Vatican reaffirms 'grave sin' of Freemasonry, says Catholics cannot join the world's largest secret society

Freemasonry has been prohibited for Catholics since 1738, when Pope Clement XII called the secret society 'depraved and perverted'

Guess the Catholic Church knows a little about Perverted organizations.....

https://www.foxnews.com/faith-value...annot-join-worlds-largest-secret-society

If I were Catholic, I'd ignore anything coming out of the current Kooky Pope's mouth if it wasn't scripture. That guy is determined to destroy the church.

Unfortunately, I (and maybe lotsa other folks) have come to view the Vatican as depraved and perverted over the last few years. I wouldn't do the opposite of what the so-called "pope" instructs without thinking, but I sure don't believe that this creep is a man of God. quite the opposite, IMO.

The ban on Freemasonry goes way back.

The primary reason is “Indifferentism” (belief in any god is approved for Freemasonry).

Pope Francis is actually quite conservative, the press just reports what they want to hear.

One of the MSM’s big lies is “Who am I to judge” when he was speaking about homosexuality.

That is accurate as far as it goes. The church does not judges souls. The Church judge’s actions. Thus, homosexual acts are prohibited.

The Church is required by Christ to bring sinners to Christ. But the MSM never reports the “repent and believe in the gospel” part.

Pope Francis is currently telling some German Bishops that they cannot bless a homosexual unions.

BMT

Just about the only thing in which Catholicism and I are in agreement

Matthew 7:15

Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves.

There's no hope in the pope.

Correct

There is no hope in any man.

There is hope in the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit

The Pope is a fuggin' commie

Infallible in matters of faith or as Archie Bunker said, “The Pope is inflammable”.

Mortal man is infallible. Go figure that one.

Amen sir.

Rope.

The Catholic Church objected to Freemasonry for hundreds of years. The Pope is not popular because he is not in step with interests of the West. His speeches and referrals to war in 🇺🇦 are perfect examples of this. The Catholic Church hierarchy is not in step with radical social issues pushed by Western elites referred to on here as "Cabal". Is it Western Canal, Great Cabal? I forgot.

Ohhhh boy! Bringing back a bad memory from 1988:

Dad was a 32nd degree Mason, and very proud of that.

At his viewing, his brother Masons began performing their ritual at Dad's open casket.
My sister, who claimed to be a born again Christian, stood up, began shouting and quoting Scripture at them, and made them pack up their kit and exit the funeral home post haste!
Mom looked like she was going to have a heart attack and make it a double ceremony!
I'm sure that no one there will ever forget that day.

My sister has a special way of fu#king things up at every opportunity.

Rope-a-pope?

This sister thing, Are you Fireball’s brother by chance?

Masonry bad, homosexual good.
Be interesting to see who proceeds him and the direction the church takes.

Both of you nailed it.

And all of the Free Masons I know are damn good folks.
They do a lot of good charity work, like their Shriner’s Children's Hospital.

And they don’t facilitate fuggin child molesters, like the Pope.

For his sake, I sure hope not! I wouldn't wish that witch to be a part of anyone's family.

Keep the pope off the Moon.

Maybe 20 years back there was an exhibit came to town…..

The Treasures of the Vatican…. lots of riches and art works from across Centuries.

It absolutely made my skin crawl and I was raised Catholic.

OTOH I know and have known many, many good people who are practicing Catholics; my mom for example.

But I do distrust the Clergy, and that exhibit to me reeked of perversion.

The Catholic Church does many good things for mankind like their Saint Vincent de Paul centers for example and like you I know many good, practicing Catholics and they’re very disturbed with the direction this Pope taken.

The New Orleans Diocese has claimed bankruptcy due to claims against it for clergy misbehavior. Tithes and donations have totally dried up if the media can be believed.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/pope-francis-texas-bishop-strickland-b2445810.html


The pope is clearly not a man of God. He's a communist and nothing more.

Aren’t the Knights of Columbus the Catholic version of Freemasonry?

To that I would add the Catholic Hospitals serving the poor around the world. There are many unsung Mother Theresa types, both men and women, quietly laboring amid the poverty-stricken out there.

The whole celibacy thing always seem unnatural to me. Maybe too because back in the 60’s I attended a Catholic Middle School-level Institution taught by an Order of Lay Irish Brothers. Of the maybe ten Brothers, it turned out two were active homosexual pedophiles.

