This was going to happen sooner or later, I just felt it. I run a youth shooting club here in pa for 87 youths ages 6 through 16. Well the other day I caught one of the youth stealing 22 ammo. It was not a lot but it was stealing. After sitting him down and talking to him he told me his dad put him up to it. Have no clue why a parent would tell the kids to steal for them. Its not the ammo it's what how it happen that pisses me off. If the dad wanted 22's for at home all he had to do is ask and I would have sold it to him. The club is free to join, they get to shoot inside my 100 yard pole build that I built for my own shooting needs. I charge $5.00 each time for them to shoot 100 rounds which I think is fair as the price of 22's now days. Then have concrete pads to shoot off of and also 3 benches. Have 5 over sized 22 traps that I had my son make and weld out of 1/2" steel. The question is what should I do with this kid. He never gave me any problems in the past that I know of, he might have been stealing from me for some time now I dont know. Should I leave him continue to shoot and watch his closely or just kick him out? I started this 5 years ago to give kids something to do other than playing video games, and doing thing they shouldn't be doing, like one of my shooters just the other day got caught and arrested with 10 pounds of weed. I'm at a rock and a hard place here.
I think you should call the dad in for a talk and see how acts. If he is hostile than ban the dad. I would give the kid a suspension to teach him that stealing is wrong and against the law. But you don't want to push the kid away completely. If the dad acts reasonable and admits his guilt I would suspend him for awhile and then allow him to come back. I would sure want to know why he thought it was okay to steal from you, when you are helping the kids and giving so much to them. Good luck.
I have talked to the dad, he didn't say a word when his son ratted him out, just grabbed his son up and left. The boy is 11. His parents aren't model parents, dad was in jail for beating the mom up, DUI 3 times and who knows what else. This is why I started the club for kids had a place to come and learn to shoot, hang out with others, and most of all stay out of trouble.
Just curious do you have an inventory procedure? 100 rds per paying customer wouldn't be hard to keep track of purchases vs stock. Not dissing your system just curious.
I applaud you and your efforts to keep shooting sports an option for our youth and future leaders. Thank you.
I believe that actions have consequences. Sometimes, you can say "I'm calling your parents" and it works.
Unfortunately, it does not seem to be that way in this case...maybe he's lying to you, in which case GOODBYE.
However, how will you know if he's lying to you? If the father is willing to send his kid to steal from you, I'd be willing to bet he's scumbag enough to make sure his kid takes the fall and lie to you.
Long ban, and have to earn his way back in...with restrictions until he can prove they are not necessary (a time which is completely up to you, of course).
The dad is not much of a dad. The kid probably needs all the help he can get and a positive role model and father figure. I would help the kid and give him a break. He has a tough life and the odds are against him. The dad would never step foot in again unless it was a special event.
I have talked to the dad, he didn't say a word when his son ratted him out, just grabbed his son up and left. The boy is 11. His parents aren't model parents, dad was in jail for beating the mom up, DUI 3 times and who knows what else. This is why I started the club for kids had a place to come and learn to shoot, hang out with others, and most of all stay out of trouble.
I have talked to the dad, he didn't say a word when his son ratted him out, just grabbed his son up and left. The boy is 11. His parents aren't model parents, dad was in jail for beating the mom up, DUI 3 times and who knows what else. This is why I started the club for kids had a place to come and learn to shoot, hang out with others, and most of all stay out of trouble.
Just curious do you have an inventory procedure? 100 rds per paying customer wouldn't be hard to keep track of purchases vs stock. Not dissing your system just curious.
I applaud you and your efforts to keep shooting sports an option for our youth and future leaders. Thank you.
Going to change the procedures now, before they went and dropped $5.00 in the ammo can and got 2 boxes of 22's. Never in the 5 years I been running this did I come up short, no one stole money or ammo. Running a club this size with me and 2 of my buddies it's hard to keep track of that many kids when they aren't on the shooing line. Might just have to bring a few more friends on board.
Hope you taught him to fall on his own damn sword and not rat you out like the punk did to his old man in this tale.
I have a placard over the fireplace that reads "Snitches lie in Ditches."
Travis
If you don't mind me sayin'....clever sarcasm is a trait few can master....if you ain't the best at it here then I don't know who the heck is.....carry on.
Have him prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.
prosecute who?, dad or son? Dad will say he never said for his son to steal them. It will be he said she said. I do believe the boy, he seems like a good kid.
If you don't mind me sayin'....clever sarcasm is a trait few can master....if you ain't the best at it here then I don't know who the heck is.....carry on.
I have talked to the dad, he didn't say a word when his son ratted him out, just grabbed his son up and left. The boy is 11. His parents aren't model parents, dad was in jail for beating the mom up, DUI 3 times and who knows what else. This is why I started the club for kids had a place to come and learn to shoot, hang out with others, and most of all stay out of trouble.
