posted by Pharmseller
Two kinds of nations in the world: those on the metric system, and those who have walked on the moon.




P
Originally Posted by denton
What do Myanmar, Liberia, and the United States have in common? They are the only countries in the whole world that are not on the metric system. There is a reason practically all the world is metric. It's not because the metric system is less useful than SAE.

I have never known any one fully conversant in both who preferred working in SAE rather than metric.

A system based on water. One CC equals one ML and weighs one gram, it freezes at zero and boils at 100 at sea level. 1000 ML equals a liter. 1000 MM equals a meter. 1000 meters equals a KM, or a klick for the military guys. 1000 grams is a Kg aqnd 1000 Kg is a ton. Nothing could be more logical or easier to understand than that.


We would be a lot better off if we had adopted metric with the purchase of Louisiana Territory.

The system came from France because at that time in History, France held the distinction of being the most scientifically advanced nation on Earth. Does Curie, Pascal, Laplace and Pasteur ring a bell.

I wonder why the spread sheets at work calculate in feet and tenths instead of inches?

I have been using metric interchangeably with SAE since the seventh grade. I can work with either. If I could change history, we would all be using metric.
Originally Posted by 12344mag
I'd much rather say I have a 36 waist than to say I had a 914.4 waist........

LOL! Why not say you have a .914 waist.?That fourth significant digit is superfluous.
Ain’t no big deal, a person would get used to it.
Originally Posted by RiverRider
Originally Posted by mathman
I can't believe some of the irrational bullshit I'm reading here.




Many are saying essentially, English system over metric system. What's irrational about that?


It's not about the preference. The "reasoning" behind the preference is faulty.
Some of us don't like the metric system.... too bad.

If I was to hazard a guess, I'd say that the vociferous metric apologists (and Imperial attackers) were all Glock shooters....
Originally Posted by JohnBurns
There are lot's of counties that use the metric system and there is one county that has it's own collection of moon rocks.

Just sayin.
And we did that in spite of our refusal to adopt metric. Americans truly were an amazing bunch of people 60 years ago.

Now they buy into every bullschitt story Biden and his Press Corp feeds them. Then they let .gov toss $100 Billion down the toilet of Ukraine to protect the personal interests of American Politicians.
Originally Posted by rickt300
Originally Posted by Valsdad
Originally Posted by rickt300
Originally Posted by Dixie_Dude
Napoleon had the metric system developed because every country he conquered had a different measuring system. From there it spread all over the world. French, Spanish, Italian, and German colonies used it. Metric is all based on 10's.

You start with a millimeter; 10 millimeters is a centimeter. 100 centimeters or 1,000 millimeters is a meter (a little longer than a yard), 1,000 meters is a kilometer (about a half mile).

1 cubic centimeter is a gram of water. 1,000 grams is a kilogram dry weight (2.2 lbs) or 1 liter of water. 1,000 liters of water is a metric ton (about 2,200 lbs).

Anything less than 1 liter of liquid weight is a milliliter or say 1 cup is about 300 milliters (ml)

Not hard to remember. Each wrench metric is based on millimeters. So the higher mm the larger the wrench.

In metric heat and cold, 0 degrees is freezing or 32 F. 100 degrees is boiling or 212 degrees F. There is also the Rankin temperature scale, and the Kelvin scale used in physics and space. 0 in Kelvin is absolute zero where everything freezes and nothing can get colder. This is like deep space far away from the sun or any star.

Fahrenheit was developed first by a Dutch scientist in the 1600's. Most countries have switched to Centigrade metric scale because water is identifiable easier. Kelvin will eventually win out if our species becomes seriously space bearing, like Startrek or Starwars, due to space being so cold between stars.

Eventually we will have to go metric if we continue to trade with other countries.

Bullschit, get them to go SAE, much better system.

Yes, because 16ths, 32nds, and 64ths are so much easier to deal with than everything being in 10ths?

You bet, not to mention the metric system breaks everything down into millimeters which are a bit smaller than needed for many projects. A 1/2' socket does anything a 12MM or 13MM socket can do. A SAE socket set has fewer sockets in it because the system is more efficient. You do not need sockets or wrenches spaced 1 millimeter apart. 1/16 is much better. You end up with more sockets or wrenches than needed with metric.

1/16 inch = 1.5875 mm

Then why does my end wrench and socket set contain fractions of x/32. You know like an 11/32 which is between 5/16 and 3/8?
Originally Posted by denton
Originally Posted by rickt300
Originally Posted by denton
What do Myanmar, Liberia, and the United States have in common? They are the only countries in the whole world that are not on the metric system. There is a reason practically all the world is metric. It's not because the metric system is less useful than SAE.

Actually if you had a clue you could see that the Metric system does not have any advantage over SAE, none and there are areas where SAE kicks Metrics azz.

Well, OK.....

How much heat energy is required to raise one quart of water 10 degrees Fahrenheit?

Vs..

How much heat energy is required to raise 1 liter of water 10 degrees C?

Or....

An object that weighs on pound on Earth is moved to a place in space where there is practically no gravity. How much force must be applied to accelerate it 10 feet/sec/sec?

Vs....

A 1 Kg object is moved to a place in space where there is practically no gravity. How much force must be applied to accelerate it 3 meters/sec/sec?

In both cases, someone who understands metric can answer the second question in 1 second flat. Try the first questions, time yourself, and let us know if it took you less than that.

Metric is vastly easier, and fully as precise as our system. But if you grew up on our system, the transition is painful. The worst situation is a helter skelter mix of the two, which is what we have in the US.

Ok, Boomer...


Ummm, wait, if'n you're a Boomer, you're sposed to be arguing how fluid ounces is more easier than milliliters. Cut that logical s--t out!
Originally Posted by rickt300
Originally Posted by mathman
I can't believe some of the irrational bullshit I'm reading here.

An interesting thought, tell me how measuring in thousandths of an inch is harder than measuring in millimeters. And tell me how using a Metric steel tape is easier or faster than using one set up for inches.

[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]
Measuring is no different. Calculating is.

Quick, what is 1/10 of 4 ft 9 inches and 13/16"? How about "I need to cut ten pieces of 4 ft 9 inches and 13/16. How much stock should I purchase?

If the measurement was made in metric, you just move the decimal.

So, you only wish to divide by four? It is still easier to do so with a metric measurement than one which must first be converted to the lowest common denominator.

4 times twelve equals 48 inches plus 9 equals 57 inches.
57 inches times 16 equals 912 16'ths plus 13 equals 925/16'ths.

Some one check my math please. That's a lot of arithmetic. Someone is bound to make a mistake somewhere during the day.