I was never a victim but the vibe was there. It is simply astonishing today what was overlooked back then.

When I was about 10 years old, I told my mother I wanted to be a Catholic. She about had a fit and began hauling my young ass to the Episcopal church every week, whether my father got out of bed or not.

She never asked why. One reason was because my best friend at the time was a Catholic and had me convinced that only Catholics would go to heaven, everyone else would go to hell. The big reason though, was because another friend, a guy a little older who knew about everything, told me the Catholic churches had a lot of gold hidden in the back rooms and they had arsenals full of weaponry in the basements.

Raping children and covering it up is forgivable. Being involved in a prestigious non catholic club is a sin. Interesting group of folks, they should unite with muslim scum and start a whole new religion.

The Catholic Church has had this right from the start.

PS The reason the Catholic Church started The Knights of Columbus was to minimize the temptation for Catholic men to join Freemasonry. The idea was that this was a men's club that gave a similar kind of benefit to its members, but without all the problems associated with Freemasonry.

I know 2 men that belong to both organizations one of which is a District Attorney.

The pope is a dope.

I don’t think that the man is a dope. He’s riding herd over one of the world’s larger entities and lives in a fishbowl for most everyone to watch his every move and hear his every word.

This is generally correct

The Knights of Columbus began as a men’s group in New Haven CT

Link: https://www.kofc.org/en/who-we-are/our-history/founding-and-early-acts.html

There is absolutely nothing the catholic hierarchy could say that would be believable or interesting.

Since Catholicism is a doctrine of works and not Grace who cares

I think joining clubs or groups to be unhealthy.

I refuse to be a member of any club or group that would have me as a member.

That is wildly mistaken. Not nearly enough room to explain in this thread, link:



https://www.catholic.com/magazine/print-edition/faith-and-works-0

Can Catholics take their kids to a shiner's hospital?

Be interesting to ask his holiness this.

Yes.

Catholic hospitals also offer services to Shriners.

Link explaining issues:

https://www.catholicnewsagency.com/news/256045/explainer-why-can-t-a-catholic-join-the-freemasons

Ditto

Amazes me to see the Catholics call freemasonry a cult. They believe and do a whole bunch of shìt thats not in the Bible and a bunch more that the Bible says not to do. Pray to the dead, ask men for forgiveness, hail Mary's, worship Mary, etc... And they have an empire of monetary riches like no other.

My father was a 32nd degree Mason, Scottish Rite, Jester and Legion of Honor! He always said the Knights of Columbus was a cheap imitation of the Masons!

Have the Mason’s started investigating pedophila?

The Pope should work on his own mess first...

Matthew 7:3-5

The institutional Catholic Church went bad after Vatican II.

That's stretching the Biblical definition of works. It's only works if works includes understanding the basics of Christianity, being a member of the Church (in some sort of way), accepting Christ, and being sorry for one's sins. I'm not sure that's what the New Testament authors meant by works, but I could be wrong.

My mom's older brother (my uncle), too.

Yep, but with a far worse God Complex than most commies.

You could literally switch "Masonic" and replace it with "Roman Catholic priesthood" and it would still be true.

The big difference is the Knights of Columbus have bars in them. Masons don’t.

Sounds like Plan Trusting.
C anon? The Papist are in control.

"Would you like to see the Pope on the end of a rope, do you think he's a fool?"

Black Sabbath - 1971

I am a Master Mason and will freely admit there were things said and done in my 1st, 2nd and 3rd that I didn't like or agree with.

not just the Pope ..back in late 70's early 80's .our independent Baptist preacher , at the church we went to when i was a teenager ,Use say FreeMasons was of the devil and we should not join them .to him you was taking an oath to someone other than God or something like that ..been too long to remember right .but he didnt like them at all and preached against them

Errant preachers of all faiths have caused a lot of problems in this old world.

That is evident when ever a religion thread pops up on the 24HCF.

yes and he sure caused a lot of un neccessary problems in our family between dad and us kids ,dad believed everything that guy said

Many of us have seen this happen. Splits families, ruins what was good friendships, etc.

Do tell. Why ? What's your issue?

What are the alleged problems?

Not for free !

Please! It's a form of Satanism. How blind could you be?

Every time I am in a Catholic church stuff is said that makes me cringe.

Can anyone here cite the specific source and circumstances in which God granted or assigned such authority to the Pope?

There isn't a thing in masonry that's even remotely demonic or satanic. I also refuse to believe that God is so petty as to give a damn about an old man's club. If anything, the lodge is based off of biblical text.

