It is an old saying about how someone gave away the farm but tomorrow the wife and I are doing just that. Quit claim deed the place over to our daughter then leave town on the train for Oregon. It is the best way we can protect her and the grandkids in case we get really sick or die.

Leaving on the train because the old car lost it's transmission and is not worth even half the cost of repair. We will look for another when we get back to OR.

Neither of these things are bad.

Good luck on your search for another farm,Scott.

I hope things are OK for you guys. If you need anything, please let me know. Night or day. Seriously.

Thanks but we are fine. This is just retirement and letting go of the things that tie us down.

Adventure is just around the corner.

Wow.

was wondering how much longer that car was gonna last congrats to your daughter, couldnt be leaving it in better hands....

Good luck to you and your wife Scott. I'll miss the farm pictures! God bless you on your new adventures!

Bob

you are the man! good luck to you.

Safe travels, my friend!

Ed

Good luck Scott!

estate planning is never a bad decision...even if you don't plan on checking out any time soon.

don't check out any time soon I enjoy your posts here at the fire.

Good luck and safe travels

Best of luck to you, Scott.

Washington State or Oregon, you and your wife, are still my Heroes.

Safe travels, and God Bless you both.

Take care my Friend

My mom gifted me the place after my dad passed away. Couple years later when we moved her to town, I sold it for a whole bunch of money.



Good luck in Oregon. When I'm done here, I plan on going there too.

Good luck in your travels

My mom did that for us about 20 years ago. She had nothing else to give us. It's all she and dad owned and dad had passed and she did not want the responsibilities. I'm going to do the same for my kids as well. kwg

good lucks Scott I hope all your plans work out.

PM sent Scott, the new medicaid rules make that plan a bad idea. there are better ways to go about it. Let me and VAnimrod help you out with a plan that will work. FWIW I am past president of the Walla Walla Estate planning council, was dealing with this stuff for 37 years before I retired including many, many estate planning seminiars and workshops hosted by me.

I am the "owner" of the family farm . but I'd sell my sole to the devil before either mom or dad had to move or die any where else unless it was their choice.

Good luck, Scott! Looking forward to following your new adventures. If you guys drift down this way, plan to stay with us for a few days.

Ben

No idea about Scott's wife but if Scott is 65 years old (or older) now, I would think that he would be covered by Medicare - not Medicaid.

Traveling mercy to ya.

Happy trails my friend, Whatcha gonna be doin' in Oregon?

[video:youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=XcYsO890YJY[/video]

We will still have our cabin at the farm, we just will not legally own it. There will be more farm pictures along the way along with travel pictures.

Last weekend was the Jefferson County Farm Tour and Fiber Tour.

Just a couple of samples.

Hardest work I have done all year.








There were 227 visitors last weekend and lots more pictures with a lot prettier faces and vies than those above posted on my Photobucket HERE

Will miss the pictures of your beautiful stead.

I am sure where ever your travels take you, those lucky enough to be around you and your wife will benefit from your knowledge. Can't imagine your wife seeing a patch of dirt without thinking how to put it to best use.

Proust!

Medicare and VA.

Nailed it!!!

Any idea what an old VW camper in that good of shape is worth today? Last one I saw that was fixed up and running was around $20,000.

I think I saw something similar, it didn't have the turret on top, parked someplace along a 2 lane road North and just a bit East of Minot ND. If you would like pictures let me know.... I will be going through there in the next week or so.

I did read an article......click and clack or some thing along those lines.........they just recommended buying an old Chevy van and taking off 2 of the spark plug wires, as I recall it was the feeling of driving a VW van, but you had a bit of a safety factor.

It is our choice and we will have our cabin here as long as we live. Not getting kicked out, more like getting out of the way so the next generation can do her job. We want to get out and hope to be able to travel a bit. That is why we are leaving. In a couple of weeks we start a six week house sitting gig in a Mc Mansion. Then it will be back to the farm for a couple of weeks, them maybe San Diego. It is time to have some fun!

I would like one of the new Freightliner Sprinter campers but an about $119,999 shy of the $120,000 price. We will see what we can find.

was fun hanging out and talking oddball fruit with someone for once instead of just the other voices in my head.....i want to show back up in 5 years and see how those kiwi of hers do....way to much rain for me but it is a real cool setup you guys put together....

a twin mattress jusssst barely fits in the back of a full size Ford Bronco.........pm me for any additional details, best camping I ever did....