But yes, now you are ready to multiply or divide as you need. And then you get to convert the whole mess back into feet and inches.
"Well, OK.....

How much heat energy is required to raise one quart of water 10 degrees Fahrenheit?

Vs..

How much heat energy is required to raise 1 liter of water 10 degrees C?"

Trick question. Ten degreesF is damn chilly and 10 degree C equals 50 degrees F.

I worked in weather for 33 years and one of thing I had to during that 33 years was inflate a big balloon and tie a parachute and radio to the thing and let it fly at 00 hour Zulu and 12 hours Zulu. That's Greenwich Mean time for those that don't know. That radio measures pressure, temperature and humidity with some balloon reaching 60K+ height in altitude which was measure IIRC in meters. Temperature data was in degrees Celsius. Interesting fact that degrees F and degrees C become the same way up yonder at minus 40 degrees. I always enjoyed working up those RAOBS. Made the time go by fast.
PJ
Originally Posted by PJGunner
"Well, OK.....

How much heat energy is required to raise one quart of water 10 degrees Fahrenheit?

Vs..

How much heat energy is required to raise 1 liter of water 10 degrees C?"

Trick question. Ten degreesF is damn chilly and 10 degree C equals 50 degrees F.


PJ
It is not chilly when that delta ten degrees is from 190 F to 200 F.

It requires 10,000 calories to heat one liter of water from 30 degrees C to 40 degrees C
Originally Posted by rickt300
Originally Posted by MPat70
It's been a dual system my entire life so 🤷🏻‍♂️ it is what it is. Own both metric and sae tools. Metric won't go away.
The good ole days were when all you needed were SAE and I didn't have to deal so often with two sets of sockets and wrenches. Tool boxes definitely grew in size when that happend. Only thing I hold against Nixon. Add to that all the metric sockets fit on ratchets and extensions that are SAE.

Taking us off the gold standard hurt us a lot more than the metric system ever did or will.
Quote
It requires 10,000 calories to heat one liter of water from 30 degrees C to 40 degrees C

Exactly.

Now we should consider that if we want to know how quickly you did that in your head, we'd have to measure it in seconds or milliseconds. And seconds are a metric unit of measure. If you really hate metric, you'll need a different kind of watch. The Indian ghurry is a unit of time measure that you could use if you really want to get away from metric.
So I have a VERY unique job that allows me to visit hundreds of manufactures worldwide. I can assure you the imperial system is alive and well in Europe and Asia not only in their equipment but the goods they mfg. What metric countries have in common? Their women don’t know how long 20 cm is as well.

Anyways funny story… wife was determined to measure windows for blinds. She took the fat max (imperial) around the house with paper and pencil. She explained that kitchen window was 46.519” wide. I said carefully “I do not doubt you, but please show me how you arrived at that number.” She could not. Later in day used my 1/4” wood chisel to remove calcium from pipe.
Originally Posted by colodog
Originally Posted by JohnBurns
Originally Posted by colodog
P.S, Nasa used Metric for the Apollo moon landings, not Imperial... just sayin..

Funny but they used feet and MPH for the approach and landings on the moon.

There is no way to land a lunar lander on the moon if you use meters.

Just won't work and you will be stuck in space.

[Linked Image from imagizer.imageshack.com]

Calculations and functions were metric, Display was in Imperial for obvious reasons.

Of course displays were in the Founding Fathers measurements.

This is also why those who use optics in Mils don't have good results hunting.

[Linked Image from imagizer.imageshack.com]
The metric system is for Eurotrash, egg heads and Commies.
I have taps, dies, nuts, bolts, and washers organized from 2-56 through 1/2-13.

Then I have a couple buckets marked "Metric and suspected metric"
Some things are very intuitive in each system, but converting can cause mental backflips , Ha

Miles Per Gallon or Liters per 100 Kilometers
Originally Posted by reivertom
The metric system is for Eurotrash, egg heads and Commies.
So, What?

Is egghead a synonym for educated?
Originally Posted by JohnBurns
Of course displays were in the Founding Fathers measurements.

This is also why those who use optics in Mils don't have good results hunting.
Unless the hunting is for men! They seem to do quite well in that environment!

1/3 MOA! Laugh my ass off!
Originally Posted by denton
Quote
It requires 10,000 calories to heat one liter of water from 30 degrees C to 40 degrees C

Exactly.

Now we should consider that if we want to know how quickly you did that in your head, we'd have to measure it in seconds or milliseconds. And seconds are a metric unit of measure. If you really hate metric, you'll need a different kind of watch. The Indian ghurry is a unit of time measure that you could use if you really want to get away from metric.
It might have taken a second. I did not have to look up any conversion factors, as I learned in High School Chem class at age fifteen that 1 calorie heats one gram of water one degree.

I would have to start with Google to do the English conversion. Hell, it would be easiest to convert the water mass and temperature change to metric.
Originally Posted by Idaho_Shooter
Originally Posted by JohnBurns
Of course displays were in the Founding Fathers measurements.

This is also why those who use optics in Mils don't have good results hunting.
Unless the hunting is for men! They seem to do quite well in that environment!

1/3 MOA! Laugh my ass off!

We all know your "Man Hunting" happens at the local dive gay bar.

The Campfire is a family forum and here such things are frowned apon.

Now if you have a picture or 2 of good results from normal hunting done with mils/metric feel free to post it up.

Keep it family friendly, pervert.

[Linked Image from imagizer.imageshack.com]
Interesting (not) how your fantasies always run to the homosexual. "Not that there's anything wrong with that" (cough).

Never claimed to have the honor of Service with armed forces. Just pointing out the fallacy and ridiculous nature of your post.

US Army, Marines, and SEALS been getting it done with mils for decades.

You may be too stupid to make the transition from English to Metric. That does not mean we all are.

I have pics of me with dead critters from the age of 6 through 60. But I sure as hell am not going to go to the effort to digitize, find a hosting site, and hang 'em here for the likes of your self aggrandizing ass.
Originally Posted by Idaho_Shooter
Interesting (not) how your fantasies always run to the homosexual. "Not that there's anything wrong with that" (cough).

Never claimed to have the honor of Service with armed forces. Just pointing out the fallacy and ridiculous nature of your post.

US Army, Marines, and SEALS been getting it done with mils for decades.

You may be too stupid to make the transition from English to Metric. That does not mean we all are.

I have pics of me with dead critters from the age of 6 through 60. But I sure as hell am not going to go to the effort to digitize, find a hosting site, and hang 'em here for the likes of your self aggrandizing ass.

