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Posted By: wabigoon Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/24/15
The twenty-sixth president.

Thoughts?
Posted By: 4ager Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/24/15
Need to dig him up, re-animate him, and have him serve another term.

One of the greatest we've had.
Posted By: ingwe Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/24/15
If he knew what was going on, he would be rolling over in his grave at about 4500rpm...
Posted By: dvdegeorge Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/24/15
Bully!!!
Posted By: TBREW401 Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
This---
Posted By: Huntingnut Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
Originally Posted by 4ager
Need to dig him up, re-animate him, and have him serve another term.

One of the greatest we've had.


+1
Posted By: 4ager Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
Originally Posted by ingwe
If he knew what was going on, he would be rolling over in his grave at about 4500rpm...


He'd come out of his grave, grab an 1895 in .405, and set about fixing this schit.

Washington, Jefferson, Madison, Monroe, Franklin, and Adams would all be in prison or on a watch list. Patrick Henry would be dead, along with Lighthorse Lee.

They'd all look at us with disgust for what we have given away.
Posted By: watch4bear Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
Thieving azz post office


http://articles.orlandosentinel.com..._deland-theodore-roosevelt-sagamore-hill
Posted By: wabigoon Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
Do you think "Teddy", was seen as to progressive in his day, by the conservatives?
Posted By: mrfudd Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
Originally Posted by wabigoon
Do you think "Teddy", was seen as to progressive in his day, by the conservatives?

Yes, he was liberal on many issues. He was strong on defense, but also an activist in business issues and was instrumental in federal land grabs.
Posted By: BOWSINGER Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
Consider the times and the real problems of those days.

Anybody want to go back to those long work weeks and working conditions?
Posted By: 4ager Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
Originally Posted by wabigoon
Do you think "Teddy", was seen as to progressive in his day, by the conservatives?


He didn't fit a mold and he didn't kowtow to political machines.

This, we need; now more than ever.
Posted By: OrangeOkie Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
Originally Posted by wabigoon
The twenty-sixth president.

Thoughts?


Posted By: wabigoon Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
Another of the military veterans, and a man that knew a horse, and which end of a fork to pick up.
Posted By: Pugs Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
You would be unlikely to find a bigger TR fan than me. He was the right man at the right time and conducted himself above reproach and acted a leader and not a manager. I suspect I have read a dozen books on him.

That being said, his platform for the Bull Moose Party was decidedly contrary to conservatism of the day (along with some good ideas) and his ego in running as a third party candidate in 1912 likely got us the useless POS Woodrow Wilson.

There's a lesson to be learned there.

Posted By: poboy Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
"Ranch Life and The Hunting Trail" - Teddy Roosevelt written
in 1888. A really good read about what the title suggests.
Posted By: kaywoodie Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
Originally Posted by poboy
"Ranch Life and The Hunting Trail" - Teddy Roosevelt written
in 1888. A really good read about what the title suggests.


^^^Highly recommended.
Posted By: Pugs Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
Originally Posted by kaywoodie
Originally Posted by poboy
"Ranch Life and The Hunting Trail" - Teddy Roosevelt written
in 1888. A really good read about what the title suggests.


^^^Highly recommended.


African Game Trails is also excellent if you have an Africa bent.
He was the best we have ever had.. Great man..
Posted By: kaywoodie Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
Posted By: viking Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
There it is a lot of history about him in Medora ND. His ranching days there were transforming.
Posted By: LostHighway Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
He tried to move the GOP toward Progressivism, including trust busting and increased business regulation. In November 1904, he was reelected in a landslide against conservative Democrat Alton Brooks Parker. Roosevelt called his domestic policies a "Square Deal", promising a fair deal to the average citizen while breaking up monopolistic corporations, holding down railroad rates, and guaranteeing pure food and drugs. He was the first president to speak out on conservation, and he greatly expanded the system of national parks and national forests. By 1907, he propounded more radical reforms, which were blocked by the conservative Republicans in Congress.
Wikipedia
One of our great presidents. Contrast him and Barry Goldwater with today's bunch you see how far to the right the Republican party has moved to.
Little known fact- His party bosses wanted him out of the way. So, they lobbied to put him on the ticket with Mckinley as VP. Giving him a powerless, obscure office. Then Mckinley gets assassinated. You know the rest of the story.
"American Experience" on PBS did a show on Roosevelt which is worth watching.
Posted By: jorgeI Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
Originally Posted by Pugs
You would be unlikely to find a bigger TR fan than me. He was the right man at the right time and conducted himself above reproach and acted a leader and not a manager. I suspect I have read a dozen books on him.