Hey Scott, Oregon has some real nice places and a ton of variety from seashore to high desert to alpine country. You could spend a lifetime here and not see it all.

More along the lines of w ghost at we are thinking. Not sure what we will end up with but it will probably be Spring befor we decide.

In all of this not one bit about poor ol chocolate, would you like the name/address of my lgs for shipping? I will fix the sight!
I also don't know what a Mcmansion is.

great attitude - I hope I can have one like it when the time comes

Ol Chocolate is still needed to keep my pants from falling off and thus has job security.

A Mcmansion is a huge house on a tiny lot where two old folks live. It has five or more bedrooms and the old folks built it after all their kids were grown.

Look for the Chevy Corvair version, more room in general and cheaper.

and the looks and build quality are cheesy....

I suspect that Scott is smart enough to have gotten good advice and followed it.

Yep. Have been talking with my friendly attorney.

What did you do with rattler?



Travis

But Gee, there might be a buck in it....

Good for you! Wish I had stopped in more often, but it sounds like you will still be at the farm once in awhile for coffee and good talk. Your place is peaceful with good memories for me. Thanks for good visits and all the best in the future.

Maybe even TWO bucks.

UBER!



Travis

A VERY common misconception, and a very costly one, is that Medicare or VA will cover long term care. This is not the case in most instances. If (more like WHEN, statistically) either Scott or his wife need long term care. Such care is not covered by medicare unless after a 3 day stay in the hospital AND the person is getting "Skilled Care" which is very narrowly defined and very limited in time and scope. VA does not cover this, either, unless the long term care need can be directly linked to an injury incurred while on active duty and under orders.

For long term care such as Nursing home, Assisted living, long term in home health care (medicare does have a limited benefit for this in home care IF one is completely homebound and other criteria are met, but only for limited skilled care, not around the clock supervision etc.) the money comes from either:

1) Your assets - most common -

2)Long term care insurance, which far too few people have or

3) Medicaid...

BUT, Mdicaid only comes into the picture AFTER one has spent one's own assets down to very low levels, and transfers of money or property within the past 7 years before application for Medicaid can and will be reversed unless the property was sold for fair market value. A gift, putting the property in a will or the common revocable trust etc. is no longer a valid protection plan. As Medicaid has become more and more of an albatross on the federal budget, more and more of the onus or costs are being put onto the families in need, and gifts or old estate plan idea's are oft times no longer good protections.

Generally, only a special needs trust for a disabled dependant or an IRREVOCABLE trust that is more than 60 months in place, with the asset one is trying to protect placed into that trust also 60 months prior to need will save a farm etc. OR, of course, a good long term care insurance policy.

Another good plan for this kind of issue can be to get a reverse mortgage on the property being protected and use some of the proceeds to purchase either a monthly pay or single premium long term care policy. There are single premium long term care policies out there that, if not used, return 100% of the premium paid, with interest, to the estate! These should be a LOT more popular than they are.

For some other still active estate planner, perhaps. My help and advice to friends is and has been for years, free. As was the overview I just wrote, above.


if Scott is hoping that a quick claim deed will protect his farm in the event of a catastrophic health care need not covered by medicare or the VA, as it seems, then no he has not been given good up to date advice or counsel. This is my fear, and why I have offered assistance at no cost. Scott also knows VAnimrod fairly well. I brought VAnimrod into the financial planning part of the Estate world and he did very well in it for several years, even becoming a training manager for the company we both worked for before he moved on to becoming a development officer for Johns Hopkins University. He or I can guide Scott to some more solid footing for his goals. And at no charge of course.

Good to hear! I hope the fun is almost more than you can bear. All the best to you, Scott.

The catastrophic health scare only counts 60 months. That should be and likely is the least of his concerns.

Tax implications would be far and away a more real concern and if Scott is smart enough to have sought counsel this (and not the boogie man of health scare) would have been the focus of the advice.

Is it just me or does anyone else think that taking long term financial advise from someone who looks forward to jury duty to supplement their income might be a tad risky?