Did they leave by car or walk home?
they have a car, would be a heck of a walk where I live
You said he seemed to be a good kid, with bad parents. No one gets to chose their parents, so I would tend to be a little more lenient with the kid. Actually, I would probably try to spend more time with him, as he obviously needs a good role model or two in his life.
Also, here is the basic question. What would you do if it had been your son? That pretty much answers what you need to do now.
If the kid shows up again, the left black eye is for getting caught, the right blue eye is for snitching and the split lip is just for cause.
If that would happen to the kid, then I would get the police involved for sure. We will see if next Wednesday night if they show up, I know dad wont as I told him he was not allowed on my land, I will have him arrested for sure. its just a shame that it had to come to this. One azzhole and spoil the whole bunch.
you are more tolerant than me. I don't think i would let "any" troubled youth around firearms. The risks are too great, and the liability is something you should consider. a thief is a thief is a thief. Doesn't work for me. As to the sperm donor, that doesn't work either. You remind me in this story of a good friend of mine now deceased active in the big brothers program. He mentored this little turd for a number of years, did everything he could to show the kid a better way. Didn't work. Don't want to say it always doesn't work, but the odds are against one. I would question how you could ever trust that kid again?
You said he seemed to be a good kid, with bad parents. No one gets to chose their parents, so I would tend to be a little more lenient with the kid. Actually, I would probably try to spend more time with him, as he obviously needs a good role model or two in his life.
Also, here is the basic question. What would you do if it had been your son? That pretty much answers what you need to do now.
I would never tell my son to steal from anyone else. If found out he did, lets just say he wont be doing anything fun for a long time.
when i was in i think first grade another kid and i thought it was great fun to steal candy from a local drug store. I didn't know there was see through one way glass upstairs. I found out. One day i walked out pockets full of candy and my dad asked me what i was doing. He had been up top with the owner. Got caught red handed. I got a pretty good butt spanking right there IN the drug store with people watching, branded as a criminal, and had my butt kicked down the main street in prescott. I also had to apologize to the owner of the store. Thus my short life of crime. Crime has consequences. Like the time i shot a songbird with a bb gun and was banned from ALL guns for about a year.
How sure are you that the kid wasn't lying when he ratted on his dad? Any chance he was just trying to pass the blame for something that was entirely his own doing?
If the kid was really telling the truth, I would try to cut him some slack and let him participate with a little extra personal attention.
How sure are you that the kid wasn't lying when he ratted on his dad? Any chance he was just trying to pass the blame for something that was entirely his own doing?
If the kid was really telling the truth, I would try to cut him some slack and let him participate with a little extra personal attention.
Myron
Myron judging from the the way the dad acted by saying nothing and grabbing his kid and just leaving, I would say 110% the kid called it right and put the blame where the blame needed to be. He didn't even try to defend himself.
Gemby, it's a pretty neat thing you're doing with those kids and it's a shame someone put a wart on things.
Agreed that the lack of denial or argument from the father doesn't speak well for his innocence, IMO.
My initial urge was to recommend you ban the kid outright as trust is a huge part of having the privilege to shoot, but when you describe the kid's home life and parents a bit more, I'm inclined to cut him some slack. Have you considered pulling the kid aside next time he's around and asking him what he thought was an appropriate action for you to take?
How sure are you that the kid wasn't lying when he ratted on his dad? Any chance he was just trying to pass the blame for something that was entirely his own doing?
If the kid was really telling the truth, I would try to cut him some slack and let him participate with a little extra personal attention.
Myron
Myron judging from the the way the dad acted by saying nothing and grabbing his kid and just leaving, I would say 110% the kid called it right and put the blame where the blame needed to be.
He didn't even try to defend himself.
Why would he, when you've already accused him and told him not to come back?
Had a talk with the mother of the boy at Lowes today. First she learned about this. I told her his son is still welcome but she needs to be there the whole time keeping a eye on him at all times. I think the dad is just a dirt ball, hard to take it out on the kid.
I missed this the first time around???? I think you are doing the right thing, the deck is stacked pretty heavily against the kid at this point but he does need to learn a lesson on stealing. Maybe make him clean up during half his shooting time.
There is no doubt the kid needs guidance and God put him there for you. Like I've told you before, you're a good man, you'll know what to do.
I missed this the first time around???? I think you are doing the right thing, the deck is stacked pretty heavily against the kid at this point but he does need to learn a lesson on stealing. Maybe make him clean up during half his shooting time.
There is no doubt the kid needs guidance and God put him there for you. Like I've told you before, you're a good man, you'll know what to do.
How are you doing for ammo this year?