[Linked Image from external-content.duckduckgo.com]

That's a lot of words to just say you have never had any good results hunting with Metric/Mils optics.

A few have, most, like you, have not.

MOA optics simply rule in delivering good hunting results.
Originally Posted by wyoming260
Originally Posted by wabigoon
If they'd gone to it before we were born, we'd like it. A friend that ran a motor grader talked about an engineer's foot. 12 inches divided by ten for easy figuring.

All surveying and grade work is done in Tenths of feet. dumber than either Sae or metric. The federal government uses metric for road work now and it is way easier after a day of getting used to it. Most every vehicle built in the last 20 years is all metric also.....

This is NOT true anymore. I have worked on 100's of federal highway, levee, and airport projects for the federal govt. for over 20 years.... For quite a few years it was mandated by the feds in an attempt to get everyone to convert but it all ended around 2010 if I recall. If any project had federal funds tied to it, it was the rule. I have not seen any plans in metric in at least 10 years..... it was a pain in the azz converting back and forth.....also considering we already are constantly converting inches to engineers scale, adding one more was even more confusing.

I had no issues with it..... it's just a standard 100 scale like engineers scale or counting money. The decimal (100 scale ) is a must for doing percentages of grade.... we don't grade a road like a roof 1in 4 etc..... lol. We do 2% crosslopes..... run sewer lines at .00385% etc. The issue is that material suppliers work in inches... the gps in the Blade works on engineers scale and the plans are in metric..... too much converting back in forth led to too many mistakes..... Just stick with one or another and be done with it.
The metric system is based on a certain fraction of the speed of light, a constant, not old arbitrary made up measurements like other systems. It should be the world's standard. But people are most comfortable using what they were taught when they were young, myself included. Our science teachers tried to teach us the metric system when I was in school in the 70s and early 80s with varying success. Some people have poor understanding of mathematics in general. Unfortunately I am one of them and I did poorly learning metric, my understanding of it is rudimentary at best. The USA should have went ahead with the changeover during the 1970's, fifty years of accommodation would have been done and everyone would have been used to metric and comfortable with it by now. It will probably never happen because of all the "we're great and superior" jingoism. Maybe better anyways at least in my lifetime, I'm too old to learn it now.
Quote
10" huh...
That's why women make poor carpenters. They think the length of their index finger is 10" long.
]

Back in the late 60's, when I started surveying, I was told that only whores and carpenters dealt in inches. Years later when I took over a crew doing bridge surveys, I learned different. Some bridges were scheduled to be widened instead of replaced, and I had to measure the substructure in feet and inches, to see if "as built" matched the plans. Then some time later, we started measuring in metric. At one time I had all of the equipment in my trucks to measure in metric, feet and tenths, and feet and inches. Problem was most of my crew could not read a tape of any one of those. I was alwas hearing it is x number of feet so many inches and three of those other marks. Problem was some tapes were in eighths and some in sixteenth's, so then I had to ask which tape they had. I did on bridge on hwy 70 in east Arkansas three times. First time was feet and tenths, with a chain, in a book. The second time was metric in a data collector, and using an EDM to measure,and then we quit metric and instead of converting the data I went back and did it again using a data collector, and EDM in feet and tenths. miles
Originally Posted by smallfry
So I have a VERY unique job that allows me to visit hundreds of manufactures worldwide. I can assure you the imperial system is alive and well in Europe and Asia not only in their equipment but the goods they mfg. What metric countries have in common? Their women don’t know how long 20 cm is as well.

Anyways funny story… wife was determined to measure windows for blinds. She took the fat max (imperial) around the house with paper and pencil. She explained that kitchen window was 46.519” wide. I said carefully “I do not doubt you, but please show me how you arrived at that number.” She could not. Later in day used my 1/4” wood chisel to remove calcium from pipe.



My specs call for widths of 12.91", 18.1" or 6.80"...
We measure with a Stanley tape.
Pisses me off, engineering is so lazy we don't even have a tolerance range
for that customer.

So, I'm all squinty eyed trying to see the edge of a piece of ground steel against a tape,
"Just a smidge under an eighth".
Trying to get it perfect when you can't even measure perfect.
Originally Posted by Valsdad
Please explain the rationale of having water freeze at 32 degrees vs 0 degrees.

That Dutch Fahrenheit guy set the freezing temperature of salt water in the bay near where he lived as “0”, the “32” and “212” things came about quite arbitrarily based upon how he set the marks on the glass thermometers he made.

The coolest thing about the Imperial system is that a “mile” come from the Latin root word “mil” ie. 1,000.

A Roman “mil” was one thousand paces. A pace is different from a step. A step is moving either foot, a pace is every time the same foot hits the ground (the marching cadence “left…. left…..” is paces, the “left, right, left” part is steps).

Posts designating mils, or thousand paces, were set up on Roman roads, a tradition we continue with mile markers today.

Other than that, IIRC in the Imperial System distance was based on body parts. When ya don’t have standardized rulers or tape ya use what ya got.

The yard was a measure of cloth, the motion of pulling it from a roll in a motion similar to drawing a bow.

“Feet” is self-explanatory but again IIRC an “inch” was based on the middle section on the index finger.

I’m guessing it was King James, who standardized the English Bible and English dictionary who standardized the Imperial system.
All the explanations and support for metric, I don’t see how it will change a damn thing. A bridge is built to cross a gap and who cares how far it is, it is a distance that is finite and meters won’t make the bridge any better.

Easier is a mindset and there are still people that wear analog watches to tell time. If you wear a digital watch, you still have to convert to analog in your mind to relate to the time of day. Who cares, it is not going to change because someone wants an easier way to tell time…
[Linked Image from jpgbox.com]
My favorite rifle caliber is a 9.3mm. Does that count? I'd say it makes me a metric fan.
Who really benefited from all this SAE/Metric stuff?
Tool manufacturers.
Originally Posted by TBREW401
Who really benefited from all this SAE/Metric stuff?
Tool manufacturers.

Snap-On at 120 a week from now till death....
The argument for metric has always revolved around the arbitrary beginnings of the standardization for imperial units. It's pretty moot now because both metric and imperial measurements are standardized and controlled to very tight standards both equal. Metric has it's place. One thing is for sure, discussion always gets spirited between the two proponents. Support for metric is near nonexistent in most areas around my little part of the world. If I have to work with metric I can but I have to convert to decimal which is how I measure.
Originally Posted by Idaho_Shooter
It might have taken a second. I did not have to look up any conversion factors, as I learned in High School Chem class at age fifteen that 1 calorie heats one gram of water one degree.

I would have to start with Google to do the English conversion. Hell, it would be easiest to convert the water mass and temperature change to metric.

