With all the use of trail cameras these days,seems like it is an unfair advantage for hunter. Cameras sitting on water or bait 24 hrs a day.Are we getting lazier?Trophy at any cost?

Add a cell phone to the package and one won't have to endure the trip out to check things.

I do not use them because they would be stolen on public ground.

All they do is give you a picture, not like it kills the animal for you.

They already have them with cell connections. e-mails a picture to you online.

So if you go scouting a new area or a old one a couple of times and dont see a good animal,are you gonna still hunt that area.If you have a camera on a water source for a couple months and see there is a good animal coming in,you wont hunt there now?

This question sort of proves a delimma for me. On one hand, trail cameras add a whole new chapter of enjoying the outdoors. I can see the animals I chase year round and watch things I'd never see otherwise. On the other hand, it takes away a lot of the mystery and excitement of what 'might' be out there.



Sometimes I think the best place for my trail cameras would be at the same spot as my cell phone,.....at the bottom of a lake.


Just feel that maybe I should step away from all the technology and BS and just friggin' hunt.

the automatic update ones, yes could see those being bad......normal ones you have to go and check? all they tell you is where a critter has been in the past.....wish Montana's laws werent as strict cause i would like to use them to check some stuff out, less looking for horns more to try and see what other critters are around but the way Montana law i written you can only use them briefly during the year as they cant be used during ANY big game season....which means you can use them from about June 16 to Aug 14 this year.....

I like setting out in the off season. interesting to see animals.

never used to aid in hunting. kind of have mixed feelings in that regard.

We were given thumbs for a reason...

from what ive seen during our deer season mule deer move and act differently through the season as the rut usually kicks in the last couple weeks.....usefulness could be limited, know the elk we hunt move alot aswell....

know ppl elsewhere that use them and short of sitting in a tree stand with all the trails wired with the automatic update ones i honestly think though they are helpful they arent a huge advantage....

...a hunter with Class...

I have 4... no, 3 or them. One of those $200 boogers took a $200 poop. I have pics of alot of deer That I never see during hunting hours. The only deer that has ever been caught on camera and killed was 15 yards in front of my wifes tree stand and 2 days later during youth muzzle loader season a 14 year old kid sitting in a tent 400 yards from my front door killed it. I heard the shot and walked out to see the 192 " pig. I have a blue spruce in my yard the bucks love almost to death every year. I put a camera out there this year { 39 lazered yards from my back door} and caught 5 different bucks in one night. I have more than one picture of a 190 class 10 pointer rubbing the tree. Never see them while hunting tho

Is your truck fair chase or should you walk to the hunting woods? Binoculars? Radios? Rifle scope? It can get a little ridiculous. A deer that feeds and waters at night, isn't necessarily going to show up during the daylight. I don't use trail cams, but I can't see where they increase your odds of taking a trophy animal.

Dan

My viewpoint exactly -- almost. I think they can (but haven't yet for me) increase the odds of taking a trophy animal. For one thing, they can tell you a trophy animal is there, and help you make a decision where to hunt.


Funny how two people can think the same thing and come to the opposite conclusion. With all the animals I see on my trail cameras, I think they increase the mystery and excitement of what might be out there.

How can a thread on trail cameras can go on for 12 posts, and have no trail camera photos? To fix that, and to illustrate my point, check my picture of a bald eagle with an injured wing. (No food, no carrion, nothing to put it in front of the camera.) What happened to this eagle is a mystery, and it's always exciting here in these parts to see a bald eagle. She was in front of the camera for over 3 minutes, and in all 5 pictures she is holding her right wing so it doesn't drag on the ground.



There's a nest about 150 yards from here, and another about 400 yards, but they don't use the nests in November.

Is there a hunter anywhere who doesn't do anything to increase the odds of taking an animal? Why aren't we all using spears? Or digging pits and chasing the animals into them?

Steve.

Trail cameras are great for figuring out what or who is living on your back 40. Imagine my surprise when I discovered it was one of the guys who posts to 24hr.