Oh hell yeah get a reverse mortgage that is a strong and secure plan!
Some people should understand their own limitations. I'm sure Scott and his wife actually planned their retirement with the same acuity that they lived their life.

mike r

So rattler stays with the farm?



Travis

Might seem risky on the surface. But when you get into the weeds of his strategy, you find gun swapping for tires makes a big difference.



Travis

I'd seek counsel from kawi before that guy.


ScottF - best of luck to you! Hope you enjoy your travels!

rattler hasnt been on the farm since the beginning of July....

Are you sure?




Travis

pretty sure, driven by Sam's ranch a couple of times

Has anybody actually seen Rattler since he (supposedly) went to Australia? You have to admit it's kind of suspicious Scott wanting to get away from the farm so quick.

If you're really Rattler, post a selfie with today's newspaper.

Okay, it's you.

Whatever works for you and your lovely bride Sir, I pray for peace, joy, relaxation and freedom from want for Y'All.

Best of luck!

It is absolute suicide !

Having to deal with getting my MIL into long term care right now. From what we've learned SM is pretty much correct.

FWIW...

Much traveling mercies to yall.....still hope to see pics from time to time....grin

lol!

Best of luck to you and yours, Scott. Pulling for you from back east.

[/quote]

The catastrophic health scare only counts 60 months. That should be and likely is the least of his concerns.

Tax implications would be far and away a more real concern and if Scott is smart enough to have sought counsel this (and not the boogie man of health scare) would have been the focus of the advice.[/quote]

Not true RE the health care, and that was what Scott himself said was the reason for the quick claim deed.

Tax implications are also a real concern with this plan, obviously, but those were not stated in the original post. Capitol gains taxes for the daughter someday, with no automatic step up in basis available for her to use to exempt them down the road are a problem, possibly, but having been involved in long term care planning and estate planning for many years I know that your boogeyman or scare is very very real. Unplanned for long term care expenses are the number 1 cause of impoverishment of seniors. To ignore this reality is folly.

for it to matter Scott would have to be willing to kick his daughter and grandkids off the land.....its a farm, a small one at that on a chunk of property not really ideal for splitting up and being able to sell off anything meaningful money wise.....think i know Scott well enough to know no matter how bad it got he wouldnt consider asking his daughter to give up what she herself has put that much blood sweat and tears into....Scott and his lovely bride are not the only ones that have made that wonderful place what it is....

You'd've loved Frank C. Everybody at the University of Alaska in the late 1950s loved guileless, friend-of-everybody, scatter-brained Frank.

He had a single room in the rear of the temporary dorm when a more desirable room became vacant across the hall. He started moving across the hall as haphazardly as he tackled everything else � move a few things, then go over to the Student Union for a shake, a couple of games of pool, and of course a while chinning with whomever else happened to be there.

After a few days of such interruptive intervals, he forgot which way he was moving � and moved back into his old room.

He sent his laundry out in an unsorted heap and when it came back, he "drawered" it � still unsorted � randomly in several bureau drawers � a randomly scooped armload in this drawer, an armload in that drawer, etc.

The day that he was moving OUT for good � leaving � he had several big cardboard boxes here and there all around the room, and was packing them the same way � an armload in this box, an armload in that box, etc.

In the middle of this "procedure," he stopped suddenly, looked around at all the chaos, and muttered,

"A man's a slave to his goddam possessions."

Scott has already said he has had a conversation with an attorney. I would suspect that the attorney can read the law and understand that Medicare's look back period on real estate transfers is 60 months. That information is readily available on the Medicare website and other online sources. It also comes into play only if the person making the transfer needs institutional care outside of what his health insurance (for Scott, as he has stated, Medicare and the VA) inside of those 60 months from the date of real estate transfer. Again, this information is readily available through the official Medicare websites and others. There may be other components in play, and an attorney would have advised him as to whether any were pertinent to his situation.