A British thermal unit (Btu) is a measure of the heat content of fuels or energy sources. It is the quantity of heat required to raise the temperature of one pound of liquid water by 1 degree Fahrenheit at the temperature that water has its greatest density (approximately 39 degrees Fahrenheit).

[Linked Image from upload.wikimedia.org]

The cooling for the diesel engine in this vehicle was calculated with British thermal units, pencil, paper, and slide rules at paccar in Renton WA.
We may as well get used to it, it's here to stay.
This whole threads reminds me of ancient film clip of 100 year old veterans shaking hands at Gettysburg in the 1920s

Well Ezekiel… nothin left to do but cry
Originally Posted by shrapnel
...

Easier is a mindset and there are still people that wear analog watches to tell time. If you wear a digital watch, you still have to convert to analog in your mind to relate to the time of day.


In my long-ago youth, I thought that people who spoke foreign languages had to mentally convert what they heard into English before they could understand what was said. (I still think so.)
Originally Posted by 5sdad
Originally Posted by shrapnel
...

Easier is a mindset and there are still people that wear analog watches to tell time. If you wear a digital watch, you still have to convert to analog in your mind to relate to the time of day.


In my long-ago youth, I thought that people who spoke foreign languages had to mentally convert what they heard into English before they could understand what was said. (I still think so.)

Some do - they don't become as proficient as those who don't, IMO. You know a language when you don't flip it to your native in your head.
Anyone want to go to the old British system of Pounds, and Shillings? laugh
[Linked Image from blogger.googleusercontent.com]
Originally Posted by 12344mag
I'd much rather say I have a 36 waist than to say I had a 914.4 waist........

Maybe when you were in junior high.
Originally Posted by Whelenman
Originally Posted by 12344mag
I'd much rather say I have a 36 waist than to say I had a 914.4 waist........

Maybe when you were in junior high.
The four years he spent in 6th grade... 🤭
ah, A personal vendetta? laugh
Originally Posted by AJ300MAG
Originally Posted by Whelenman
Originally Posted by 12344mag
I'd much rather say I have a 36 waist than to say I had a 914.4 waist........

Maybe when you were in junior high.
The four years he spent in 6th grade... 🤭
what sounds more impressive 8 in or 203.2 mm??
Originally Posted by ldholton
Originally Posted by rickt300
Originally Posted by ldholton
metric systems actually fairly easy .

but I can do inches or metric no big deal but this will blow your mind then a lot of our blueprints are actually in 10th of an foot
so it looks like a lot of people here with short circuit trying to do that..

Odd the blueprints I saw and used at Bell were either metric or inch. We far preferred the latter. Fewer decimals to fool with." is less filling than MM.
I'm talking blueprints for subdivisions inner structure sewer , water storm drains , subgrade, asphalt finish grade top of curb grade etc..

Considerably looser tolerances to mess with.
Originally Posted by Idaho_Shooter
Originally Posted by Pharmseller
Two kinds of nations in the world: those on the metric system, and those who have walked on the moon.




P
Originally Posted by denton
What do Myanmar, Liberia, and the United States have in common? They are the only countries in the whole world that are not on the metric system. There is a reason practically all the world is metric. It's not because the metric system is less useful than SAE.

I have never known any one fully conversant in both who preferred working in SAE rather than metric.

You don't get out much do you?

A system based on water. One CC equals one ML and weighs one gram, it freezes at zero and boils at 100 at sea level. 1000 ML equals a liter. 1000 MM equals a meter. 1000 meters equals a KM, or a klick for the military guys. 1000 grams is a Kg aqnd 1000 Kg is a ton. Nothing could be more logical or easier to understand than that.

So you are unable to understand the way our powder measures work, that 32F is freezing, that water boils at 212F, that a quart is 1/4th of a gallon, A half mile is a half mile, 2.2 pounds is a Kilo, 2000 pounds is a ton?


We would be a lot better off if we had adopted metric with the purchase of Louisiana Territory.

Your mental issues noted.

The system came from France because at that time in History, France held the distinction of being the most scientifically advanced nation on Earth. Does Curie, Pascal, Laplace and Pasteur ring a bell.

I wonder why the spread sheets at work calculate in feet and tenths instead of inches?

I am beginning to feel you have no clue what you are speaking of. In tight tolerances inches are broken down into thousandths of an inch. If you never noticed which is obvious when inches are broken down into thousandths then overall it mimics the metric system but with smaller values. The math is just as easy.

I have been using metric interchangeably with SAE since the seventh grade. I can work with either. If I could change history, we would all be using metric.

That said have you ever made anything with tolerances as tight as .0003?
I absolutely LOVE the metric system, bring it on.
Originally Posted by Morewood
[Linked Image from blogger.googleusercontent.com]

I’m a fan of SAE. But that said, we didn’t land in the moon. At least not when Kubric’s movie came out saying we did in the 60’s.
Originally Posted by AJ300MAG
Originally Posted by Whelenman
Originally Posted by 12344mag
I'd much rather say I have a 36 waist than to say I had a 914.4 waist........

Maybe when you were in junior high.
The four years he spent in 6th grade... 🤭


There are other things that sound better in metric......
Originally Posted by mathman
Originally Posted by RiverRider
Originally Posted by mathman
I can't believe some of the irrational bullshit I'm reading here.




Many are saying essentially, English system over metric system. What's irrational about that?


It's not about the preference. The "reasoning" behind the preference is faulty.

For those that only dabble in math then sure the Metric system works but for those who have to apply said math then it sucks. If you ever had to work off a print that was converted to inches from metric or inches to metric you would see the light. That and still today most measuring devices are still inch. Add to this that often the smallest dimension on metric measuring devices is .5 MM which is 0.019685, kind of coarse actually when your tolerances are inside .001. .1mm is still more than .003 inch at 0.003937. Face it for making tight tolerance parts metric is not as easy to use. This all said when the inch is divided into thousandths all the way out the math is just as simple as the math for metric.
Originally Posted by rickt300
Originally Posted by mathman
Originally Posted by RiverRider
Originally Posted by mathman
I can't believe some of the irrational bullshit I'm reading here.




Many are saying essentially, English system over metric system. What's irrational about that?


It's not about the preference. The "reasoning" behind the preference is faulty.

For those that only dabble in math then sure the Metric system works but for those who have to apply said math then it sucks. If you ever had to work off a print that was converted to inches from metric or inches to metric you would see the light. That and still today most measuring devices are still inch. Add to this that often the smallest dimension on metric measuring devices is .5 MM which is 0.019685, kind of coarse actually when your tolerances are inside .001. .1mm is still more than .003 inch at 0.003937. Face it for making tight tolerance parts metric is not as easy to use. This all said when the inch is divided into thousandths all the way out the math is just as simple as the math for metric.