Has he banned f ucking kids yet?

Ouch.



Brings to mind the old “How do you get a nun pregnant?” joke.

LMAO! Good one Bob !

What's the point of being a "free mason"?

Damn satanist!

Getting to wear a cute sash? Is that the main perk?

Nothing more than a fraternal order. Being one does not make you any better than anyone else. You get out of it what you put into it. I do not feel that I am any worse off for being a Mason. It’s all about self improvement. I find it interesting and built upon solid moral values and principles.

Really?

“When the Mason learns that the key to the warrior on the block is the proper application of the dynamo of living power, he has learned the mystery of his craft. The seething energies of Lucifer are in his hands and before he may step onwards and upwards he must prove his ability to properly apply this energy.”

Albert Pike, Morals and Dogma

"Lucifer, the Light-bearer! Strange and mysterious name to give to the Spirit of darkness! Lucifer, is the Son of the Morning! It is he who bears the Light.”

Albert Pike, Morals and Dogma

Internet query. That's not masonic or even in anything to do with the lodge. And also, you should probably read in the Bible and see that "lucifer" indeed means light bearer and never one time refers to Satan. In fact, the word lucifer is used 1 time in the Bible.

So you're a Lucifer fan?

Yes, he does appear as an angel of light. Says that in the Bible, too.

- 2nd Corinthians 11:14

Isn’t there some relationship between the Shriners, the Masons, the Knights Templar and the Rosecrucians?

Isaiah 14:12 was never meant to be interpreted as Satan and lucifer being one. That's a later interpretation that doesn't stand up to scrutiny by biblical scholars. Lucifer is the name for the planet Venus and the verse was in reference to the king of Babylon at the time.

Shriners and Templars are appendant bodies of the masonic blue lodge.

Yep. My uncle was a 32nd Degree Freemason and a Shriner. He had the full Shriner funeral service. Pictures of him in his fez in his and his wife's home, that I recall from childhood.

Shriners drive little cars in parades. How could you not want to join up wit them?

LOL. Yep, I remember a year or two ago they had something going on down the street, where there used to be a Masonic lodge (recently converted to a black church), and they were driving around in those.

It is, at it's best, a mutual backscratching society. At it's worst... it's much worse.

I expect that there are quite a few here that belong to that society, and I think most don't even comprehend the criticisms.

I’m pretty sure you have to be a Mason to join the Shriners.

They have an outstanding Children’s Hospital.
Like I said before, every one of them I know are damn good folks.

They have over 100 locations to access free care and they’re international.

Founded 100 years ago in 1922.

At best you are very misinformed.

Jmo

Look at the back of a dollar bill if you don't think freemasonry played a big role in the principals and attitudes of the founding fathers.

No stonework, however, buttraping boys is GTG - gotta love Catholics.

So what is the point of freemasonry?

My great Granddad, and Granddad were Shrines, I am not.

The Shrines build hospitals.

Agreed.

It's just comraderery and a club.

SATAN is determined to destroy the church.

Drinking coffee and smoking cigarettes downstairs before meetings.

Or as a prerequisite to being a Shiner

I don’t care, fuqqkk the pope, he’s a piece of shhitt.

Masons build all the Shriners Hospitals

Every single one!!!!

Sounds retarded

Yes indeed.

They can't tell you.

I just did. It's about comraderey and friendship. Then there's giving back to the community also.

Freemasonry is Satanism

the inner circle of the club (WEF/MOSSAD) are working to eliminate Christianity in order to establish the one world religion with the AntiChrist as their horned king

the rest of the "good works" members are blind sheep , useful idiots

You know nothing. You sound like the people that post conspiracy videos on tiktok.

It's funny that some one who does not have a dog in this fight would have no clue as to which side you were for or against.

Basically Rotary with a snazzy dress code.

Well you're a proven fucking idiot so I guess that's a Plus 1 for the Masons.

That said I bet you got a whole bunch of anti Pope hate boiling right beside your anti semite hate.

It must be exhausting for you to figure out who scares you the most on any given day.