I suspect, too, that Scott is smart enough to have sought legal counsel and advice from an attorney that specializes in tax issues to assist with any taxable implications from the transfer and/or from a CPA. There is a lifetime gift amount that parents are allowed to give to their children. That may include land, and the amount might cover the transfer. I suspect the attorney/CPA Scott talked to would have mentioned this. You mention capital gains. For one, there are exclusions to capital gains on any sale of a primary residence. It sounds as though the daughter lives on the farm. Depending upon specific details that an attorney and/or CPA would go over with Scott and his family, capital gains are likely not a concern at all. Gift taxes might be, but again, there is a lifetime exclusion that I'm certain any decent attorney and/or CPA would discuss with them in detail as they apply.

safariman, by your posts here you didn't do estate planning for 37 years. You sold insurance for 37 years. There is a substantial difference. To present what you did in any other light might not be entirely accurate. That is for you to determine, not me. Also, a cursory review of your history here also raises questions about what you did and how you did it. Again, that's not for me to determine but it is there.

For me, an insurance salesman is not involved in estate planning or long-term care planning. He or she is selling an insurance product in order to make a commission. That is it and that is all. Planning requires, at least for me, someone with a license and training in a specialty area of law, accounting, and/or finance and investments. Attorneys have to pass the bar exam and then specialize in an area through continuing education and other requirements. CPAs have to pass a professional exam and do the same through CEs. Financial professionals are federally licensed through a series of exams and other requirements. Insurance agents pass a very basic test and sell insurance to make the companies they represent and themselves money through the sale of products. They are minimally licensed, they are generally not insured or bonded (unlike attorneys, CPAs, or financial professionals), and are not "planners".

Like it or not, insurance agents are not the go to source for legal advice. Attorneys are. Insurance agents are not the go to source for advice on investments. Financial advisers and planners are. Insurance agents are not the go to source for advice on taxes. CPAs are. I'd not talk to an attorney, CPA, or financial planner about the proper insurance coverage for my truck, and I'd not talk to an insurance agent about real estate transfers, investments, or tax issues. I suspect that Scott has sought the advice of those necessary.

I apologize to ScottF for the sidetrack of his thread. Good luck, Scott, on your new adventures and I'll be wondering where the new roads take you.

That's a hilarious story, and the last line is painfully true. It's good advice to remember. Thanks.

Fortunately or unfortunately depending on how you look at it, others are now reviewing Mark's history here, and it is not now, nor will it be in the future, a good thing for him.

I would have loved the guy!

As you might well know, letting go of possessions that are not really needed is a wonderfully freeing exercise.

As to the tax thing. Since my wife and I will still be paying part of the mortgage and since we (daughter, wife, and I) transfer funds into a joint checking account and the bank removes the mortgage from that account it can be easily verified. The daughter cannot refinance for six months and has no plans to refinance for several more years. So it appears we will not be hit with the tax by either the Feds or the state.

The plan is to stay healthy for the next several years and to use the VA for my primary health then make the decision what to do when the construction company can afford health care for all the principals.

This is the best plan we have for protecting our daughter, grandkids, and the farm.

Wishing you well, even the very BEST as you move forward.

Never thought I would ever see you leave that farm while still upright.

I guess this means no more 24hrcf gatherings at your place. Maybe Sherri and I will have to pick up that torch and plan something out this way. I am sure glad I attended the event that I did over there, loads of fun and all.

Blessings, prosperity, peace and grace to you and your clan my friend. Keep us posted as you go along!

MARK

Once again, living proof that getting together in person is worlds better than just ganging-up on-line.

had the same sorta thought when packing up my stuff to leave Darla....after the important stuff like my guns and the rare books i was standing around looking at what was left to pack up.....started shaking my head and my brother asked what was wrong and i said, its chit....its all just chit and easily replaced chit at that....

For now it means no more gatherings. The school at the farm had kind of made that no longer an option as it takes up almost all the farm.

Thanks Mark. I will be keeping the travels updated.

Headed out to the ferry is a few minutes, then once across the water a ten minute walk to Amtrack. Will be in Canby, OR this evening.

If someone could persuade his daughter to join the Campfire, We could at least see some more pictures now and then.

By my read of the thread, Scott's still gonna live there. Maybe just not as often.

reading comprehension, aint it grand

So true.

"It is preoccupation with possessions, more than anything else, that prevents us from living freely and nobly." --Thoreau

"I'd rather sit alone on a pumpkin than crowded on a velvet cushion." � attributed to Thoreau

I'm betting ol' Henry David never had a hot date next to him on a couch, velvet or otherwise. Just sayin'...