What's the smallest metric unit of length? Hint: It's not millimeters. Millimeters are divided into micrometers, which are divided into nanometers, which are divided into picometers, then femtometers, etc. ad infinitum.
Originally Posted by rickt300
For those that only dabble in math then sure the Metric system works but for those who have to apply said math then it sucks. If you ever had to work off a print that was converted to inches from metric or inches to metric you would see the light. That and still today most measuring devices are still inch. Add to this that often the smallest dimension on metric measuring devices is .5 MM which is 0.019685, kind of coarse actually when your tolerances are inside .001. .1mm is still more than .003 inch at 0.003937. Face it for making tight tolerance parts metric is not as easy to use. This all said when the inch is divided into thousandths all the way out the math is just as simple as the math for metric.
Maybe in your world...
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]
Though I didn't use it down to the second decimal point but it accurately defines the first. During the last few years of my career every part I made was from a metric 3D model. If someone needed a 2D print I'd have to make one up using Mastercam, revert it to imperial and then dimension the part and send it off to the plotter to print off a blueprint.
Originally Posted by JohnBurns
A few have, most, like you, have not.

MOA optics simply rule in delivering good hunting results.
There you go.......again, talking out your ass about that which you know nothing.

I bought a Tascco World Class MOA thirty years ago. It works just like my Leupold, Vortex, B&L, Bushnell, Burris, and Super Sniper scopes.

You check the range, check the card on the butt of the gun for hold over/under and kill anything out to 500 yds.
Originally Posted by rickt300
Originally Posted by Idaho_Shooter
Originally Posted by Pharmseller
Two kinds of nations in the world: those on the metric system, and those who have walked on the moon.




P
Originally Posted by denton
What do Myanmar, Liberia, and the United States have in common? They are the only countries in the whole world that are not on the metric system. There is a reason practically all the world is metric. It's not because the metric system is less useful than SAE.

I have never known any one fully conversant in both who preferred working in SAE rather than metric.

You don't get out much do you?

A system based on water. One CC equals one ML and weighs one gram, it freezes at zero and boils at 100 at sea level. 1000 ML equals a liter. 1000 MM equals a meter. 1000 meters equals a KM, or a klick for the military guys. 1000 grams is a Kg aqnd 1000 Kg is a ton. Nothing could be more logical or easier to understand than that.

So you are unable to understand the way our powder measures work, that 32F is freezing, that water boils at 212F, that a quart is 1/4th of a gallon, A half mile is a half mile, 2.2 pounds is a Kilo, 2000 pounds is a ton?


We would be a lot better off if we had adopted metric with the purchase of Louisiana Territory.

Your mental issues noted.

The system came from France because at that time in History, France held the distinction of being the most scientifically advanced nation on Earth. Does Curie, Pascal, Laplace and Pasteur ring a bell.

I wonder why the spread sheets at work calculate in feet and tenths instead of inches?

I am beginning to feel you have no clue what you are speaking of. In tight tolerances inches are broken down into thousandths of an inch. If you never noticed which is obvious when inches are broken down into thousandths then overall it mimics the metric system but with smaller values. The math is just as easy.

I have been using metric interchangeably with SAE since the seventh grade. I can work with either. If I could change history, we would all be using metric.

That said have you ever made anything with tolerances as tight as .0003?

The FAA has ZERO tolerance..... I've built runways and taxiways at SFO, Oakland, Sac, Fresno, and many other smaller regional airports.... it's impossible to do with 100,000 pound heavy equipment but we try and are paid by our accuracy.
Originally Posted by BillyGoatGruff
Originally Posted by Morewood
[Linked Image from blogger.googleusercontent.com]

I’m a fan of SAE. But that said, we didn’t land in the moon. At least not when Kubric’s movie came out saying we did in the 60’s.
Hint: Capricorn One was not a documentary.
As addressed to me:

Quote
For those that only dabble in math


TFF
Originally Posted by rickt300
Originally Posted by Idaho_Shooter
Originally Posted by Pharmseller
Two kinds of nations in the world: those on the metric system, and those who have walked on the moon.




P
Originally Posted by denton
What do Myanmar, Liberia, and the United States have in common? They are the only countries in the whole world that are not on the metric system. There is a reason practically all the world is metric. It's not because the metric system is less useful than SAE.

I have never known any one fully conversant in both who preferred working in SAE rather than metric.

You don't get out much do you?

A system based on water. One CC equals one ML and weighs one gram, it freezes at zero and boils at 100 at sea level. 1000 ML equals a liter. 1000 MM equals a meter. 1000 meters equals a KM, or a klick for the military guys. 1000 grams is a Kg aqnd 1000 Kg is a ton. Nothing could be more logical or easier to understand than that.

So you are unable to understand the way our powder measures work, that 32F is freezing, that water boils at 212F, that a quart is 1/4th of a gallon, A half mile is a half mile, 2.2 pounds is a Kilo, 2000 pounds is a ton?


We would be a lot better off if we had adopted metric with the purchase of Louisiana Territory.

Your mental issues noted.

The system came from France because at that time in History, France held the distinction of being the most scientifically advanced nation on Earth. Does Curie, Pascal, Laplace and Pasteur ring a bell.

I wonder why the spread sheets at work calculate in feet and tenths instead of inches?

I am beginning to feel you have no clue what you are speaking of. In tight tolerances inches are broken down into thousandths of an inch. If you never noticed which is obvious when inches are broken down into thousandths then overall it mimics the metric system but with smaller values. The math is just as easy.

I have been using metric interchangeably with SAE since the seventh grade. I can work with either. If I could change history, we would all be using metric.

That said have you ever made anything with tolerances as tight as .0003?

I have not but if needed. It is just as easy to work in decimals in metric as is in SAE. .003 inches equals .00007.62 meters or .0762 mm. or 76.2 microns. Labs measure and build to micron scale regularly
Originally Posted by rickt300
For those that only dabble in math then sure the Metric system works but for those who have to apply said math then it sucks. If you ever had to work off a print that was converted to inches from metric or inches to metric you would see the light. That and still today most measuring devices are still inch. Add to this that often the smallest dimension on metric measuring devices is .5 MM which is 0.019685, kind of coarse actually when your tolerances are inside .001. .1mm is still more than .003 inch at 0.003937. Face it for making tight tolerance parts metric is not as easy to use. This all said when the inch is divided into thousandths all the way out the math is just as simple as the math for metric.
Therein lies the rub. It is not the working in metric which is difficult. It is the jumping back and forth, and remembering all the conversion factors.