The Scottish Rite of Freemasons is the gentile/goyim order that is allowed to exist with money & power, as established by the Talmudic Yids , so long as they obey the commands of their masters and work mindlessly in assisting to establish the One World Government

Most if not all .... of the millionaires, politicians, judges, lawyers, doctors, professors. etc. etc. are in the coven of Satanists with varying levels of knowledge of the true goals of Freemasonry, the higher the degree the more they are allowed to know and attain wealth beyond any normal citizen

The rest of the rabble are zombies, clueless and blind like rats in cages waiting for the masters instructions for the next mission, expendable drones

I see we have some of those mendicants here

A known Pedophile like you has zero credibility ... Why do you even bother to post anything on an intelligent conversation ?

Did your handlers lengthen your leash and allow a bit more internet time ?

Yeah, like "I do ". oh crap no, don't say that! Don't ever say that!

I think the investigation of the Catholic Church should be left to the Police.

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 what a maroon.

Catholic news agency ? I'm sure that's an unbiased source.

Like going to the DNC to explain Election Law

Can you stop with the sound bites and cloak and dagger crap.
What's your point? Do you have one ?

Sure they can. They even have bumperstickers 2B1ASK1

Good boy! I hope you get a nice head pat for that.

It would certainly appear that way

Nothin' like a Catholic Freemason thread to bring out the kooks. Almost like a Jew thread.

So, because it's "biased", nothing they say is true? Please elaborate. Tell us all about the true rites, rituals, oaths, beliefs, and practices of freemasonry. Dispel all our misunderstandings, ignorance, and foolishness.

As the Orthodox church says "How can one man purport to speak for God to the world?".

This is just one example of papal arrogance:

https://www.oca.org/orthodoxy/the-orthodox-faith/church-history/eleventh-century/pope-gregory-vii

Pope Gregory VII

The reforming spirit of the Roman Papacy in the 11th century reached its height under Hildebrand who, as Pope Gregory VII (r. 1073–1085), firmly established the Papacy as a secular power. In a document called the Dictatus papae, he advocated the most extreme interpretation as yet of Papal authority in both church and state: “the Roman pontiff alone is to be called universal” (or “ecumenical”); “he alone can depose or reinstate bishops”; “he alone may use the imperial insignia”; “the pope is the only one whose feet are to be kissed by all princes”; “he may depose emperors”; “he himself may be judged by no one”; “to this see the most important cases of every Church should be submitted”; “the Roman Church has never erred, nor ever, by the witness of Scripture, shall err to all eternity”; “the Roman pontiff, if canonically ordained, is undoubtedly sanctified by the merits of St Peter.”

Should we always discount the reliability of information based on the source rather than the merits of the information…?

The source is an important consideration. What does he, she, it have to gain or lose by this being true or false?

The truth is also an important consideration, regardless of the source. Should we discount the truth because we don’t like the source…?

The Catholic Church has basically become a homosexual mafia the past few centuries and continues protecting homosexual pedophile priests. The church still refuses to take any responsibility for the thousands of lives their priests destroyed and all of the cover ups and refusal to help in child rape investigations. Why anyone would still support the Catholic Church is mind boggling.

I was raised Catholic, and there are a number of great Catholic folks that are near and dear to me.
My Dad's side of the family had a number of Masons (including he, my uncle and Papa). Many of my close friends belong as well.
In general, my interactions with Freemasons have been 'better' than those with alleged 'christians' preaching what they see as The Truth.

Analyze only the validity of the points made, rather than considering the source.

The source often gives insight into the truth.

Gaydar test image.

Got to be, what, 11 there?

Biased source should be ignored as, you know, the Catholic Church was adamant there was no priest molestation of Altar boys.

Give me one reason why a person should do anything the pope suggests?

Don't forget ponzi scheme...

https://news.yahoo.com/english-courts-order-vatican-disclose-150000932.html

Jeebus. Another tiktok watcher. So let me ask you this since you are another that apparently believes a Scottish Rite Mason with the honorary 33rd degree is an end all be all..
What about the other appendant body, The York Rite and their highest degree, the Templars? Why are they not "in the know?"
Let me guess, you didn't know that there was another appendant body of masonry? Go find a tiktok video about that.

Aside from belief in the Almighty what do Christians and Freemasons have in common?

Which Christians (I’ll use the correct uppercase and assume we’re talking about folks who don’t just talk the talk) and which Freemasons?
Both groups include a tremendous variety of folks.

I know a lot of Masons. My dad and grandfather was one. I’m not going to ever be one, but still have respect for them. My dad never pushed the Masonic idea or any religion or talk there of on me. Just know, most of our founding fathers were masons.