Finally someone got a good picture of Big Foot. Instead of some blurry picture no one can tell if he is real or not.

Fairness isn't a concept that exists in nature. The idea of what is fair and not fair exists only in your head and in your head alone. Go to someone else's head and you'll find a totally different "fair".

In nature, you're either the windshield or the bug. Let's keep game management practices strictly to real numbers instead of bullschit artificial concepts.

Where do you draw the line. Take the scope away. Camo and scent lock clothing/not fair. You have to catch um with your bare hands.

If I could afford them there would be several on the farm just to see what it is that lurks in the night and sets the dog off. We usually have bear tracks in any fresh snow and it would be fun to see what he looks like.

Not really interested in using them for hunting.

+1

Fair chase is hunting naked, bare foot, and using only fingernails and teeth for weapons. God gave us smarts/dominion for a reason. Tools work much better.
I honestly dont understand how some can look down on others or judge eachothers ethics for using what God gave em, and then go buy a hamburger and think nothing about how fair the cow was treated. It wont ever be fair to be an animal, thats just the way it is. Wipe your tears and be glad your human.

Cameras don't give off scent,movement,much noise,sitting in the woods 24hrs a day,thats not a big advantage?
Maybe a bigger deal out west, in places where water is limited.

I do not think this was directed at me but just for the record I do not look down on those who use trail cams for hunting. It just is not why I would like a trail cam and I doubt I would ever use one for hunting. My trail cam would be busy keeping an eye on the new beaver dam of some other such thing as looking at what is trying to get into my chicken coop.

God gave us high fences,horse trailers also,do you use those tools to shoot your trophy there?

The local fly shop owner has always been very honest with me.

Ask him any question about anywhere and he'll answer it - rare for a fisherman and he explained it like this:

"I'll always tell you exactly where the fish are and what they're hitting on. Why would that bother me? I CAN'T make the cast or presentation for you and that's the IMPORTANT part - the rest, not so much."

I kind of look at it like that. I KNOW there are deer there, I KNOW where they travel - BFD. No camera is going to make that shot for me. I, STILL, have to knock that arrow or pull that trigger. It still requires me to have a skill.

We use cameras - sure. Have quite a few of them. If I set up a camera over a WalMart parking lot - I won't get much. I know where the deer are, I know where they move, what I don't know is WHAT deer are moving there or WHEN. I CAN'T be there 24/7. All a camera does is increase my odds of an encounter, it does nothing to increase my odds of the kill.

So long as it's legal - I could give a toss what someone else thinks or uses.

Deer cameras are a great entertainment tool, but I never thought much about using them as a hunting tool.
That is probably because I've used them enough as an entertainment tool to realize that they give little advantage to a guy hunting by legal methods. If you are a POS that will break the law anyway, a game camera is only gonna slow you down.

To get good game camera pic's you have to understand where game travels. Kinda like hunt for the spot. If you know game well enough, you set your camera where you get pictures. If you don't know game - or your ass from a hole in the ground - you get nothing. Kinda like hunting.

I can see them as a good educational tool for a guy that can't read animal sign and understand feeding and travel routes, etc... After a gob of years you might start figuring things out the round-about way.

I use cameras where I live for the shear entertainment and educational value. I was able to watch the progression of mange through the local coyote "herd" this year. I got to see the progressive beat-down of a fine set of unique antlers that were better in the looks dept. than function.
I was able to watch the attraction of what I'll call a sign post - something not usually mentioned for deer. A lone willow twig not much beyond 3/8" in diameter that was visited countless times by numerous deer, including at least 11 different antlered bucks. I could go on and on. I had to be smart enough to get the camera within bow range (less, actually) to get photos - I hunted for a good spot.

I do not use cameras where I hunt. I can recognize bedding areas, feeding areas, travel routes, scrape lines, etc...
I have never set a camera there.
I might, just for entertainment. I just killed the biggest racked deer there that I've seen come off the place in 40+ years of hunting, so I don't see a camera adding much to that.