If the US had adopted metric 100 years ago, there would be no need for making conversions. The only time you would need to even think about an SAE measurement might be if restoring some machine 100 yrs old, made before the conversion.
.03937 will forever be burned in my memory.
Originally Posted by Phillip_Nesmith
The metric system is based on a certain fraction of the speed of light, a constant, not old arbitrary made up measurements like other systems. It should be the world's standard. But people are most comfortable using what they were taught when they were young, myself included. Our science teachers tried to teach us the metric system when I was in school in the 70s and early 80s with varying success. Some people have poor understanding of mathematics in general. Unfortunately I am one of them and I did poorly learning metric, my understanding of it is rudimentary at best. The USA should have went ahead with the changeover during the 1970's, fifty years of accommodation would have been done and everyone would have been used to metric and comfortable with it by now. It will probably never happen because of all the "we're great and superior" jingoism. Maybe better anyways at least in my lifetime, I'm too old to learn it now.

Show me where, please.

I do not think this is true as the speed of light is 2.998 x 10 to the eight power expressed in meters per second.
Originally Posted by denton
Originally Posted by rickt300
Originally Posted by mathman
Originally Posted by RiverRider
Originally Posted by mathman
I can't believe some of the irrational bullshit I'm reading here.




Many are saying essentially, English system over metric system. What's irrational about that?


It's not about the preference. The "reasoning" behind the preference is faulty.

For those that only dabble in math then sure the Metric system works but for those who have to apply said math then it sucks. If you ever had to work off a print that was converted to inches from metric or inches to metric you would see the light. That and still today most measuring devices are still inch. Add to this that often the smallest dimension on metric measuring devices is .5 MM which is 0.019685, kind of coarse actually when your tolerances are inside .001. .1mm is still more than .003 inch at 0.003937. Face it for making tight tolerance parts metric is not as easy to use. This all said when the inch is divided into thousandths all the way out the math is just as simple as the math for metric.

What's the smallest metric unit of length? Hint: It's not millimeters. Millimeters are divided into micrometers, which are divided into nanometers, which are divided into picometers, then femtometers, etc. ad infinitum.

So is that really easier than adding a 0 after the decimal point? That said one micrometer jumps down to the point of being overly small at 0.00003937 inch's. .0001 equals 2.54 micrometers, which number would you rather calculate with?.001 being 25.4 micrometers which would you rather calculate with?
Originally Posted by Idaho_Shooter
Originally Posted by rickt300
For those that only dabble in math then sure the Metric system works but for those who have to apply said math then it sucks. If you ever had to work off a print that was converted to inches from metric or inches to metric you would see the light. That and still today most measuring devices are still inch. Add to this that often the smallest dimension on metric measuring devices is .5 MM which is 0.019685, kind of coarse actually when your tolerances are inside .001. .1mm is still more than .003 inch at 0.003937. Face it for making tight tolerance parts metric is not as easy to use. This all said when the inch is divided into thousandths all the way out the math is just as simple as the math for metric.
Therein lies the rub. It is not the working in metric which is difficult. It is the jumping back and forth, and remembering all the conversion factors.

If the US had adopted metric 100 years ago, there would be no need for making conversions. The only time you would need to even think about an SAE measurement might be if restoring some machine 100 yrs old, made before the conversion.

Not at all metric is a boring goofy system with flaws which I have pointed out in many ways. Your claim is BS and you have yet to make your case.
Thank Gawd we didn’t buy into the French Republican Calendar either!!!

For the curious, look that up.
Originally Posted by wabigoon
We may as well get used to it, it's here to stay.
So is SAE.


Originally Posted by wabigoon
Anyone want to go to the old British system of Pounds, and Shillings? laugh
Eff no, it's why we beat the chit outta them decades ago - ON OUR SOIL!!!

Not to mention they have bad teeth.. laugh laugh
I remember sitting in High School and the teacher was talking of switching to metric. He said it would take many years to make the conversion. I asked why can't we just issue every one a new meter/measuring device and switch now. We use the new ruler to measure how much of X we need and off we go. He stood there and huffed and puffed and finally said "you just don't understand" Then changed the subject.
Originally Posted by rickt300
So is that really easier than adding a 0 after the decimal point? That said one micrometer jumps down to the point of being overly small at 0.00003937 inch's. .0001 equals 2.54 micrometers, which number would you rather calculate with?.001 being 25.4 micrometers which would you rather calculate with?
The problem is, you are still thinking conversions.

If working in metric, that is all you do. Just move the decimal point. If you were running metric, your tolerance would not be 2.54 microns. It would be 2 microns, or 3 microns. Just as in the previous example with .003 inches.

You just move the decimal, whether working with the infinitesimally small or infinitely large.

Has anyone ever expressed the distance from Chicago to Boston in inches and decimals? No, it is miles, and rods, (admittedly archaic, but still on plats), yards, and feet. Oh yes, don't leave out furlongs.
Who cares, people don't want change, live with what you learned growing up and be happy.
Originally Posted by mathman
Originally Posted by RiverRider
Originally Posted by mathman
I can't believe some of the irrational bullshit I'm reading here.




Many are saying essentially, English system over metric system. What's irrational about that?


It's not about the preference. The "reasoning" behind the preference is faulty.


You missed the joke. Think "three over four."
I grew up with both, and don't really care which I use, as long as the lathe, mill or whatever is graduated in the same system.

A standard metric micrometer is graduated in hundredths of a millimetre, which is a smaller dimension than the thousandths of an inch a standard Imperial mic is showing. No big deal either way, and there isn't a lot outside of toolmaking that requires more accuracy than +-0.01mm (slightly smaller than half a thou).

Fabricating in mm I find easier than converting to Imperial - adding 64ths, eighths and the rest is just a pain in the butt. 620mm + 510mm is a simple thing, 2' 13/32" + 1' 6 5/64" - who needs that bs?

As for volume and weight, easy win to metric. A litre of water weighs a kilogram, a thousand of them weigh a ton and they fill a cubic metre. Thermal calcs are the same win to metric.

It's a bit like learning another language - it all seems clumsy until it falls into place, then it's easy.
Originally Posted by Idaho_Shooter
Originally Posted by rickt300
So is that really easier than adding a 0 after the decimal point? That said one micrometer jumps down to the point of being overly small at 0.00003937 inch's. .0001 equals 2.54 micrometers, which number would you rather calculate with?.001 being 25.4 micrometers which would you rather calculate with?
The problem is, you are still thinking conversions.