It would be funny if the masons released a statement saying something like that’s ok, we wouldn’t take Catholics anyway. But the masons it seems can out class the Catholics in this case by not criticizing them.

Do you have to know how to cut stone with a chisel, lay rock, brick, block, pour concrete? Tile, etc? To be a Mason?

??

No. Most weren't.

Ok, not sure how many because I don’t really think about it much. But there were some. Doesn’t that piss you off?

True. Just 9 of the 56 signers of the Declaration of Independence were.

Nope. It never was about that.

Yep

And pay union dues yearly

Being a good person isn't enough.

Good people do His work.

People going to Heaven strive to be with Him even here on Earth.
Doing works in any other name is in vain.

Repeat, “His work”.

I guess I misunderstood you. Or are you disagreeing with me?

Doing works in the name of the Grand Architect of the Universe <> doing works in the name of Jesus Christ.

Been in for 41 years seen good people and turds in. Usually exposes turds quick Foundation in charity an being a better neighbor to our fellow man And yes guilty every day that im trying to take over the world and all this satanic crap is dumbassery an proves you know crap... if you dont believe in God you WILL be led out before you see the inside of the lodge

Any god, though, right? Baphomet, Baal, Ra?

There is only one God the father hawkeye

Thanks, but I'm no god, and certainly not the only one.

PS A comma would have helped, LOL.

But I actually read it as if there was a comma, and know what you meant to say. Glad you feel that way, but the religion behind Freemasonry does not. It teaches that God the Father and Lucifer are on equal footing.

No it's doesn't.

"Secret" Rituals etc etc, stupid looking hats, hanging around a male only "club" filled with Boomers, etc.....nah I think Im good without!!

The Masons or the Pope and Clergy?

LOL

The Shriners wear the goofy hats. All shriners are Masons but not all Masons are Shriners. It amazes me when people believe goofy shìt and rumors because they have a fear of what they don't know. If you really knew what our "secrets" are, you'd laugh. It's just something to differentiate ourselves with.
And Mark, the rest of my rant wasn't focused at you. Just a generalization.

Well, Grandad was a Mason and he’d tell you pretty quick that Catholicism was a false religion (“in the pope we hope” was his line😂).

So I suppose it was mutual…..

^ 👍

Your line of defense is Tik Tok ? LMAO !
I Don't have that app, lol !

It is quite clear some of you here are absolutely clueless on what Freemasonry is and what their goals are ...

"Muh daddy & grandpa were Masons" .. really ? so stupidity does run in the family .....

My Great grandpa's Shriner sward is around here.

Were you ever a Mason?

No, I'm actually a Mason and was master of my lodge from 21-22. I'm also a Knights Templar in the York Rite which is "as high as you can go." I bring up tiktok because that's the kind of stupid rumors that are on there and people spread the lies and the oblivious believe them because they have nothing else to go off of.

Ok, cool !
(not really)

You've reached the peak of where the blind goyim are allowed to be at .

Beyond that is pure evil

So when a person gets to a certain "level", THEY sit him down and say,
"Alright man, now here's the real deal."...
Lmao. It's as stupid as it sounds. There's no supernatural shìt in this world. Just people living and judging others.

Sucks doesn't it ?

you sell your soul to the devil and do as you're told like a fkn slave but still can't be in with the boys in the circle, and have no fkn clue what the clubs real goals are ....

Maybe it's time to do some real research ?

Both!!!

Again. That's retarded. Theres no such thing as "evil" for one. And, I'm already as high as you can go so when do I get to learn the dark arts?

So just some old guys with soft hands, never touched a bag of Type-N,S and likely have to call a plumber even for wussy stuff like a clogged kitchen drain?

10-4

But the rings are cool

Is Jesus mentioned in any of the rituals?

OK....


This alone should be telling.

Only GOD. Actually, belief in Jesus is left up to the individual. It's not a religion nor is it claimed to be.

Sorry but I believe in taking responsibility for my own actions and not pawning them off on a perfect person that absolutely doesn't deserve it, all in the name of not being able to help myself because I'm being tempted by invisible forces.

As high as you are allowed to go .....

Think hard about that...

Were you ever a Mason?

That's a pretty weird thing to say.
Is that what you think Christianity is about?

Who said "allowed" except you?