I think that anybody that sees a camera as a threat to deer or hunting ethics needs to back away from the videos and outfitter BS for a while and spend some time in the woods.

They ain't hurtin a damned thing.

I don't use them, but don't care if others do.Not having them has not impaired my ability to keep my freezer full every year for many years.

Personally,my oinion, it is just another one of these high tech gadgets that make up for less than better hunting ability in the field.I guess some guys/gals do not have the opporunity to spend extra days in the field scouting and the cameras supplement that. I can hunt with a muzzle loader, iron sighted lever guns or scoped rifles and I still take animals consistently and not all of them are dinks.

If you set the cameras out and then know where the game is, it is sort of like hunting on these pheasant hunting preserves where they set the birds out in the dark,the morning you are to hunt.You know they are there and know pretty darn close as to exactly where that "there" is.


Some will do about anything to put an animal on the ground.More power to them. After a lot of years, one gets the idea that the killing isn't so important and the ego involved( bragging rights) fades.

Teal,

Increased odds of an encounter mean better odds for a kill.

Out here trail cams are useless. There is far too much open country and too low concentrations of deer. Scouting and spotting for long hours work.

If I lived back east it would be fun to see what lurks at night, but IMO technology might be going too far in the field, at least for the way I like to hunt.

To qualify how I feel I don't have an I-phone, don't text, etc. If there were still phone booths I'd probably not use my cell phone except for work. It is pretty much a generational thing, and I'm not pointing fingers at all. I like having choices.

BTW, I have a trail cam on my big elm tree in the yard and enjoy seeing what critters visited from off the desert every night. I see a lot of kinds I never see in the daytime.

I hold nothing against a person who uses trail cameras, scent lok, high power scopes, etc. Not looking for a pissing contest. Just sharing some things that have been on my mind last couple of years.


For myself, I think getting back to the basics and away from all the extras will help me enjoy hunting in a more pure way if that makes any sense. Archery hunting has shown me a whole different side to the chase and I think I would just feel a greater sense of achievement if I went back to the more primitive route.

Well here's to hoping that FLIR technology gets smaller and cheaper, and maybe they'll come up with some sound wave technology that brings them slobbering in like zombies over top a big pile of corn and salt that we have built up under the bedroom window.

At some point it does become less about building our skills and more about killing livestock that gets fed, bred, and patterned.

Personally I see it like this, scope and rifle technology is simply a better arrow. But technology like game cams and FLIR and whatever else comes down the pike are a slippery slope. Just my $.02

If you set up your cameras over a WalMart parking lot, you'll get some pictures worth posting.

Yes and no. If a guy can't shoot, he can't shoot or is prone to "buck fever" - camera doesn't change that. If a guy has no concept of the wind, scent or movement (his not the critters) he's not going to be successful. Camera changes none of that. That's where I was with that but understand your point.

90% of my camera photos are after dark, I spend most of my time trying to figure out where the danged deer was 90 minutes prior to that pic. (I don't hunt over the camera)

It's definitely regional. If I hunted muley's out west - a camera would be useless to me but I don't. I hunt swamps/thickets of the upper midwest. Small plots of land (relative to western hunters) so it's different.

I have several and have a grand time with them on my land. Do they help me hunt? Not really. Game moves around through the area so much that getting a nice buck on camera does not mean he will ever show up when and where I am hunting.

Unless you are a cougar in California. Ok, make that - mountain lion.

Well then you could use one like you said you want to: to see what else is there.

A dilemma for me too. I don't own a trail cam and have never used one. But, I think it would be neat to see what's out there, game and non-game species alike.

A friend of mine who hunted deer in PA a lot last year, told me he put up trail cams behind his house AFTER deer season and saw six different bucks that he'd never seen during season. It's nice to know that several bucks made it through.

Billy Goat,
What is FLIR?