If working in metric, that is all you do. Just move the decimal point. If you were running metric, your tolerance would not be 2.54 microns. It would be 2 microns, or 3 microns. Just as in the previous example with .003 inches.

You just move the decimal, whether working with the infinitesimally small or infinitely large.

Has anyone ever expressed the distance from Chicago to Boston in inches and decimals? No, it is miles, and rods, (admittedly archaic, but still on plats), yards, and feet. Oh yes, don't leave out furlongs.

I have already said that once you start working in inches divided into thousandths them the calculations are exactly the same for both systems, just move the decimal point or add a 0. In fact you agree in saying that, metric is not easier than inch. However " is easier to type and takes fewer figures than UM or MM. One has to also admit that speed limit signs in Kilometers are hilarious.
Originally Posted by RPN
I grew up with both, and don't really care which I use, as long as the lathe, mill or whatever is graduated in the same system.

A standard metric micrometer is graduated in hundredths of a millimetre, which is a smaller dimension than the thousandths of an inch a standard Imperial mic is showing. No big deal either way, and there isn't a lot outside of toolmaking that requires more accuracy than +-0.01mm (slightly smaller than half a thou).

Fabricating in mm I find easier than converting to Imperial - adding 64ths, eighths and the rest is just a pain in the butt. 620mm + 510mm is a simple thing, 2' 13/32" + 1' 6 5/64" - who needs that bs?

As for volume and weight, easy win to metric. A litre of water weighs a kilogram, a thousand of them weigh a ton and they fill a cubic metre. Thermal calcs are the same win to metric.

It's a bit like learning another language - it all seems clumsy until it falls into place, then it's easy.

Typically you would measure parts that long with a scale or a steel tape and either method is easy. And why would you be adding such dimensions anyway? Typically overall lengths are on the print. Adding fractions is too hard for you? Usually dimensions listed in fractions have large tolerances. The point is either way of measuring is pretty easy with the win going to SAE. By the way a thousand Kilos does not weigh a ton. That said are teaspoons, tablespoons and fractions of cups all that hard to follow? Quarts and gallon beyond your ability to grasp? Public school?
Canada is metric, lumber yards still sell 2x4s, 4x8 plywood, but shingles are a meter long.
[Linked Image from i.ebayimg.com]
Originally Posted by rickt300
Originally Posted by RPN
I grew up with both, and don't really care which I use, as long as the lathe, mill or whatever is graduated in the same system.

A standard metric micrometer is graduated in hundredths of a millimetre, which is a smaller dimension than the thousandths of an inch a standard Imperial mic is showing. No big deal either way, and there isn't a lot outside of toolmaking that requires more accuracy than +-0.01mm (slightly smaller than half a thou).

Fabricating in mm I find easier than converting to Imperial - adding 64ths, eighths and the rest is just a pain in the butt. 620mm + 510mm is a simple thing, 2' 13/32" + 1' 6 5/64" - who needs that bs?

As for volume and weight, easy win to metric. A litre of water weighs a kilogram, a thousand of them weigh a ton and they fill a cubic metre. Thermal calcs are the same win to metric.

It's a bit like learning another language - it all seems clumsy until it falls into place, then it's easy.

Typically you would measure parts that long with a scale or a steel tape and either method is easy. And why would you be adding such dimensions anyway? Typically overall lengths are on the print. Adding fractions is too hard for you? Usually dimensions listed in fractions have large tolerances. The point is either way of measuring is pretty easy with the win going to SAE. By the way a thousand Kilos does not weigh a ton. That said are teaspoons, tablespoons and fractions of cups all that hard to follow? Quarts and gallon beyond your ability to grasp? Public school?

What does metric ton mean?
1000 kilograms
There has been a metric ton of something in this thread. grin
#nerdfight
What is heavier?

Shît-ton of something, or a metric shït-ton?
I got a like new Starrett micrometer off ebay for dirt cheap.



....it was metric:(
Originally Posted by Clarkm
I got a like new Starrett micrometer off ebay for dirt cheap.



....it was metric:(
Now you can figure out what all of those taps are that you have in buckets... 😄

Get yourself one of these too.
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]
Originally Posted by gunswizard
They tried to force the metric system on us in the early 1970's, it went nowhere.

It went nowhere? ..... So you're saying Americans can't multiply or divide by 10 and get it right? LOL
It’ll be pennywieght or hundred pound when the Man comes around!
OK, an inch is three barley corns laid end, a foot is the length of a man's foot. Pure simplicity right?
Originally Posted by denton
Metric is vastly easier, and fully as precise as our system. But if you grew up on our system, the transition is painful. The worst situation is a helter skelter mix of the two, which is what we have in the US.

So, is it a good idea to have engineers who can only work with the "vastly easier" system designing aircraft and bridges?

Working with a slide rule can be tedious, but do we want people who don't have the capacity to deal with a slide rule designing spacecraft?

Digital calculators make arithmetic problems simple and easy, but do we want people who never develop enough number sense to solve 297^2 / 17^3 using a pencil and paper designing nuclear reactors?
Going to cut the grass in the back meter, then I'll open up a 44 and and kill a gram.
Originally Posted by RiverRider
Originally Posted by denton
Metric is vastly easier, and fully as precise as our system. But if you grew up on our system, the transition is painful. The worst situation is a helter skelter mix of the two, which is what we have in the US.

So, is it a good idea to have engineers who can only work with the "vastly easier" system designing aircraft and bridges?

Working with a slide rule can be tedious, but do we want people who don't have the capacity to deal with a slide rule designing spacecraft?

Digital calculators make arithmetic problems simple and easy, but do we want people who never develop enough number sense to solve 297^2 / 17^3 using a pencil and paper designing nuclear reactors?

Wrong questions. Irrelevant.

You can find the number of sheep in a flock by counting the legs and dividing by four. But there is an easier way.

There are a great many engineers in the world who design aircraft and bridges using only the metric system, or use the old system only incidentally. They seem to be doing alright.

SLIDE RULE???? Dear me. 'Tis quaint. At one time, I was very proficient with mine. I keep it as a momento. Haven't had reason to seriously use it in about 50 years.

Whether a person can or can't calculate squares and quotients by hand is irrelevant to the discussion of which system is better.

I have no stake in persuading you. I'm quite happy to let you work in whatever system you like. But I do take exception when some of the other posters give foolish and uninformed reasons for their choice, or resort to name calling.
is a dozen metric eggs 1.2 dozen?
Originally Posted by denton
There are a great many engineers in the world who design aircraft and bridges using only the metric system, or use the old system only incidentally. They seem to be doing alright.


...which is why they got to the moon first.