I do now. I used to be a Christian, raised all my life as such until I decided to take the perspective of an outside observer and come up with my own conclusions because like most people, I was indoctrinated into the belief. I now see it as a crutch and it sounds completely weird being objective. Demons, dragons, devil, angels, a God that loves you so much that he created a hell even knowing that the majority of his creation would end up there. I believe in a God, but not a God that's obsessed with blood, sacrifices and worship. But my opinion doesn't have to be anyone else's.

Houston: were you ever old Toot? Idiot.

But it aligns with what others have been saying about the Masons, and you made their point for them.

How so? Because I'm personally no longer a Christian and don't believe in supernatural bullshìt?

Do you consider The Grand Architect of The Universe and His Creation as supernatural bullscchitt?

Look, I'm not dogpiling on the Masons. I don't care either way, but for them that claim you are "satanic" at worst, and unchristian at best you proved them right with your posts.

I am ambivalent leaning to supporting them myself. The Shriners at least do God's work with the hospitals and no-one can gainsay that.

I believe everything is a sum of science and physics. Who or what put them into motion is who or what I consider as "God." What many think of as miraculous things in the Bible are likely nothing more than science and physics taking place in a form that wasn't understood by bronze age goat herders.

Fair enough. I appreciate your honesty.

Then why is God mentioned?

The Masons are the Swamp.... Worldwide

That is the TRUTH !

In the USA we have political parties established to divide the citizens ... Democrats vs Republicans and etc ...

The politicians may present themselves to the public as Democrat or Republican etc ... BUT they all are members of the same club and kneel to one master who controls them ...


When a Mason tells you that they are a harmless group of fellows who gather at night to play cards or do good works for their fellow man .... It simply means he and those like him have not been accepted into real Freemasonry

These are the low level cucks who are not worthy, yet make the most noise

Your sources for all of this?

Considered to be the creator. And Jesus not? Considered by many to be the Son of God but also not considered by many (non-Christians) to be the Son of God. As I said, Freemasonry is not a religion but belief in a higher power, whoever it may be called, is a requirement.

Exactly.
The difference between this, current Progressives and Baal worshippers is about zero. Add in some charity (ripped off from Christianity) to make it palatable to the masses.

I can see where this is relevant. The Trinity is the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. The Father, God, created the universe and all that is in it. He passed down rules and laws for living in the universe he created which is the Old Testament. He intended for man to follow those rules and everything would be just fine.

Man, being weak and arrogant revolted against those laws. God sent his son, Jesus to prepare a pathway so man could turn from his sins and enter the place God had intended for him all along, the New Testament.

The Holy Spirit is God’s influence on the lives of those who have accepted His pathway and are trying to live according to his moral compass. If a person has truly accepted Christ as the savior, the Holy Spirit is reflected in his life and people recognize that. They might not understand but they recognize there is something different about that person.

Yep.

You mean to give Catholic men an opportunity to join an organization that is controlled by the Roman Catholic church. Freemasonry is beholden to no man, and the popes have had a problem with that for a long time.

I cannot believe the rhetoric here. I am a Mason, Past Master, 32d Degree AASR. Number one the Masons is NOT a religion! Period! You must believe in a Supreme Being and only one Supreme Being, monotheism. Religion and Politics are forbidden topics in the Lodge. It would be kind of hard to plot to take over the world when you are not allowed to discuss politics. This two subjects are banned from discussion because they cause division. The Masons are a Fraternity of Good Men trying to become better men. It is not a secret society. The meeting places are clearly marked and there are sign saying when we meet. There are secrets but they are no big deal. They are just to separate us from non Masons, nothing more.

Christianity is a religion. I am a Christian. The main two beefs about Masons not being compatible with Christianity is:

#1. Masons say if you live a good life you will get to heaven. Christianity says if you believe Jesus Christ is your personal savior who died for your sins you will get to heaven. Remember Freemasonry is NOT a religion. You worship the God of your choice in the manner you choose.

#2. Taking an oath. Christians or the Bible in general says about not taking an oath to any entity except God. They are talking about taking an oath of allegiance against God. We take a lot of oaths. I took a few to join and re-enlist in the military, you take them in the courtroom. Sure Masons take an oath but they most certainly do not take an oath of allegiance against God!

The sin of Adam and Eve was the attempt to attain perfection without God.

The sin of Nimrod in building the Tower of Babylon was the attempt to reach Heaven without God.



Just something to keep in mind.

BINGO! ...... Spot on!

The Pope can’t be the one to do this when this is a Christian tradition that dates as far back as mystery cults/societies themselves.