That being said, his platform for the Bull Moose Party was decidedly contrary to conservatism of the day (along with some good ideas) and his ego in running as a third party candidate in 1912 likely got us the useless POS Woodrow Wilson.

There's a lesson to be learned there.



THIS. I will also add (and of course in the context of the times), he would have agreed with the all-too-true contents depicted in the book "The Bell Curve"...
Posted By: curdog4570 Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
Any body that Glen Beck hates can't be all bad. grin
Posted By: KFWA Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
I've been watching the 7 part series on the Roosevelts created by Ken Burns.

Unfortunately I missed the Teddy Roosevelt segment and started in on FDR during the New Deal activities - but I've been addicted to watching them since I caught the first one.

I had several ideas about FDR that turned out to be wrong.

But this documentary is so good, I'm going to track down the first episodes and watch them on Teddy.

Ken Burns does amazing work.
Posted By: deflave Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
Teddy was our last GREAT President.

Although I freely admit, his writing bores me to tears.



Clark
Posted By: FieldGrade Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
Originally Posted by deflave


Although I freely admit, his writing bores me to tears.



Clark


Thought I was the only one.
I bought an 800+ page book of his about ten/twelve years ago.
IIRC I'm on page 200.
Posted By: deflave Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
Pretty horrible IMO.




Travis
Originally Posted by BOWSINGER
Consider the times and the real problems of those days.

Anybody want to go back to those long work weeks and working conditions?

If the choice is between that and what's ahead of us, it may be better than what's ahead.

Steve.
Posted By: hatari Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
Originally Posted by mrfudd
Originally Posted by wabigoon
Do you think "Teddy", was seen as to progressive in his day, by the conservatives?

Yes, he was liberal on many issues. He was strong on defense, but also an activist in business issues and was instrumental in federal land grabs.


Yes!

Were he President today, the RP bunch would have a fit about him Trust busting and establishing National Parks. He was quite progressive in his day, but he was no puss. TR was staill a man's man in many respects. Hard work, fresh air, and a can do attitude ruled his thinking.

Sagamore Hill is a great tour, should you get a chance to see his stuff.

As an author, his writings are stilted and dry, which was the style of the day.
Posted By: KFWA Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
Originally Posted by hatari
Originally Posted by mrfudd
Originally Posted by wabigoon
Do you think "Teddy", was seen as to progressive in his day, by the conservatives?

Yes, he was liberal on many issues. He was strong on defense, but also an activist in business issues and was instrumental in federal land grabs.


Yes!

Were he President today, the RP bunch would have a fit about him Trust busting and establishing National Parks. He was quite progressive in his day, but he was no puss. TR was staill a man's man in many respects. Hard work, fresh air, and a can do attitude ruled his thinking.

Sagamore Hill is a great tour, should you get a chance to see his stuff.

As an author, his writings are stilted and dry, which was the style of the day.


how do you think Fox News would treat him?
Posted By: MadMooner Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
He be railroaded by "conservatives".
Posted By: Pugs Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
Originally Posted by hatari
Sagamore Hill is a great tour, should you get a chance to see his stuff.

As an author, his writings are stilted and dry, which was the style of the day.


It is a superb tour and the best historic home, emphasis on home and not house, tour I've ever been on and I've been on a lot. You can truly see a man who loved his country, family and the outdoors embodied in a building. Even the US Park Service, notorious for a stick up their butt, was nice. Finn, our lab, had been in the truck for several hours and we still had an hour to go to our tour time. We asked a strolling ranger where we could take to walk around and she said "Anywhere you like, the Colonel would approve"

You want dry TR, read the Naval War of 1812. The definitive source but boring does not begin to describe it.
Posted By: mrfudd Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
Originally Posted by Pugs
You want dry TR, read the Naval War of 1812. The definitive source but boring does not begin to describe it.


Dry, but very informative. His journal from the River of No Return is also good. African Game Trails was interesting, but did not reflect well on his shooting abilities- but it shows he was honest about his failures.
Posted By: mathman Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
TR went outside the Constitution with his expansion of executive power.
Posted By: wabigoon Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
A hundred, and six years after Theodore Roosevelt's presidency. It is pure speculation, but I wonder how he would stand on the Keystone pipeline?
Posted By: crossfireoops Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
I just finished a re-read of "The Rough Riders"

Here's a typical book site review,....