Not trying to get a pissing match going, I spend as much time in the woods as I can,now my oldest daughter is old enough to hunt and killed a great buck at 10 years old.It was a tough hunt,most rewardable hunt I have been on.We didn't use a device left in the woods to do are homework.I want to teach her how to hunt and to respect the animal and not use any means to take a trophy,even if it is legal.

I am not whinning,this has been bugging me since my Dec.hunt in AZ,just wanted to get others take on it.

That means you go back to a rock or snare, correct?

Exactly what does this mean?

I wish the game animal would be more fair by being slower, not able to jump so high, smell so well, see so good etc,etc,etc...

Seriously, all the guys I know using them have a lot of pictures of big deer that they never harvest. I'm not sure it gives any advantage.

I have a hard time really differentiating this to other scouting though.

What exactly is it that you think cameras do..? Do you think they send a signal to my Dick Tracy watch telling me to be in Deer Stand G between 08:36 A.M and 08:39 A.M facing the NW to kill buck #14..?


Unless you're walking around in a buckskin loin cloth with a piece of rock affixed to a stick, your argument is invalid.!



It apparently means if you use a camera, then you have no respect for game animals.!

Forward Looking Infrared...

I'm gonna get a trail cam one of these days...
Would have been nice to see who it was that came in to camp & took some schitt while I was gone...or ran off with my brothers tree stand...

Damn man, some of you guys are really taking this personally.


I know how much fun trail cams can be. It's a way to extend hunting season and checking the cards can really get a fella pumped up. Absolutely nothing wrong with that.


Some just want to take a step back from all the technology and go a different route. Nothing more.

They cant send photos to your phone,computer?

Hunting over a timed corn thrower,now thats respect,any means to take that trophy.Teach are kids to be lazy,everytime some new electronic comes out.

Real scouting takes time and work. It is another aspect to actual hunting. In this country it involves many weekends spent driving 400-600 miles out and back and a lot of walking and spotting.

I can see in more congested areas and thicker wooded areas where it would be different, however.

You don't know and will never have a clue.

Cameras can cut both ways.

You can get shut out completely waiting for that 200+ rack that you saw on camera to walk by.

LOL...

Good point, for sure.

We have a doe on our little piece of hunting land that we have been seeing for about five years now. She has half of one ear that is missing and is off limits to any of our hunters. No one has ever seen her during legal hunting hours, but we all get a kick out of watching her raise fawns each year on the trail cams.

Trail cameras can be used in a lot of different ways. I have used them in the traditional way to get pictures of deer and other animals as well as to catch a guy trespassing during turkey season and another guy that was checking my garage out for items of interest at 2:00 one morning. I like to use them to enhance my experience in the field (or garage) and never thought of them as necessary to ensure that I will kill a deer. I have no problem if someone else doesn't choose to use them at all or if they use them in a different way. It is just that the more of us there are that are out there hunting, the better off we will all be in the long run.

I like that.
Also this,

Is your truck fair chase or should you walk to the hunting woods? Binoculars? Radios? Rifle scope? It can get a little ridiculous. A deer that feeds and waters at night, isn't necessarily going to show up during the daylight. I don't use trail cams, but I can't see where they increase your odds of taking a trophy animal.
Dan


At our farm in east Texas, for three years beginning in early 2005 I kept three game cameras set up at 3 spin cast feeders, 24/7/365. During approximately 36 months I did not have one picture of a buck in daylight hours. They only appeared between the hours of 10PM and say 4:30 AM. Would see fox, hogs, bobcat, white-tail does, cats, coyotes.

I've had game cameras out in the Texas hill country, off and on since '04. Between August of 1999 and May of 2010, I made a monthly trip there to hunt and just hang out. Three hundred miles one way. The anticipation and enjoyment of looking at as many as 1700 pix, can be a very enjoyable part of a three day stay. I'd say I learned a lot by watching those pix, in conjunction with just sitting out either in a stand or hillside. Where I hunt, deer definitely have a spring/summer range pattern and a fall winter hunting season.
I watched this buck along with 4 others in one area for three years, both on camera and in person. Never shot him.