I don't know squat about Masons, Catholics, Templars, or whathaveyou. I don't claim to, either.

I DO know some Masons, and some Catholics, and some Jews, even. And I know there are good and bad people in any gathering, even in Christian gatherings.

It's human nature, gather up enough people and you'll find diamonds and turds. That's the way it is.

All this squabbling about does no good to anyone, why don't we all try to find good things instead of bad, in all that we look at? It might be better for the whole world, and us in general.

Be a diamond, not a turd.

Its religion, if religion it may be called, is the unbiased belief in the one living an true God.. sound familiar?

Catholic Church, really all religions, is about control and lining their pockets.

Ummmm.....
Drink coffee and smoke
Once a month we eat

Which part of you worship the God of your choice in the manner that you choose don't you understand. Freemasonry is not a religion; it is religious, but not a religion!

You can literally worship Satan himself and be a Freemason. I’d never even consider being in it!

Listen to the testimony of those who were also of the highest degree and then left it. They speak the truth and reveal facts the FM don’t want exposed or shared.

Two things, first is that the papacy clown cannot ban anyone from anything. Second is that Freemasons are adults and can go about their lawful endeavours as they will.

In Whom Do You Put Your Trust?

False. We don't accept Satanists into our fraternity.

Would you accept a Muslim?

If he believes in God.

And must pass a strict an thorough investigation And impeccable refrences and a unanimous vote... i might add respectively to remember the WM charge to the EA.. and not get lead into an argument with those who, through ignorance, may ridicule it..

This is my belief also. ^^^ 👍 I've never been able to describe it as succinctly as you did, however. Thanks.
I'm curious what "religion" you consider yourself following.

FWIW, I am a Mason - not active in a looong time, but raised up as such while I was still in college.

Question: What might constitute a difference between Satan and Lucifer, the Light Giver?

Also, I am curious….. given your condescending comment regarding “goat herders,” I would assume you don’t hold Christians with much regard. Would a Christian not pass the “entrance exam?”

Pick a fight much...and are you saying they weren't goat herders?


Does the Christian believe in God, and what is his character...you know, all the relevant info and such.

- - - Due to my experience to date, this also triggers some curiosity. What does it mean for one to "follow" a religion, or consider doing so? What does a person "follow"?

Is this based on a concept of discovering a structure of principles/rules/beliefs set by other humans and deciding to adhere to those, or formulating those for oneself, or ???. Or, does it involve belief in a higher level being - one having beyond-human insight/wisdom/power - and subjecting oneself to the teachings/directives of that being? Or, some other trail to be followed?

If he's Moslem, he doesn't believe in God (even though Allah means "God" in Arabic, it's an imposter god).
https://biblereasons.com/allah-vs-god/

Re: JSTUART

Well, you make me smile!

But, yeah, I do once in awhile.

Had a pretty negative job evaluation one time….was told that one of my flaws was that I had “no tolerance for “bullshit.”

Satan is only Satan in the Bible, other times referred to as the devil. The term Lucifer was used to describe the kind of Babylon at the time and the church later used the term to refer to Satan (which it doesn't .) I was a Christian myself for 37 of my 40 years here on earth until I realized that Jesus didn't teach religion in his teachings. My use of goat herders wasn't condescending by any means. It was a reference to the uneducated people at the time that thought unexplainable things happening via science and physics to them were "magical powers of God" because they didn't understand otherwise. And people today still take those things as supernatural because it was written in the Bible. And yes, many of Christians make it into lodge as I did when I was Christian.

I just want to set the record straight here. Yes Moslems can become Masons. The requirement is belief in One God, Period, no other stipulation! We don't discuss religion or what they call their God or how they worship their God. They worship the God of their choice in the manner of their choice.

Now...if only the rest of the world could do that!

Here are some quotes from Albert Pike….. “A prominent member of the Freemasons, Pike served as the Sovereign Grand Commander of the Supreme Council, Scottish Rite (Southern Jurisdiction, USA) from 1859 to 1891.” Probably the most influential Mason of his time…..

Here is quote from Pike wherein he clearly refers to Masonry as a “religion.”