Quote
In 1898, as the Spanish-American War was escalating, Theodore Roosevelt assembled an improbable regiment of Ivy Leaguers, cowboys, Native Americans, African-Americans, and Western Territory land speculators. This group of men, which became known as the Rough Riders, trained for four weeks in the Texas desert and then set sail for Cuba. Over the course of the summer, Roosevelt's Rough Riders fought valiantly, and sometimes recklessly, in the Cuban foothills, incurring casualties at a far greater rate than the Spanish. Roosevelt kept a detailed diary from the time he left Washington until his triumphant return from Cuba later that year.
The Rough Riders was published to instant acclaim in 1899.
Robust in its style and mesmerizing in its account of battle, it is exhilarating, illuminating, and utterly essential reading for every armchair historian and at-home general.


As an artillerist,....I found his comments on the 1" Gatlings, the Hotchkiss, and the "Dynamite guns" of interest,....

As an American, I was profoundly impressed at the style of leadership that he espoused, practiced, and promoted, not in words but in his ACTIONS.

GTC
Posted By: add Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
Originally Posted by KFWA
I've been watching the 7 part series on the Roosevelts created by Ken Burns.

Unfortunately I missed the Teddy Roosevelt segment and started in on FDR during the New Deal activities - but I've been addicted to watching them since I caught the first one.

I had several ideas about FDR that turned out to be wrong.

But this documentary is so good, I'm going to track down the first episodes and watch them on Teddy.

Ken Burns does amazing work.


Great series.

The distinctions between the family trees was striking.

Posted By: Hotload Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
Originally Posted by Pugs
....
That being said, his platform for the Bull Moose Party was decidedly contrary to conservatism of the day (along with some good ideas) and his ego in running as a third party candidate in 1912 likely got us the useless POS Woodrow Wilson.

There's a lesson to be learned there.



And 80 years later the same thing happened again. Bush 1 was up for re-election and along comes Ross Perot, who split the vote. The end result was gun-control Clinton.
Posted By: Pugs Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
Originally Posted by mathman
TR went outside the Constitution with his expansion of executive power.


Yep, between the National Wildlife Refuge system, vast increases in national parks, forests and monuments holdings not to mentioned the Panama Canal Zone. As I said, complex guy. Lots to admire and lots to question.
Posted By: mathman Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
Originally Posted by Pugs
Originally Posted by mathman
TR went outside the Constitution with his expansion of executive power.


Yep, between the National Wildlife Refuge system, vast increases in national parks, forests and monuments holdings not to mentioned the Panama Canal Zone. As I said, complex guy. Lots to admire and lots to question.


What sticks out in my mind is TR deciding if he didn't agree with how someone ran their business, he'd just strong arm them by threatening to send in troops and nationalize the industry. Seems kind of tin pot to me.
Posted By: Hotload Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
Originally Posted by wabigoon
The twenty-sixth president.

Thoughts?



On Jan. 6, 1919, TR died in his sleep. At the time people said ... if he had been awake there would have been a fight.
Posted By: 4ager Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
The left would railroad him over his hunting, and the right would crucify him over his positions on "social issues".

He'd tell them both to shove it.

The media would hate him, but the people would love him.
Posted By: Hotload Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
Originally Posted by KFWA
I've been watching the 7 part series on the Roosevelts created by Ken Burns.

Unfortunately I missed the Teddy Roosevelt segment and started in on FDR during the New Deal activities - but I've been addicted to watching them since I caught the first one.

I had several ideas about FDR that turned out to be wrong.

But this documentary is so good, I'm going to track down the first episodes and watch them on Teddy.

Ken Burns does amazing work.

This was an excellent series ! Well worth your time to find and watch.
Posted By: Harry M Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15


http://teachingamericanhistory.org/library/document/progressive-platform-of-1912/
Posted By: Hotload Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
Oct. 14, 1912 - before a speech in Milwaukee, TR was shot at close range. He went on to give the speech
with the bullet still in his body. TR spoke for nearly an hour before going to the hospital.

Compare that to our present POTUS
Posted By: rosco1 Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
I have TR to thank every time I go hunting.

Its also interesting to note that he wanted government controlled healthcare.

He's my favorite president, but I'd just as soon drive an ice pick into my eye than read one of his books. He does have some catchy quotes tho.