I would see him between say the middle of February until late September. Then poof, I'd not see him again till next year. This was an area of a 3,000 acre low fenced ranch that backed up to Lost Maples State natural area. No civilization other than county roads and ranch houses for at least 40 mile radius.

During the 5 years I was there, never saw this buck except this one sequence.







Even had a sequence where the shutter was set for 1 minute intervals. From the sequence you could see that a large boar had killed a shoat. Throughout the course of a day, you could watch buzzards come and totally devour the shoat. By dark there was nothing but a spot in the dirt.

I definitely have enjoyed seeing what kind of hill country hoglets were dropping by from time to time

GWB





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That is one of the meanest, foulest looking critters I've ever seen..

luv2safari,

I didn't say it was the only form of scouting and believe me I don't need your definition to tell me what it is. But it is a form of scouting whether you like it or not.

Would it then be unfair if you had more time to go out and scout then someone else? Maybe trail cams give those with less time better info or maybe you should be limited to time you are able to scout because you have an unfair advantage over someone else. Completely flawed logic.

I don't use one but have no problem with those that do.

You made some good points. I, too, have less and less time to scout and far less gas money.

I would consider just seeing a rack even close to that in one of my cameras to be a once in a lifetime hunting high point.

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Put one over a gut pile if you want to have a little fun. A corn pile can also be interesting.

Those fox pics are amazing.

I guess 'unethical long range shots' will be next!

As a former biologist and current game manager I love them. I don't care how often you are out in the woods there are deer you will never see. Period. End of story.

I lived on my property for over 10 years, hunted everyday of a near 6 month season, was out on the property every day the other 6 months, did spotlight counts multiple times and in 3 days with enough cameras you will see lots of deer no one has ever seen or will see.

It's a great management tool to manage people more than anything else. Hunters all the time are convinced there are no quality deer on their property and you can run a 100 cameras over a pile of corn over 3 days and show them only a select few and they suddenly realise it's not the deer but the hunter.

It's also hands down the most accurate way to census a population of animals (not just deer). Can get deer per acre, an accurate sex ratio (people who look at enough pictures often enough will learn to ID does from one another) and health of a deer herd.

I personally use them all the time. I have never shot a deer that I got on camera ahead of time except for does some younger deer.

One deer that I was glad I got on camera was one I shot too low with a bow and heard that terrible whack. Tracked him for days, looked for buzzards, checked out all the water holes etc...Never found him.

Then the next year he showed up on camera after the season with a missing leg. Showed up 3 more years with a missing leg where I hit him. Never once did I catch him on camera during daylight.

Without the camera I figured he would have crawled off and died in a pile somewhere but he lived at least another 3 years and became a tough cookie to find.

I have built over 30 trail cameras. It used to be some serious fun, until MT made it clear that they don't want them in the woods. Very sad, as I used to get some phenomenal shots, especially of the predators. I never filled a single tag thanks to one. In fact, when it comes to whitetails, I firmly believe they do more harm than good, flashing a big buck, stinking up the place checking them, etc. I just never felt I had some unfair advantage. If it did anything, at least up here in the timber country, it showed some good whitetails were around in velvet, in bachelor groups, then when the velvet came off, I wouldn't get them on cam until after hunting season. You just aren't going to pattern one of these rutting big timber bucks.

I just really liked them for the intrinsic value of something to get me out in the woods. It was also something my kids sure like to go and do. I also got some good info for the bios around here.

I think MT made a mistake with that. I will say, it does lead to some bad behavior such as salting areas for elk. That is rampant in this country. The cams kind of lead people to do that. Personally, I like the fun of getting a more natural pic, scouting for travel routes, natural areas of gathering, etc. To get animals in their normal activities.

MT changed the laws, I got rid of most of them, keep a few around the house, and on some friends property where trespassers cause him some real problems.

Personally, I'm glad MT doesn't allow them.

Why would you want 'em? You can see everything for miles around.

har har.