No problem getting ammo, have 22 cases in my gun room right now, good to go there. Cleaned out the bullets traps on sunday, and melted that lead and what I had in a buckets from clean ups before and got 415.2 pounds of lead. With 40gr bullets that's around 72,625 rounds since I started it
Gemby, you've undertaken a remarkable project and certainly a respectable goal.
Sounds you've come to a sensible conclusion and plan. Best of luck to you, and hope for the young kid he eventually nets a positive experience from this misadventure. Guidance and forgiveness go a long way. The dad I've no empathy for, but the kid, while he may have some odds against him one just never knows, there may be a fine human being in there struggling to get out. And if time proves the opposite, can 'em.
This was going to happen sooner or later, I just felt it. I run a youth shooting club here in pa for 87 youths ages 6 through 16. Well the other day I caught one of the youth stealing 22 ammo. It was not a lot but it was stealing. After sitting him down and talking to him he told me his dad put him up to it. Have no clue why a parent would tell the kids to steal for them. Its not the ammo it's what how it happen that pisses me off. If the dad wanted 22's for at home all he had to do is ask and I would have sold it to him. The club is free to join, they get to shoot inside my 100 yard pole build that I built for my own shooting needs. I charge $5.00 each time for them to shoot 100 rounds which I think is fair as the price of 22's now days. Then have concrete pads to shoot off of and also 3 benches. Have 5 over sized 22 traps that I had my son make and weld out of 1/2" steel. The question is what should I do with this kid. He never gave me any problems in the past that I know of, he might have been stealing from me for some time now I dont know. Should I leave him continue to shoot and watch his closely or just kick him out? I started this 5 years ago to give kids something to do other than playing video games, and doing thing they shouldn't be doing, like one of my shooters just the other day got caught and arrested with 10 pounds of weed. I'm at a rock and a hard place here.
Keep the kid on, bust his pop's windpipe. Due diligence required.
I don't have a bunch on hand, but I'm sure I could contribute a bulk pack if needed, let me know.
I have talked to the dad, he didn't say a word when his son ratted him out, just grabbed his son up and left. The boy is 11. His parents aren't model parents, dad was in jail for beating the mom up, DUI 3 times and who knows what else. This is why I started the club for kids had a place to come and learn to shoot, hang out with others, and most of all stay out of trouble.
I'm liking this family more by the minute.
Travis
L O L, You remind me of this song...
Is one of your names "Dan" ??
If he only said GFY at the end I would know for sure...
Keep the kid on, bust his pop's windpipe. Due diligence required.
I don't have a bunch on hand, but I'm sure I could contribute a bulk pack if needed, let me know. [/quote]
Thanks for the offer. Don't have problems getting 22's. Only problem is the price it has gone sky high in the past 7 years. Might have to start charging more for the kids to shoot. Use what you wanted to donate to our program to a kid in your area that would like to shoot. Thanks for the kind offer.
I'd talk to the kid, see if he knows how much he took, give him the option to do some chores or something to pay for what was taken, then he can resume shooting once you are made whole again.
Keep an eye on him and try to teach him to be a man.
You may be the only good influence he will ever have.
You said you have more kids than you can keep track of off the firing line and you have one kid that stole ammo and you don't know how much of for how long and you are charging a fee. You have maybe too much going on with this very admirable enterprise. You might think about a consult with a lawyer to sketch out possible outcomes if things go south. I hope you find a way to carry on, you are definitely riding the high country.
You said you have more kids than you can keep track of off the firing line and you have one kid that stole ammo and you don't know how much of for how long and you are charging a fee. You have maybe too much going on with this very admirable enterprise. You might think about a consult with a lawyer to sketch out possible outcomes if things go south. I hope you find a way to carry on, you are definitely riding the high country.
We keep track of the kids on he firing line, there well attended too. Its the ones that are waiting to shoot and got done shooting that we don't keep a eye on. But I have a few friends that are willing to help out. I would say 99.9% of the kids stay inline. Like my heading says<<<< It was going to happen
Everything went well tonight at the shoot. We had 42 shooters tonight. The kid in question came up to me and said he was sorry for what he did. I told him he just became a bigger person for being able to live up to what he did. He also told me that his dad told him if he didn't take the 22's that he was going to get his azz beat when he got home.
I believe the kid, sure wish I could have the old mans azz arrested. Well wont have to deal with him anymore and if he shows up I will have him arrested. Got a few new staff member on board tonight to help out and all went well.
Still want to thank all that wanted to donate to the club. I just rather you use it for kids in your area, I got this club covered for now.
It wasn't a full house tonight for some reason, maybe because of the weather. Did hear someone say something about open house at the middle school tonight.
Also note that the red dot sight that ErichTheRed donated to the club was a big and I mean big hit for the kids. Going to start looking for more of them for a cheap price. Any one has any laying around that you will part with for cheap let me know. Thanks again Erich, it will be put to good use. Kids were standing in line to shoot the gun with the red dot on.