Posted By: Dave_Skinner Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
I think TR was a product of his times. Capitalism was new, brash, and turning America oligarchic while pillaging resources.
Roosevelt set aside lands, sure, but he also took pains to tell the agency people that they were to manage for use, not mindless preservation. That gets lost in the translation.
I think he would be miffed beyond belief at USFS and USFWS today.
Posted By: 4ager Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
Originally Posted by Dave_Skinner
I think TR was a product of his times. Capitalism was new, brash, and turning America oligarchic while pillaging resources.
Roosevelt set aside lands, sure, but he also took pains to tell the agency people that they were to manage for use, not mindless preservation. That gets lost in the translation.
I think he would be miffed beyond belief at USFS and USFWS today.


Without a doubt. He'd have agreed with the creation of the EPA, but not a run-away agency, there or anywhere else.

You can bet your ass he'd want the Fed audited.

You can also bet your ass we'd have a LOT less trouble out of the Middle East.
Posted By: kaywoodie Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
He didn't care for Ben Lilly much when he (Lilly) guided him on his Mississippi bear hunt. Because Lilly wouldn't hunt on Sunday. LOL!
Posted By: blynyrd Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
Originally Posted by Pugs
Originally Posted by kaywoodie
Originally Posted by poboy
"Ranch Life and The Hunting Trail" - Teddy Roosevelt written
in 1888. A really good read about what the title suggests.


^^^Highly recommended.


African Game Trails is also excellent if you have an Africa bent.


^^^This is a great read, would also add "East of the Sun, West of the Moon", and "Through the Brazilian Wilderness".
Posted By: cv540 Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
Originally Posted by wabigoon
Do you think "Teddy", was seen as to progressive in his day, by the conservatives?


The Republicans of the day were very leery of TR at all levels of government. Mark HANNA, a mover and shaker within the party made a famous statement when the party was debating nominating Roosevelt for Vice President.....

"Matter! Matter! Why, everybody's gone crazy! What is the matter with all of you? Here's this convention going headlong for Roosevelt for Vice President. Don't any of you realize that there's ONLY ONE LIFE BETWEEN THAT MADMAN AND THE PRESIDENCY? Platt and Quay are no better than idiots! What harm can he do as Governor of New York compared to the damage he will do as President if McKinley should die?"

After the party nominated Roosevelt for VP contrary to HANNA'S advice, he told McKinley, "Your duty to the country is to live for four years from next March."

Of course McKinley was assassinated, and TR took over.
Posted By: FAIR_CHASE Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
"River of Doubt"

Excellent book.
Posted By: tbear99 Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/25/15
Originally Posted by Huntingnut
Originally Posted by 4ager
Need to dig him up, re-animate him, and have him serve another term.

One of the greatest we've had.


+1


+2
Posted By: LostHighway Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/26/15
Originally Posted by KFWA

Yes!
Were he President today, the RP bunch would have a fit about him Trust busting and establishing National Parks. He was quite progressive in his day, but he was no puss. TR was staill a man's man in many respects. Hard work, fresh air, and a can do attitude ruled his thinking.


how do you think Fox News would treat him?(and 24hr) [/quote]

Teddy-Trust busting and increased business regulation.
FOX- ANTI BUSINESS LIBERAL /24hr- RINO/LIBERTARD

Teddy- Breaking up monopolistic corporations, holding down railroad rates, and guaranteeing pure food and drugs.
FOX- SOCIALIST/24hr- COMMUNIST/TRAITOR

Teddy- He was the first president to speak out on conservation a
and he greatly expanded the system of national parks and national forests.
FOX- TREE HUGGER/24hr-TREE HUGGER, HATES AMERICA/LAND GRABBER

Teddy-By 1907, he propounded more radical reforms, which were blocked by the conservative Republicans in Congress.
FOX- Thank God for real Americans/24hr Send him back Africa where a elephant will step on him then %$#& on him.
Posted By: watch4bear Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/26/15
Doesn't it just want to make you lick obamas nuts? grin
Posted By: CharlieFoxtrot Re: Theodore Roosevelt. - 02/26/15
"If you got them by the balls, their hearts and minds will follow."
-TR

TR stood by his convictions, right or wrong. He wasn't part of the established hierarchy in gov't; not in Albany, not in NYC, and certainly not in Washington. Media bashed him as well. he wasn't afraid to play hardball and stand toe to toe with anybody. This country is begging for someone that would be just a fraction of him today.

His handling of the monopolies would be political suicide today. His naval expansion which made us a world power would be condemned by the left. There are those who would be against his national park system and it goes on and on. He was bold when the country needed it...we clearly need it again today.
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