May seem that way at times, but even where I'm at the lay of the land alone hides quite a few interesting things, let alone the grass.

Ha! This brush can hide an entire elk at 10 paces. Trail cams don't help you do anything here. Its pure entertainment. Well, used to be.

so what....it's just like scouting on foot, only less intrusive. trail cam pictures are off season fun...add a lot of interesting what ifs? to the game. they don't hunt for you, they don't tell you where that animal will be on opening day, if he's even still alive. if you can read sign, you know if there are deer around or not...it just adds some interest to see the occasional muy grande....plus all the interesting non-game animals that turn up.

I'll find something else to worry about, I believe. YMMV

law says they cant be used during any big game season.....written just like that, no if ands or buts......which means in Montana you have a 2 month window from mid June to mid August to use them......rest of the year has atleast one big game animal in season somewhere and ive seen nothing that says just cause im looking for bobcats that i can use them during deer season...

and given my previous heated arguments with MTFWP on up to the higher guys in Helena i know there are some ppl on staff that would love to nail me to the wall just for being a pain in their arse showing up on their doorstep in Helena on a regular basis a bit ago.....the law is basically one sentance with no real wiggle room...

I've been using them for years and never killed a buck that I had on camera. They're fun and they let me know what bucks are in the area, but as far as being any advantage in hunting they really aren't.

For the comment about setting them up over water sources, I'm in Mississippi, there's water every 20 feet here. Even in the driest of years it doesn't do any good to hunt water holes, there's too many places for them to get it.

It's all much ado about nothing, there's nothing unethical about them. They're just fun and I've got a friend with two young boys who act like it's Christmas morning when you pop the SD card into the computer to check out the latest pictures.

quite frankly the main thing i wanna get on camera is a bobcat or cougar.....the cameras themselves wont really help hunting mule deer where im at......the eagle pics posted are also along the lines of what i think is neat....

part of the reason i like to hunt is getting out and seeing things.....trail camera could let me see some stuff i might not otherwise or a new perspective on it.....

as i said in my first post, the cameras show where a critter was, i really dont care for the auto update ones like i said but overall i dont see them as a huge advantage in hunting critters and do find the pics ppl post off them neat as hell....

I am quite fond of the bobcat pictures myself.

I am going to have an unpopular opinion here but I wish that game cams would be outlawed on public ground.

I say this because I have hunted areas that will have 15 cameras on one water hole and have seen the lengths that people will go to to not only kill a deer but to keep others from killing a deer. In some areas game cameras take all of the guess work out of it and people can scout effectively with little to no effort. In certain areas you will see almost every deer or elk on camera and it makes it easy to pinpoint where you need to be. Due to game cameras these animals are getting hammered

I love hanging game cameras on private ground to see whats there and its almost like christmas when you go check em but I have seen the bad they bring out in people where there is too much competition.

To answer the OP's question, in certain areas and for certain species I feel that the use of trail cameras makes it not fair chase. In arid climates on early season hunts these deer and elk have to water at least once a day and trail cameras take all of the guess work out of it

I can't even pick my nose any more there are so many cameras going all the time.

Alan

Trail cameras are fun and can be useful, but I really think that for the price they should last a little longer. The Cuddeback that took this pic was one of the earlier models and went for $399. It lasted less than 2 years before it did exactly what Wiley did in the pic below.




That said, I believe they can be helpful, but if someone believes that the advantage through technology of the trail camera is unethical, then that person should feel free to impose their own limits upon themselves. Possibly going back to a smoothbore flintlock front stuffer and a stick and string for archery.

I don't think the water hole analogy um.... holds much water.

It sounds like people think others wouldn't find and/or dog pile on the waterhole w/o a camera available.
I think the cameras are a symptom, not the disease.

Want to talk slippery slopes - think of outlawing hunting watering holes and all of their approaches because we know the game is going to be there. Camera or no, BTW.