Seriously, though. This is so much like the MOA v. mils arguments. Whatever a fellow is competent with and comfortable using will work for him. There is no solid, compelling reason to force the metric system upon an unwilling country.
Originally Posted by RiverRider
Originally Posted by denton
There are a great many engineers in the world who design aircraft and bridges using only the metric system, or use the old system only incidentally. They seem to be doing alright.


...which is why they got to the moon first.

Seriously, though. This is so much like the MOA v. mils arguments. Whatever a fellow is competent with and comfortable using will work for him. There is no solid, compelling reason to force the metric system upon an unwilling country.

On that, we heartily agree.
Originally Posted by SuperCub
Originally Posted by gunswizard
They tried to force the metric system on us in the early 1970's, it went nowhere.
It went nowhere? ..... So you're saying Americans can't multiply or divide by 10 and get it right? LOL
It’s not that they “can’t”, but that they ignorantly refuse to. Almost as if it comes from “soccer nations”!

😆😆
Originally Posted by rickt300
Originally Posted by mathman
I can't believe some of the irrational bullshit I'm reading here.

An interesting thought, tell me how measuring in thousandths of an inch is harder than measuring in millimeters. And tell me how using a Metric steel tape is easier or faster than using one set up for inches.

[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]

WTF ?

When did conthairs become mm's ?
Looked it up, there are multiple definitions of the standard meter length and those have changed over the years.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metre
Originally Posted by Swamplord
Originally Posted by rickt300
Originally Posted by mathman
I can't believe some of the irrational bullshit I'm reading here.

An interesting thought, tell me how measuring in thousandths of an inch is harder than measuring in millimeters. And tell me how using a Metric steel tape is easier or faster than using one set up for inches.

[Linked Image from i.postimg.cc]

WTF ?

When did conthairs become mm's ?


What does the metric system use in place of color coded ones?
"A thin blonde one?"What about time?



How does the ErroAsiaFriken [bleep] deal with time?

That's gotta hurt their little heads.
60 seconds/minute 60 min/hrs.
7 days, /week
4 weeks/month, But not even weeks, 28, 30 or 31 days. Sometimes 29


12 months of uneven days, or 52 weeks but not really......
Originally Posted by ironbender
It’s not that they “can’t”, but that they ignorantly refuse to. Almost as if it comes from “soccer nations”!

😆😆

There’s enough wiggle room in FIFA regs that you can have a 105m x 70m soccer pitch, but the critical goal and penalty box dimensions are still 100% Imperial.

https://sports.yahoo.com/big-world-...Ppv2CJX4tANm340czHIhzVplOnsxgApr14NX987S
Originally Posted by RiverRider
Seriously, though. This is so much like the MOA v. mils arguments. Whatever a fellow is competent with and comfortable using will work for him. There is no solid, compelling reason to force the metric system upon an unwilling country.

Has anyone brung up the infamous failed Mars mission yet?

What really surprises me is that Imperial units were employed anywhere in the whole process.

125 million and maybe a few careers out the window…..

https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-1999-oct-01-mn-17288-story.html
Using only one system when getting my engineering degree would have nice.
Originally Posted by mjbgalt
Originally Posted by Valsdad
Originally Posted by rickt300
Originally Posted by Valsdad
Originally Posted by mjbgalt
But the places with metric often have Celsius too. Which is less precise than fahrenheit.

So tell us how it's about precision and accuracy lol

Could be like 3 or four degrees colder or hotter, same temp in C
Is there an issue with measuring Celsius to the 0.001 degree C?

Please explain the rationale of having water freeze at 32 degrees vs 0 degrees.

Why is that significant?


Because mjbgalt says Celsius is less precise than Fahrenheit.

I'd like to hear how, and why.

Just told you. One degree of C could be several degrees of F...it is less precise.

Yes, but C is measured in tenths of a degree also.

And, there are only 100 degrees C between freezing and boiling points, instead of 180 degrees F which would appear to make C more precise than F, no?

It's a measuring system, just like any other measuring system. Cubits, rods and chains, parsecs, bushels and pecks, quarts and cups and ounces, etc to no end.

The difference, as I understand it, is it is in base 10 (decimal system) which makes it relatively easy to multiply and divide parts equally across the system.

Instead, certain parts of the West are still using measuring systems with differing, and somewhat more difficult to use, bases. Those, once learned and memorized, are easy enough for regular users to understand. Sometimes. I've known folks in their 40's that still have to look up how many quarts in a gallon and then how many ounces does that multiply out to. But, a liter is always 1000 milliliters. Or 100 centiliters. Or 10 deciliters. Easy peasy scheidt I tell you.

I say let's go back to

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persian_units_of_measurement
Quote
And, there are only 100 degrees C between freezing and boiling points, instead of 180 degrees F which would appear to make C more precise than F, no?

No.

If we're working in whole degrees then Farenheit degrees cut finer.
Originally Posted by mathman
Quote
And, there are only 100 degrees C between freezing and boiling points, instead of 180 degrees F which would appear to make C more precise than F, no?

No.

If we're working in whole degrees then Farenheit degrees cut finer.

Global warming is scarier in Celsius.
Originally Posted by mathman
Originally Posted by RiverRider
Originally Posted by mathman
I can't believe some of the irrational bullshit I'm reading here.




Many are saying essentially, English system over metric system. What's irrational about that?


It's not about the preference. The "reasoning" behind the preference is faulty.
mathman,

...............You weren't expecting anything other than faulty reasoning here, were you?

PS, if I was nearby I'd buy you a couple of fingers of nice Scotch for your comments on this thread.
Originally Posted by mathman
Quote
And, there are only 100 degrees C between freezing and boiling points, instead of 180 degrees F which would appear to make C more precise than F, no?

No.

If we're working in whole degrees then Farenheit degrees cut finer.

I prefers dem hole nummers.

deys mush eeziar to deal wif then dem frackshun things.
Originally Posted by MPat70
It's been a dual system my entire life so 🤷🏻‍♂️ it is what it is. Own both metric and sae tools. Metric won't go away.

Same here. Metric can be real handy when needing to repair stripped threads. The next size larger is much closer to original than going up in SAE.
First time I went to England I was confused when everyone was using the imperial system. I ask for directions and they give them to me in miles….when I asked about it at the Pub the guys laughed and said they use both but a lot of the English preferred using miles, inches, etc. This was around 1993 so maybe it’s different now but it surprised me since I’d always heard that we’re the only ones using inches, miles, yards, etc.

I prefer the old system, not metric. If only because I don’t want to follow the effeminate Europeans in ANYTHING they do. 😀
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