“Masonry, like all the Religions, all the Mysteries, Hermeticism and Alchemy, conceals its secrets from all except the Adepts and Sages, or the Elect, and uses false explanations and misinterpretations of its symbols to mislead those who deserve only to be misled; to conceal the Truth, which it calls Light from them and to draw them away from it. p.104-5”
― Pike, Albert, Morals and Dogma of the Ancient and Accepted Scottish Rite of Freemasonry

Here is a quote from Pike and his description of Lucifer. Not quite the vague description you posted….” The term Lucifer was used to describe the kind of Babylon at the time…”

“Lucifer, the Light-bearer! Strange and mysterious name to give to the Spirit of Darkness! Lucifer, the Son of the Morning! Is it he who bears the Light, and with its splendors intolerable, blinds feeble, sensual, or selfish souls? Doubt it not!” – Albert Pike, Morals and Dogma of the Ancient and Accepted Scottish Rite of Freemasonry, p. 321, 19th Degree of Grand Pontiff.

Also……"When the Mason learns that the key to the warrior on the block is the proper application of the dynamo of living power, he has learned the mystery of his craft.

The seething energies of Lucifer are in his hands and before he may step onwards and upwards he must prove his ability to properly apply (this) energy."
Manly P. Hall (33º Freemason)


FWIW…. My father was a 33rd Degree Mason, Past Grand Master of the State of Arizona…and an active Shriner of Sabbar Temple in Tucson. I know some about Freemasonry. I quite clearly saw that my father considered the Freemasonry was the only religion he needed.

Further, the Masons do indeed require that a candidate for membership must express a “belief in God.” Ok, but note that they only have to believe in the “concept of God.” This is important as they do not have to declare WHAT their concept of God really is.

Different “concepts of God” as defined in Islam, Mormonism, Hinduism and Christianity are not compatible with one another.

If a man chooses to profess a belief that Lucifer was the brother of Jesus, that is OK by the Masons…. He has a “concept of God.” It makes no difference in the Masonic Order if this true or not. “True or Not?” An important distinction. Many prefer to believe the comforting lie rather than the uncomfortable truth.

Just curious but you are not a Mason, your father was? And he shared with you the things you claim to be Masonic facts? Or was your last post something you read about Freemasonry?

Much is written and shared on the subject, but not by Freemasons.

Good evening,
Geo

Legit inquiry given the nature of this discussion …..So…..

Masons who read this may choose to comment….. this is just a testimony.


I am not a Mason, my father was. He was devoted to it. Freemasonry is by nature a secret society and it is forbidden to share the secrets. You are correct that there is little written about Freemasonry by Masons…Albert Pike and a few other Masons are exceptions. Much is written by those who abandoned the order.

I attended many Masonic social functions when I was young. I knew many of my father’s Masonic friends, hunted with them etc….. as an aside….everyone of my father’s friends was a fine and upstanding man and citizen. I was told that if something ever happened to him, that the Masons would see to me and the family. I believe that to be true. There is little doubt that the “spirit of fraternity” was well developed in his lodge.

More…. When I was old enough, I attended a number of Demolay meetings and functions. My father was a 33rd degree Mason at that time. He progressed rapidly through the various degrees. I was expected to join and follow the process. I did not.

When Dad saw my reluctance, he began a soft but lengthy recruitment and began to tell me more about the order and answer my questions. He placed limits on many of his answers and often told me that I had to enter the order and if I did, the answers and secrets would be revealed in stages.

He repeatedly told me that I had to ask to join….or had to express interest in the order before I could join. No hard sell allowed and one had to pursue Masonry in some fashion before the initiation could begin.

Having said that, he told me that most who joined Masonry did not progress beyond the early and mid degree stages and that while Masonry was still important to them, they did not fully grasp the importance of it. He would have “acolytes” or new initiates repeatedly come to our residence for private counseling and instruction.

He would tell me that for most, the secrets and deep knowledge of the Masonic Order would remain unknown to those who did not progress to the 31st degree…. It was only then that the true secrets and knowledge of the 33rd Degree was revealed. Here in lies one of the main reasons I did not join… he described a society that kept its true secrets from its own members. This was a problem for me….in simple terms, he could not reveal “what I was signing up for.” It was made clear to me that he expected me to make a commitment….but he would not reveal what I committing to.

Anyway, that’s enough….gotta go…

Edit to add: my Dad was a Shriner as well…. He joined what he referred as the “mounted police” …. A group of thirty or so that would ride their matching motorbikes in various parades….he had great fun but always let me know that while the Shriners were great fun, the Masonic Order was more serious and more important.

Also…. My soft recruitment period was off and on for over 30 years.

Knights of Columbus and Knights Templar have swords and use them in their ceremonies, but Shriners do not.