Doesn't hold water? In northern AZ the bow tags used to be over the counter and success rates were atrocious but it was a fun hunt and if you got lucky you could see some deer.

In recent years they have gone to a draw tag and everybody and their brother hangs cameras on every waterhole. You'd be hard pressed to find a water hole with fewer than 15 cameras on it. The country is vast, the numbers of deer are low and they are really spread out. Without cameras it is literally a crap shoot as to where to hunt. With cameras these deer are getting hammered, the success rates have shot way up. People also get creative and find ways to get deer to stop watering at certain spots. It's unethical and it's not fair chase. You're right when you say that the cameras are a symptom and not the disease but what options are there. The disease is the people that will go to any length to kill a big deer, or keep others from killing big deer. The cameras facilitate this like nothing else.

I just wish I knew the location of one these water holes that all the game animals use. Around here in a normal year I can shoot an arrow in just about any direction and hit water with only a little luck.

Different parts of the country have different problems I guess. I don't think that the use of trail cameras is unethical, but I do believe that hunters can use just about anything unethically and those that will, couldn't care less what anybody thinks or what the law says.

Wow, someone that has the same view.I know every state is different,how you hunt,food source,water.I should've spcified more about AZ and states where water is very limited.

Multiable camers are on water all over the place on public land most of them are used for deer and elk.The number of BIG deer have sky rocketed in the last 4 to 5 years.You used to see or hear about 1 to 5 coues deer in the 120"+ range getting taken a year,now it has easily trippled or more,not to count the ton of more great bucks that score under that.Something has changed the in the game.

To me it looks like trail cameras have played a big part in that.Water is a big key in states like AZ where it is very limited and I have heard of the crap that some guides and hunters have done to keep deer from watering at night.RESPECT for a animal or money and your face in a magazine?

I run a camera over my clover patch just to see what pops up. In the eastern woods, where mast crops and water sources are highly available,very broadly distributed, the camera is invaluable for figuring out when the deer are feeding. It's also invaluable for building patterns on those larger deer that go nocturnal well before firearms season. I knew one large buck was visiting from his tracks, but until I put a camera out, I didn't know that he was only there after dark, I didn't know how big he was, and I didn't know how seldom he visits my food plot. No amount of scouting would have told me that, and more scouting would just have driven him nocturnal even earlier in the season (he's gone fully nocturnal by the 2nd or 3rd day of early muzzleloader, so I get 1-2 hunts before he's gone for the season).
I think that cameras are just a symptom of the fact that we have less and less scouting time available to us as fewer and fewer of us actively work outdoors.

Nothing to do about cameras, but why can't someone find where those nocturnal bucks go during the day time. I'm no whitetail hunter, but elk do the same at times and I have been sucessful at finding them.

If mature whitetail bucks have a home range of only a few miles, seems like someone could find them unless they get on to land that one can't access.

Not flaming here, just asking a question out of ignorance on my part.

Because we can't hunt those lands.
My private huntable area is less than 3 acres. Private land is scarce for many hunters in the east. In general, people with farmland access do very well. They have high food density (alfalfa, beans, corn,etc), which is the defining attribute of good deer land in the east. Water and cover are abundant, so hunting them is often a waste of time unless you have excellent scouting data, and the areas haven't been disturbed by other hunters. Hunting a waterhole in the east is great...if you're after ducks. Otherwise, it's often a waste of time. Even my tiny lot has several hundred yards of creek area, and that's just one of many small areas with surface water within less than a 1/2 mile.
Public land in the east (at least in the three states I've hunted) is low-moderate quality woodland, but is of relatively low quality for mast (compared to local farmland0, has that mast very,very spread out, and has enormous amounts of cover relative to its low food density. Add to that the inability to glass for animals on most public land due to a lack of open fields compared to most places in the west, and cover so thick you can't walk through it, and you get at least some idea of why you can't always hunt the east like you can the west. This is also why deer drives were used frequently,especially in the southeast. To this day, my state allows drives with dogs for deer, due to the thick, inaccessible cover.